As Rugby refuses to take the knee, is it time the Premier League stopped too?

[Zlaatan]

If we really want to get racism out of this society we have to do things that matters. If Premier League think they can stop it by only taking a knee they are wrong. Give money to society. To schools. To social workers. To other education places. To people who really can affect and take care of this problem on micro level.

They don't think that, it's done to simply raise awareness.

Racism a massive issue and it's not going to be stopped quickly no matter what you do or how much money and resources you throw at it. It's going to take time and if a small thing such as athletes taking a knee for 5sec impacts even a small minority of kids to be more opposed to racism like their idols are then it should be worth doing it for that reason alone, and as we've seen in this thread there's people who have had positive experiences because of it and as long as that keeps happening, and as long as we have people thinking like the OP, they should continue doing it.

 

[Giggs86]

Yes, should've stopped long time ago. Do it for a week, fine, but what's the point of doing it for months? It became very cringe at this point.

 

[calodo2003]

Christ almighty. What’s the fecking harm in taking a knee? There’s no downside to it.

 

[Vernon Philander]

Because I doubt a Millionaire Footballer is really in touch with the world and are only doing as they are told, not what they actually care about.

For instance, its ok for them to break lockdown rules, have haircuts etc, whist the rest of us follow the rules.

So you mean they're about as touch with the people as those who break Lockdown rules to take a 200 mile round trip to test ones eyesight? Or those that defend and keep them employment?

 

[Vernon Philander]

Is Racism such a problem in the UK though?

I for one think we have many more problems than Racism, in fact, Id likes to believe racism is something of the past. Sure, I imagine there are still issues surrounding racism but how relevant are they to most peoples lives. I believe there are more divides than colour and Rashford for instance is highlighting that himself.

Black Lives Matter is a Political Movement, Political Movements have no place in Sport.

I grew up as a child on the 80s, I remember the Brixton Riots etc, I would like to think the UK has moved on and grown up since those days. Today we have so many laws enforcing equality that I don't think Racism is in any way the issue it once was in the UK.

If anything I think this "Wokeness" and I will use the term Woke, does more harm than good and highlights a problem that really isn't there anymore from a UK perspective.

BLM is about as political as a Poppy on the shirt. It's a symbol to show solidarity or remembrance.

Is it woke to wear a poppy?

 

[Micky Targaryen]

1) Why do you keep highlighting that they are millionaires?

2) Is bending the knee harming anyone in any way? Or is it just one of your pet peeves?

3) Will football somehow become better if we get back those precious 10 seconds of bending knees?

4) Racism is everywhere. Granted it is more dire in the USA compared to UK, but it still is everywhere. Shall athletes only bend knees in the most racist countries?

Honestly, I've no idea as to why you are so put off by it.

 

[padzilla]

Same with woke. So being alert and open to what is actually going on is bad now?

People who use woke and social justice warriors as insults are racists and bigots. Why else would they be so threatened by others calling for equality and fair treatment for minorities?

 

[ravi2]

At the weekend the Irish and Scottish Rugby teams refused to take the Knee for BLM.

Surely this cringe show should now end and the silliness of millionaire footballers taking the knee before an empty stadium every week should stop.

Whilst I have sympathies with the problems in the United States I fail to see how millionaire footballers bending the knee each week does anything to help those in the States and certainly is something we have to worry about in the UK.

No matter what your view, BLM is a political Movement, I much prefer we aim to make all lives better no matter, and one thing that Rashford has highlighted in the UK is the divide between the haves and have nots regardless of colour.

I honestly believe this Premier League Wokeness needs to stop, and I fully support the Rugby Teams in taking a stand on this.

https://www.irishpost.com/news/enti...e-before-six-nations-tie-against-wales-203307

You seem to care more about taking the knee than racism itself.

Either consciously or sub-consciously I think you are a racist.

