Aye, true that.
David Moyes: That was a good performance from us...
- Thread starter CapeTownRed
- Start date
Aye, true that.
The performance was exactly what was expected with that line up. Giggs starting was an absolute shocking call.
He actually said we played well? Jesus... If that's playing well then I can't wait to see what he says if City give us a hiding.
He actually said we played well? Jesus... If that's playing well then I can't wait to see what he says if City give us a hiding.
Calling someone a drama queen and telling them to go watch the power rangers is insulting !
I would welcome your criticism about my opnion, but there isn't any. You are not saying why i shouldn't be frustrated about today's game or about the transfer window, why i shouldn't be worried, why i shouldn't find the comments from Moyes bullshit. You are just calling me a drama queen and telling me to chill and shut up ! As to others who are telling me i shouldn't have been promoted and i shouldn't even be posting here...
That has absolutely nothing to do with the content of my opnion and it is considered insulting from my side.
When i told you (and others) to feck off, i posted it in the context of you (and others) telling me as much as to keep my steam in, not vent my frustration and basically to shut up !
If a nearly 40 year old legend is our best option as a right winger on one of our hardest away game then our squad is not good enough.
I don't agree that this was our best performance this season, we created almost nothing and our passing tempo was slow and we where way to static in our positions.
Our midfield still lack pace, passing tempo and movement. Carrick had an average game and Clev where to predictable in the build up. Why didn't we sub Clev against Ando the last 15-20 minutes. Ando's pace and attacking instinct was what we missed in the last part of the second half.
Moyes approach to games like this is to cautious and defensive. This is not Everton. He need to change his mindset and realize that United always play to win.
Regarding his comments of our transfers I can just be quite until Tuesday morning. To much has been said already.
I don't agree that this was our best performance this season, we created almost nothing and our passing tempo was slow and we where way to static in our positions.
Our midfield still lack pace, passing tempo and movement. Carrick had an average game and Clev where to predictable in the build up. Why didn't we sub Clev against Ando the last 15-20 minutes. Ando's pace and attacking instinct was what we missed in the last part of the second half.
Moyes approach to games like this is to cautious and defensive. This is not Everton. He need to change his mindset and realize that United always play to win.
Regarding his comments of our transfers I can just be quite until Tuesday morning. To much has been said already.
To be fair, compared to the last two to three performances at Anfield, it was a marked improvement.
He is clearly protecting the players. Clearly we were well below par today. Notiably giggs, clev and young.
#MoyesOut appears to be trending due to the amount of people complaining that #MoyesOut is trending.
It was a poor performance but a lot of the issues were nothing new and will take time to iron out. His comments are quite standard, this early in to his tenure I don't think he's gonna say anything too harsh publicly.
For example the passing out from defence has been an issue for a while not imo. Vidic still has a good long ball on him but a lot of times he seems to kick the ball out of play and between him and Rio they're both extremely reluctant to carry the ball forward a little at the moment, maybe because they've both lost some pace. We're suffering more for this because teams are just covering Carrick and Clev isn't doing enough to make up for this. Add most the wingers not being able to pick the ball up and turn and you've got an issue. That will take time to get around.
Add to that we've got a lot of injuries to our most creative players, Rooney, kagawa, Nani, either not fit or not deemed fit enough to be involved. It's a big loss not having them as neither Valencia/Young have shown many signs of getting their cutting edge back against an organised team and Welbeck doesn't bring much creativity. Add to that a central midfield that is neither particularly solid not particularly creative and it's an issue.
I think that's one area Moyes can get some flack. We were very solid against Chelsea, utilizing the energy and strength of Valencia and Welbeck to counter Chelsea's players drifting inside. Once Rooney was injured to me it made more sense to go with that similar approach, control the game and then look to get better luck against Liverpools defence which isn't as good as Chelsea's and maybe utilize the likes of nani/hernandez later in the game.
