You are talking about the shooter and not Wolf aren't you?
Gun control
- Thread starter ukbob
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Wasn’t he a Scud stud? No way a Scud stud ever got bullied.
I realise it's a rather obvious/stupid point but the actual noise the shots make is scary.
Dunno. Don't think it was him?
If I see someone on my security cam breaking into my house with a gun and I am unarmed I am at their mercy.
If you do you had better hurry up getting it from that secure safe you keep your gun in to stop your kids from accidentally killing themselves with it. And watching your security camera 24/7 must be a chore?
That's a very weird thing to say.
No it isn't. If your gun is kept safely then if you see someone breaking in you would be lucky to get the gun from the safe, load it and then get back to shoot the (hopefully) very slow burglar. An unlocked or loaded gun is not a safe gun. Always assuming you even see the burglar on home CCTV as presumably you don't watch it 24/7. The idea that you need a gun for self protection is where the whole problem starts. The only way to reduce gun violence is fewer guns, even if the sheer number of legal guns will fuel illegal guns for a long time if they were banned now (which they will never be). You own a gun you are part of the problem whether you like it or not.
I know we can't all just move on a whim for work or family or financial reasons, but is it not possible to just live somewhere safer?
This depends on your location and in my location yes a gun helps. My area tops the chart for violent gun related crime from criminals and the defenseless have died. Your scenario is also ridiculous because:
1) I am not watching my camera. I have a google nest camera system that buzzes my phone when it identifies a person
2) It does not take that long to get ready for me from safe to armed, considering anyone breaking in is not superman and it takes a while to cross a few yards, make their way upstairs etc.
3) I have the exact situation happen with me when someone tried to break in through my backyard fence though luckily they backed out when I just used my flashlight and made some noise.
Using a gun is the absolute last resort and there is a lot that goes into the safety of it. You're supposed to have a plan of where to corner yourself, hide your family, call the cops and then use your gun only if it comes to life or death.
The only way to reduce gun violence is to vote for the correct politicians and push for policy. You are fooling yourself if you think all sensible people not buying guns will change anything. Also, the amount of crazy gun obsessed folks who buy arms far outweigh the single home defense piece people like myself have.
On the contrary, I would say the kind of opinion you hold is one of the few stumbling blocks towards proper gun control. It's uninformed and exaggerated. If I was a pro gun skeptic, such an opinion would possibly affirm my belief in sheltered liberals living in safer areas that just don't know what they are talking about. Obviously, I am not a pro gun skeptic so that's not what I think.
I used to have a similar opinion to yours back when I lived in a safer apartment. Having someone show you their "piece" as intimidation changes your perspective fast. Trust me, I would love for guns to get eliminated in one swift blow but politicians have not enforced that and I am not going to die for them to prove some point.
It doesn't alter the fact that more guns = more gun deaths. Voting for gun reform and not owning a gun are about the only things you can do to improve things even if it will take a very long time (if ever) in the US. The reason there is so much gun crime (as opposed to crime) is because there are so many guns.
I was around guns a great deal when young but I wouldn't own one under any circumstance now.
Highland Park is 15 mins from my home. Was planning to go to the fireworks in my suburb tonight with family. Well we cancelled the plans when news broke out. The fireworks got cancelled anyways.
Terrifying. Not unexpected sadly, if you can go into a super market and by these kinds of guns relatively easily then don't expect idiots not to use them to terrorise every day people.This is the 308th MASS SHOOTING in the US in just 2022 alone!
Cool. So you get a gun. And your neighbors get guns. Eventually one of those neighbors will kill multiple people. Just say you’re cool with that because being able to own makes you feel safe. OWN IT! Just say you feel your ability to feel a little bit safer is worth the continued mass shootings. I am not asking you to give up your death machine, just to acknowledge to yourself that your ownership, in part, enabled Sandy Hook and Parklsnd, and Buffalo, and Uvalde, and Highland Park.
The saddest and most laughable part of all this is how many people still bang on about the USA being the land of the free when it's clearly not.
I think the USA is probably the least free country in the modern world. I can't imagine having to own a gun because I was so scared of criminals. (personally I always refer to Jim Jefferies sketch regarding home invasion, and also the stats back his comedic observations up in that most break ins are by unarmed criminals who just want your TV)
My 9 year old daughter was at school yesterday doing her sports day, while her 9 year old cousin was at school in Florida and had an active shooter drill. There's a viral Tik Tok video doing the rounds of a family of Americans on holiday here in the UK who made the exact same observation
I think the USA is probably the least free country in the modern world. I can't imagine having to own a gun because I was so scared of criminals. (personally I always refer to Jim Jefferies sketch regarding home invasion, and also the stats back his comedic observations up in that most break ins are by unarmed criminals who just want your TV)
My 9 year old daughter was at school yesterday doing her sports day, while her 9 year old cousin was at school in Florida and had an active shooter drill. There's a viral Tik Tok video doing the rounds of a family of Americans on holiday here in the UK who made the exact same observation
Yeah, but all these gun owners believe that the safety they feel by owning is more important than the life of you niece. She should suck it up and acknowledge we are leaving her a far, far, far worse world than we inherited.
and not driving a car = less gun deaths but the solution is making the seat belt the law and having a drivers license.