 

[pacifictheme]

Always like my racists out where I can see them so good topic overall

 

[Deery]

To be fair rugby players seem like cnuts with a major superiority complex, not surprised they didn’t kneel...

Have they given any reason as to why they didn’t kneel?

 

[Amarsdd]

feckin hell! Didn't realize footballers taking a knee for 10 seconds was taking food off the table for some people here.

 

[SecondFig]

At the weekend the Irish and Scottish Rugby teams refused to take the Knee for BLM.

Surely this cringe show should now end and the silliness of millionaire footballers taking the knee before an empty stadium every week should stop.

Whilst I have sympathies with the problems in the United States I fail to see how millionaire footballers bending the knee each week does anything to help those in the States and certainly is something we have to worry about in the UK.

I hadn't realised that we'd fixed racism in the UK, but it's great to hear we don't have to worry about it in the UK any more.

No matter what your view, BLM is a political Movement, I much prefer we aim to make all lives better no matter, and one thing that Rashford has highlighted in the UK is the divide between the haves and have nots regardless of colour.

Nah, black lives matter is an acknowledgement that systematic racism in the USA, (and the UK, Australia, Canada etc etc) have failed to value the lives of black people. Whether it be police systems, prison systems, education or even health - black lives are not valued or protected in the same way as white lives. Obviously all lives matter, but saying that in this context isn't really saying "all lives matter" is it? It's just a way to try and stop people talking about systemic racism against black people.

I honestly believe this Premier League Wokeness needs to stop, and I fully support the Rugby Teams in taking a stand on this.

You call taking the knee a "cringe show" and then talk about "Wokeness"? Really? I think there is a genuine discussion to be had about whether players continuing to take a knee has lasting significance or meaning, and I 100% respect the opinion of people like Les Ferdinand who feel that it's become tokenistic, and that there are better ways to show support for black lives, black people, black players. But calling Premier League players "woke" for making a gesture against racism is utterly pathetic and you should be ashamed.

 

[SecondFig]

Is Racism such a problem in the UK though?

I for one think we have many more problems than Racism, in fact, Id likes to believe racism is something of the past. Sure, I imagine there are still issues surrounding racism but how relevant are they to most peoples lives. I believe there are more divides than colour and Rashford for instance is highlighting that himself.

Black Lives Matter is a Political Movement, Political Movements have no place in Sport.

I grew up as a child on the 80s, I remember the Brixton Riots etc, I would like to think the UK has moved on and grown up since those days. Today we have so many laws enforcing equality that I don't think Racism is in any way the issue it once was in the UK.

If anything I think this "Wokeness" and I will use the term Woke, does more harm than good and highlights a problem that really isn't there anymore from a UK perspective.

Are you black? Or any UK ethnic minority? If not, you don't get to decide whether racism is a problem in the UK.

(not to mention the fact that the data quite clearly shows it is still a significant problem)

 

[SecondFig]

Always like my racists out where I can see them so good topic overall

Silver linings and all that...

 

[padzilla]

I just need one more use of "virtue signalling" to complete the full racist bigot house along with snowflake, woke and social justice warrior. There should be no politics in football say the hordes who scream abuse and boo players for not wearing poppies.

 

[Wumminator]

Depends, What is Racism?

Hypothetically,

If I hated someone because of their skin colour and told them directly how I felt about them using derogatory words, then that I would consider would be racism.

If I wanted to unsettle a player at a rival club, one tool I could use is derogatory terms to unsettle them. Would that be racism if I cheered on my own players of colour and I didn't really care about skin colour at all?

Wow. What a surprise. The person who made this thread is a total knobber.

 

[Wumminator]

Did they refuse to take the knee or have they just not been brainwashed into thinking it is mandatory behaviour?

People still think they're raging against the machine in protest when Apple, Disney, Google, Mastercard, Sony and every major sporting league is on their side.

This type of post is also hilarious,

The biggest leap in logic I’ve ever seen.

