Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager

VP89

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Of course, City also started dropping points after some injuries etc, and it is all common sense for everyone except anti Ten Hag brigade, where mentioning common sense = excuses. When he has run of games with healthy squad, and we still don't see difference, then I am fine with people starting to be against him. It is all about context.
The frustrating bit is also the demand for a sexy style of play when the man has no first choice defenders to choose. What the actual feck.

Then he focuses on grinding out results with 4 wins out of 5 and it's still a problem. Posters like @crossy1686 still had their pitchforks out before full time. He can't win. We can score our open chances vs Luton and win 3 or 4 mil and the comeback would be "it's Luton".


At the end of the day the man's gone out and beaten Luton, Sheffield, Brentford, Fulham and yes lost to City. But 4 wins out of 5 is great form. Something his peers couldn't do despite coming from a much bigger advantage.
 

crossy1686

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The frustrating bit is also the demand for a sexy style of play when the man has no first choice defenders to choose. What the actual feck.

Then he focuses on grinding out results with 4 wins out of 5 and it's still a problem. Posters like @crossy1686 still had their pitchforks out before full time. He can't win. We can score our open chances vs Luton and win 3 or 4 mil and the comeback would be "it's Luton".


At the end of the day the man's gone out and beaten Luton, Sheffield, Brentford, Fulham and yes lost to City. But 4 wins out of 5 is great form. Something his peers couldn't do despite coming from a much bigger advantage.
:lol: Pitchforks? I said I was happy with the win but we played shit and that's still a concern. I also said we were lucky Luton didn't have any attacking threat because we made them look dangerous every time they crossed the half way line.

We should be beating Luton by 3 or 4 goals, we've spent £400m and they're a Championship team. We've beat Brentford, Sheff United, Fulham and Luton in that winning run you mentioned, hardly games you'd expect us to drop points is it? In the mean time, during that run, outside of the PL and in the PL we've lost to Galatasary, Newcastle, Man City, Copenhagen, and shipped 13 goals against that lot.

It would appear that any team with any form of organisation can put 3 past us with ease.

You call it pitchforks, I call it legitimate criticism and cause for concern.
 

Chumpsbechumps

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:lol: Pitchforks? I said I was happy with the win but we played shit and that's still a concern. I also said we were lucky Luton didn't have any attacking threat because we made them look dangerous every time they crossed the half way line.

We should be beating Luton by 3 or 4 goals, we've spent £400m and they're a Championship team. We've beat Brentford, Sheff United, Fulham and Luton in that winning run you mentioned, hardly games you'd expect us to drop points is it? In the mean time, during that run, outside of the PL and in the PL we've lost to Galatasary, Newcastle, Man City, Copenhagen, and shipped 13 goals against that lot.

It would appear that any team with any form of organisation can put 3 past us with ease.

You call it pitchforks, I call it legitimate criticism and cause for concern.
There are plenty of games and examples where you can have a go at how United played and how they were lucky, Luton is not one of them.

We should of won by 3/4, it wasnt tactics or even how we were playing, it was the finishing of players lacking confidence. The only way to overcome this is by our forwards getting goals, a manager cant come onto the pitch and put the ball in the net for them. Some of the misses were really poor, but its just where we are at. There have been so many games where we start well or have really good periods (green shoots) but then we get sucker punched and all to easily fold, alot of this is confidence for me (not just leadership).

Listening to the Athletic podcast there, they said it really is an odd thing at United. There are good reasons why we are playing poor (not ALL down to manager) and anybody watching us play could hardly get excited about the way we have generally be playing. But we have been playing so poor and yet appear to be there or therabouts (in the top 4 race if you want to call it that), it really does feel like there is a massive pendulum swing potential that could go either way.

