You’re including all 11 so Mkhi is playing better than Mkhi then? haha
Even now Zlatan is better any of those. Matic also. Dalot is 19. Grant a 3rd choice keeper.
How much of Ole's success is Mourinho's?
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Even now Zlatan is better any of those. Matic also. Dalot is 19. Grant a 3rd choice keeper.
Ole claims it all by bringing oldschool United vibe, the Phelan factor, plus Michael Carrick looks way more involved on the bench than before.
I remember Jose saying he doesn't even know where to fit Pereira in the squad... Ole somehow involves him in another great comeback vs Southampton.
Two different identities. Jose is not Ole and never will have that DNA, therefore 100% kudos for the new one.
I remember Jose saying he doesn't even know where to fit Pereira in the squad... Ole somehow involves him in another great comeback vs Southampton.
Two different identities. Jose is not Ole and never will have that DNA, therefore 100% kudos for the new one.
Jose brought the likes of Dalot, Lukaku, Matic and Lindelof in but Ole is the one that’s got them playing.
Hey he was laying the foundations
Could have locked this thread after the first reply. It’s worth repeating, though.
Fecking zero.
Fecking zero.
I know people do not like Mourinho, but it seems silly not to credit him with anything. The team he took over was poor. That team failed to get into the top four in a season where Leicester won the league, which shows just how weak the Premier League was that season. That is possibly the weakest the Premier League has been in the last two--maybe three--decades. There is no doubt the team he took over was terrible.
Transfers are certainly something that Mourinho should be credited with. I notice some people on here say that Mourinho's transfers were terrible but then say he should have been challenging for the title with the team he has. Which is it? Either the team is good enough and Mourinho's signings were good or the team is not good enough and his signings were bad. You cannot have it both ways.
Pogba, Lukaku, Matic (I think people forget how much we improved with his signing), Dalot, Lindelof, and Fred. He signed four current first team players and a right back with massive potential. Fred is also a highly talented midfielder, who I think will do well if he can settle. Strangely, all but one of those players was 25 and under when he signed them, so it is not like he bought a bunch of oldies.
I know he bought Sanchez, but most people on here were excited about that signing. I think it was certainly worth the risk even though it has not panned out.
Overall, he certainly improved the team. We went from fifth in one of the weakest premier league seasons ever to second in a league that had improved vastly in strength. Manchester City and Liverpool were massively improved last season; Tottenham improved; Arsenal were about the same; Chelsea probably were not that much worse, just the competition had gotten stronger.
We improved a lot defensively under Mourinho last season. I know people say we were good defensively under Van Gaal, but I do not think that is true. The only reason we conceded a low amount of goals is because we held on to possession a lot more. I remember any time we gave it away under Van Gaal our defense and midfield would be shredded by any team. The opposition was almost guaranteed a shot on goal if we gave it away.
Transfers are certainly something that Mourinho should be credited with. I notice some people on here say that Mourinho's transfers were terrible but then say he should have been challenging for the title with the team he has. Which is it? Either the team is good enough and Mourinho's signings were good or the team is not good enough and his signings were bad. You cannot have it both ways.
Pogba, Lukaku, Matic (I think people forget how much we improved with his signing), Dalot, Lindelof, and Fred. He signed four current first team players and a right back with massive potential. Fred is also a highly talented midfielder, who I think will do well if he can settle. Strangely, all but one of those players was 25 and under when he signed them, so it is not like he bought a bunch of oldies.
I know he bought Sanchez, but most people on here were excited about that signing. I think it was certainly worth the risk even though it has not panned out.
Overall, he certainly improved the team. We went from fifth in one of the weakest premier league seasons ever to second in a league that had improved vastly in strength. Manchester City and Liverpool were massively improved last season; Tottenham improved; Arsenal were about the same; Chelsea probably were not that much worse, just the competition had gotten stronger.
We improved a lot defensively under Mourinho last season. I know people say we were good defensively under Van Gaal, but I do not think that is true. The only reason we conceded a low amount of goals is because we held on to possession a lot more. I remember any time we gave it away under Van Gaal our defense and midfield would be shredded by any team. The opposition was almost guaranteed a shot on goal if we gave it away.
Mourinho was poisoning this club and the poison has been removed. Less than zero, much less.
1% or less, I'd say. Obviously he'll say it's all him.
Van Gaal taught us how to pass and keep possession and bore the opossition into surrender, Mourinho taught us how to hate, Ole needs massive credit not just for motivating but for tactics an organisation, the nouse he has shown in games particularly against Chelsea, Liverpool and PSG is top draw.
It's certainly a possibility which I hope is not the case!
I too have been thinking about Martinez at Everton and once the players relied on him for defensive coaching it all went to pot!