 

[tenpoless]

Still think it's a good thing to do. Adults might not be affected by it but if kids and teenagers see their fave players doing it and find out the meaning behind it, chances are they will follow. I personally think you could fight racism more effectively with newer generations. If you taught them well, there will be a better future for race equality. Adults and grumpy old men are hard to change, does not matter what you do.

 

[Ish]

He was only saying it to upset oppos though, he cheers on his own team's black players. Just think of the charming potential atmosphere we're missing at OT during lockdown.

Imagine also telling black people that racism (in the UK anyway), doesn't exist. Man....not even sure what to say. All lives matter I guess.

 

[Ish]

Wow. What a surprise. The person who made this thread is a total knobber.

Some absolute gems in this thread, Wumm. Couldn't believe what I was reading in quite a few posts

 

[royce987]

BLM is about as political as a Poppy on the shirt. It's a symbol to show solidarity or remembrance.

Is it woke to wear a poppy?

BLM was started by self professed Marxists

Swain alluded to Black Lives Matter’s three co-founders, who are still featured prominently on the group’s website — Patrisse Cullors, Alicia Garza and Opal Tometi. Their primary backgrounds are as community organizers, artists and writers. Swain, though, was referring to a newly surfaced interview Cullors did in 2015, where she said:

"We do have an ideological frame. Myself and Alicia, in particular, are trained organizers; we are trained Marxists. We are superversed on, sort of, ideological theories. And I think what we really try to do is build a movement that could be utilized by many, many Black folks."

We didn’t find that Garza and Tometi have referred to themselves as Marxists. But the book publisher Penguin Random House has said Garza, an author, "describes herself as a queer social justice activist and Marxist."

Included on its list of beliefs is one that has drawn criticism as being consistent with Marxism:

"We disrupt the Western-prescribed nuclear family structure requirement by supporting each other as extended families and ‘villages’ that collectively care for one another, especially our children, to the degree that mothers, parents, and children are comfortable."

A spokesperson for Black Lives Matter; Kailee Scales, managing director at Black Lives Matter Global Network Foundation; and the three co-founders did not reply to our requests for information.

"On one level, these are just put downs," University of Massachusetts Amherst economics professor Richard Wolff, author of "Understanding Marxism," told PolitiFact about the attacks on Black Lives Matter.

If people declare themselves Marxists, they are in effect Marxists, but "there really is no standard" of what Marxism is, "there’s no way to verify anything."

BLM is super political.

 

[Wibble]

I hadn't realised that we'd fixed racism in the UK, but it's great to hear we don't have to worry about it in the UK any more.



Nah, black lives matter is an acknowledgement that systematic racism in the USA, (and the UK, Australia, Canada etc etc) have failed to value the lives of black people. Whether it be police systems, prison systems, education or even health - black lives are not valued or protected in the same way as white lives. Obviously all lives matter, but saying that in this context isn't really saying "all lives matter" is it? It's just a way to try and stop people talking about systemic racism against black people.

All lives matter makes me cringe. Not once in my nearly 57 years on this planet have I ever though my life didn't matter because of my bluey/white skin colour.

 

[Siorac]

BLM was started by self professed Marxists





BLM is super political.

Every organisation that aims to achieve serious social change IS political. Every single equal rights movement, from suffragettes to the US' civil rights movement, was and is political, by the very nature of their goals.

 

[Siorac]

All lives matter makes me cringe. Not once in my nearly 57 years on this planet have I ever though my life didn't matter because of my bluey/white skin colour.

Wait, blue skin? Are you an Asari? Or a smurf?

 

[Wibble]

Wait, blue skin? Are you an Asari? Or a smurf?

If exposed to UV I go white briefly before burning and peeling. I blame my Irish ancestors.

 

[Berbasbullet]

BLM was started by self professed Marxists





BLM is super political.

Luckily it’s not BLM the premier league are doing anymore isn’t it?

 

[Grinner]

One day a player will injure themselves taking the knee.

Lucky this wasn't happening during Darren Anderton's career.

