Totally get it, feeling numb about everything now, wins, draws, losses don't matter, groundhog day, feels like ETH lifted us (as has most of the managers post-SAF) but that he's got to the point (as have all the others) whereby the horrific disfunction outside the club is dragging them down...
Club Sale | It’s done!
- Thread starter JB08
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Surely this behaviour will affect a future sale too? Fool me once and all that? Surely the goodwill value will take a hit?
I think everyone needs to calm down, NDAs are there for a reason however the one absolute truth is that the Glazers are the greediest cnuts to ever walk this earth and my theory is something like this;
1. Early stages SJ/ Qatar were not sure that the Glazers actually wanted to sell so they lowballed them knowing that Ineos was simply a plan B option by the Glazers.
2. When Joel and Malcolm Glazer asked Khallefi to get involved, it proved that it was a state bid irrespective of what the Qataris say and the bid was aggressive and probably just a bit more than INEOS maybe £5.3bn plus the A shares purchase at maybe $32 each.
3. There was some dialogue 12 weeks ago and wrongly the Qataris jumped the gun and leaked information the deal was done with their own media and Bloomberg etc.
4. The Glazers stalled them, saying they would only sell for £6bn for their 69% stake, what prevailed was more radio silence with the odd rumour saying Qatar as done the deal and the Glazers were going to stay.
5. Nothing more then was really leaked until we heard from Custis and the Cardiff chairmen that United would be sold in October to November for 100% at £7.3/7.4bn which is what 100% would cost if you gave the Glazers £6bn for their 69% controlling shares, again speculation as we do not know that a 6th bid went in from SJ/92 foundation. This could be Raine trying to get the Qatari’s to make a final bid?
6. Then finally a few days ago, The Glazers are staying and taking the club private well even at $19 per share that would cost the 6 siblings about $1billion, they don’t have that in liquid cash not a chance, they owe $400m plus with the Tampa and united are losing money hand over fist!
This is brinkmanship once again and they may have pushed SJ/92 one step too far which is why the recent leak of the desperate clubs financial situation to the press may have come from the SJ side.
It’s simple if United finished outside the top 4/5 this season and they do not get at least £30m cash investment from the owner then with the FSP reducing to 80% next season they will have a maximum £50m budget before player sales. More seriously than that is the current toxicity of the club. Do they really have the stomach to be dealing with everything that’s going on with the club when they can not currently take dividends from the club due to its perilous financial situation.
Antony and Greenwood issues aside, we now have players on 350k per week falling out with the coach in the public eye, we have a fan base that are so depressed from years of mental abuse at the hands of the owners and we have a fractured soul that was always the part of an indomitable spirit of the fans, stadium and club always being together and more importantly, always believing that we were never beaten and could always come back against any opposition in any adverse scenario.
This unique story of the club has finally come to an end, destroyed by the greediest cnuts to walk the planet, people with no conscious, just pure avarice, I hope they don’t sell it, I hope the banks take it off them in 2/3 years and I hope we see Avram and Joel starring in ‘Trading Places 2’ the movie as the homeless bums on the street eating from the garbage cans, only then will justice be done and united fans will have the club back with a wry smile on our faces.
1. Early stages SJ/ Qatar were not sure that the Glazers actually wanted to sell so they lowballed them knowing that Ineos was simply a plan B option by the Glazers.
2. When Joel and Malcolm Glazer asked Khallefi to get involved, it proved that it was a state bid irrespective of what the Qataris say and the bid was aggressive and probably just a bit more than INEOS maybe £5.3bn plus the A shares purchase at maybe $32 each.
3. There was some dialogue 12 weeks ago and wrongly the Qataris jumped the gun and leaked information the deal was done with their own media and Bloomberg etc.
4. The Glazers stalled them, saying they would only sell for £6bn for their 69% stake, what prevailed was more radio silence with the odd rumour saying Qatar as done the deal and the Glazers were going to stay.
