David Moyes West Ham Manager (Again) | European Champion

LawmanMan

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It was obvious by October 2013 that Moyes was out of his depth at United. He's a very good PL manager and has done a wonderful job at Everton and West Ham, but that's his level. Let's not be revisionists now.
Just like Alex was out of his depth coming on from Aberdeen. He was given time to adapt.
 

Big Ben Foster

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Just like Alex was out of his depth coming on from Aberdeen. He was given time to adapt.
My god, the "but Sir Alex!" excuse again.

We could have given Moyes 200 years and he still wouldn't have been good enough.

If anything, we gave him too much time. Real, Barca, Bayern, and City would all have sacked him before Christmas. That's the benchmark we have to compare against.

And I say that as somebody who likes Moyes and rates him highly as a solid PL manager.
 

Plastic Evra

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Sounds like Alex quit on a dime so there wasn’t really time to do anything like that. Had Moyes just stayed at Everton he probably would have been much better off. He had just signed John Stones and would have spent the Moshiri money far better than the clowns who came in after him.

A Moyes Everton with Lukaku would have probably finished top four.
Yeah and he most likely wasn't the first choice as been documented in a couple of books.

People seem to forget that he lost the dressing room. He walked into the club with a weirdly big ego and it didn't come off well with the staff, or the players. No matter how poor West Ham were, they still played for him. So maybe the spells with us and Sociedad humbled him a bit.
The big ego was maybe trying to cope and adapt to the big club with big stars, bringing the same level of intensity as the skipper.
He maybe learned something from the experience (that was poor for him).

Anyhow that's not so much to do revisionist history. I don't know Moyes could have done better, fact is he didn't. I think there's some fairness to say he was handed an impossible mission, in hindsight.
 

thegregster

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He is what is is. If your not a top 7 club he is a good option. His two PL jobs outside of United have had pretty decent results.
 

Zlatan 7

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People seem to forget that he lost the dressing room. He walked into the club with a weirdly big ego and it didn't come off well with the staff, or the players. No matter how poor West Ham were, they still played for him. So maybe the spells with us and Sociedad humbled him a bit.
I don’t think he did have that ego did he? I’m sure I read that he said to the players he isn’t used to winning so they need to show him how, might have been an evra quote and it made the players lose some respect for him. That’s hardly big ego. He just tried to make his own changes and maybe it was just too much too soon
 

LawmanMan

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He is what is is. If your not a top 7 club he is a good option. His two PL jobs outside of United have had pretty decent results.
Moyes got better than top seven regularly with Everton and he did it against teams on much bigger budgets.
 

stevoc

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I don't necessarily disagree though given the whole statement of intent implied he would have more to mould the team... at least when he signed. He did get less time that most managers after him (but they had better results).

Water under the bridge.
Question posed and answered there.

His successors earned their 2nd seasons.

Moyes had more than enough time to mould a team. Instead of doing that he spent his time agonising over what to write in the matchday programme notes, reading self help books and banning low fat chips in the canteen.

Out of his depth.
 

Plastic Evra

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He is what is is. If your not a top 7 club he is a good option. His two PL jobs outside of United have had pretty decent results.
He had a howler with Sunderland. Until taking WHU his record did cast some doubt on his Everton years.
Cheers to continued success (not against United please if possible).
 

AndySmith1990

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He's a good manager, just not a great one who is suitable for a club with ambitions of challenging for the league. West Ham are a good fit for him and it's nice to see him doing well. Bet Everton would take him back in a heartbeat
 

GMoore23

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He's a good manager and never got a proper chance here. He had the hardest job in football history being the direct successor to Fergie. The next manager after the great man was always going to fail miserably as his players would never accept anyone else. Plus, the fact most of our top players were in decline made things even more hostile.
We should have brought in a scape goat first, then Moyes and he'd have had a much better chance. Not saying he would have been a success either way.
 

Koldbeer2021

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Define regularly.
If it was like today when 7th is often enough for European football Moyes would have only missed out in 2 of his 10 (I think!) full seasons with Everton. So far at West Ham he is 3 in 3, albeit he would have ordinarily missed this upcoming season.

So 11 out of 14 seasons at teams he has spent full seasons at, 12 put of 15 if you include the Man Utd season which was basically a full season. Thats regular by any standards.

He just seems to struggle to go beyond that point.

If West Ham were to replicate Everton's long term performances, I think few would be unhappy at the club.
 

