Does it actually matter if we don't get into the Champions League?

[Feed Me]

Let's be honest, our commercial operation is such that a season out of the completion won't make a real difference.

Heck, we crashed out at the group stage this season anyway, so I can't imagine it'll have been that much of a cash cow.

With the mega TV deal coming into effect next season, we won't be short of a bob or two, although, granted, that applies to the rest of the league too.

I'd say the reason Van Gaal is being extended so much patience is that we don't *need* CL football in the short term.

Does anyone agree with this?

 

[Xivon]

Football isn't (all) about money, especially for a club of your stature.

 

[Adam-Utd]

Perhaps not for cash terms, but if it keeps happening sponsors won't want us and players won't want to join either. We obviously budget for the CL group stage money and when we don't get it it messes things up.

We can afford to miss another season but if it keeps happening it will definitely effect us

 

[AkaAkuma]

Personally, I dont see the point if we arent competitive. I think we need to be beating midtable premier league clubs before we set our sights higher.

It may make us less attractive for some players though.

 

[Gopher Brown]

Does it actually matter if we never win another trophy?

 

[2 man midfield]

Once, perhaps not. But twice yes. We all said that on here when Van Gaal took over, another season without is unforgivable.

 

[Nanook]

Don't we lose £20m from the Adidas deal if we don't qualify?

 

[Damien]

Whichever way you look at it, being out of the CL two out of three seasons isn't good and it would prevent us from making certain signings. Like a couple of seasons ago van Gaal namedropped Sanchez as a player he'd like but Arsenal being in London and having the CL made them infinitely more attractive

 

[Feed Me]

Does it actually matter if we never win another trophy?

I'm not saying this is an acceptable attitude, by the way. Just speculating as to why Van Gaal is getting so much patience. When you look at how poor we are, and some of the stats make for grim reading, I can only conclude that the club has calculated that CL football isn't imperative. Otherwise, surely a change would have been made by now.

 

[Damien]

Don't we lose £20m from the Adidas deal if we don't qualify?

That was if we didn't qualify last season. Don't think it'd have the clause every single season though who knows

 

[Feed Me]

Don't we lose £20m from the Adidas deal if we don't qualify?

Not sure. Can anyone confirm?

 

[Raees]

Embarrassing that people consider this acceptable and normal now.

 

[JinnerJamie]

Don't we lose £20m from the Adidas deal if we don't qualify?

Only if it happens 2 seasons on the bounce.

 

[Sky1981]

Let's be honest, our commercial operation is such that a season out of the completion won't make a real difference.

Heck, we crashed out at the group stage this season anyway, so I can't imagine it'll have been that much of a cash cow.

With the mega TV deal coming into effect next season, we won't be short of a bob or two, although, granted, that applies to the rest of the league too.

I'd say the reason Van Gaal is being extended so much patience is that we don't *need* CL football in the short term.

Does anyone agree with this?

Having a fever once in a while is good, having 3 nights of fever means there's something bad going in your body.

Liverpool demise dont start over a season, neither our rise to dominance starts over a season

 

[Feed Me]

Embarrassing that people consider this acceptable and normal now.

As I've said above, I'm not trying to say it's acceptable, although it is certainly becoming normal. I'm trying to understand the motivations of the board in keeping faith in our busted flush of a manager. I can only conclude that they're prepared to back him until the season's end because CL qualification ultimately doesn't matter for the business plan, at least in the short term. The club clearly doesn't want to be seen as dispensing with managers in the same way clubs like Chelsea and Real Madrid do.

 

[Akshay]

We need to buy players in the summer and will need both money and CL football to attract the best. So yes, I'd say it matters a great deal.

 

[Nanook]

That was if we didn't qualify last season. Don't think it'd have the clause every single season though who knows

Not sure. Can anyone confirm?

Only if it happens 2 seasons on the bounce.

Yeah it's consecutive seasons, it gets cut 30% so £22m. Adidas can also cancel it if we get relegated

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/28581355

 

[goin4glory]

Of course it hurts us don't be so ridiculous. We immediately lose 50m minimum in revenue between the Adidas deal/ticket sales and TV money. Not to mention the damage it does to the club in future negotiations with sponsors. On the footballing side it's very damaging to our chances to signing top quality players or keeping the world class players we already have I.E DDG/Martial.