We lost a sloppy goal and after that it's not like Liverpool attacked well we just simply didn't function and I think it was because the balance was off. We opted for two wide players who being on the flanks they were, weren't going to provide much width and it's questionable how good they are coming in. Add to that on the right side with Jones as well we had virtually no creativity there until Jones went off. I thought the lack of balance let Liverpool be in the game more than they should have been, as we kept loosing the ball and had to concede a lot of fouls breaking up the game. That ultimately cost us time to get back in it and got the crowd up.
It's a waste really because Liverpool weren't particularly good and they were without Suarez. This should have been at least a draw and probably 3 points. Not the end of the world though but hopefully re-enforced and thoughts Moyes had on strengthening the middle if he can.
For example the passing out from defence has been an issue for a while not imo. Vidic still has a good long ball on him but a lot of times he seems to kick the ball out of play and between him and Rio they're both extremely reluctant to carry the ball forward a little at the moment, maybe because they've both lost some pace. We're suffering more for this because teams are just covering Carrick and Clev isn't doing enough to make up for this. Add most the wingers not being able to pick the ball up and turn and you've got an issue. That will take time to get around.
Add to that we've got a lot of injuries to our most creative players, Rooney, kagawa, Nani, either not fit or not deemed fit enough to be involved. It's a big loss not having them as neither Valencia/Young have shown many signs of getting their cutting edge back against an organised team and Welbeck doesn't bring much creativity. Add to that a central midfield that is neither particularly solid not particularly creative and it's an issue.
I think that's one area Moyes can get some flack. We were very solid against Chelsea, utilizing the energy and strength of Valencia and Welbeck to counter Chelsea's players drifting inside. Once Rooney was injured to me it made more sense to go with that similar approach, control the game and then look to get better luck against Liverpools defence which isn't as good as Chelsea's and maybe utilize the likes of nani/hernandez later in the game.
We lost a sloppy goal and after that it's not like Liverpool attacked well we just simply didn't function and I think it was because the balance was off. We opted for two wide players who being on the flanks they were, weren't going to provide much width and it's questionable how good they are coming in. Add to that on the right side with Jones as well we had virtually no creativity there until Jones went off. I thought the lack of balance let Liverpool be in the game more than they should have been, as we kept loosing the ball and had to concede a lot of fouls breaking up the game. That ultimately cost us time to get back in it and got the crowd up.
It's a waste really because Liverpool weren't particularly good and they were without Suarez. This should have been at least a draw and probably 3 points. Not the end of the world though but hopefully re-enforced and thoughts Moyes had on strengthening the middle if he can.
It's a sign of a good manager, protecting his players, but I don't think what he said was far from the truth. Apart from the goal, Liverpool struggled to create chances and we did well considering our numerical disadvantage in midfield. Moyes simply has to address the space between the centre-backs and midfielders. There were too many occasions where Vidic and Ferdinand had to play long (in the second half) because Cleverley and Carrick were no where to be seen. Fit enough or not, Kagawa would have benefited greatly off the space in the middle. Even Nani managed to exploit the space twice when he came on.
I tell you what. The future looks so good. So many "experts" in here to choose from and here was me thinking we had a policy on wumming in here!!
Get some perspective people. We hardly get positive results at Anfield. Sir Alex would have put out virtually the same team.
Ah!! some sense!
T
That he may but if Fergie was there to make a mistake he was there to fix it. Fergus was always in for the win. Moyes can't change his negative demeanour, sorry but I don't think Moyes can change.
If Fergie managed to fix every mistake, we would have won a lot more games at Anfield
Moyes is the manager, Fergie has gone, Get over it or go support another team.
When we drew to Swansea at the Liberty Stadium last season, after an awful performance, SAF deflected the attention by claiming that Van Persie could have been killed by Williams' "clearance". Would people prefer the manager to give a textbook answer that he felt the team performed decently, or come out with some sensationalistic bollocks?
United were certainly the better football team today. Small margins lost us the game. Certainly not the best performance of the season. Swansea away was very good.
I agree. I think we were worth a point today. Last year we should have lost, even with an extra man.
The result doesn't bother me so much,
I hope Moyes is soon willing to take a more offensive approach. He don't have to gamble but sometimes a shake up can do good.