Regardless, I think ETH has been just a really unlucky manager, you couldnt find anymore unfortunate things that he would have to deal with in really 14 months:

- Club ownership question marks
- Fans at loggerheads with owners
- Superstar player falls out within weeks of him taking over
- Takes over a club/squad in crisis from a miserable season
- multiple players with external scandals that manager has nothing to do with
- Savage injury issues to entire defence (he brought in a GK specifically for his passing , partially so we can play out from back) , Even our emergency left back defender got injured, i mean WTF, Erickson gets a run and gets injured
- New GK trying to bed in with second string defence and a team short in confidence
- VAR decisions, some fair, some very marginal and inconsistent for/against (we do seem to be suffering alot with this, but since we are already struggling, this is probably affecting us more)
- Kane v Hoijland. Manager wanted Kane, we are either a super club or we are not, cant have it both ways. The club made a long term decision by going with Hoijland (which I am not completely against BTW), but they left the entire team exposed. Kane would of been banging them in and the team would of gotten confidence with a leader like him and dare i say wed actually not be in a terrible position now.
- Next to this One strong striker at the club unproven. This is massive, there is no opportunity for Hoijland to bed in or get taken out of firing line. Manager wanted Kane and Ive said it before, Hoijland (I like him) is the player you bring in after you have a Kane. Hoijland is not getting a decent chance to bed in, so in the deep end. I like what i see, but coupled with all the other issues, i feel the compounded effect is making is so hard for everybody
- Transfers, Uniteds transfer policy has been a mess for a decade, regardless of whether ETH hand picked the players or not, the issue isnt ETH, its that whatever setup the club has is a mess. ETH inherited the same kind of messers that every other United manager has had.

I might of even left out something , but what other manager has ALL these things to contend with in the first 14 months of their managerial appointments ? None. Absolutely none. What club has kept on a Martial or Phil Jones for multiple contract extensions long after they were every going to succeed ? None.. This idea that concurrent United managers wanted these sort of players kept is bulls*t. A manager has to make concessions, they dont get everything they want , I dont understand how people can think that a manager gets 100% what they want, its so stupid to think that.
 

RedorDead21

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No, but the idea that ETH signed these players against the will of the DoF is just bizarre.


Yeah we played shite football this season, whilst also having serious injuries. Spurs lose two players and looked shite against Wolves. Posters against ten hag were chatting rubbish about how great ange was in such a quick time up to then.

Newcastle had a few injuries and looked shite vs Bournemouth too. It's almost like having a few key injuries disrupts your style of play.
Newcastle and spurs don’t stop their style of play until their players return and we’ll see how their approach goes. Our manager admits it’s on hold until they return as he ops for a more direct approach instead. So players waiting for their chance at United are greeted with the realisation it’s not quite the same game for them when they get their chance. Is this demotivating or motivating…for me the style goes right through the club at some point not sure why you’d start changing your approach so radically from one week to the next. I think the players lost faith in his game plans at some point.
 

Strelok

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At the end of the day the man's gone out and beaten Luton, Sheffield, Brentford, Fulham and yes lost to City. But 4 wins out of 5 is great form. Something his peers couldn't do despite coming from a much bigger advantage.
Tbf even against City we're doing quite ok until the dodgy pen.
 

Iker Quesadillas

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The frustrating bit is also the demand for a sexy style of play when the man has no first choice defenders to choose. What the actual feck.
There is an injury problem, but the way people talk about it, you'd think Ten Hag's playing the kit man.

Lindelof started 14 PL games last season, 6 EL games, 4 FA Cup games, 3 EFL games. Dalot started 24 PL games, 8 EL games, 3 FA cup games, 3 EFL games. And United had a good season!
 

evil_geko

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:lol: Pitchforks? I said I was happy with the win but we played shit and that's still a concern. I also said we were lucky Luton didn't have any attacking threat because we made them look dangerous every time they crossed the half way line.

