Other wingers have managed it? So I guess the same, or atleast not just run down a blind ally or run out of room
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If I was talking about pogba id mention more than just his passing, I would mention his touch, awareness of where his team mates are, physique, long range shots off the top of my head.
with James the only thingthat gets mentioned is “oh well he runs around a lot”
Awesome, let’s see how far that gets us
Thanks mate. I can imagine James can be quite tough to play against when he’s on song. A poor man’s Park
I really think you’re overlooking stuff like non stop aggression, direct play, pressing and a solid positive mentality. If Rashford or Martial had James more aggressive traits they’d already be world class. If Pogba worked as hard as Fred off the ball he’d be undeniably world class box to box. I think you need a baseline level of intensity in this league to break even the smaller teams on a regular basis that a lot of our more celebrated players don’t exhibit often enough. Look at Shaw once he started running aggressively up and down and demanding the ball, different player altogether. He always had the quality on the ball but without the workrate and enough aggression it ain’t worth much.
I get that
But I don’t think the running around makes up for the average at best footballing intelligence and average ability on the ball.
Not for a winger, if you’re a midfielder like Fred it’s alright to not be modric on the ball because there are more elements to midfield
If you’re a winger for Man Utd you need to be a danger to the opposition goal and he isn’t.
im not a lingard fan, but I can’t argue against him being a squad player because when he comes on I feel like he could do something.
When I see Dan James I immediately presume we’re losing the ball, I don’t expect a thing.
Sure, nobody's said he's Park, but one of main reasons why Wales playing decent stuff is James and despite his limitations, he deserves praise no matter what.
I almost spat my juice out when I read it. There’s a chant in there somewhere, “Shit Dirk Kuyt, you’re just a shit Dirk Kuyt!”A shit Dirk Kuyt no less. That's a proper fecking insultThough Dirk is quite the looker now that he's had all the cosmetic surgery.
Also, I was unaware ol’ Dirk had been under the knife to get all that work done. A quick Google search shows that he’s very much going for the Duke Nukem look these days!
100% agreed. Just mentioned the Park reference in a United context but he’s clearly one of the better Welsh players and is making a great impression in the tournament.
What other wingers?
Anyone played wide does a better job
Let’s see the stats then, how many assists, how many chances laid on
Park and Nani were frequent starters in a side which glittered with names like Rooney and Ronaldo and Rio and Vidic.
None of our regular starters today would be anywhere near starting for that United 08 side. Or 09 or 11 perhaps but I’d have to think about that a bit more to be sure. Maybe Bruno.
Daniel James wouldn’t be allowed anywhere near the 08-11 sides, but the point is that the club has dropped significantly since then and that James is a decent squad player for this side, the one which we live with today and isn’t going to change significantly any time soon.
Not exactly breaking news, but we’re light years off the level of 08-11. We can thank the Glazers and Woodward for mismanaging the club over the last 8 years and putting us in a position where have to settle for James instead of Ronaldo…or even Nani.
surely you mean Rashford Pogba or Martial instead of Ronaldo? Or Ole vs Fergie? Last time I checked James had 900 mins in the league vs Rashford playing in 37 games? James isn’t the reason we aren’t winning stuff anymore but he seems to be a very easy scapegoat for lazy supporters who don’t want to deal with the hassle of going in on our big players who start every game regardless of performance or fitness or indeed a conspicuous lack of recent silverware. These lads are amongst the highest paid players in the country and they are our star players these days for better or worse
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well put
If we want to get back to winning titles then James needs to go. We need to buy quality that will bench our current starters
Personally I think first teamers need to be pushed by good squad players. We just don’t have that.
janes is a good enough squad player for this squad but is he pushing any of the starters in your opinion?
I’m going to waste all that time it’s boring, I’m going off his inability on the ball, he’s not a top 4 club player.
I’m afraid we may never get the answer to that particular question with Ole in charge. Maybe James just isn’t good enough to get more games but Ole simply does not rotate his key players no matter how badly they are playing or how tired they look. If you need 2 examples all you have to do is look at Martial phoning it in until he got injured and at Donny for what, 40 million and 5/600 mins in the league? A very expensive international player that isn’t trusted enough to rotate with Fred or McT until second is in the bag…. I find his use of the squad players to be perplexing to say the least. If James isn’t good enough then why did he buy him in the first place and then continue to play him all though his first season even after it was clear his form and confidence had totally dropped off? It’s Ole. Once you’re in it seems like it’s nearly impossible to get dropped or rested.