The result is not the biggest issue, a loss at Anfield is not the end of the day. What's bother me and many others is that our weaknesses is still there to see. That Giggs starts is not promising, our midfield is still to static and slow, our build up is to predictable and our passing tempo isn't the best.
I hope Moyes is soon willing to take a more offensive approach. He don't have to gamble but sometimes a shake up can do good.
Moyes needs to adapt or die. United is a club that stops for no one. United isn't Moyes project, he needs to get upto speed with the United philosophy to always going to go for the win.
Except it wasn't awful and all and our second half there was actually quite terrific.
Like people said, he's done nothing differently from what the previous manager has done quite a bit in recent years.
Moyes has inherited a good team, not perfect, and with clear flaws. He may rectify and improve it, he may not. It won't happen within a few months (though a decent transfer window would have helped...).
The same young Fergie who lambasted his players after winning a cup final at Aberdeen?
Moyes has just lost an away game to Liverpool! We're forgetting he got a fantastic result at Swansea, and Mourinho set his team for a draw at Old Trafford, and getting a draw was hardly a bad result. Give the guy a chance before we criticise.
And then apologized for it. Maybe we shouldn't look at that particular incident as positive or correct.
Tbf with the players available today there wasn't much more he could do. I thought he got it wrong, fundamentally changing the approach from the Chelsea game, but aside from that not sure what else he could do. A lot of the problems are to do with the players which is the problem when you've got to play a bunch of players not particularly suited to playing with each other.
I don't exactly remember today's performance as a bus parking exercise by us? Unless i saw a different game, we went for the win.
We lost away to Liverpool, I'll need to go into hiding when we get a result like City vs Cardiff, which every team gets once or twice a season anyway.
He could have not started Giggs and Young.
I must say that I found his comments concerning myself. It did sound like an Everton manager who had played one of the big teams and lost but were proud that they were at least 'brave' and not hammered.
Believe me if Fergie was still in charge the same reaction would have happened. No midfielder bought again so far. Losing to Liverpool. Creating feck all. When Fergie made mistakes he got criticised as well on here. Nothing to do with Moyes (At least not much).
And he would have been criticised for it.
You arent getting it. Show me where I said dont be frustrated...
Just deal with frustration better and dont say stupid things like "put a sock in it Moyes" and "we are truly lost" after 3 games.
Criticism is fine, I just think it's a bit over the top.
Well he is saying we played a very good game. I guess I am living in another world then, because in my world, I am usually feeling quite happy and confident and proud of the team when they played a very good game. But I am feeling none of those at the moment!
So yeah if this is his standard of a very good performance, then I think we are truly lost, because I couldn't even start to imagine what kind of game Moyes would label as a very bad performance.
None. When would the manager come out and say "We were terrible today. I don't know why they played like that." For that matter, do you remember Fergie saying that?
Fergie isn't Moyes and Moyes isn't Fergie. Expectations are totally different. Moyes can't demand the same kind of respect for his comments as Fergie could. What I'am trying to say is Fergie had proven himself before he was playing these mind games and making these kind of comments (saying we played well, while we clearly didn't). Nobody dare to question Fergie because of it, and when he said something it had an impact.
Moyes still has to prove himself and show what he can do with a team like Manchester United. When he comes out now, and says we played well, people are just linking this performance to the expectations of Moyes, and are saying, this is his standard. Fergie could say whatever he wanted, people knew what he was capable off with United, and people knew what is standards were. So when Fergie says, we played well, while we didn't, he says as much, as to shut up and look to the next game.
Moyes saying it now, makes him look like a clueless manager, who thinks he played a great game, while his team were actually nowhere. I don't expect Moyes to come out and say we played terrible, but I didn't expect him to say we played very well. There clearly were issues on the pitch and he could have adressed a couple. He could for example have said we played to slow, or that we lacked the creativity to break through the liverpool organisation and that those are points the team has to work on.
Jesus I am tired of the fact that on this part of the forum, there are so many nitpickers, that like nothing better than to have a dig at posters for sharing their true and genuine feelings... If you can't even vent your frustration about a match like today in a post match thread or about the manager's comments about the game in a thread like this, than were the hell can you?