5. Nothing more then was really leaked until we heard from Custis and the Cardiff chairmen that United would be sold in October to November for 100% at £7.3/7.4bn which is what 100% would cost if you gave the Glazers £6bn for their 69% controlling shares, again speculation as we do not know that a 6th bid went in from SJ/92 foundation. This could be Raine trying to get the Qatari’s to make a final bid?
6. Then finally a few days ago, The Glazers are staying and taking the club private well even at $19 per share that would cost the 6 siblings about $1billion, they don’t have that in liquid cash not a chance, they owe $400m plus with the Tampa and united are losing money hand over fist!
This is brinkmanship once again and they may have pushed SJ/92 one step too far which is why the recent leak of the desperate clubs financial situation to the press may have come from the SJ side.
It’s simple if United finished outside the top 4/5 this season and they do not get at least £30m cash investment from the owner then with the FSP reducing to 80% next season they will have a maximum £50m budget before player sales. More seriously than that is the current toxicity of the club. Do they really have the stomach to be dealing with everything that’s going on with the club when they can not currently take dividends from the club due to its perilous financial situation.
Antony and Greenwood issues aside, we now have players on 350k per week falling out with the coach in the public eye, we have a fan base that are so depressed from years of mental abuse at the hands of the owners and we have a fractured soul that was always the part of an indomitable spirit of the fans, stadium and club always being together and more importantly, always believing that we were never beaten and could always come back against any opposition in any adverse scenario.
This unique story of the club has finally come to an end, destroyed by the greediest cnuts to walk the planet, people with no conscious, just pure avarice, I hope they don’t sell it, I hope the banks take it off them in 2/3 years and I hope we see Avram and Joel starring in ‘Trading Places 2’ the movie as the homeless bums on the street eating from the garbage cans, only then will justice be done and united fans will have the club back with a wry smile on our faces.
It does seem a big pull based on speculation, I imagine the Qatar one was inching closer at the time so I think there are implications. Understandably the Qatar driven spike went up since they released the info, this speculation is coming from the Daily Mail which you would think would have zero impact on United shares.
The main issue seems to be none of the Glazers can agree on a single aspect which is why it's going back and forth.
True on Ratcliffe, unless he still thinks he can salvage a deal.
They're psychopaths.
The ongoing sideshow that should be about a great football club has made me not to be bothered about results anymore, a loss in the past would resonate with me to spoil my days until the next game. I have to admit I am a very bad loser where my team is involved it is painful to see what is happening on and off the field for a supporter of more than 65 years. I have wonderful memories of standing in the Stretford End in the early 1960's, in tears seeing the team relegated in the early 70's and the refreshing play of the Tommy doc era.
I am now retired abroad but would love to participate in any protest against the leeches. I have unsubscribed from the United website and will not buy any merchandise or subscribe to M.U.T.V. I do manage to watch all the games live and kick or head every ball much like anyone who has played the game and is now an armchair or sometimes a standing viewer.
Glazers get the hell out of my club.
I am now retired abroad but would love to participate in any protest against the leeches. I have unsubscribed from the United website and will not buy any merchandise or subscribe to M.U.T.V. I do manage to watch all the games live and kick or head every ball much like anyone who has played the game and is now an armchair or sometimes a standing viewer.
Glazers get the hell out of my club.
Ah apologies. Yes, everyone is spouting nonsense when it comes to this sale.
RedCafe is a platform for me to moan about the Glazers I guess. I'm not watching another minute of football until they're gone. And if that means two years, so be it. I don't care about CL football and all that overrated crap anyway. We're not going to get near the final, so whats the point?
The club used to give me joy. When we were losing in the 80s, every weekend - I still felt connected. I hate the club now, with a passion.
If the club's doctors were ordered by the Glazers to keep the Antony allegations quiet, surely they are no longer fit and proper persons to be owners. Sometimes you must destroy in order to rebuild.
Fair. I suppose its different for me. I grew up watching united win the lot so the last 10 years or so feel like part of the cycle. My lad is absolutely in love with the game and united so it keeps me drawn in.
