Chelsea 2020/21 - General discussion

blue blue

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I'm pretty sure its only Kepa's transfer fee thats kept him in the team. The board must have been pressurizing Frank to give him just one more chance hoping he could turn it around. He was dropped on a couple of occasions last season and Willy did OK but Kepa came back and still made errors. The start of this season has been equally disastrous. I'm not one to pile in on players after a few poor performances but Kepa has just got worse the longer he's been at the club. Maybe he can resurrect his career somewhere else but Chelsea really can't allow him to continue in goal.
I remember his antics in the League Cup final when he refused flatly to leave the pitch after Sarri substituted him. He was punished for that but a bad disciplinary record and a really poor save ratio is not something any club should tolerate.

I can't ever remember such a bad transfer.
 

Mount's Goatieson

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I'm pretty sure its only Kepa's transfer fee thats kept him in the team. The board must have been pressurizing Frank to give him just one more chance hoping he could turn it around. He was dropped on a couple of occasions last season and Willy did OK but Kepa came back and still made errors. The start of this season has been equally disastrous. I'm not one to pile in on players after a few poor performances but Kepa has just got worse the longer he's been at the club. Maybe he can resurrect his career somewhere else but Chelsea really can't allow him to continue in goal.
I remember his antics in the League Cup final when he refused flatly to leave the pitch after Sarri substituted him. He was punished for that but a bad disciplinary record and a really poor save ratio is not something any club should tolerate.

I can't ever remember such a bad transfer.
Drinkwater is still at the club mate. For £35m that's the single worst transfer I've ever seen at Chelsea.
Kepa has been a bust but he is still only 25, very young for a goal keeper and I'm still hoping he gets his act together and manage a good career, be at Chelsea or elsewhere. Drinkwater on the other hand is a lost cause, basically signed and retired, the proverbial money flushed down the toilet.
 

blue blue

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Drinkwater is still at the club mate. For £35m that's the single worst transfer I've ever seen at Chelsea.
Kepa has been a bust but he is still only 25, very young for a goal keeper and I'm still hoping he gets his act together and manage a good career, be at Chelsea or elsewhere. Drinkwater on the other hand is a lost cause, basically signed and retired, the proverbial money flushed down the toilet.
Drinkwater while being a disaster was half the price. I also suspect he didn't costs us half as many points as Kepa.

Bakayoko, Shevchenko and Torres have all been bad signings but nobody has cost £72m and caused the club to lose so many games.
 

Jesper Weber Mortensen

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Drinkwater while being a disaster was half the price. I also suspect he didn't costs us half as many points as Kepa.

Bakayoko, Shevchenko and Torres have all been bad signings but nobody has cost £72m and caused the club to lose so many games.
€58,5million in 2011 was a ton of money though. Surely that amounts to €70-80million nowadays? But I agree - Kepa is definitely the worst, and the 7-year contract is definitely cementing that.
 

Dancfc

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Drinkwater while being a disaster was half the price. I also suspect he didn't costs us half as many points as Kepa.

Bakayoko, Shevchenko and Torres have all been bad signings but nobody has cost £72m and caused the club to lose so many games.
I will still actually say Torres.

Despite how bad Kepa has been, he hasn't actually cost us our objectives (apart from maybe the LC but he made up for it in the Europa semi shootout), the best we could have realistcally achieved with our squad in the last two season's was top four and we got it.

Torres held us back as a club and it was clearly felt whenever he was on the pitch. Because of our commitment to making him work we couldn't didn't sign Aguero/prime Falcao/Cavani and even let go Sturridge. The amount of games we lost/drew where even a semi decent striker would have likely won for us for excruciating. A decent striker we'd have given United a run for their money in 12/13 (probably have fallen short, Fergie was like a man possessed after that heartbreak the season before) and with Eto'o played as numero uno all season I believe we win it in Jose's first season back.
 