It's not venting frustration, it's telling Moyes to put a sock in it for a diversionary comment about how we actually played well. All of a sudden people aren't talking about how bad we were, but how stupid Moyes' comments were. Meanwhile, team morale remains relatively unscathed.
I'am frustrated with the performance of the team today and I wasn't pleased with the comments from Moyes. So me telling Dave to put a sock in it, is actually venting my frustration. I guess I should have said, well said Moyes, clearly you are right, the team was brilliant today and played very well, I'am not concerned or frustrated about anything at all !
Learn to accept that there are people who are absolutely not amused by the state of affairs at the club. If you can't even be frustrated and annoyed about a match like this, following a transfer summer like we have, then WTF? Especially because things aren't really looking to improve much this season (window is almost closed). Apparently some people on here have already accepted a transition year, and have accepted that Moyes would go on to lose these kind of games, and are already looking to next season and next summer... but I want to see United do good this year, I want to see him strengthen this summer, I want us to compete this year and not skip it as a transition year! Looking how things are going for us atm, I am very frustrated, and if I can't even vent that on this forum (which is designed for it) than, I am sorry, but feck off !
State of affairs? What's wrong with the club? Fergie's left. What else? Are you annoyed that we haven't won all three games? Fergie won just one of them, and he was lucky to do that. You're ambitious, we get it, but I get the impression from you that if we weren't winning the league year in, year out, you wouldn't even know who we are. I also get the feeling that if we drop out of the top four, you'd suddenly lose your allegiance to this club.
Well there is the fact our entire backroom staff has been changed, there is the fact Gill left for Woodward. There is the fact we haven't made any signings while the window is almost closed. There is also the fact we already lost 5 points against teams who were far from brilliant, and there is also the fact we haven't been able to score a single goal in 2 games.
I would prefer if you kept your judgement about my allegiance to the club to yourself. I will always support this club, just like I support my home team in Belgium. They haven't been champions in 8 years and are going to one transition year after another (like Arsenal...). I still support them with all my hearth. I just really don't want to see United fall back to such a situation, the club is too beautifull for that.
What most people are doing is accepting that this could be a tricky time for the club. We've just lost a manager we've had for 26 seasons. That's more than my life. Realistically, to know what the club was like before Fergie, you'd need to be in your mid 30s. We've not got a new manager, and it should take time to adapt, but in all honest, we seem to be transitioning much quicker than I expected. I didn't expect four points from four games. I wouldn't want less, but it was a realistic possibility.
I accept it is a tricky time. That is why I find it even more necessary than ever to strenghten the team (which we aren't doing). I accept the results can't immediatly be the same as under Fergie, but I do expect a club like United to be competing for the title and I expect them to get atleast past the group stages in the CL, even with a tricky group like we have. I don't think that is too ambitious. Without signings and seeing us play the way we have against Chelsea and Liverpool today, I fear that won't even happen. I don't want to simply roll over and accept it, I think United should do better, I think they can, and i think a club like this deserves it !
If you don't want to read posts venting their frustration or sharing their concern, perhaps you shouldn't be reading post match threads like this, especially not right after a game, which has been more than frustrating!
Thx i guess...
We have a quote system
You're totally missing the point. You're saying David Moyes is clueless, when you're the one who's clueless. You don't seem to understand that David Moyes is deflecting attention away from the team and onto himself. Fergie did it all the time. Did you call Fergie clueless?Thx i guess...
In short, don't take what David Moyes said seriously. I mean, don't pay any attention to it at all, it means nothing.
Very different though. Aberdeen had won the cup and Fergie had been their manager for years and they had had a successful season. Lambasting players publicly following a defeat, especially in a new job, is not done by top managers and Fergie very rarely did it, especially in his early years. Remember the consequences for Keane when he did it. He was released.
There is nothing to be gained by publicly criticising players after three games as manager. Surely this is just blatant common sense.
Who would he have played? We saw nani clearly wasn't sharp, same with Hernandez. We're all speculating on how fit kagawa is. Ando has only played a handful of minutes. Like i said I thought we got it wrong with changing the approach from the Chelsea game but he was limited in the options he had.