When your mum makes you take a pic with your dad while on holiday
Emmanuel Macron
- Thread starter Raoul
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Yes. Though I wouldn’t say 17-years old were kids back then… quite a different world now.
He was 15 when they met, there was definitely some grooming going on even if they didn't actually become a couple until he was 18 (as they claim).
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Time to show the UK what a protest is.
Yikes, that won't go down well. Open goal for the far right in France now.
Sounds like the kind of malarky you would expect from the far right
My neighbours father retired at 57, as did his grandad. My neighbour still at it at 60 +
I wish I know what was going through François Mitterrand's mind when he lowered the retirement age to 60 years when his government was in charge, before Sarkozy rose it up to 62. All of that while the norm for retirement remained 65 years of age and that some European countries with better quality of life even have higher retirement ages.
So why would he risk himself and his party for this? The world needs less right wing governments but this guy and Trudeau can't keep their screwing up and are opening the doors in their countries. Who knows if Biden can keep the US left in 2024, the UK is already Conservative, losing Canada and France won't help the worldwide situation. It's so frustrating. There better be a good reason to force this through
Countries simply can't afford the current retirement ages as it stands, as people live longer than they did 30 years ago and the current retirement generations are some of the biggest generations, that will be paid for by much smaller generations.
I know im a tinfoil nutcase, but i believe that there are certain powers that supercede goverments and when things like this happens, without passing through parliament, jeopardizing your political career, it seems to me that a non political decision had been taken from someone and is not negotiable. Standards of living are getting worse. There are crisis after crisis since 2008, covid, inflation, war between superpowers/proxies. And the gap keeps widening
The balls of not going through parliament. I hope they take out the guillotines, for real. And not only in france
They could if they would stop bailing out banks, political corruption, start taxing big companies and a big etc...
Our life expectancy 50 years ago was only 5-8 less in most of wealthy countries. The productivity had risen much more per inhabitant but this had been hoarded by companies. Politicians steals more than ever and they are servants of the private interests not the public interest.
They are lying that retirement and health care is unsustainable. It is a lie and they repeat it over and over till we repeated like parrots and we end believing it
In the near future will be less and less jobs due to automation and AI and you want to lengthen the retirement age? So more people to employ? Nah, they dont want to pay their retirement and we will have a miserable 60s unrmployed and a miserable 70-90 because the pension will be meager because you didnt work the last years of your life.
Lies lies lies. Widening the gap
62 to 64? And they burn down cities for it?
Spoiled bastards. Not long ago, my retirement age rose to 72.
Spoiled bastards. Not long ago, my retirement age rose to 72.
Maybe you should have considered burning cities as well.
This is what we should be doing in the UK tbh
Oh agree. UK unions(and in general the public)could learn a lot of the french response to political attacks.
It will be interesting to see how this develops.
Except it's not the rich that lose in riots is it, they're still living far away in peace and quiet. The losers are the poorest people, shopkeepers, often 1st generation immigrants working 12+ hours a day and seeing their businesses wrecked, and the people living above them in terror praying they don't get burned down.
If the rioters were to target politicians and the wealthy that won't pay taxes then I would have some respect, they would still be wrong but I could understand it, but rioting in city centres hurts the weakest the most, it's indefensible.
If the rioters were to target politicians and the wealthy that won't pay taxes then I would have some respect, they would still be wrong but I could understand it, but rioting in city centres hurts the weakest the most, it's indefensible.
from my years of working with french people, i can understand why they’d be furious at having to pretend to do work for another 2 years of their lives.
It's the far left and Brain of France, Mélenchon, who thinks the retirement age should be reduced to 60, increase pensions and finance it by the government borrowing more debt. Le Pen just joins in the noise. When they've got no pension in the future they'll be happy. It had been agreed by the cross party committees in the parliament and the senate but then they started playing politics. There will be a vote at some point.
Mélenchon was supposed to retire and then appointed his successor who went on to be prosecuted for beating up his wife.
Record profits say that they can but the money is going somewhere else.
Isn't it to bring France's retirement age in line with its competitors, or maybe knowing that the French tend to riot at the drop of a hat, maybe it is a diversion tactic by Macron?