We should be beating Luton by 3 or 4 goals, we've spent £400m and they're a Championship team. We've beat Brentford, Sheff United, Fulham and Luton in that winning run you mentioned, hardly games you'd expect us to drop points is it? In the mean time, during that run, outside of the PL and in the PL we've lost to Galatasary, Newcastle, Man City, Copenhagen, and shipped 13 goals against that lot.

It would appear that any team with any form of organisation can put 3 past us with ease.

You call it pitchforks, I call it legitimate criticism and cause for concern.
What the feck, Luton didn't get a sniff whole game except that one header ffs. :lol:
 

FrenchRed

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I have never seen us play so badly. The win against Luton really didn't say a lot about the team - we are still abject. Yes, our defense has a lot of injuries, but our attack doesn't, and we are shocking.

Fed up of excuses after 18 months, we should be doing much much better. My OUT still stands.
 

YzWayne

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I have never seen us play so badly. The win against Luton really didn't say a lot about the team - we are still abject. Yes, our defense has a lot of injuries, but our attack doesn't, and we are shocking.

Fed up of excuses after 18 months, we should be doing much much better. My OUT still stands.
Who would you replace with then? I’m curious as it’s clear we are stuck in this vicious cycle of sacking managers and hyping the next. Clearly the injuries has affect the dynamics of the team. I’m sure rashford will thrive if Shaw is playing at left back as both of them has great chemistry. You can go as far to put them as excuses but what excuse are you going to give when the next one fail?
 

crossy1686

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Who would you replace with then? I’m curious as it’s clear we are stuck in this vicious cycle of sacking managers and hyping the next. Clearly the injuries has affect the dynamics of the team. I’m sure rashford will thrive if Shaw is playing at left back as both of them has great chemistry. You can go as far to put them as excuses but what excuse are you going to give when the next one fail?
Maybe stop the hyping and just judge the manager on how he manages the team, how he spends the transfer budget and how he has us playing?
 

crossy1686

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And sack him after 18months when things are still the same as these 10 years?
How are they the same? We’ve seen that sacking managers who are poor brings an upturn in form, to the point the next manager often wins a trophy. So you’re saying we shouldn’t do that and we should just be happy where we are?
 

MackRobinson

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- Kane v Hoijland. Manager wanted Kane, we are either a super club or we are not, cant have it both ways. The club made a long term decision by going with Hoijland (which I am not completely against BTW), but they left the entire team exposed. Kane would of been banging them in and the team would
United were never getting Kane.
 

Oranges038

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How are they the same? We’ve seen that sacking managers who are poor brings an upturn in form, to the point the next manager often wins a trophy. So you’re saying we shouldn’t do that and we should just be happy where we are?
Yeah like he club got rid of Ole and then Ralf and ETH won the league cup.

So sack him now.

Who do you bring in that's going to get the new manager bounce all the way to a trophy?
 

crossy1686

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Yeah like he club got rid of Ole and then Ralf and ETH won the league cup.

So sack him now.

Who do you bring in that's going to get the new manager bounce all the way to a trophy?
Ole was a penalty away from winning a europa league and Rangnick was an interim, you know what that means right?

Not my job to be identifying new managers, and I’ve listed at least twice a massive list of potential candidates for full time and interim job should Ten Hag get the sack in the “who replaces Ten Hag?” Thread. The DOF or INEOS are tasked with finding a manager they believe will be best suited to the current squad and continue to build a squad in the current mould of how we want to play.
 

Oranges038

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Ole was a penalty away from winning a europa league and Rangnick was an interim, you know what that means right?

Not my job to be identifying new managers, and I’ve listed at least twice a massive list of potential candidates for full time and interim job should Ten Hag get the sack in the “who replaces Ten Hag?” Thread. The DOF or INEOS are tasked with finding a manager they believe will be best suited to the current squad and continue to build a squad in the current mould of how we want to play.
So have I.

But the idea that you should bring in a new manager just so you might get a new manager bounce to a trophy is fecking laughable.

