There are Paisley gates but Shanks has gates too. I don't know to be honest.
Does Rooney deserve a statue?
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
Even though a large part of our fanbase can't stand him?
I think you're being a little pedantic there over the timing. There was a very quick change of mind from saying he's leaving to signing a new bumper contract.
Anyway let's pretend it wasn't about money. Rooney still threatened to leave twice when things weren't to his liking. That's fairweather loyalty. There's no real feeling for the club there. People make mistakes, I don't think there's a particular need to hammer him for it but equally you don't give a guy whose done that a statue. Not when there's the likes of Giggs and Scholes around.
Is his massive contract not recognition of his status? His name being chanted most weeks?
If I were him that would suffice. I wouldn't feel a lack of recognition.
He probably does deserve a statue, however as mentioned previously I think it might be prudent to wait and see how he conducts himself in the years after he leaves United.
I'm not talking about now, I'm talking about 20-30 years time. As someone else pointed out, it took 40 years for the other statues to go up. Hopefully you lot won't be harbouring silly grudges for our record goalscorer then, and can appreciate what he actually achieved here
No, as the statues we currently have are unique and relate to the storied history of the club. But they didn't go up for 40 years? Maybe in the same length of time in the future when the ill will towards Rooney has faded maybe. And hopefully in that time someone else will have surpassed Rooneys achievements and this argument will be irrelevant anyway.
Silly grudges? You can appreciate Rooney and still think he doesn't warrant a statue you know. As you do with many other ex United players.
As ever there's no middle ground with Rooney enthusiasts.
Our fanbase loves Rooney. He has sold more shirts than anyone else in our history. It's just a tiny vocal minority in the forums that hates him, but in 10 years they will be irrelevant. The goal record will be there for decades, sooner or later he will get a statue.
I knew about the gates but he definitely deserves a statue as well.
I'm not being pedantic mate come on it all happened over a period of months not days. Theres no need to pretend anything you can believe whatever you like but i'll go with Fergusons opinion on this one. Didn't really think it was about money then and still don't now. In 2010 as we know he was worried about the clubs ability to attract world class talent. It wasn't really his place to do so but you know what he was right, and the majority of United fans felt the same way at the time.
Does everything with Rooney always need to be dressed up so dramatically. He asked to leave privately because he was unhappy about something, players are allowed to do that they do it all the time. No one seems to have a problem with the club binning players once they are deemed to be past their usefulness.
Ronaldo asked to leave twice also, the 2nd time he asked to leave he actually did leave yet he draws virtually none of the dislike that Rooney does. It's bizarre.
I'm no Rooney enthusiast, not at all. But the stick he's getting is ridiculous. He's not just any ex United player. Let's look at som facts, shall we?
He's our all time leading goal scorer, captain for many years, leading goalscorer for the English NT, he's spent 13 or so years at the club, 6th in games played. He's been the talisman of English football for most of his career. All while playing for Manchester United, the biggest club in the world.
Adding to that, he's won the league 5 times, 1 FA cup, 2 league cups (soon to be 3?), 1 champions league (with another 2 finals). Add to this all of his individual honors, probably a few dozen.
I realize he's a polarizing figure. I realize his antics from a few years ago are difficult to forget about (and they shouldn't be forgotten either), but he's a club legend no matter how you put it.
People keep saying that "any striker spending more than a decade at the club could've/should've beaten the goal scoring record", but that's not really the case is it? His goals to games ratio is 0.458, which on its own is very good. Better than King Eric, better than Sir Bobby, better than George Best, better than Andy Cole, better than Cristiano Ronaldo (at United ofc). Robin van Persie has a better ratio, but he only lasted a few seasons. RVN had a great ratio, but his last two season were significantly worse than his best, stats wise. Denis Law could've done it, but he left for City.
The goalscoring record stood for 44 years for a reason. Absolutely fantastic achievment to break it, but people keep playing it down simply because it's Rooney. Heck, he didn't even play as a striker for half of his time here.
That said, maybe Rooney shouldn't have gotten as many games as he did. Maybe we should have let him go a few years back. But you can't blame that on him.