 

[kthanksbye]

No.

 

[Wumminator]

It would be interesting to see the overlap between “all lives matter” people and those that think Rashford shouldn’t ask for government handouts for children.

 

[GazTheLegend]

I felt since the beginning that the taking the knee gesture was always more likely to inflame tensions than it was to soothe them in this country. I think dividing people into different groups is dangerous. And of all groups of people, had anyone asked the question yet why it might be the Scottish and Irish that don't take the knee? Do you not think that they know a little about persecution?
I feel like we are now at the point where, much like the poppy, this something has become a sacred symbol of an ideology that nobody can touch. And I bet there's a lot of people reading this thread who are -afraid- to articulate that for fear of being labelled a racist, which should be absolutely ridiculous given the prominence and importance of black players at our football club past and present and how much we adore them.

We can't start villifying people who don't take the knee. It doesn't automatically make them racist, but their group identity might be a persecuted one anyway. I would take the knee if I was playing football, absolutely, but I don't think we should start attacking individuals and teams that don't. It's more nuanced than that.

 

[pacifictheme]

Silver linings and all that...

Luckily I don't think the ramblings of tc will have any wider impact on the fight against racism so all that's really happened as he's outed himself.

 

[SirScholes]

I feel the kneeling has lost whatever ‘impact’ it might have had. I don’t really listen to celebrities with them trying to tell me what to think. And in regards to racism, kneeling does pretty much next to nil and has had zero impact on anyone I know in this matter.

As someone stated above there needs to be more of a micro view taken to snub it out. As well as social media platforms to have a better way to track these racist turds and have them charged or outed publicly. That will stop it at least severely slow it down.

But if you were a kid growing up you’re more likely to be influenced
If each generation can have an impact on its kids, thats a massive weapon in the fight.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

Depends, What is Racism?

Hypothetically,

If I hated someone because of their skin colour and told them directly how I felt about them using derogatory words, then that I would consider would be racism.

If I wanted to unsettle a player at a rival club, one tool I could use is derogatory terms to unsettle them. Would that be racism if I cheered on my own players of colour and I didn't really care about skin colour at all?

You really need to get out more.

But if that post is the kind of thing you are going to say, don't speak, just listen.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

How so?

Maybe I am out of touch but I would argue things are much better than they were in the 80s, equality laws have benefited all, how are things still so bad?

So in the 1960s should black people in America have just said, "hey its better than the 1880s, we don't have to pick cotton every day in the slave fields. How are things so bad?".

 

[Gehrman]

Well, you can ask yourself why at the time was Ireland a major exporter of food but the British government decided to starve them of that food. Sure it may have nothing to do with skin colour but it had everything to do with race.

A bit late, but I don't think that anything to do with race, but still nationality.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

Yet is still sponsored by an oil company.

Mercedes race team are sponsored by Petronas. Hamilton is employed by that team. Others have already highlighted the internal pressure he is putting on his employer and the changes he has made personally.

Who do you work for? Can you cancel their company commercial contracts or sponsorship if you don't like them?

 

[Fluctuation0161]

https://www.thesun.ie/sport/2330602...e-suit-from-tommy-hilfiger-to-monster-energy/

We have a Sun reader! What a surprise.

How dense do you have to be to not realise those are Mercedes sponsors.

 

[El Zoido]

Racism won’t go away until we evolve in to a post-human race or become assimilated in to a network of advanced computers, so I imagine players will still be taking the knee in 500 years time. It’s a fine message though, I really could see it becoming a permanent thing.

 

[Wumminator]

https://www.thesun.ie/sport/2330602...e-suit-from-tommy-hilfiger-to-monster-energy/

fecking hell.

I've wondered where United's missing right wing was for years. Should have just checked RedCafe.

 

[Bubz27]

It should also be noted that we live in a time where it's the "easiest" if you belong to the racial, sexual or religious minority.

Sorry, are you saying it's easier to be the minority?