Mb194dc

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Just hoping we get Kepa loaned out this window, even if we have to pay part of his wages to do it. As others have mentioned he was actually quite decent when he joined us but has gone backwards in a very big way. Is now a bit of a joke and the chances of him ever improving whilst playing for us are pretty much zero.

I think in the right environment he can get his confidence back and be a top keeper. A move back to one of the clubs near home would be best for him and wherever he goes we need him to be starting games every week. Spain would be best, though Italy or other top leagues could also work.
 

Dorris

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Yeah we'd gone for Alisson and Oblak, but the lack of CL football was a huge obstacle. Also the timing for Courtois' stunt was an issue - in 2018, the PL had moved the transfer deadline to before the season, so we had all the pressure to get the deal done on an accelerated timeline that clubs on the continent didn't have to worry about.

We basically had to find a goalkeeper who was good with his feet to accommodate Sarri, had top 5 league experience, had a buyout clause, and would be willing to sign for a team in the Europa League. And all this had to be done in about a week. Ultimately our choices were very limited.



Yeah he recorded literally the lowest save percentage in the history of the PL last year - 54.5%. He's given up the most goals in the league from outside the area since he arrived in England. Chelsea had a better defence by expected goals than Liverpool did last year.

He's a total trainwreck.
There's absolutely no way they bought him without scouting. Top football clubs will know about every top division player in Europe and have a decent analysis of them. They obviously saw something in him and got it wrong.
 

TheMagicFoolBus

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There's absolutely no way they bought him without scouting. Top football clubs will know about every top division player in Europe and have a decent analysis of them. They obviously saw something in him and got it wrong.
Well yes, we'd not normally purchase a player so hastily, but the club were put in untenable circumstances. Obviously he'd been watched once or twice but proper scouting takes months and that simply didn't happen.
 

blue blue

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There's absolutely no way they bought him without scouting. Top football clubs will know about every top division player in Europe and have a decent analysis of them. They obviously saw something in him and got it wrong.
They did get it wrong but the circumstances under which the decision was made had such a time constraint they weren't able to scout in the way you normally would, especially for a player being bought at £72m. Scouting involves sending people to look at that player perhaps over some period of time. Chelsea had 7 days to sign a keeper without the opportunity to go and see him play. They were not looking to sign a keeper until Courtois downed tools 7 days before the end of the window. He placed them in a really difficult position and if you can't accept that you are ignoring the facts. I would also question if every top European team does have decent analysis of every player. Its no easy task keeping a player database up to date with the top 5 leagues having about 3,000 players. Chelsea would have had some stats and at that time and his reputation was that of a keeper replacing DeGea in the Spanish team. They had a really short period of time within which to identify and sign a top keeper, proper scouting wasn't an option.

I suspect they looked under top keepers and who was for sale and did any of them have buy out clauses. Kepa was the only one and to their cost they got a wrong'un.
 

Tony247

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Chelsea wants Rice too? Crazy transfer window getting crazier for chelsea fans.
 

Mount's Goatieson

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Very disappointing game tbh. Shouldn't be conceding such sloppy goals if we aim to do better than last season. Obviously delighted with the comeback but we really should be beating Westbrom
 

Walters_19_MuFc

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Chelsea was always going to have a slow start to the season. Don't get me wrong, it was a sin to concede three in the first 25 mins against West Brom, but with the new additions they've added o the squad, it was always going to take them a while for them to click. A lack of pre-season has meant Lampard is trying to find his most balanced side during the season which, as a result, could potentially mean a drop in performances and results.

Once they find that balance and new additions start to settle, then I think they'll be firing. I do think that they should have invested in a world-class centre back, though.
 

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Thought Lampard did poorly today. Mount is simply not a wide attacker; he killed so many attacks for us. Once he was moved back to the 8, he was dramatically improved. Thought Havertz looked decent there as well and got himself into good positions.