People might disagree with him deserving a statue, that's fine. But, in 20-30-40 years, he'll be remembered as an all time great, a true legend. People are blinded by the fact that Rooney is no longer the player he was 5 years ago, and fail to give him the credit he deserves. I agree we shouldn't build a statue today. But with time, in a decade or two, he'll be as deserving as anyone.
/rant
We played his statue a few times already, that's by far the biggest honour we've ever given out.
No no no no no. Unless you are a time lord, have been to the end of days and checked, NO. He is our highest goalscorer TO DATE. (Amazing amazing achievement, absolutely, but I hate it when people say whatever of all time.)
We should retire him too
No of course he doesn't and the OP knows he doesn't. I think it's a shame when people try to turn an incredible achievement into a thread they know will be predominantly people saying how he's undeserving of an accolade.
It's like attending someone's graduation and spoiling the day by asking "Is he going to be a company director yet?", forcing everyone to point out his 2:2 in media studies makes that unlikely but thanks for reminding us that he'll likely end up at McDonalds, we're so glad you came.
It's like attending someone's graduation and spoiling the day by asking "Is he going to be a company director yet?", forcing everyone to point out his 2:2 in media studies makes that unlikely but thanks for reminding us that he'll likely end up at McDonalds, we're so glad you came.
I don't think that's true at all. The fans began to give him criticism for the last couple of seasons when his performances have been poor, evidenced by the fact he's no longer a regular starter, but I don't think it's fair to say they can't stand him. People on the internet have a weird 'Batman villain' opinion of him but that's always seemed an alternate reality among the people who I know who're United fans in real life. The opinion of Rooney widely held by fans on the internet really bares no relation to my experience of what fans actually think in real life.
I am far from a fan-boy or enthusiast. In fact I couldn't care less if he does or doesn't get a statue. It just irritates me the reasons against, which pretty much boil down to "we don't like him so therefore he can feck off". Its a bit silly. Lots of clubs have retrospectively recognized their record scorers.
Precisely.
Its really not a minority. But we will agree to differ.
Many great players we have had over the years, many of who have been loved by the fans, Rooney not one of them.
Ref the record, he plays up front and has been with us for years, is it really "that much" of an achievement, i guess there is perhaps 50 pens in there too?
Le Tiss for example, similar ratio for a far far worse team.
It's funny, considering all he's won with the club and how he has become our record goal scorer, but I think there are a number of players who "deserve" a statue more.
Giggs and Scholes won it all, time after time, while being in our top 3 appearance record holders along with Sir Bobby. I'd actually like to see a statue of those three and Gary Neville, if we felt we had to recognise more players with a statue.
Maybe he will get one in time, but Rooney has won it all at United, is our all time top scorer and 6th on our all time appearance records, yet there is a debate. That says it all I think.
Giggs and Scholes won it all, time after time, while being in our top 3 appearance record holders along with Sir Bobby. I'd actually like to see a statue of those three and Gary Neville, if we felt we had to recognise more players with a statue.
Maybe he will get one in time, but Rooney has won it all at United, is our all time top scorer and 6th on our all time appearance records, yet there is a debate. That says it all I think.
not too sure about a statue just yet. How's about spraying him with silver spray paint from head to toe on games days,and have him stand still outside Old Trafford. Judge fans reactions, if it's favourable , then maybe have a sculptor commissioned to make a paper marche version of him instead of bronze to save money.
He does . I agree.
Anybody who has won more European Cups then Ferguson deserves a statue.
I just couldn't resist.
Soz la !
Nope.
I'd say so but not for a few years
26 or 28 pens not 50
No
There's no drama. I've simply pointed out he asked to leave twice. In the same post you quoted, in fact the next sentence, I said he doesn't need to be hammered over it. So no drama.
The Ronaldo point is a separate debate. This here is should he get a statue. I along with many others don't think he should, him wanting to leave twice being a big part of that.
Just the other day you said he should get a statue on retirement. Unless I've mistaken you for somebody else?
You're being unfair on those who don't, misrepresenting the argument as simply "we don't like him." It's not that at all. He's been a great player, a great signing. For many the bond just isn't there, him asking to leave twice being part of that. Which seems very reasonable to me.
