Planet earth where I'm being realistic and we won't spend 300m in one window to get starters for LB, RB, GK, DM, CM, RW and ST. It's unlikely we sign a fullback this summer as we can get by with what we have. That's probably a summer 2023 thing. If we fix DM, RW and ST, clear out the dead wood, and Ten Hag implements his style and we get top 4, that'll represent a good season for me. Then sign a LB/RB/GK and whatever else the following window from a position of strength.
Erik ten Hag - Ajax Manager
- Thread starter Panther
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I agree this is most probably the best case scenario we can hope for. Probably bring garner and donny even martial and maybe try and win a cup. Whilst we go along this road it’s key to build up winning mentality
Everyone except the players
Would tend to be my thinking too.
Horrendous though we've been, we're still currently only three points off fourth place and I think everyone involved at the club would happily take fourth place next season. Four or so quality signings plus an otherwise pared down squad with the right manager bridges that gap, I think. Especially if we also start seeing improvements in other areas Rangnick has alluded to, like the level of fitness and injuries among the players.
It's still going to be a very flawed team next season with players who shouldn't be starters starting but that's what you expect after just one transfer window into a rebuild.
Wholeheartedly agree with this post. Even after todays results & Ralfs comments people are still willing to accept change at a snails pace that doesn’t actually result in anything. As a fanbase we’re getting exactly what we deserve, we’ve seen multiple players under multiple managers fail to deliver but so many would have us walk into next season with them forming the core of the squad even though we’ve basically given up this season. If we’ve got no one transfers lined up after the season our ‘transfer committee’ have seen then we’ll never succeed - as Ralf says, there are players that regardless of manager we should be pursuing but fans will allow the club to operate at the pace of a ship at anchor.
We need better players all over the squad, this isn’t simply a finishing touch. If a good LB, CB, CM, ST, RW & so on is available we need to go for them. The reason we move so slowly is we value our rubbish too much & don’t like to admit it’s not working out. We’ll extend Shaw on increased wages & wonder why he’s showing the same patchy form we’ve seen under 4 managers.
You can’t change everything at once but you can certainly make more than 3 signings when you effectively gave up on the season in November.
Yeah. Its one thing being ambitious and another being unreasonable. Expecting 5 starters is dumb. The cost of a starter is essentially 50m these days, we likely aren't spending more than 100m with a max of 150m, and even that's aggressive. It's reasonable to expect a window of:
- Antony (or similar) for RW
- Darwin (or similar) for ST
- Kamara (or similar) for DM
- Timber (or similar) for defensive depth and future
- Johnstone as a backup GK
Sancho Darwin Antony
Fred Kamara Bruno
Shaw Varane Maguire Dalot
Ddg
Rashford Martial Elanga
Garner McTominay VdB
Telles Lindelof Timber AWB
Johnstone
That's nowhere near being ready to compete of course. But it gets a concise squad that is relatively well balanced and a much different mentality among the squad. It also means we don't need to sign another 5 players just to be depth players, as that's unrealistic. Give them a chance under Ten Hag. Summer 2023, take the next step and replace the 2 fullbacks and the goalkeeper, then maybe if more is needed in midfielder depending on Kamara and/or Garner. Its still a good squad for the first season that should be capable of achieving next season's target, which 100% should be get the teething issues out of the way, get top 4 and progress into a proper team, with possibly some decent cup runs. Fred Kamara Bruno
Shaw Varane Maguire Dalot
Ddg
Rashford Martial Elanga
Garner McTominay VdB
Telles Lindelof Timber AWB
Johnstone
Expecting more than 3-4 actual signings (not counting a backup GK) is just being unrealistic. As much as we'd all love for 7 players in one summer, it's not happening at any club.
4-5 tops then...
The absolute worst thing he can do is come into and club and tell everybody that it's a clean slate, and that they have a new chanve to impress him. This will empower the likes of Harry Maguire to continue with the captaincy. He really really needs to carry on from where Rangnick leaves, and this can be done by judging the players over the last 6 odd months.
The first thing he needs to do is come in and really make it known that he is here to change things.
The first thing he needs to do is come in and really make it known that he is here to change things.
All I want is a massive clearout, get whatever new players he wants, get some youngsters for depth, show signs of his style being implemented.
At this time at least I don't care what position we end up next season.