 

[MoskvaRed]

The club is able to sign commercial mega deals on the back of its perceived glamour and prestige. If we carry on our current trajectory in the champions league (last 5 seasons - group stage, last 16, QF, did not qualify, group stage - followed by a failure to qualify in 2016-2017) then at some point someone will point out the emperor is short of clothing.

 

[JustFootballFan]

Let's be honest, our commercial operation is such that a season out of the completion won't make a real difference.

Heck, we crashed out at the group stage this season anyway, so I can't imagine it'll have been that much of a cash cow.

With the mega TV deal coming into effect next season, we won't be short of a bob or two, although, granted, that applies to the rest of the league too.

I'd say the reason Van Gaal is being extended so much patience is that we don't *need* CL football in the short term.

Does anyone agree with this?

Problem is that you put an extra 20-40M into the pockets of capable people at places like Tottenham or Leicester. If Spurs can keep their young squad and strengthen it, you suddenly have a five way fight for four CL spots every year and Liverpool won´t lay down either under Klopp.

 

[didsbury1982]

Football isn't (all) about money, especially for a club of your stature.

Couldn't agree more.

 

[Gopher Brown]

I'm not saying this is an acceptable attitude, by the way. Just speculating as to why Van Gaal is getting so much patience. When you look at how poor we are, and some of the stats make for grim reading, I can only conclude that the club has calculated that CL football isn't imperative. Otherwise, surely a change would have been made by now.

I think the board's attitude is that we have a better chance to get 4th with him than if we disrupt our season mid-way.

It's a very conservative, and ultimately foolish idea though. We will see though.

 

[K2K]

Didnt Woodward brief the press after our elimination in the champions league that it wasnt a worry due to the money in the league?

Financially it'll be a hit, but the new premier league money means we can cushion that blow. I think there is a high likelihood of us not being in the UCL next season, and the board will have thought of that retaining our current manager.

How good is the money in the Europa league?

 

[K2K]

Football isn't (all) about money, especially for a club of your stature.

For the fans, yes. But we dont really matter. If fans boycott games for example, someone else can replace them.

Manchester United is a business. A very succesful one on the commercial side. As long as we meet our financial objectives , investors are happy, the share price goes up, the owners get a return on their investment and life goes on. We are on course to generate record revenues next year, have good sponsorship agreements , so we can afford a model where we dont really win anything.

 

[Andy_Cole]

We will do because our board are incapable of making quick decisions. Too slow to sack Moyes, now too slow to sack LVG. Whilst everyone else manages to secure the best available managers. We'll be left with Giggs and next thing we know, we won't be making top for for the next 5 seasons.

 

[Varun]

Since when has football become all about the money even for fans? I want to see us play against the top European teams, we need CL football for that.

 

[Feed Me]

Having a fever once in a while is good, having 3 nights of fever means there's something bad going in your body.

Liverpool demise dont start over a season, neither our rise to dominance starts over a season

I don't disagree. The question I'm asking is, is the club keeping Van Gaal in place because they don't think CL qualification next season matters that much? I'm just trying to work out the rationale of keeping a manager who has presided over the following run:

10 points from 10 games.
16 goals from 16 games.
The least shots on target at home amongst the top 92 clubs in England.

It's grim.

 

[Devil81]

It's not a worry because of the Premier league money???

So let me get this straight, City & Arsenal get the Premier league money plus the continued money from the Champions league. Of course it's a worry when you rivals are banking all that extra cash.

It's not a worry because the Glazers debt is being paid more like, and it's not a worry as they are also getting a sizable chunk to fund their lifestyles.

 

[Nanook]

Didnt Woodward brief the press after our elimination in the champions league that it wasnt a worry due to the money in the league?

Financially it'll be a hit, but the new premier league money means we can cushion that blow. I think there is a high likelihood of us not being in the UCL next season, and the board will have thought of that retaining our current manager.

How good is the money in the Europa league?

It's pretty shit, you get about €10m for winning it in prize money. That doesn't include market pool which would be worth an extra few million for United. We would probably earn more in ticket sales than from the competition itself.

 

[Feed Me]

We need to buy players in the summer and will need both money and CL football to attract the best. So yes, I'd say it matters a great deal.

Even with CL football we were not able to attract the best. Perhaps we need to start being more savvy in the market and snare those players on the cusp of something great.