What I didn't understand from Lampard is changing from the 4-3-3 we'd done very well in to go for some sort of 3-4-1-2 thing where we looked awful. CHO, who was an absolute menace, was moved from the wing to play wing back and thus was of little threat. Giroud and Abraham just got in each others' way, we had no one linking play properly through midfield so our buildup was crap, and James wasn't really free to make dangerous overlaps as he was playing RCB. I feel like we'd have won the game if we'd just stuck to 4-3-3.

Also, hopefully this marks the end of the Kante / Kovacic pivot. It just doesn't work, both players insist on getting forward (Kovacic to carry the ball, Kante to hunt for it) and the result is acres of space between our lines, which is then really exacerbated by our fullbacks being aggressively positioned. Jorginho for all his faults at least stays deep and is thus well positioned - in case anyone is wondering why we want Rice, this game demonstrated to a T why a player like him is needed.
 

LVGSdive

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Thought Lampard did poorly today. Mount is simply not a wide attacker; he killed so many attacks for us. Once he was moved back to the 8, he was dramatically improved. Thought Havertz looked decent there as well and got himself into good positions.

What I didn't understand from Lampard is changing from the 4-3-3 we'd done very well in to go for some sort of 3-4-1-2 thing where we looked awful. CHO, who was an absolute menace, was moved from the wing to play wing back and thus was of little threat. Giroud and Abraham just got in each others' way, we had no one linking play properly through midfield so our buildup was crap, and James wasn't really free to make dangerous overlaps as he was playing RCB. I feel like we'd have won the game if we'd just stuck to 4-3-3.

Also, hopefully this marks the end of the Kante / Kovacic pivot. It just doesn't work, both players insist on getting forward (Kovacic to carry the ball, Kante to hunt for it) and the result is acres of space between our lines, which is then really exacerbated by our fullbacks being aggressively positioned. Jorginho for all his faults at least stays deep and is thus well positioned - in case anyone is wondering why we want Rice, this game demonstrated to a T why a player like him is needed.
CHO changed the game when he came on. The attacking play had a lot more speed and options with him. Lampard always feels the need to demand more of him for some reason like he did in his interview after the game.
 

TheMagicFoolBus

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CHO changed the game when he came on. The attacking play had a lot more speed and options with him. Lampard always feels the need to demand more of him for some reason like he did in his interview after the game.
Yep, which is why it was even more bizarre that he was moved to wing back having had such a massive impact.
 

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Lampard seems to have realized that he needs an actual center forward in the side to make the attack more functional.

Chelsea have incredible attacking depth now but its also just a really inefficient use of resources. If we're not playing fantasy football or FM and just slotting in players to some kind of dream team, in most games they'll need a real striker and in most games Lampard will want two real CMs, particularly given their fragility at the back. So that leaves three attacking positions (wingers and one advanced central midfielder, whether a 10 or the most attacking 8 in a 4-3-3) and six really good players fighting for those three spots (Werner, Havertz, Mount, Pulisic, Ziyech, CHO). Depth and competition for places is great but investing such heavy resources into that area of the pitch just doesn't make a lot of sense while the CBs remain a weak link, the keeper situation is a bit dicey, and the CMs may be turning from a strength to a bit of a weakness as well.
 
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FootballHQ

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Think Pulisic is a massive miss for them with the way he was playing in run in. Team looks very narrow fitting in all the CMs and his pace is needed to stretch teams in final third.

Ziyech is injured I presume?

Lampard did o.k last year but will now be judged like any other chelsea manager. Miles off a title challenge and not winning a coup usually dosen't bode well for year 2 of a Chelsea manager's tenure.
 

TheMagicFoolBus

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Think Pulisic is a massive miss for them with the way he was playing in run in. Team looks very narrow fitting in all the CMs and his pace is needed to stretch teams in final third.

Ziyech is injured I presume?

Lampard did o.k last year but will now be judged like any other chelsea manager. Miles off a title challenge and not winning a coup usually dosen't bode well for year 2 of a Chelsea manager's tenure.
Ziyech and Pulisic are both out for another week or two is the latest report. Ziyech picked up a niggly knee injury in our preseason friendly.
 