Hopefully the rats are gone soon so you can enjoy the club once again.
Odd how you hate the club for who owns it? I find that very random.
Maybe relegation is the only way out of this. I wonder if EtH may consider walking given the absolute shambles the club is in.
Shares dropping again, now $18.99. Opened at $19.48.
Again the only way is to cause protest mayhem. Stop a high profile game, massive demonstrations, boycotts of sponsors, social media campaigns, and we need more public statements from ex players. The fans can unite behind this if we create a social group. Someone like Beckham who has a voice in the US to create pressure.
Wouldn't blame him as this club is bad for your health right now and no signs of that improving
Wow. I lost like USD12 on this worthless investment already.
I’d say this club is worse for your partners health
Down to $18.88 now
I don’t agree that the Qataris didn’t think the glazers wanted to sell. I think they’re trying to hide it’s a state bid as best as possible or just negotiation tactics. How many times did we hear Ineos in the lead? Can SJ afford this? A final last bid from Qatar at the very death of the process. They can easily come in and blow Ineos out of the water in 1 bid and just be done with it.
If the offer was £5.5B and the Glazers wanted £6B, doesn’t sound like it would be hard to negotiate a successful outcome. Or do we really think Qatar and the Glazers have been waiting by their phones for the last 12 weeks, waiting for the other party to call them first….
All bids from both sides have been for the overall value of the club, Ineos could’ve offered £5B with the intention to own 50% meaning there offer was £2.5B
I think the real news is the part where you said Qatar and Bloomberg jumped the gun, I think that’s where SJ was the exclusive party and a deal had been or was close to being agreed in principle and now it’s a matter of completing everything relevant to get the sale over the line including clearing it with the football governing bodies. I believe this took Newcastle 12 months but they had some big issues around illegal streaming in SA.
Infomation was strategically leaked at the beginning of the process to up the bids but now the NDAs have kicked in for real. As mentioned in the AGM questions, the outcome will be shared to the NYSE when there is news.
No information should be leaking out and if anyone had it, I’m certain it wouldnt be some sporting publication, the majority of them have zero knowledge on football transfers so how are they getting news from the top of these companies over a sale……
Nothing to do with Custis but I think this completes by Xmas.
I’m still holding my shares. There’s going to be a serious class action lawsuit from the minority share holding hedge funds if they choose to act in their own interests rather than the club/stakeholder/shareholder interest as they promised in their official club statement.
I also still just do not see how it’s financially viable for them to continue running this club.
I also still just do not see how it’s financially viable for them to continue running this club.
Surely the shares prices dropping is a bad thing for the glazers? Maybe if they continue to drop, the glazers might actually sell? Or is this wishful thinking?
I mean it’s not costing them anything unless they are selling and they’re not selling on the public market so it doesn’t really make a difference to them.
It could impact their ability to get minority investment though.
Tread careful, chief.
They've never officially stated the club is definitely for sale. You may hold up Ratcliffe, though, they'll probably manage to worm it.
Yeah can't be easy for his wife
That makes sense, but wouldn’t the lower prices dropping the value of the club to potential buyers (assuming they want to sell at some point)?
The price was $13 when they started the process and they asked for and have offers for around $35-38 so no I don’t think it effects the price of a private sale.
It’s a punt. It’s not going to bankrupt me if it goes back to $13. I know the risks and that it’s not certain.
How much did you invest?
That’s none of your business
Nick Speed (I know) is claiming that Raine Group are speaking to Reuters tomorrow about the sale.
Let’s give Wall Street Rumours more credit than they deserve and assume they are correct and that’s actually happening, it would explain the sudden drop in share price if it’s bad news as there is always insider trading.