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Plenty of kick and run players have played for United, Antonio Valencia for example
besides how he manages it is irrelevant if he clocks up high numbers
Fair point but that could be partly down to the fact that he really doesn’t trust these players. By that I mean we’ve been behind in so many games, do you trust Dan James to get you out of that hole?
the VDB signing is more perplexing, he is a good enough squad player, the lack of minutes leaves a lot of questions
I wouldn’t be looking for him to come on and be the one to score two goals or something no. What I would do, no problem, is take the initiative and start him on the left instead of one of Martial or Rashford against the poorer teams where pressing from the front, crossing and high energy is more effective than dribbling inside. Where getting in behind and turning teams around is the most effective way to split the pack and break teams down. Where you can actually force a silly mistake out of defenders in the poorer teams instead of just running around like a headless chicken pressing the best teams and never getting anywhere near it
Rashford and Martial are constantly waiting for it to feet in the half space between midfield and attack. Your options can’t always just be dribble past 5 players or pass it backwards. Their style clearly works much better staying up 1v1 for quick counters against good teams that are trying to attack us. One of the lads was saying in another thread that Rashford is one of the lowest pressing forward players in the PL/European top leagues? That’s surely not the right approach if you want to win against a packed defence?
We need to be forcing mistakes as early on as possible to open stubborn teams up, playing high energy aggressive stuff as standard and then our class should take care of the rest. This eventually get the ball forward to a Rashford/Martial on the edge of the box is heaven for teams whose only tactic is to try to counter. No arial threat. No running the channels. No crosses from the left unless Shaw overlaps. No getting to the byline or getting in behind and no pressing from the front.
I don’t think James is as good of a player on the ball as either of the lads but he does offer those other things. Just simple direct aggressive and hardworking. Every team needs a few of them. I may be wrong but Im convinced at this stage that we are missing those fundamentals. Too often we act like we’ve already won games by virtue of showing up and then we get sucker punched while we overproduce basic moves repeatedly trying to find static forwards in non threatening positions.
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In my opinion both of you are missing the point. James doesn't have to pick a cross for any particular player. His job is to put it where it could be attacked in the air or the space on the ground. It is the job of the player getting on the end of the cross to be there. One thing a defender hates is to face his own goal when defending. Yes before Cavani we did not have anyone who was capable of getting to the end of the crosses. Players need to be used the best way they can play. It is pointless trying to make James into a Martial or a Henry kind of player.
But when I see Dan James in a United shirt I just shake my head. It just reminds me how far we’ve fallen. Back to the days of Ralph Milne and Colin Gibson when SAF
the problem with a high press is that it fails immediately if one player isn’t in the right position. I think that’s a coaching issue, we’ve had a long time to resolve it but we are probably one of the worst in the league with our press.
DJ can run and run all day but lacks the fundamental basics of the game at the Utd level and just being able to run snd close down isn’t enough for me personally.
I mooted a year or so ago that he should be retrained to an attacking wing back. He has the basic ingredients as his touch is like a defenders (Brucie had a more delicate touch than DJ ;-)
Tevez was the ultimate hounder of Centre halves but he also could play ball and wasn’t a regular starter. Here lies the problem
Ultimately, we don’t have a good enough team yet and we’ve dropped off in standards. Once we start getting better players in DJ will be finished here.
if we get sancho:
sancho
Rash
Greenwood
Amad
Pellistri
James
Possibly Lingard
Martial
where is DJ getting his games outside of a cold wet Tuesday night away at Hull in the League Cup? I’d rather we sold him if that’s the case and use the money towards an A lister type player, and like Scholes snd Butt and Becks etc give the youngers like Mejbri his chance in those games
How do you see DJs position amongst that list?
nice post mate.I wouldn’t be looking for him to come on and be the one to score two goals or something no. What I would do, no problem, is take the initiative and start him on the left instead of one of Martial or Rashford against the poorer teams where pressing from the front, crossing and high energy is more effective than dribbling inside. Where getting in behind and turning teams around is the most effective way to split the pack and break teams down. Where you can actually force a silly mistake out of defenders in the poorer teams instead of just running around like a headless chicken pressing the best teams and never getting anywhere near it
Rashford and Martial are constantly waiting for it to feet in the half space between midfield and attack. Your options can’t always just be dribble past 5 players or pass it backwards. Their style clearly works much better staying up 1v1 for quick counters against good teams that are trying to attack us. One of the lads was saying in another thread that Rashford is one of the lowest pressing forward players in the PL/European top leagues? That’s surely not the right approach if you want to win against a packed defence?
We need to be forcing mistakes as early on as possible to open stubborn teams up, playing high energy aggressive stuff as standard and then our class should take care of the rest. This eventually get the ball forward to a Rashford/Martial on the edge of the box is heaven for teams whose only tactic is to try to counter. No arial threat. No running the channels. No crosses from the left unless Shaw overlaps. No getting to the byline or getting in behind and no pressing from the front.