You'll be whinging for the next guy when it turns sour in 12 months. Long term planning is the solution, not hoping every manager can produce a bounce over a honeymoon period to paper over the cracks.
 

stefan92

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So have I.

But the idea that you should bring in a new manager just so you might get a new manager bounce to a trophy is fecking laughable.

You'll be whinging for the next guy when it turns sour in 12 months. Long term planning is the solution, not hoping every manager can produce a bounce over a honeymoon period to paper over the cracks.
Long term planning might not include keeping the same manager for the long term.
 

AshRK

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How are they the same? We’ve seen that sacking managers who are poor brings an upturn in form, to the point the next manager often wins a trophy. So you’re saying we shouldn’t do that and we should just be happy where we are?
Without contingency plan , sacking managers will lead to no where. I rather new owners come and take control of footballing part and have an honest talk with the manager on how they want the football to be played.
 

crossy1686

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So have I.

But the idea that you should bring in a new manager just so you might get a new manager bounce to a trophy is fecking laughable.

You'll be whinging for the next guy when it turns sour in 12 months. Long term planning is the solution, not hoping every manager can produce a bounce over a honeymoon period to paper over the cracks.
That’s not what I said, I said you should sack a manager that isn’t up to the job and replace him with someone who might be. You won’t find a manager that’s good enough if you’re constantly wasting too much time on the ones that aren’t.

I couldn’t give a shit how often we sack mangers, if it’s clear they’re making things worse, losing games and playing shit football then they have to go. You think Palace should have kept De Boer because they’ve sacked a bunch of managers over the last 10 years? You think Benitez shouldn’t have been sacked by Liverpool because they sacked Houlier a few years before? Maybe they all sat around and decided that sacking managers for the last 30 years wasn’t working so giving Hodgeson 10 years was the way to go instead?
 

crossy1686

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Without contingency plan , sacking managers will lead to no where. I rather new owners come and take control of footballing part and have an honest talk with the manager on how they want the football to be played.
Who said there’s no contingency plan? That’s what the DOF or INEOS are for.
 

Oranges038

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That’s not what I said, I said you should sack a manager that isn’t up to the job and replace him with someone who might be. You won’t find a manager that’s good enough if you’re constantly wasting too much time on the ones that aren’t.

I couldn’t give a shit how often we sack mangers, if it’s clear they’re making things worse, losing games and playing shit football then they have to go. You think Palace should have kept De Boer because they’ve sacked a bunch of managers over the last 10 years? You think Benitez shouldn’t have been sacked by Liverpool because they sacked Houlier a few years before? Maybe they all sat around and decided that sacking managers for the last 30 years wasn’t working so giving Hodgeson 10 years was the way to go instead?
But he hasn't been losing games lately, won 4 out of 5 in the league, granted they weren't the toughest fixtures, still only 6 points off the top 2, higher than the great resurgance of Howe and Newcastle and only a few points of Ange and Spurs that everyone was jizzing themselves over only a few weeks ago. That's hardly sackable especially when you look at all the off field distractions and injuries etc.
 

fallengt

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Who said there’s no contingency plan? That’s what the DOF or INEOS are for.
You expect immediate result once take over happen? Just look at Chelsea, full take over, 1b spent, 4 managers and they still do not look like a functional team after 1.5years.
INEOS takes control is a good thing but no reason to think they're a hail mary before it even begins.
 

crossy1686

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But he hasn't been losing games lately, won 4 out of 5 in the league, granted they weren't the toughest fixtures, still only 6 points off the top 2, higher than the great resurgance of Howe and Newcastle and only a few points of Ange and Spurs that everyone was jizzing themselves over only a few weeks ago. That's hardly sackable especially when you look at all the off field distractions and injuries etc.
We’ve beaten very beatable teams, teams you’d expect United to put a couple past. While I don’t really care what other teams are doing, their dips look like the exception, whereas our wins look like the exception.
 

crossy1686

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You expect immediate result once take over happen? Just look at Chelsea, full take over, 1b spent, 4 managers and they still do not look like a functional team after 1.5years.
INEOS takes control is a good thing but no reason to think they're a hail mary before it even begins.
Nope, I expect us to improve once the manager has had time to coach the team and implement his ideas. I expect INEOS to hire a manager who can work with this bunch rather than go for Conte because he’s available.
 

