No way should 'no deal' be on a ballot. You don't hand suicidal people a loaded gun.
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
- Thread starter Silva
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Parliament can vote for a clear plan now, they don't need a GE
Yes. But it would have to be a two part thing or the Brexit vote gets split and when they lose they say its not fair and we have to do it again.
The premise of No Deal has to be an option. Because ultimately, it's one of few actual possibilities.
They're part of the United Kingdom right now and they want to remain in the EU, so it's in their interest for the UK to remain in the EU. It's not remotely hypocritical for them to also want to leave the UK. All the more so now the UK seems determined to leave the EU, against their wishes.
What happens when none of the options get more than 50%?
In theory. But theyve shown they actually cant.
Or you think on Monday they can agree to something on the indicative votes thing?
The opposing parties would just jump on that as being undemocratic as we voted to leave. At least by offering another vote they can say it is democratic because a lot of time has passed and new information is available etc.
So is becoming the 51st state of the US, let’s put that in too?
It's not a viable alternative. If we exit with no deal, we'd still have to agree a deal similar to the Withdrawal Agreement (divorce bill, citizen's rights and Irish border) with the EU in the months following our exit, only now from the position of being in the middle of an economic disaster.
Particularly given a big argument used to encourage Scottish voters to vote to stay in the union during the Independence referendum was how it would be difficult for them to join the EU as an independent nation.
I don't think a general election is in anyone's interest right now. Except maybe the Tories.
Electoral fatigue.
Conservative majority if it happens.
A lot of people have sympathy for May (feeling she's between a rock and a hard place, being hard-done-to, etc. by petulant MPs)
From a Left/progressive/Labour POV, best to let the Tories front the shit-show of a No-Deal Brexit for a while.
Electoral fatigue.
Conservative majority if it happens.
A lot of people have sympathy for May (feeling she's between a rock and a hard place, being hard-done-to, etc. by petulant MPs)
From a Left/progressive/Labour POV, best to let the Tories front the shit-show of a No-Deal Brexit for a while.
BINO + 2nd referendum should just about get over the line
I honestly think they won't find anything on the indicative votes because MP's are completely split on what they want. It'll be more of the same, plus would they be able to bring back the same vote again? Wouldn't Bercow have something to say about that? If the house has rejected No Deal, Second Referendum, Revoking and Customs Union, then whats left to vote on?
No I don't but having a new parliament doesn't really change course for a new plan. Same old same old.
All about optics.
Next election 'don't vote for Corbyn, he didn't vote for Brexit, vote for us, and we will gerron wiv it'
How is no deal a viable option when it clearly violates an international treaty?
Oh I agree, I said as much a few minutes ago. But the EU will have to play along with the fantasy that it is a step towards a solution. There is no way if we say now we are going to have a GE that the EU say too late, time's up, youre out. It just wont happen. Even if they wanted to deep down they wont because it stiffs one of their members.
Well, I'd put some money now on UK participating in European Parliament elections, then.
Indicative votes is a 2 stage process
A second vote would be decisive by way of it being a second vote. You can't just lay out some made up scenario to debunk a people's vote.
Surely the logical conclusion of not confirming an instruction is to cancel? This is the brexit we can deliver do you want it yes or no. Simple
No one is booting the UK out, the UK decided to leave and they are free to change their mind on that particular topic. EU member states have to take care of themselves and they can't really stay in the unknown forever. I mean what happens if there is a long extension and the next government has no clearer plan or majority?
The UK is lucky that Ireland exists, it's the only reason why the rest of Europe hasn't told your politician to do one. And I insist on politicians, the majority of british citizens are hostages of absolute weapons but they need to understand that it's the same situation for the rest of the EU, we are in a limbo for no good reason. If they want to leave just do that but if they don't want to leave or aren't not sure then cancel everything and we all move on.
This
The EU isn't booting us out and we can withdraw A50 at any time.
So where do we go then on Monday they all get voted down again?
On Wednesday, didn't the Tories get a free vote, whilst Labour were whipped? I didn't follow it too closely as i'm frankly extremely bored of the whole thing now. It's like a group of toddlers arguing over what they want to play with!
I'm not sure there would be though - likely again very close and more problems whoever wins.
It will go on forever, ten years down the line it will still be the same ,will the EU let it go on forever
Yes, "booting us out" is the wrong way to put it.
But they wont give an ultimatum, "stay or leave, right now, decide" if we have called a GE.
But they wont give an ultimatum, "stay or leave, right now, decide" if we have called a GE.
It's totally hypocritical for them to campaign to stay in the EU on the basis that leaving would do damage to the Scottish economy etc when Scotland is more dependent on the UK internal market than the UK is with the EU economically.
I still think a soft Brexit & a public vote should get it over the line. We’ll see
0/11 !!
Imo, You should have a referendum with three options: No, soft or Hard Brexit. Or possibly just two: Hard and No Brexit.
Brexiteers campaign should be on how they would protect the union and the economy; Remainers on a possible new future relationship with the EU.
Imo, You should have a referendum with three options: No, soft or Hard Brexit. Or possibly just two: Hard and No Brexit.
Brexiteers campaign should be on how they would protect the union and the economy; Remainers on a possible new future relationship with the EU.
Maybe, but anything getting a majority in parliament still has to be an outside bet. It would probably bring down the government as well - enough ERG would likely back the opposition in a vote of no confidence.
No, a referendum offers 2 viable choices that can be implemented, it won’t be a problem
And Ireland prepared for a no deal, that's the part that is missed, while the EU and Ireland will try everything to avoid it, they won't try forever. And there is no chance for me to be right since I haven't claimed a thing, I don't know what EU leaders will decide since they haven't officially talked about it yet, it will happen the 10th.
Problem is, i've read that upto 40 Labour MP's refuse to back a public vote because it goes against what their constituents voted for. They want to respect what was originally voted for, and will defy the whip/resign. Whether or not they actually do it when it comes down to it remains to be seen.
That’s probably true.