Idxomer

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If it was like today when 7th is often enough for European football Moyes would have only missed out in 2 of his 10 (I think!) full seasons with Everton. So far at West Ham he is 3 in 3, albeit he would have ordinarily missed this upcoming season.

So 11 out of 14 seasons at teams he has spent full seasons at, 12 put of 15 if you include the Man Utd season which was basically a full season. Thats regular by any standards.

He just seems to struggle to go beyond that point.

If West Ham were to replicate Everton's long term performances, I think few would be unhappy at the club.
Oh, I think he has been mostly great for West Ham but he didn't finish regularly above 7th with Everton.
 

LawmanMan

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Oh, I think he has been mostly great for West Ham but he didn't finish regularly above 7th with Everton.
Everton under Moyes
2012-13 Sixth

2011-12 Seventh

2010-11 Seventh

2009-10 Eighth

2008-09 Fifth

2007-08 Fifth

2006-07 Sixth

2005-06 11th

2004-05 Fourth

2003-04 17th

2002-03 Seventh

2001-02 15th
 

stevoc

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Just like Alex was out of his depth coming on from Aberdeen. He was given time to adapt.
Absolute nonsense, SAF didn't take over the Champions and a squad that had never finished outside the top 2.

Utter shite.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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Just like Alex was out of his depth coming on from Aberdeen. He was given time to adapt.
:lol:

I actually can't believe people still think Moyes should have been given more time.

Him/Woodward that 1st season managed to ruin 26 years of SAF's aura and turned us into a meme club in 1 season. He should have been sacked before the New Year then.
 

dinostar77

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He's a good manager and never got a proper chance here. He had the hardest job in football history being the direct successor to Fergie. The next manager after the great man was always going to fail miserably as his players would never accept anyone else. Plus, the fact most of our top players were in decline made things even more hostile.
We should have brought in a scape goat first, then Moyes and he'd have had a much better chance. Not saying he would have been a success either way.
Yeh we needed a carlo ancelotti straight after fergie. Someone who has the medals as a player and a manager. Plus ancelotti rarely rocks the boat i.e. if its not broken dont fit it.

There would have been a inevitable slide in standards post fergie as will happen to city post guardiola. But ancelotti would have kept us in CL spots and still competing for the league.

Im sure i have read from more than one outlet that Guardiola was 1st choice, but when fergie had dinner with him in NY, he was at Barcelona and never hinted that he might leave. Then they wanted Ancelotti who had just signed a new deal with some club (cant recall who).

Maybe Moyes should have been given more time, but he made alot of mistakes when he arrived (vetoing thiago from barcelona being one). Losing Fergie and David Gill in the same summer should never had been allowed to happen.
 

Mb194dc

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Good to see some managers doing OK with the opposite of the high pressing possession dominance most teams try to play these days.

There's still room for top teams who are designed to counter as much as control games. Too boring if all teams just try clone Pep.
 

Plastic Evra

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Think they had a decent draw for Europa though Fribourg could be a though nut.

 

Rista

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He's a good manager and never got a proper chance here. He had the hardest job in football history being the direct successor to Fergie.
Hardest job only in the context of being an actual successor, as in carrying on with level of success of Fergie. He finished seventh. He was given more time than he would have been given by any other top club.
 

Plastic Evra

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Hardest job only in the context of being an actual successor, as in carrying on with level of success of Fergie. He finished seventh. He was given more time than he would have been given by any other top club.
Yes but you can't exactly uncontext it. Ferguson's tenure was not the norm (in top clubs or elsewhere, I can only think of Guy Roux at Auxerre as the only similar hard to kill dinosaur, coached the team for 40+ years, retired in 2005), United itself claimed they didn't want to be normal and inheriting a locker room of people breathing and bleeding SAF with no real transition was probably doomed. The club talked the talk but didn't do its due diligence or had the actual foresight to prepare an orderly succession.

Being flamboyantly performative about the history, the tradition, the exceptionalism only to operate as any other outfit is, in hindsight, fitting.
 

Stacker

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He made some weird decisions during his time here and I do believe the step up to United was too much for him.

That picture of him in the United office with the computer springs to mind; Totally star struck like a kid who just walked into a huge sweet shop and couldn’t believe it.