Knux

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You know that other teams actually improved their back 4 since last year, right? And to finish 4 points clear is nothing to brag about. I don’t think a 35 year old Silva will improve your defence, I think it might give your fans some false hope actually. Rudiger and 35 year old Silva is probably the worst CB pairing in top 6 tbh.
I was quite right about this. But @duffer you still think Silva Will improve your defence and be one of the best CBs in PL this season? Your answer to my prediction was pretty laughable actually.
Chelsea Do not have a Top 4 defence, period.

United might have some CB problems this season but oh my..the meltdowns in here if we had Rudiger, Silva, Christensen and Zouma to choose from..
 
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Dancfc

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I was quite right about this. But @duffer you still think Silva Will improve your defence and be one of the best CBs in PL this season? Your answer to my prediction was pretty laughable actually.
Chelsea Do not have a Top 4 defence, period.

United might have some CB problems this season but oh my..the meltdowns in here if we had Rudiger, Silva, Christensen and Zouma to choose from..
You could have quite easily have shipped 6 at home to Palace.
 

Champ

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As long as Chelsea defend like that today, we really don't have to worry about them.
Lampard is living off the 'new team' excuse right now, won't last long if they carry on the same way.
 

Knux

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You could have quite easily have shipped 6 at home to Palace.
But we didn’t. And the topic here was whether Silva would improve your defence drastically which he wont.
 

Dancfc

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As long as Chelsea defend like that today, we really don't have to worry about them.
Lampard is living off the 'new team' excuse right now, won't last long if they carry on the same way.
You a City or Liverpool fan?
 

Dancfc

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Nice try,

You've got issues bigger than ours
Not quite sure how we finished level on points with you, strengthened the majority of our week areas and are now nothing for you to worry about. I'll accept that assesment from Liverpool and City fans, but it doesn't really add up you lot saying it.

And that's before we get into the fact that apart from whoever you put on the bench out of Pogba, Bruno and VDB you've got the square route of feck all in reserve.
 

Cheimoon

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They'll be fine for top 4 again I think, despite today's result.
They'll have to get their act together soon though. Although it would make it very interesting for the league if both United and Chelsea start poorly. Would leave 3rd and 4th place wide open.
 

Foxbatt

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Lampard has the same problem with Derby too, He has issues with defending and he needs a good defensive coach to help him defend. he might as well Terry back to chelsea as their defensive coach.
 

amolbhatia50k

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Their defense is horrendous. Ours has been rubbish of late too but at least we have the comfort of ours having been solid last season. But theirs is a real mess. Silva the "composure" signing comes in and showing them what they do if they don't want to improve at all, takes the case.

Early impressions of Havertz based on the league games I've seen is that he appears a tidy and potentially effective player but not sure there's a special talent there. But will have to see him over the course of the seasons to judge the player properly.

Been a pretty poor start by Chelsea. But given the additions they've made I think they'll finish in the top 4 this season. I expect them to be a good watch this season. But remains to be seen how good a manager Frank is and whether he can build a proper team or just one that bombs forward and doesn't really know what it's doing defensively. Contrary to what Chelsea fans thought, it wasn't just Kepa
 

gajender

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Lampard would only do well if he can ignore the price tag of his all new recruits and actually play his best eleven even if it means some of his new player's are left out he needs to field a balanced team rather than accomodate all his new signings which would become more of a challenge once all his players are fit.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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Nothing is surprising from the West Brom result, they are lucky that West Brom's defense is championship level. People were overhyping it because they spent massive this year. In reality, I don't see how Chelsea is any better than United. The only thing Chelsea has over United is the squad depth, their squad depth quality is miles better than ours. However, when it's down to main XI, I don't see any difference with our current one on paper.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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Still not buying them leaping a level above us.