This is the biggest misconception of the bid for the very last time all bids were for 69% of the Glazers controlling stakes the enterprise value of £6bn or $7.3bn to buy all of the Glazers Class B controlling shares, after that has been agreed of which the current debt would have to be subtracted from that payment because the existing debt is overwritten by the Glazer Family, when Malcolm dies the siblings inherited all of his assets but also all of his debts. That means that should they sell the club in 100% sale and delist from the NYSE they must pay the existing debt owed to the bank and other investors, rumoured to be £535m plus credit card of £170m, they would not have to pay the £304m amortised debt owed to other football clubs because those payments are guaranteed by the club not the Glazers.
There are 54 million class A shares which are currently valued at $19, the Glazers can not negotiate an enterprise value for these shares because they only own 4.3% of these Shares. The new owner would have to negotiate a fair enterprise offer under Cayman law per share to purchase the remaining shares so for the very last time how can the Glazers negotiate a share price to sell for major investors like Lindsell train LTD, Ariel investments, Eminence Capital, Pentwater Capital and Morgan Stanley without their input or agreement that is why the figure being asked for and negotiated is purely for them to relinquish control and sell their B class voting shares.
It’s widely reported that a lot of these huge companies were looking for 36-38 dollar offer to sell their shares to SJ/92 Foundation. For the record that’s another $1.9-2.1 billion dollars on top of the $7.3bn they currently want. If and when this deal finally concludes, people will realise that the Cardiff Chairmen who said £7.3/7.4 billion to sell in October/ November was the only person to talk sense, not surprising really as he brokered the original club buyout deal in 2005 when Malcolm bought the club in a leveraged buy out!
I simply don’t understand why a simple statement can’t be released by Glazers or the acting associate Raine.
It’s either a continuing and fluid on-going sale situation or the club is not for sale.
The Radio silence is deafening
It’s either a continuing and fluid on-going sale situation or the club is not for sale.
The Radio silence is deafening
Can someone please stick up a new thread seeking creative (and legal) ideas from the Utd fanbase on what action fans or fan groups can take to force the Glazers out the door. Be great to see what we can come up with.
It shouldn't be hard. A concerted, well-planned and illegal operation could work wonders. If done well no-one needs to go to jail. Find their weakness and squeeze
Sort of like the capitol riots. Speaking of which one ringleader got 22 years.
I do believe that we are getting towards the end point of this saga and I do think that the Glazers will sell to the 92F, I also suspect that it is the takeover and the prospect of working under new owners that is keeping Ten Hag from walking away at this point.
Wasn't done well. Also, I'm not suggesting some overt operation. A handful of carefully picked, skillful operators could set up a situation where the Glazers choose to sell. Not forced to
You got to make them an offer they cannot refuse. Plata o plomo.
I cannot envision a scenario where they release a statement in line with what the Mail reported.
If they use that rationale for not selling now and we have confirmation that 92F's bid cleared and offered a full buyout at a massive premium to the market price, they are going to face lawsuits. Again, I have no idea if those would stick, but it would be a major pain in the arse for them to deal with at minimum. It's one thing to have no accountability to fans of the club, but they do have a fiduciary responsibility as directors when it comes to the investors.
The most scrumptious part of this to me is how they could have avoided this altogether had they not publicly offered any shares. The thought of their greed back then biting them in the arse now is just poetic.
For justice, we must go to Don Corleone
202.03 Dealing with Rumors or Unusual Market Activity
The market activity of a company's securities should be closely watched at a time when consideration is being given to significant corporate matters. If rumors or unusual market activity indicate that information on impending developments has leaked out, a frank and explicit announcement is clearly required. If rumors are in fact false or inaccurate, they should be promptly denied or clarified. A statement to the effect that the company knows of no corporate developments to account for the unusual market activity can have a salutary effect.
The market activity of a company's securities should be closely watched at a time when consideration is being given to significant corporate matters. If rumors or unusual market activity indicate that information on impending developments has leaked out, a frank and explicit announcement is clearly required. If rumors are in fact false or inaccurate, they should be promptly denied or clarified. A statement to the effect that the company knows of no corporate developments to account for the unusual market activity can have a salutary effect.
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