Ethnic mix of United youth coaches.

[Blzbud]

A picture was recently published of Michael Carrick and a group of players and coaches from our younger age group teams. Aside from Carrick, I counted seventeen adults in the picture and only one who is not obviously Anglo-European in ethnic origin. This was in stark contrast with the mix amongst the boys themselves.

Now I know this an issue in football more generally, but for those who are maybe more familiar with the way our club does things at this level, is it something we could/should be doing more about? How do we compare to other clubs at these levels in terms of the ethnic diversity of our coaches?

 

[SwansonsTache]

Eh, no?

Ethnicity of a coach should not be considered when hiring.

Lefties gonna' leftie.

 

[Blzbud]

Eh, no?

Ethnicity of a coach should not be considered when hiring.

Lefties gonna' leftie.

Seriously?

 

[SwansonsTache]

Seriously?

Yes.

The best qualified gets the job, independent of skin colour and religious beliefs.

 

[T00lsh3d]

Seriously?

Yes. You hire the best candidate for the position, based solely on their ability.

 

[SirAF]

Seriously?

Of course, wtf?

 

[711]

A picture was recently published of Michael Carrick and a group of players and coaches from our younger age group teams. Aside from Carrick, I counted seventeen adults in the picture and only one who is not obviously Anglo-European in ethnic origin. This was in stark contrast with the mix amongst the boys themselves.

Now I know this an issue in football more generally, but for those who are maybe more familiar with the way our club does things at this level, is it something we could/should be doing more about? How do we compare to other clubs at these levels in terms of the ethnic diversity of our coaches?

Racist.

 

[harms]

Wtf?

 

[walkinhop]

wow

 

[Blzbud]

You see 'best' opens up a whole can of worms. Best for what exactly? As far as I'm concerned it would be better for the club if the ethnic mix of youth coaches better reflected the ethnic mix of its youth players, for all sorts of reasons, some of which may be a little bit left leaning, but also football reasons. I believe it can only be good for boys in those age groups to be educated by people they can relate to. And I believe there plenty of extremely well qualified people who could do great work - and learn themselves - at this level of football.

The question is why we seemingly haven't employed more of them. But for all I know there maybe a level of engagement by United with the various ethnic groups that make up the Greater Manchester area (which is still, after all, where we get most of our kids) that isn't represented in the picture I saw.

 

[simonhch]

This thread has serious trainwreck potential. Hope it gets closed soon.

 

[harms]

I believe it can only be good for boys in those age groups to be educated by people they can relate to

Kids can't relate to people of other race?

Spoiler

 

[Theonas]

Yes.

The best qualified gets the job, independent of skin colour and religious beliefs.

Yes that's how it should be! You know if the world started yesterday. As long as we are the result of a long chain of historical events, there never will be an equal starting point and therefore absolute equality is actually contributing to inequality. We live in a time where everyone looks at their very immediate surrounding and environment though so the idea of justice and fairness is incredibly short sighted.

 

[Blzbud]

This thread has serious trainwreck potential. Hope it gets closed soon.

Look shut it down. I am getting kicked to death here. It's like the SPG has reformed.

 

[Globule]

The problem is much bigger than us. I don't think for one second that we would discriminate against any particular race or religion, but as others have already said, we hire the best candidates. There's a problem, for a combination of reasons, with the number of black and ethnic minority people in football coaching/management, so it stands to reason that there would be an even smaller pool of candidates that would be suitable for our club.

There's no doubt though that more needs to be done to encourage BAME people to pursue football coaching, and, more importantly, give them opportunities.

 

[T00lsh3d]

I love equal opps....by its very nature it's more discriminatory than the discrimination it claims to fight

 

[711]

To be fair I've noticed the Stretty is looking a bit honky lately, maybe we should look at season ticket allocation for a bit of re-balancing*.

*edit: affirmative action.

 

[shamans]

Yes.

The best qualified gets the job, independent of skin colour and religious beliefs.

So you're against affirmative action?

 

[shamans]

I love equal opps....by its very nature it's more discriminatory than the discrimination it claims to fight

No it is not. This is just typical simplification of the issue. What equal opportunity is supposed to do is stir up the pot and change the balance in order to make the ground even. It is more complex than "you're being hired because you're a woman". It is not usually implemented the right want and causes problems too but it is needed in some form or fashion.

 

[Blzbud]

Kids can't relate to people of other race?

Spoiler

I would say the issue is more general. Individuals are individuals, but there is still the issue of representing the diversity that you're made of. e.g. Greater Manchester area.

 

[ivaldo]

You see 'best' opens up a whole can of worms. Best for what exactly? As far as I'm concerned it would be better for the club if the ethnic mix of youth coaches better reflected the ethnic mix of its youth players, for all sorts of reasons, some of which may be a little bit left leaning, but also football reasons. I believe it can only be good for boys in those age groups to be educated by people they can relate to. And I believe there plenty of extremely well qualified people who could do great work - and learn themselves - at this level of football.

The question is why we seemingly haven't employed more of them. But for all I know there maybe a level of engagement by United with the various ethnic groups that make up the Greater Manchester area (which is still, after all, where we get most of our kids) that isn't represented in the picture I saw.