I don’t think James is as good of a player on the ball as either of the lads but he does offer those other things. Just simple direct aggressive and hardworking. Every team needs a few of them. I may be wrong but Im convinced at this stage that we are missing those fundamentals. Too often we act like we’ve already won games by virtue of showing up and then we get sucker punched while we overproduce basic moves repeatedly trying to find static forwards in non threatening positions.
the problem with a high press is that it fails immediately if one player isn’t in the right position. I think that’s a coaching issue, we’ve had a long time to resolve it but we are probably one of the worst in the league with our press.
DJ can run and run all day but lacks the fundamental basics of the game at the Utd level and just being able to run snd close down isn’t enough for me personally.
I mooted a year or so ago that he should be retrained to an attacking wing back. He has the basic ingredients as his touch is like a defenders (Brucie had a more delicate touch than DJ ;-)
Tevez was the ultimate hounder of Centre halves but he also could play ball and wasn’t a regular starter. Here lies the problem
Ultimately, we don’t have a good enough team yet and we’ve dropped off in standards. Once we start getting better players in DJ will be finished here.
if we get sancho:
sancho
Rash
Greenwood
Amad
Pellistri
James
Possibly Lingard
Martial
where is DJ getting his games outside of a cold wet Tuesday night away at Hull in the League Cup? I’d rather we sold him if that’s the case and use the money towards an A lister type player, and like Scholes snd Butt and Becks etc give the youngers like Mejbri his chance in those games
How do you see DJs position amongst that list?
Right but he runs the ball out of play when going down the channels so you could have crouch in the middle and it wouldn’t make a difference
You're of course correct that we need to buy quality that will bench our current starters if we want to get back to winning titles. But we're not going to buy enough quality in this summer that would force James off the squad altogether.
Say we go with my dream summer activity (which isn't going to happen):
Sancho
Grealish (unless Pogba stays, but it seems likely he will leave)
Varane
Kante (if Chelsea do bring in for Rice, although Chelsea would be daft IMO to swap Kante for Rice)
This is wildly speculative on my part as the Glazers can barely tie their shoes, let alone oversee the building of a title-winning squad. But my point is that even if we bring in Sancho and Grealish to supplement Rashford in wide positions, it seems clear to me that Greenwood is and should used as a CF with Cavani in 21-22. We have Diallo, very young of course but very promising, and we have Pellistri but I have no idea whether he's ready for United first team action -- probably not. Even with all these names on the squad, there's still room and a need for someone like James to come on in garbage time, during fixture congestion season and the opponent is a club like Norwich and/or when the inevitable injury crisis hits. That's all I'm saying. But no, I don't see James being a United player 2-3 season from now. The building of a truly great squad isn't going to happen all at once this summer.
Disappointing today but overall a good tournament from James.
If Sancho is arriving and money is an issue in signing other positions then it makes sense to move him on. It's apparent that his qualities are more suited to teams lower in the league.
If Sancho is arriving and money is an issue in signing other positions then it makes sense to move him on. It's apparent that his qualities are more suited to teams lower in the league.
Far from a fan of James, he's not United quality, but he's had a decent tournament. Put some good balls in to good areas consistently but nobody attacks them. One of Wales better performers.
Decent tourney. Needs to play continuously to have any chance of growth. A loan would be great if Amad and Martial are at the club next season and Sancho arrives.
This tournament showed the type of team where he could look decent and it's nowhere near where he's currently.
He was as he always was: dire, uninspiring, lacking real quality.
Shouldn't have been moved to the right today.
He can hold his head up high - created the most chances so far at the Euros.
He can hold his head up high - created the most chances so far at the Euros.
Any one got any decent tournament stats for our Dan I can silence my mates with?
A poor one?
Swansea?
Whoscored has him 6th in key passes per game:
https://www.whoscored.com/Regions/2...tics/International-European-Championship-2020
Appreciate that thank you but he doesn’t appear in the stats linked!??
Stop living in the past. This is why we are so behind because we are willing to settle for kick and run players with no brain. We need physicality and technique together not just the former. james is not required here.
I’m just saying that there is a time and a place for a player like James, but he will not get the kudos here because no one at United gets in the box enough to get on the end of crosses. So we don’t need traditional wingers. In which case we may as well sell if he doesn’t suit how we play.
It’s also a reason to be cautious about how successful Sancho will be
But his crossing is far from consistent. Everything in his game is inconsistent. He would be great for a team which isn't expected to win every game. But for a team like United, it's not enough to just work hard
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