Nope, if anything I think views such as this contributes to making gun control so difficult, delaying any action and further polarizing the loons. Base your statements in logic and facts and that may help push this discussion forward. But at the end of the day, I still don't think having an absurd opinion like yours is the main issue. It's politicians and lack of regulation. Simple as that
This example you give is completely flawed.
Exactly. Again with Jim Jefferies, but I can't stand the bullshit excuses. Why can't gun owners just admit they like guns? Or at the very, very least admit they are part of the problem.
I always like reading @Carolina Red and @Dr. Dwayne replies in threads like this as they often add much needed balance and sensible and articulate replies to an often very heated debate.
So my view that guns, whose sole purpose for existence is the taking of life, is the problem. Again, I am not asking you to give up your gun. I am not asking for legislation banning them. Both of those are non starters in this fecked up country.
I am merely saying that those who put money into the hands of the gun lobby should acknowledge what they are doing. But apparently that is a bridge to far huh? Whatever, enjoy your gun. Enjoy the safety it makes you feel. I honestly pray and hope you never feel what it’s like on the other side. To know the pain of the random loss of a child’s life due to guns.
I am so done with the excuses.
“I am responsible”
“Guns don’t kill people, people do”
“I need it for protection”
“ it’s my constitutional right”
.
.
.
Whatever. It doesn’t matter anyways. We will have another shooting tomorrow, and another the next day, and guns will continue to be the leading cause of death among children, and nothing will change. But hey, at least you will feel safe, so that’s a thing.
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Who would have guessed?
I honestly thought it was a Where's Wally convention...
first of, I don't enjoy anything with guns. As I said before if I could eliminate all the guns around me I would. Of all the quotes you put there I only agree with protection and yes I do need it. That may be a messed up situation but that is the reality. The solution is to put regulations on gun control i.e make it safer so we don't have to own one.
Cars are an essential of modern life that only injure and kill people incidentally. Guns are not and are designed to kill people.
What makes gun control difficult in the US is the ludicrous notion, enshrined in the constitution ffs, that owning a gun is a right. That background checks, waiting periods and other incredibly mild checks are so contentious seems batshit crazy to most people outside the US. States. Where open or concealed carry is allowed doubly so.
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Or be part of the solution and don’t own one. I lived in some shit parts of LA and Birmingham as a student/teacher. I was genuinely afraid walking from my car to door. I never once considered buying a gun.
Again, I am not saying you should give up your gun. I am only saying you need to be honest with yourself that the money you spend on guns/ammo will, in some part, make its way into the hands of politicians who will do feck all. You can’t have it both ways. You are either all in on eliminating guns from the US or you are 100% behind funding their proliferation.
This.
Guns exist, in all their forms, for the sole purpose of increasing the ability of a single human to kill as many other humans as fast as possible. Any other use is secondary to a guns primary function.
I have seen people talk about "safe areas" in the USA, when people have been shot and killed in nightclubs, churches, and movie theatres, where exactly are these supposed safe places.
The sad thing is there is simply NO safe place in America, you are most likely to die these days just by stepping outside your front door.
These people that buy guns, are nuts, no one needs a gun, it is only those people that lack the will power to not contribute to the NRA that do.
That is a death cult, and all who buy a gun is part and parcel of that death cult, those dead children, that is on you, if you own a gun, their blood is on your hands.
No sane person should ever feel the need to buy or own a gun.
Those that do, need locking up in a mental asylum.
Guns are the problem, the sooner people recognise this, the better.
Guns are inheritly evil, they have no other purpose than to kill and mame, why anyone would be proud to say that they own one, nevermind multiples, is crazy, and is the mind of a psycho.
The sad thing is there is simply NO safe place in America, you are most likely to die these days just by stepping outside your front door.
These people that buy guns, are nuts, no one needs a gun, it is only those people that lack the will power to not contribute to the NRA that do.
That is a death cult, and all who buy a gun is part and parcel of that death cult, those dead children, that is on you, if you own a gun, their blood is on your hands.
No sane person should ever feel the need to buy or own a gun.
Those that do, need locking up in a mental asylum.
Guns are the problem, the sooner people recognise this, the better.
Guns are inheritly evil, they have no other purpose than to kill and mame, why anyone would be proud to say that they own one, nevermind multiples, is crazy, and is the mind of a psycho.