 

[Feed Me]

Of course it hurts us don't be so ridiculous. We immediately lose 50m minimum in revenue between the Adidas deal/ticket sales and TV money. Not to mention the damage it does to the club in future negotiations with sponsors. On the footballing side it's very damaging to our chances to signing top quality players or keeping the world class players we already have I.E DDG/Martial.

If it damages us so much, why is the board seemingly gripped by decision making paralysis. Make no mistake, if things stay as they are, we won't get top four. In that context, you'd think VG would be gone by now, yet he seems totally secure. I can only conclude that the club is prepared to miss out on the CL.

 

[JPRouve]

For the fans, yes. But we dont really matter. If fans boycott games for example, someone else can replace them.

Manchester United is a business. A very succesful one on the commercial side. As long as we meet our financial objectives , investors are happy, the share price goes up, the owners get a return on their investment and life goes on. We are on course to generate record revenues next year, have good sponsorship agreements , so we can afford a model where we dont really win anything.

The business is successful because of on field success, without it, the club will ultimately have less sponsors and each of them will offer less money, the model that you are describing isn't viable unless you do a Real Madrid, sign galacticos and actually compete in the best competitions, winning isn't important but competing is crucial.

 

[Feed Me]

I think the board's attitude is that we have a better chance to get 4th with him than if we disrupt our season mid-way.

It's a very conservative, and ultimately foolish idea though. We will see though.

If that's the board's rationale, then, frankly, it's absolute lunacy. VG is done.

 

[Hed Zitin]

Anything that helps attract players is worth it and CL hugely helps. Foreign players want money and then to play in the CL. I don't think they give that much of a toss about league football.

 

[Crossie]

Let's be honest, our commercial operation is such that a season out of the completion won't make a real difference.

Heck, we crashed out at the group stage this season anyway, so I can't imagine it'll have been that much of a cash cow.

With the mega TV deal coming into effect next season, we won't be short of a bob or two, although, granted, that applies to the rest of the league too.

I'd say the reason Van Gaal is being extended so much patience is that we don't *need* CL football in the short term.

Does anyone agree with this?

I disagree entirely, for the many reasons that others have pointed out already. It also matters though how you missed it. If you end up being 6th or even 7th with the same brand of football you play now, it'll hurt you much more than coming in 5th and having played a more attractive football (creating more and higher quality chances that is) but just were unlucky, e.g. due to some game deciding decisions by referees.

 

[Sarni]

It doesn't matter that much to me. It will be a hit financially but it's not like we enjoyed this year's campaign, we were even worse than in the league at times and it was very bad in a poor group.

 

[Feed Me]

I disagree entirely, for the many reasons that others have pointed out already. It also matters though how you missed it. If you end up being 6th or even 7th with the same brand of football you play now, it'll hurt you much more than coming in 5th and having played a more attractive football (creating more and higher quality chances that is) but just were unlucky, e.g. due to some game deciding decisions by referees.

I am at pains to say that the OP doesn't reflect my opinion. I'm merely trying to understand the decision making process of the board. At any other club of similar stature to us, the manager would be gone by now. We're gripped by this pathetic sense of romanticism and it's causing grave harm. It's the reason we appointed Moyes, it's the reason we don't want to sack Van Gaal and it's the reason we'll make the terminal error of giving it to Giggs down the line.

This is really simple stuff when you look at it in the cold light of day - get Mourinho.

 

[Akshay]

Even with CL football we were not able to attract the best. Perhaps we need to start being more savvy in the market and snare those players on the cusp of something great.

When we had consistent CL football (i.e. Sir Alex days) we didn't open the purse-strings enough. When we did, we didn't have the status to bring in the best. I like the idea of buying players to mold into the next stars as much as anybody, but it's very risky when you don't supplement it with established top class players. We have very few of those.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

Even with CL football we were not able to attract the best. Perhaps we need to start being more savvy in the market and snare those players on the cusp of something great.

We were able to attract a decent level of players, another season will make even those players think twice. We're on track of completing our transformation into Liverpool, and just look at their lack of quality players.

 

[Amar__]

Even if it's acceptable in general how exactly can they keep faith in a manager who can't get us top4? Even if CL is spred to six places in premierleague finishing out of top4, hell even outside top3 is unacceptable with so much money spent and especially with this brand of football, and the team is far from poor.

It would be acceptable if this team is improving, but it's not, year and a half van Gaal is here and every week we look even worse. In which universe is that showing any signs to keep him?