VP89

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Newcastle and spurs don’t stop their style of play until their players return and we’ll see how their approach goes. Our manager admits it’s on hold until they return as he ops for a more direct approach instead. So players waiting for their chance at United are greeted with the realisation it’s not quite the same game for them when they get their chance. Is this demotivating or motivating…for me the style goes right through the club at some point not sure why you’d start changing your approach so radically from one week to the next. I think the players lost faith in his game plans at some point.
Spurs don't have remotely the same injuries :lol:
 

Alex99

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Newcastle and spurs don’t stop their style of play until their players return and we’ll see how their approach goes. Our manager admits it’s on hold until they return as he ops for a more direct approach instead. So players waiting for their chance at United are greeted with the realisation it’s not quite the same game for them when they get their chance. Is this demotivating or motivating…for me the style goes right through the club at some point not sure why you’d start changing your approach so radically from one week to the next. I think the players lost faith in his game plans at some point.
Football is a results driven business.

If your Plan A is only really viable with a certain set of players available, you need a Plan B.

There is no point stubbornly sticking with your Plan A and losing just to say you've stuck to your principles.
 

AshRK

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Who said there’s no contingency plan? That’s what the DOF or INEOS are for.
That's what I said. Let the takeover process complete and then assess the manager's future. Sacking him with the same people at top is a recipe for disaster. If SJR and his footballing people feel eth is not the guy, sack him and get their guy
 

DJ_21

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That's what I said. Let the takeover process complete and then assess the manager's future. Sacking him with the same people at top is a recipe for disaster. If SJR and his footballing people feel eth is not the guy, sack him and get their guy
Which is worrying because I’ve a feeling their guy will be someone like potter. But like you said let SJR bring in his own people and then let’s see if ETH can thrive.
 

AshRK

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Which is worrying because I’ve a feeling their guy will be someone like potter. But like you said let SJR bring in his own people and then let’s see if ETH can thrive.
People may not like to here this but I feel SJR will let ETH stay on and continue his work. And then maybe reassess next season.
 

Fortitude

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:lol: I’m not in here saying what’s the point in anything when it’s been the ‘same’ for 10 years. I said I’m happy with a win but the performance was poor, if you can’t handle that criticism then ask yourself why you can’t handle it.
 

AshRK

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:lol: I’m not in here saying what’s the point in anything when it’s been the ‘same’ for 10 years. I said I’m happy with a win but the performance was poor, if you can’t handle that criticism then ask yourself why you can’t handle it.
I won't call Luton performance poor, although it wasn't breathtaking or anything but we should have won the game 3 or 4-0.
 

Conor

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:lol: I’m not in here saying what’s the point in anything when it’s been the ‘same’ for 10 years. I said I’m happy with a win but the performance was poor, if you can’t handle that criticism then ask yourself why you can’t handle it.
Half the stuff you say is hyperbole, though. At least be genuine and maybe realise that you don't need to say the same stuff over and over and over.
 

Oranges038

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We’ve beaten very beatable teams, teams you’d expect United to put a couple past. While I don’t really care what other teams are doing, their dips look like the exception, whereas our wins look like the exception.
Spurs lose a couple to injury and suspension- lose. Expected.
If Utd lost 2-1 to Wolves in injury time after being 1-0 up the whole game this place would lose it's shit.

Newcastle lose a couple to injury and suspensio - lose. Expected. If Utd went and lost 2-0 to Bournemouth you'd have a meltdown.

Utd have several key players injured, still string a few wins together. Expected wins and still not good enough.

Right.