You don't think Scholes should get one and you're not sure why Robson would. So not wanting a club legend to be remembered in this way should at least be understandable.
Why give a statue to a player who we all know as soon as he is no longer a united player will never care about the club again?'
Once Rooney leaves us or retires he will go back to cheering on Everton that's his first and one footballing love .. He came to us only for money and trophies threatened to leave for the same reasons
We won't see Rooney on sky or by when he retires going mental when we score like Rio or calling us We like Scholes and co
That's not a knock on him he supposed Everton that's his right he achieved what he wanted with us but there's no love there so shouldn't be a statue
Once Rooney leaves us or retires he will go back to cheering on Everton that's his first and one footballing love .. He came to us only for money and trophies threatened to leave for the same reasons
We won't see Rooney on sky or by when he retires going mental when we score like Rio or calling us We like Scholes and co
That's not a knock on him he supposed Everton that's his right he achieved what he wanted with us but there's no love there so shouldn't be a statue
Yes he does. The amount of titles he has contributed to with his goals over the last 12 years earns him that statue. As Fergie mentioned, that goal scoring record may never be broken.
you're missing my point though, the difference between Scholes, Robson etc and him. Rooney has broken the goalscoring record which stood for 44 years. A remarkable achievement. Its only on that basis that I believe that at some point in the distant future, he could have a statue.
I think he has about 25-26 pens and he's missed 9-10, he's not a great penalty taker it has to be said.
On how much of an achievement the record is to put into perspective Rooney isn't as good a finisher as Van Nistelrooy was. But Ruud averaged 25 goals a season for us and if he had been at United for 10 years and maintained that ratio he would have just beat the record by one goal. It's taken Rooney 12 years but it's not like just any old striker could score that amount of goals if given long enough.
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George Best, walked out on United aged 27, womanizer, drunk, wife beater. He has a statue
Denis Law, joined City, scored a back heeled goal that relegated United. He has a statue.
Fergie stated in his book he didn't believe Rooney was chasing money. It was more that he believed United should have been bringing in better players to help us compete in Europe and a PL that was beginning to get more challengers.
I genuinely cannot get my head around the fact that United fans are trying to downplay this achievement! the mind boggles.
Going by that criteria we can tear down the statue of Dennis Law as after leaving us he joined City okay he had played for them in the 60 - 61 season, should Rooney have a statue at some point maybe in years to come yes, but at this point in time no he is still active.
Players such as Giggs and Scholes are a different generation to that of Rooney and only know one club but don´t in reality deserve a statue as much as Rooney doesn't at the present time.
The holy trinity statue represents another time and generation and as such a statue should be given sparingly along with Wayne Rooney we have had many fine players who you could also say deserve one.
Haha cheeky, it's true though. Seems a bit ridiculous you don't have a statue of paisley outside Anfield but you had one of Moyes for a whileHe does . I agree.
Anybody who has won more European Cups then Ferguson deserves a statue.
I just couldn't resist.
Soz la !
Yeah I understand that. Other fans just think there's more to such a tribute than beating a record. It's not just a case of disliking him.
Thats fair enough mate i understand where you're coming from with regards to this discussion of the statue. I've said earlier there are people who should be getting one before Rooney.
But i was just making a general point, Rooney is disliked and criticized for doing something that other player did but it's not held against them.
The stuff you come out with about George Best is a shambles. You've done this repeatedly.
We really shouldn't be surprised though mate, theres an effort to downplay everything Rooney's ever achieved at United. Just read over this thread, multiple people now saying he was never even our best player at any point in his career. Which is nonsense.
It's only a matter of time i reckon before some start debating if Rooney was better than Crouch.
He's been a key member during one of our most successful era's - which we can say about a lot of players over the last 20 years or so for sure!!! So the record breaking part is why you could argue is what could tip it in his favour at some point in the future in my opinion. You could easily argue a case for Giggs (most appearances), Cantona (catalist to our era of domination) too.
I honestly think when he leaves people will appreciate him a bit more and then they might have second thoughts on the matter a few years from now. For me, I think it's too soon for a statue but would not be against one in the future