Their defense is woeful and they don't have a great manager either.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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Not a chance. I'd not swap squads, managers, management, or ownership with you.
The managers are both on a similar level, so I'm not sure why'd you boast about that.

I'd wait until the end of the season before boasting about squads and management.
 

duffer

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I was quite right about this. But @duffer you still think Silva Will improve your defence and be one of the best CBs in PL this season? Your answer to my prediction was pretty laughable actually.
Chelsea Do not have a Top 4 defence, period.
Our defence finished top four. Unless you think adding Chilwell and Silva made it worse.

Also, did I say Silva will be "one of the best CBs in the league'? No, please don't lie. I said he'll improve our defence and one slip in his second game hasn't changed that opinion.

I say plenty of dumb stuff on here, you don't need to make things up.
 

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Odd game yesterday. We were probably better first half than 2nd half yet lost 3-0 first half and won 3-0 the 2nd half. Certainly in terms of chances created anyway. We were very fortunate to come back, created very little 2nd half at all despite having all the ball. We had 1 shot inside their box in the 2nd half until the 93rd minute. Really poor considering how the game was being played. Constantly kept going backwards as no one was willing to take a man on down the lines and running into dead ends. Pretty worrying as it points to us having no chance of breaking down parked busses again this season. James crossing was positive but Abraham was nowhere to be seen for most of them.
2nd goal was a shambles but the 1st goal is just a bit of a freak/great finish. Keeper probably should save it. 3rd goal suggests set pieces will be a big issue yet again this season, which is worrying.
Personally thought the defence looked improved yesterday under Silva (despite his error), we restricted West Brom to very few chances really, just a massive freak game that they were ever 3-0 up. Their Xg was around 0.8 I think and the 3rd goal accounted for the majority of it. Biggest worry for me was how poor Kante and Kovacic were.
 
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Feed Me

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Odd game yesterday. We were probably better first half than 2nd half yet lost 3-0 first half and won 3-0 the 2nd half. Certainly in terms of chances created anyway. We were very fortunate to come back, created very little 2nd half at all despite having all the ball. We had 1 shot inside their box in the 2nd half until the 93rd minute. Really poor considering how the game was being played. Constantly kept going backwards as no one was willing to take a man on down the lines and running into dead ends. Pretty worrying as it points to us having no chance of breaking down parked busses again this season. James crossing was positive but Abraham was nowhere to be seen for most of them.
2nd goal was a shambles but the 1st goal is just a bit of a freak/great finish. Keeper probably should save it. 3rd goal suggests set pieces will be a big issue yet again this season, which is worrying.
Personally thought the defence looked improved yesterday under Silva (despite his error), we restricted West Brom to very few chances really, just a massive freak game that they were ever 3-0 up. Their Xg was around 0.8 I think and the 3rd goal accounted for the majority of it. Biggest worry for me was how poor Kante and Kovacic were.
Lots of Chelsea fans keep talking about xG as though Kepa was the main problem. Well he was nowhere near the starting line up yesterday. The reality is that Lampard has major systemic problems to address. You’ve done a lot of business this summer but I struggle to see where your defensive improvements are going to come from.

I’ll also say it again – it’s amazing how much leeway Lampard gets. He needs time for his signings to bed in apparently. Ole doesn’t get any sort of backing and is then hammered widely for not doing a good enough job. Amazing double standards.
 

Mount's Goatieson

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If you think Lampard is up there... then :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol::lol::lol:
Neither is Ole so why swap in the first place? Isnt that like Cos 90°?
Still not buying them leaping a level above us.

Their defense is woeful and they don't have a great manager either.
Its probably this forum that I see so much fascination with United’s attack. All I see honestly is a bunch of above average footballers who can run very fast, a very talented but still too young Greenwood and the Penalty Lord. Thats why you do a lot better when you invite pressure and counter. IMHO, United need a lot of actual WC reinforcements in attack that'll actually bench their current crop or force them to improve their game. We did that for our crop from last season and the competition can only help them improve.