Happy to see him doing well though, seems a genuinely nice bloke who tries his best where ever he goes. Wish him the best.
 

united_99

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I mean nothing has changed. He was a decent or even good manager for a mid table or lower league team two decades ago and he is still that. Fair play to him that he is still in the game but he never was and never will be a good fit for a top team.
 

Abraxas

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Good manager as long as he's nowhere near a club like ours.

He wasn't "unlucky" or on a hiding to nothing here. He was incompetent. There's a difference. It wasn't an impossibility to do that job, certainly to a better level than he managed. It was a very hard job, no doubt that but the incompetence with which he went about it sealed his own fate.

He didn't build any credibility in the group and failed to take good advice. I don't think you can come back after that and intimate that it was the fault of the job or the context, make the right decisions for the context then, that's why you're in the top job in football.
 

Plastic Evra

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It's not to absolve him really, but I think the club was incredibly cavalier and light in managing what was a gigantic task. Some people in charge really expected things would more or less continue seamlessly with minimal effort.

To think a lot of folk were tipping him as the the first manager to get the sack this season. Well that ain’t happening.
To be fair WHU operates weirdly and by all accounts from the supporters and people with some ITK credentials, he was really close to getting the sack last year. His team of assistants was downsized too, I believe ? The club is in the middle of a potentiel takeover by a Czech businessman, the acting boss (Sullivan, is it ?) is the typical executive who loves himself a glamour signing and a bunch of skeletons in the closet. The long period of inactivity in July gave the impression that the new technical director from Germany was perhaps at odds with Moyes.

They didn't do everything they should have in that transfer window but it's a decent recruitment and one merging both Moyes targets while conforming with management's objectives (they recruited younger).

Supps still think they might be a little thin to deal with all competitions but it seems they shouldn't struggle to clear the 40 points.
Also could be back for Maguire or McT in January to reinforce for Europa knockouts, if they qualify (I think they could still do with homegrown players).
 

DJBillRemfry

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Moyes is a very good fit at West Ham.

It's a club that gets 60,000 plus at every home game but which is mostly unencumbered by the baggage of it's past. No one at West Ham will beat on him for not winning multiple league titles. He will get afforded a level of patience that he wouldn't get elsewhere.

Likely to finish between 60 and 70 points this year.
 

LawmanMan

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It's not to absolve him really, but I think the club was incredibly cavalier and light in managing what was a gigantic task. Some people in charge really expected things would more or less continue seamlessly with minimal effort.



To be fair WHU operates weirdly and by all accounts from the supporters and people with some ITK credentials, he was really close to getting the sack last year. His team of assistants was downsized too, I believe ? The club is in the middle of a potentiel takeover by a Czech businessman, the acting boss (Sullivan, is it ?) is the typical executive who loves himself a glamour signing and a bunch of skeletons in the closet. The long period of inactivity in July gave the impression that the new technical director from Germany was perhaps at odds with Moyes.

They didn't do everything they should have in that transfer window but it's a decent recruitment and one merging both Moyes targets while conforming with management's objectives (they recruited younger).

Supps still think they might be a little thin to deal with all competitions but it seems they shouldn't struggle to clear the 40 points.
Also could be back for Maguire or McT in January to reinforce for Europa knockouts, if they qualify (I think they could still do with homegrown players).
Moyes has always recruited young players and helped blood young players too. Signed guys like Coleman, Lescott and Stones. Also developed players like Rooney, Pickford and Rice.
 

Ludens the Red

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Should have got rid in the summer. Had him bow out with that conference win. Taken them as far as he could. His style of football is being wasted on one of the best West Ham squads in years.
 

Frank Grimes

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His terrible league form is not spoken about enough. He lost 25 of his last 49 games in the league.
West Ham have some very good players. Unpopular opinion but he only did what he should winning Europa Conference last season, not a big achievement imo. Easy to see he has a lot of friends in UK media.
 

Ludens the Red

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He just knocked Arse out the cup midweek
see below post.:.

also not sure knocking Arsenals second string out the league cup is particularly noteworthy.
His terrible league form is not spoken about enough. He lost 25 of his last 49 games in the league.
West Ham have some very good players. Unpopular opinion but he only did what he should winning Europa Conference last season, not a big achievement imo. Easy to see he has a lot of friends in UK media.
 

Ballache

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Should have got rid in the summer. Had him bow out with that conference win. Taken them as far as he could. His style of football is being wasted on one of the best West Ham squads in years.
I agree with this, West Ham actually have a lot of talented players especially in midfield.