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I was just thinking the same thing. That he cannot make the typical mistake of giving everyone a clean slate. He'll fall into the same cycle of disappointment and frustration. Use Rangnicks experience to guage this lot.
With the way how we defend this season, we definitely need 2-3 defenders this summer at least. Otherwise, we will keep conceded goals especially given that ETH likes to play very high line.
Big day today
I think you are getting your dates mixed up. The squad that Klopp inherited was far worse than this United squad
The Liverpool team that Klopp inherited wasn't the team that ran City close to the title.
That was the 2013/14 season.
Klopp took over midway through the 15/16 season.
Rodgers finished 6th in 2014/15 (25 points behind the Champions Chelsea) after losing Suarez, who was the main driving force to the previous title run. (They lost 6-1 to Stoke away in the final game of the 14/15 season, which may have been Gerrard's final game for Liverpool)
Then Gerrard and Sterling left after that season (while Sturridge was an injured shell of his 2013/14 self by then).
When Klopp came in to Liverpool they were 10th after 8 games of the 2015/16 season. (Finished the season in 8th, 21 points behind champions Leicester)
For Klopps first game the starting 11 was this ;
Goalkeeper: Simon Mignolet (De Gea)
Defence: Nathaniel Clyne (AWB), Martin Skrtel (Lindelof), Mamadou Sakho (Varane), Alberto Moreno (Shaw)
Midfield: Lucas Leiva (Fred), Emre Can (VdB), Philippe Coutinho (Bruno)
Attack: Adam Lallana (Sancho), Divock Origi (Ronaldo), James Milner (Rashford)
Bench: Adam Bogdan (Henderson), Kolo Toure (Maguire), Joe Allen (McTom), Jerome Sinclair(Martial), Joao Carlos Texiera (Elanga)and Connor Randall (Dalot/ Telles).
Vs Potential 11 for EtH in () and that's without any potential investment.
I think it's a big stretch to say that EtHs job is anywhere near as difficult (especially due to the fact that he will have a bigger budget) as the job that Klopp inherited.
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I also question why he would. In my case it‘s because he has an example in Pep that shows that he can achieve legendary status without taking the big risk. Pep is widely seen as one of, if not the best manager of this time. It‘s his safest bet as long as he takes the right jobs.
Of course, he can look at Klopp and everybody knows that Klopp will always be loved by Liverpool supporters more than Pep by City supporters.
But as you also correctly point out, it‘s a gamble. Gambling is different than playing the odds. He doesn‘t strike me as a gambler. I‘d assume he‘d rather play the odds and win in the long run than bet it all on something very risky.
I‘m surprised his signing seems to be almost carved in stone, even though I‘d love it. Considering everything that has happened to United during this season, I wouldn‘t be surprised if this deal somehow collapses, too.
I will back him unconditionally till the end of his contract, these players have proven that they don't have an ounce of self respect in them and the moment the going gets tough they down tools.
I won't care for the results because at this point I rather give all the benefit of the doubt to a man with a history of hard work and new ideas than a bunch of primadonas who think they're much better than they are.
I won't care for the results because at this point I rather give all the benefit of the doubt to a man with a history of hard work and new ideas than a bunch of primadonas who think they're much better than they are.
We should have hired someone from Nepal. Because the new manager will have to climb a fecking mountain.
One thing I think most of us can agree on with Rangnick is his honest and plain speaking, so I’m assuming these comments come from serious discussions with the board and owners.
I’m sceptical myself that this is achievable but you would like to think that at least half of those numbers quoted would be coming in and perhaps the rest from the youth set up.
Where we are we’re getting the money for this “rebuild” god only knows.
One glimmer of hope is that Rangnick is going to stick around . Hopefully he can provide ETH with the list of players to abandon from day 1.
That is why he should join before the season finishes and look at how these players play for him. Joining after the season finished is not the best idea. Our management never learns. Anyway atleast as you said, he should work on Ralfs decisions on players.
I think and hope for the same. Rangnick hinting at a high number of needed players is a good indication
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Certainly. Just hope ETH will be allowed to act on that information without being interrupted by the board.
Rangnick knows the players aren’t good enough, he’d of told the board we need at least 6 new players in the summer to give the new manager a chance. Feel sorry for him in a way you could see how frustrated he was with one of the goals we conceded last night, I bet he wants to shame the players when he gets asked questions in his press conference but hes professional and won’t.