There's a big lobby that funds politicians, directly & indirectly. The narrative gets shifted to:
-> Citizens need guns to protect themselves in case state machinery goes rouge
-> Guns are the only way to avoid a 1984 style dystopian takeover
-> Citizens need guns to protect themselves in case North Korea or Iran invades the US
-> People are safer with guns than they are without
-> Guns guarantee citizens are in control of their safety, not the state
-> George Washington had guns, so did Tupac and his 2 year old toddling neighbor
Nothing will change in the next decade.
There are sadly too many evil people in America, if you own a gun, then that automatically makes you evil, no doubt about that.
There is absolutely no such thing as a "responsible gun owner", that is just word play for "responsible for death".
Absolutely no one needs to own a gun, you are a complete coward if you do.
Guns are there to kill, nothing else.
It is just a strange type of machismo that makes people buy them.
Anyone that owns even a single one, is not a nice or sane person.
They are just looking for ways to hide their cowardice.
Guns are evil killing machines, nothing more needs to said, the sooner people have their guns taken away from them the better.
Everyone should be willing to give up their guns, if not, then they should be arrested and thrown in jail.
Just because a piece of a paper hundreds of years old says something, doesn't make it the best of things to refer to.
The constitution is completely irrelevant in today's world.
I say get rid of it, and start again, like any sane person would.
If there are no safe places, then there is something wrong, and if the Constitution is preventing change, well get rid of it.
The safety of others should come well before a tatty, irrelevant piece of paper.
I don't see anti-gun narrative based on emotions succeeding. The focus must shift to preventing flow of money from gun lobby to politicians. This is similar to tobacco battle of the 60s. It'll take a few decades before something is set right without people feeling they've been deprived off their constitutional right.
"Cars also kill people" and "guns don't kill people, but people do" may compete for the most stupid line of argument in American history tag.
Yes, a car is not a gun. I'm pretty sure I knew that but I am drawing a parallel here to show something else, which I think and hope you knew.
As for your second paragraph. Yeah, so politicians need to work on regulation and us citizens need to vote. Until then, I am surrounded by crazy people and criminals with guns and I am not going to risk getting shot in the head to make political points. I am voting and having conversations around the subject in a meaningful way to get it done.
If that is what you think, then I don't think this discussion will be of any value to either of us. As for you not considering buying a gun, that is good for you. That is not how I feel.
If you really think you partake in no activity then ultimately reaches the pockets of a corrupt politician, then I don't know what to say. Some of the mass produced items we consume on a daily basis, that we have no need to, are linked to lobbyists. People need to end their obsession with NRA and crazy people that tweet pro gun stuff and actually VOTE for the right politicians.
I was just about to say the same. The cars and seatbelt equation/argument just might be the most stupid bullshit I have ever heard. I've seen it used without a hint of irony on Twitter and Facebook.
I'm sure it's been used on here before too, but each time I see it I still get the same uncontrollable reaction of "Oh ffs, feck off" Followed by a shake of the head and then a feeling of sadness that people could actually use it in a gun ownership debate. If you have to explain why it's the worst ever comparison then I think you might as well not bother at all because it's highly unlikely you could ever have a ratinal.debate or get through to the person who comes out with something like that. That's where the brainwashing/cult similarities come in. It's a religion to so many.
So many contradictions here
But is a false parallel as they are such different things. If things can be dangerous but are essential e.g. cars or knives, then you allow them and regulate them. In the case of things like guns that are purely design to kill then an almost total ban is logical and funnily enough the more of them there are the higher the rate of death, deaths don't rise linearly with gun ownership but exponentially, so any reduction is beneficial. If you use your logic you could also say hand grenades, howitzers or even tactical nukes only need regulating - which is of course madness.
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This is interesting https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/apr/07/guns-handguns-safety-homicide-killing-study
Basically in California, if you have a gun in the house, the likelihood of being shot rises by 50% and more in states with more relaxed gun laws, and far more if you are a woman (domestic violence is included here)
Owning a gun may make you feel more safe, but it is a mistaken perception, it actually makes you less safe.
Basically in California, if you have a gun in the house, the likelihood of being shot rises by 50% and more in states with more relaxed gun laws, and far more if you are a woman (domestic violence is included here)
Owning a gun may make you feel more safe, but it is a mistaken perception, it actually makes you less safe.
That sounds like a line from Goldie Looking Chain....
Please explain where the contradictions are??
How many people do we all know who aren't criminals or mentally ill, so would pass any background or mental health check, that you wouldn't let park your car, much less handle a firearm?
At least 75% of this forum!
There was a war in northern Ireland you can't include that. It's like trying to argue that they are happening daily in Ukraine as if it's the same thing. I think there have been about four mass shootings in the UK in the last 30 years.
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I've said it before but America is a society ruled by fear. This is why there are so many guns. It's a truly horrendous society there.
If I saw someone breaking into my house with a gun (outlandish notion in this country but feck it) I would run even if I had a much bigger gun. The prospect of murdering someone in a firefight over my flatscreen TV just doesnt sound like a good idea.