Utter rubbish. Messi has had a poor season by his standards, the guy hasnt looked himself for the last 6 months or more. He looks and sounds jaded and burnt out. The occaision wasnt too much for him, its just that the timing has coincided with his being completely out of sorts. Form is temporary, class is permanent.I'm not an idiot at all. If you want to discuss football, rationally, we can do that. If you want to throw your toys out of the pram, I can do that too.
There's nothing idiotic at all about suggesting that Messi wasn't a real threat tonight, or even since the quarter finals. The occasion was just too much for him. Not a big deal, though. He's still a very good player, at club level.
They're generally taught to jump with a knee up to protect themselves in situations like corners and crosses, when they could easily be clattered by a player. That wasn't the case in this instance granted. I'd imagine Neuer did it because the upward thrust of the knee while jumping offers a similar boost to when outfield players use their arms to jump, gaining height.I seem to remember keepers are now expected to not charge with their knees up like that and just sort of jump in an upright position. It never made any sense to me, sounds completely unnatural, but I see the logic re: potential head injuries.
That said, I do like keepers pretty much owning their box and putting themselves about, if the forwards can't live with them that's their problem. No idea how it was an Higuaín foul though, clear throw in IMO.
It was one of the best 0-0 games I've seen, up until the goal obviously. Both sides created opportunities to win the game, and better finishing on another day could have seen Argentina win via Higuain. The match itself played as I expected really, Germany controlling the possession and Argentina staying tight until the opportunity to intercept and break came to fruition. I thought Germany afforded Messi too much space at times but they managed to close off his support and dealt with it that way. It would have been interesting if Di Maria had played, he's a massive threat even on a bad day. The better and more entertaining team won.thank you mate
i thought it was an interesting game, and for what was at stake, that both teams took many risks,
i'd like to know the point of view of neutrals about it
Yeah, but I seem to remember a couple of years ago it was under the spotlight, much like the same natural boost you refer to with players and elbows. Not sure exactly when but I distinctly remember the argument being made by a ref that there should be no knees up or flailing arms.They're generally taught to jump with a knee up to protect themselves in situations like corners and crosses, when they could easily be clattered by a player. That wasn't the case in this instance granted. I'd imagine Neuer did it because the upward thrust of the knee while jumping offers a similar boost to when outfield players use their arms to jump, gaining height.
I recall something like that too. I just assumed the refs were keeping an eye out to make sure the players had eyes for the ball in every challenge (with no hard 'thrusting' of the elbows as an outfield player), and would get penalised if not. No idea these days mind, it's an ordeal trying to keep up with the referee mental processes!Yeah, but I seem to remember a couple of years ago it was under the spotlight, much like the same natural boost you refer to with players and elbows. Not sure exactly when but I distinctly remember the argument being made by a ref that there should be no knees up or flailing arms.
It makes as much sense to me as running with your hands tied behind your back, mind.
Don't agree with that, Don. I thought the Argies slightly edged it yesterday, for me at leastThe keeper has every right to jump aggressively, to come out and catch the ball and take command of his own area. He got to the ball first and Higuian collided with him. No foul by either player.
If this is some sort of attempt to suggest it should have been a foul by the keeper...its very sad, tbh.
Germany were the better team on the night and throughout the whole tournament. Won it fair and square and very much deserved.
What a load of tripe!Spot on, a lot of whinging over nothing. You can tell the difference between posters that have or haven't played football.
It has nothing to do with Neuer's popularity. Giving a penalty here would have contradicted the way goalkeepers are being treated in any other match all around the world. I've seen goalkeepers in the knockout-stage of the Uefa Champions League who punched attackers during set-pieces, missed the ball, and didn't get a penalty call against them.It's a blatant foul from Neuer, I'm actually surprised it's even being debated.
But then he is very popular, so I guess I shouldn't be.
But it does. As long as this happens in the box, it's a legal play by keeper.It shouldn't make a difference if it's a keeper or a striker
"criticise the post not the poster"i see. you are an idiot
sorry
Argentina defended for 90% of the game with 9 players around their own box and just played on counter. They had 3 "good" chances or were in position for good chances - nothing else.Don't agree with that, Don. I thought the Argies slightly edged it yesterday, for me at least
Germany was better throughout the tourney though, so they were the deserved winners.
Don't the ref whistle when you underrun someone going for a header? The thinking is that you clearly don't want to go for the ball but make contact and take the heading player's chance to make a safe landing? I mean look at them making all kinds of flips when they're underrun. It's only a matter of time until someone breaks his neck like that. That's why I think he got the foul whistled for him.i was asking how was that Higuains foul
read the thread first, please
The special protection in the 6 yrd box means NBA type protection, touch him, just irritate him by being in his face and the ref will consider whistling. He's god inside his 6 yrd box. I was actually told, if he touches the ball with one finger and you flick it away, he'd get a foul against you. Not sure if the refs actually do that, but I never tried it... :PAs far as I know the keeper only gets the protection from refs in the 6 yard box. Sure, Neuer hits the ball but smashes Higuain with his knee, which in my opinion is dangerous play.