Also as most politicians (except David Cameron) are aware, you should be sure of the answer before you ask the question. Maybe Macron knows what the answer will be, if he calls for a vote?
That's a lot better than smashing up innocent small businesses and terrorising people who are have done nothing wrong except live on the wrong streets, yes.
I believe in democracy so I don't actually approve, but it's not as downright immoral as calling for riots on the streets.
Hmm, some American estate agent who doesn't know that Brégancon is the summer holiday home for the Presidents of France near Toulon in the south of France.
This is the wrong mindset.
It was mostly a statement of jalousy.
With that said, raising the retirement age when people get older than previous generations doesn’t strike me as a terrible idea.
Unless I’ve missed it, there hasn’t been reports of attacks on small businesses or local people getting terrorised(The locals are the ones protesting).
Some cars were set on fire as a symbol for the barricades and then the usual fighting with the police. All seem very reasonable considering Macron has undemocratically forced through a increase in the pension age.
This kind of direct attack on a symbol of french state power will move the average patriotic Jacques away from his natural sympathy for protestors...a more measured approach is needed. Less hot-headedness and more acknowledgement of economic realities. This unruly protest will solidify a negative image of the country, turning investors away, and of course harm workers. Just like minimum wage, maximum hours, firing protection, and other regressive legislation eventually only harms workers.
e- nvm, he got here first
The citizens of so many countries seemed to think furlough schemes and long lockdown wasn’t going to cost them big time later on.
2 extra years work for the French is probably just the beginning.
2 extra years work for the French is probably just the beginning.
The pension reform has been going on for years since Sarkozy - it's nothing new and was clear it would happen when Macron was elected, long before Covid. Ignorance is so frustrating.
Mélenchon - Piège à cons.
Mélenchon - Piège à cons.
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Absolutely, but let’s not pretend this wasn’t the final nail in the coffin and likely just the beginning.
The pension age in France is a joke and the discussion has been going on for the best part of 15 years and the country cannot afford it. Nor can any country. Macron was elected in the full knowledge that it was going to happen. How it was done was not a good look, falling 3 votes short but if it isn't done France is in trouble.
Fortunately, so far, we are not governed by idiots like Mélenchon or Le Pen or we'd have been bankrupt years ago. but they are both populists with no clue.
Indeed.
I wish I knew what François Mitterrand was exactly thinking when he lowered retirement from 65 to 60 back in 1983. He pushed on the grounds that the aging of the population would lead France to financial ruin, but I don't see where the logic stood behind that line of thought.
I looked at this data about retirement age across countries, and I swear that vocal lot really have some nerve to protest when there are European countries with better overall quality of life and yet higher retirement age. Switzerland are locked on 64-65, Denmark on 67, the Netherlands on 66-68, Finland is flexible between 63.75 to 68 years of age, Iceland on 67, Germany increasing gradually to 67, and so on.
Maybe that's what they thought in quiet Versailles in 1790?
I am proud of French. The GOATs of protests.
I am not convinced this is a good argument. Other countries driving unjust policies doesn't mean everyone has to follow it. And it is hard to compare the countries. Here in Sweden, we have a high retirement age, but those with the highest incomes can afford to retire early while the poor people often need to work past that regular age.
In the case of France I saw this on Twitter, if it is true, I fully understand that those affected will protest, why should they pledge to work longer when they have such a high chance of never reaching the retirement age? Financing a system they have 30% chances of never taking any benefit from, just so that the wealthier ones can have their pensions?
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Violent protests are never the solution... It only leads to alienating the “commoners”, you end up losing the popular support. I saw many scandalous scenes on Twitter like this one...Maybe that's what they thought in quiet Versailles in 1790?
I am proud of French. The GOATs of protests.
" Louis XVI we beheaded him, Macron we can start again! chants the crowd at #Concorde . #ReformedesRetraite "
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If only that was how the people have thought and acted through history.
(I understand your point, and partly agree (at least theoretically), but I don't believe that's how the human nature (and society) works. By the way - and of course the context is not the same, but what was the other solution for protesters in Moscow or Teheran?)
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