Needs to get rid of the bad apples with a losers mentality. Bring in fighters and winners. Build up the connection between the team and the fans again. No one cares about these spoilt players who can't even sprint or tackle.
Wonder what the odds are of these “seven” players all being successful and not simply more money wasted?
We’ve had more fecking reboots than Batman.
I think they will be aligned to a playing style and not some scattergun approach.
From the links to Nkunku, Tchouemeni, Laimer, Timber etc, it looks like they are moving in a good direction.
"Good luck Erik" BBC article https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/61157832
All those new players don't need to be £50m signings. He could be including youth players promoted, possibly one or two free transfers? Loans? I don't know, but he's absolutely right that this squad needs gutting and rebuilding almost from scratch.
I agree, I’m not to au fait with who is available on a free transfer out there, I read somewhere that Boubacar Kamara has already agreed to join United (can’t remember where I read it) and apart from the obvious Rudiger, (which let’s face it ain’t happening) I don’t really have a clue.
Mejbri, Garner and maybe that Garnacho kid that’s been making the bench recently, possibly Laird? Though he’s struggling for games at Bournemouth I understand.
The obvious links to Rice, Tchouameni, Anthony, Timber, all of which will probably cost you north of 50mil I don’t really know who else is out there for less and I just can’t see where we’re getting 250+million to make these transfers but yeah we need a pretty weighty influx of players to make up for the ones leaving made all the more difficult without CL football.
He knows that we are terrible.
He's joining because he believes that with time he can rebuild the squad and have them playing his football at a high level and win things. At United he won't be losing his best players every year if he gets there.
Us being this bad means he's more likely to be backed fully.
He's joining because he believes that with time he can rebuild the squad and have them playing his football at a high level and win things. At United he won't be losing his best players every year if he gets there.
Us being this bad means he's more likely to be backed fully.
Quite a challenge on his hands.
Probably a bigger challenge then what Klopp had.
I have no doubt in my mind that he will make it.
Probably a bigger challenge then what Klopp had.
I have no doubt in my mind that he will make it.
We are nowhere near Klopps first year at Liverpool. Brendan had them challenging for the title.
We are more like Arsenal post-Emery. It’s a back to square 1 job, rip it all up and start again.
This guy is either an idiot with a delusion of grandeur or a madman to take the job. We are a poison chalice if ever there was one.
Had them what now?
Finished 6th in 2014 and 8th in 2015 with 25 and 21 points behind the winner.
It's exactly like Klopp had.
And to be fair, Klopp did just that. Rip it up and start again.
Only Henderson and Firminho are what's left of his first team.
Let that sink in.
We are in for a similar rebuild. If, and that's a big IF, two players from yesterday's team stay with us that would be something.
This.
I dont get why people don't understand this.
Obviously if you are a top manager, you have great self belief that you can challenge with the best.
The United job is probably exciting for these managers, he knows that there is 0 expectation in the first season because how bad the club is, its not like taking over a successful club and not having time.
The fans will be behind him because we have now seen 3/4 years of evidence that the players we have have a big mentality issue, so for almost the first time, the fans will be manager > players.
With Ralf, Fletcher, who have seen the players produce this shameful football, he will be given almost a clean slate to build a team.
We're so terrible that he honestly won't be under that much pressure next season. Nobody expects us to get anywhere near a title for the foreseeable future.
Exactly - RR has used Klopp as a reference point constantly since his arrival here. The only concern is that we don’t follow through and listen to him. Expect wholesale changes if we do and I for one can’t fuking wait. Hate watching this bunch of jokers.
If Rangnick is fecked off in the summer it might just be the last straw for me.
They have a chance that we haven’t had in a decade to purge the sheer toxicity of this team and build a solid foundation.
I arguably think ETH is coming in at the best possible time. We’re pretty much at rock bottom. A lot of the players have shown their intentions and there is no going back for a lot of them. All the club has to do here is back Ragnick and ETH to see it through and I believe we will be in a far, far better place.
They have a chance that we haven’t had in a decade to purge the sheer toxicity of this team and build a solid foundation.
I arguably think ETH is coming in at the best possible time. We’re pretty much at rock bottom. A lot of the players have shown their intentions and there is no going back for a lot of them. All the club has to do here is back Ragnick and ETH to see it through and I believe we will be in a far, far better place.