The keeper has every right to jump aggressively, to come out and catch the ball and take command of his own area. He got to the ball first and Higuian collided with him. No foul by either player.
If this is some sort of attempt to suggest it should have been a foul by the keeper...its very sad, tbh.
Germany were the better team on the night and throughout the whole tournament. Won it fair and square and very much deserved.
He was good in the group stages became anonymous by the quarter final. He may as well have went home before the match with Switzerland because he didn't show up then or since.
Being honest, I'd say Argentina were a big let down. All that attacking talent, yet they got to the final by playing like Stoke and stifling the other teams.
Is this your way of initializing a rational discussion?I'm not an idiot at all. If you want to discuss football, rationally, we can do that. If you want to throw your toys out of the pram, I can do that too.
There's nothing idiotic at all about suggesting that Messi wasn't a real threat tonight, or even since the quarter finals. The occasion was just too much for him. Not a big deal, though. He's still a very good player, at club level.
I can see any one of those three given. Since when is charging at an opponent with your knee head-high not careless or reckless? And would it have been impossible for Neuer to jump towards Higuain with his legs slightly tilted downwards? He probably would have gotten the decision anyway so I also wouldn't completely rule out the use of excessive force.Here are the FIFA rules:
Careless, reckless, using excessive force
“Careless” means that the player has shown a lack of attention or
consideration when making a challenge or that he acted without precaution.
• No further disciplinary sanction is needed if a foul is judged to be careless
“Reckless” means that the player has acted with complete disregard to the
danger to, or consequences for, his opponent.
• A player who plays in a reckless manner must be cautioned
“Using excessive force” means that the player has far exceeded the necessary
use of force and is in danger of injuring his opponent.
• A player who uses excessive force must be sent off
Haha I remember that. He came out with a kung-fu kick no less. Would've taked Klose's head off if he had gone in to challenge. Neuer had not come for the ball, else Higuan would've been clean through...*only to shoot wide*Jesus, do people want it to be a non-contact sport. Neuer has to go for that ball, it's goalkeeping, it's part of defending. There was a similar incident in the first half with Romero and Klose, but Klose pulled out as he realised Romero was going to win it. Higuain had that option too. Good goalkeeping, nothing more. Don't know where the ref found a foul in it though.
It is, which is why I don't think there was anything malicious in it. Reckless on the other hand isn't even debatable - by the definition in the rules there Neuer is reckless.That's just the way every single keeper around the world goes for the ball every single time, nothing excessive about it.
I totally second your point of view, honestly, I couldn't believe my eyes, when I saw the new thread this morning.....but I guess, some (German) fans feel like something would be taken away from their victory, if they would concede the obvious.I honestly can't see how it wasn't a foul by Neuer. How is this even being debated?
Thanks to Abizzz for posting this earlier.
I can see any one of those three given. Since when is charging at an opponent with your knee head-high not careless or reckless? And would it have been impossible for Neuer to jump towards Higuain with his legs slightly tilted downwards? He probably would have gotten the decision anyway so I also wouldn't completely rule out the use of excessive force.
I thought that Higuain was lucky to still be on the pitch. Neuer could've fractured his neck or dislocated his jaw for all he cared.
Not sure if it's that. Still, horrific challenge I thought.I totally second your point of view, honestly, I couldn't believe my eyes, when I saw the new thread this morning.....but I guess, some (German) fans feel like something would be taken away from their victory, if they would concede the obvious.
The important question remains whether we want a general change in the way we treat the follow-through of goalkeepers inside the penalty area. What we saw from Neuer does not differ from what Romero did against Klose with his kung-fu kick only that Klose was smart enough to pull back. We can even discuss a possible penalty kick against Argentina when Garay won that challenge by knocking out Kramer.Not sure if it's that. Still, horrific challenge I thought.
your post is an idiot"criticise the post not the poster"
Forum rules
I'm not in this thread for the Romero/Klose and Garay/Kramer incidents, although I do believe that they should be subject to more interpretation.The important question remains whether we want a general change in the way we treat the follow-through of goalkeepers inside the penalty area. What we saw from Neuer does not differ from what Romero did against Klose with his kung-fu kick only that Klose was smart enough to pull back. We can even discuss a possible penalty kick against Argentina when Garay won that challenge by knocking out Kramer.
In general the follow-through of goalkeepers is treated differently than the one from fieldplayers as long as they hit the ball. That's the general and widely applied line of refereeing all around the globe.
We can certainly discuss, if the application of the rules needs to be changed, but doing so in a WC final would be a horrible decision.
I personally prefer the more physical interpretation, we're a contact sports after all.
There would be at least an equal number of bitter German idiots if we had lost the final.The way some Argies are acting after the match proves already why Germany is the much more deserving winner. No sportsmanship at all. Remember small final 2006.