Best for, I don't know, coaching?

Let's just scout more white players to match the coaches, savvy?

 

[17 Van der Gouw]

I would say the issue is more general. Individuals are individuals, but there is still the issue of representing the diversity that you're made of. e.g. Greater Manchester area.

It's a non-issue.

 

[Adisa]

The OP has not accused the club of anything. I don't get the hostile response.
I know there was talk sometime back that not enough minorities were taking their coaching badges. I don't know if the situation has improved.

 

[Cascarino]

While I'm not saying I agree with the thread, a lot of people in this thread don't understand affirmative action.

 

[Kostur]

Lack of an open homosexual coach, a two-spirit coach, a Polish coach, a Judaistic-coach, a Muslim coach, a Christian coach, a woman coach is appalling as well, I'm glad somebody touched upon this topic.

Or we could as well just let the best people get the job.

 

[T00lsh3d]

No it is not. This is just typical simplification of the issue. What equal opportunity is supposed to do is stir up the pot and change the balance in order to make the ground even. It is more complex than "you're being hired because you're a woman". It is not usually implemented the right want and causes problems too but it is needed in some form or fashion.

That's just it though. When it's a case of "you must consider X number of candidates from such-and-such a background for a position", then that's fine, you're gonna hire the best one anyway. The problem is when (as is suggested in the OP) it becomes, "you must have X number of people from different backgrounds on your staff".

 

[Grylte]

Lack of an open homosexual coach, a two-spirit coach, a Polish coach, a Judaistic-coach, a Muslim coach, a Christian coach, a woman coach is appalling as well, I'm glad somebody touched upon this topic.

Or we could as well just let the best people get the job.

We need a transexual coach too.

 

[harms]

While I'm not saying I agree with the thread, a lot of people in this thread don't understand affirmative action.

There is a difference between not understanding and not agreeing. By the way, affirmative action is illegal in the UK, apart from a few exceptions.

 

[Kostur]

We need a transexual coach too.

Crap, knew I forgot somebody.

 

[Member 104911]

We need a transexual coach too.

We need a coach that's not a man or a woman because they nowadays exist.

 

[Blzbud]

We need a transexual coach too.

Ffs. I am going to end up with some truly horrible tag line at this rate.

Starting this thread was always going to be a bad idea on reflection. I was bored. I became a bit less bored. And now I'm bored again.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

The OP has not accused the club of anything. I don't get the hostile response.
I know there was talk sometime back that not enough minorities were taking their coaching badges. I don't know if the situation has improved.

Although he did say that kids can't relate to coaches of different races. Which is kinda bad.

 

[lewwoo]

Im all for a equal playing field but giving people jobs based on their race is opening up a can of worms and feeds in to groups like britain first and the bnp etc. If a man/woman is the best for the job it shouldn't matter if they are white, black or orange.

 

[Globule]

Lack of an open homosexual coach, a two-spirit coach, a Polish coach, a Judaistic-coach, a Muslim coach, a Christian coach, a woman coach is appalling as well, I'm glad somebody touched upon this topic.

Or we could as well just let the best people get the job.

It's all well and good repeating the mantra 'the best people get the job regardless of race or religion', but when only 4% of coaches at PL and FL clubs are black, Asian or from other ethnic minorities, it points to a wider problem. Are we really getting the best candidates when so many are either being deprived of opportunities or being discouraged from pursuing the career in the first place?

 

[Classical Mechanic]

Im all for a equal playing field but giving people jobs based on their race is opening up a can of worms and feeds in to groups like britain first and the bnp etc. If a man/woman is the best for the job it shouldn't matter if they are white, black or orange.

Trump supporter in the house.

 

[Penna]

Ffs. I am going to end up with some truly horrible tag line at this rate.

Starting this thread was always going to be a bad idea on reflection. I was bored. I became a bit less bored. And now I'm bored again.

I think your OP was interesting and it's a perfectly valid issue to raise.

Im all for a equal playing field but giving people jobs based on their race is opening up a can of worms and feeds in to groups like britain first and the bnp etc. If a man/woman is the best for the job it shouldn't matter if they are white, black or orange.

Of course, but that doesn't necessarily happen. And we don't always start from a level playing-field.

 

[Snowjoe]

Yeah this isn't gonna go well, I'm sure there's enough places to talk about quotas and affirmative action in the CE forum.

*Closed*

 

[Raoul]

You see 'best' opens up a whole can of worms. Best for what exactly? As far as I'm concerned it would be better for the club if the ethnic mix of youth coaches better reflected the ethnic mix of its youth players, for all sorts of reasons, some of which may be a little bit left leaning, but also football reasons. I believe it can only be good for boys in those age groups to be educated by people they can relate to. And I believe there plenty of extremely well qualified people who could do great work - and learn themselves - at this level of football.

The question is why we seemingly haven't employed more of them. But for all I know there maybe a level of engagement by United with the various ethnic groups that make up the Greater Manchester area (which is still, after all, where we get most of our kids) that isn't represented in the picture I saw.

We had a similar discussion a couple of years ago regarding the hiring of black managers. You may want to have a read as some of the points you raised are discussed there.

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/should-the-fa-implement-the-rooney-rule.397238/