But a number of people don't agree with you.
Then I would question their judgement.
Less than zero. Come on Paul, I thought that you were intelligent.
Cuts both ways.
Depends on how you look at it. If it's as simple as inheriting a squad then LVG deserves credit for Mourinho's trophies won with us. If it's about philosophy, dressing room atmosphere, club culture etc.. then zero is the right answer. Ole had to reverse almost everything to fix the club.
Jose's always been very good throughout his career with signings, so I do give him credit for that. He also made us a consistent top 4 team again after Moyes and Van Gaal's faffing around, so I give him credit for that too.
Pogba, Lukaku, Lindelof, Matic, Zlatan.. all good signings. Dalot is potential, Bailly I can see why he signed him even though I don't rate him, Fred I think will be good. Mikhi / Sanchez were on paper good signings. And he cleared a decent amount of the deadwood too.
I think Jose would make a pretty strong scout actually if he wants to go into that line of work.
Pogba, Lukaku, Lindelof, Matic, Zlatan.. all good signings. Dalot is potential, Bailly I can see why he signed him even though I don't rate him, Fred I think will be good. Mikhi / Sanchez were on paper good signings. And he cleared a decent amount of the deadwood too.
I think Jose would make a pretty strong scout actually if he wants to go into that line of work.
Yeah I don't disagree. My point is he did identify talented players. Matic was similarly said to be past it but has been quite good under Ole, I'd say one of the first on the team sheet when fit
I am.
Even the players he bought, he didn't know how to play them. Absolutely atrocious, way past his sell-by date but knew that before he joined.
United should have got rid of him sooner. He gave nothing to the club. Luckily it didn't go on longer before he destroyed the players and the club even further.
Despise him.
I would like my tuppence worth here!
If you look at the current team/squad, there are players that go back to SAF. De Gea, Smalling, Jones. Then there are other players brought in by the subsequent managers including Jose. From Herrera to Shaw to Paul Labile Pogba to Lukaku.
There are players that have come through the system too. Rashford is the shining light, but let’s not forget Pogba is included in that. He’s a United graduate. Jesse, Andreas, Scotty.
SAF, Moyes, LVG, Mourinho all deserve a little credit but that’s just for the signings, which the board approve and EW writes the cheques for.
There is collective congratulations deserved, not just Mourinho.
What Ole, Mike, Carrick etc have done, is coached them on defensive shape, changed the midfield dynamic, changed the complete style of play and instilled belief in all of the squad. They’ve turned the mood on it’s head. They have turned the club on its head. It’s not just good management, it s fantastic management. Who can remember a squad chanting the managers name in the dressing room after a win? Any team, not just us?
We are playing in a Man Utd style for the 1st time in years.
But let us all not forget, Ole IS a successful manager. He has already won the Tippy-leaguey a couple of times and cut his teeth. He could potentially be at OT for years, if not decades like SAF.
The biggest credit MUST go to whoever decided to take a gamble on the Ole/Phelan axis. I think it was a calculated gamble in the 1st place, United had nothing to lose really and I’m wondering if Poch was ‘plan b’ from the off? All hoping this would work. It will have been talked about long before anyone in the public eye knew about it. We all think it was SAF I suppose. I know I do.
If you look at the current team/squad, there are players that go back to SAF. De Gea, Smalling, Jones. Then there are other players brought in by the subsequent managers including Jose. From Herrera to Shaw to Paul Labile Pogba to Lukaku.
There are players that have come through the system too. Rashford is the shining light, but let’s not forget Pogba is included in that. He’s a United graduate. Jesse, Andreas, Scotty.
SAF, Moyes, LVG, Mourinho all deserve a little credit but that’s just for the signings, which the board approve and EW writes the cheques for.
There is collective congratulations deserved, not just Mourinho.
What Ole, Mike, Carrick etc have done, is coached them on defensive shape, changed the midfield dynamic, changed the complete style of play and instilled belief in all of the squad. They’ve turned the mood on it’s head. They have turned the club on its head. It’s not just good management, it s fantastic management. Who can remember a squad chanting the managers name in the dressing room after a win? Any team, not just us?
We are playing in a Man Utd style for the 1st time in years.
But let us all not forget, Ole IS a successful manager. He has already won the Tippy-leaguey a couple of times and cut his teeth. He could potentially be at OT for years, if not decades like SAF.
The biggest credit MUST go to whoever decided to take a gamble on the Ole/Phelan axis. I think it was a calculated gamble in the 1st place, United had nothing to lose really and I’m wondering if Poch was ‘plan b’ from the off? All hoping this would work. It will have been talked about long before anyone in the public eye knew about it. We all think it was SAF I suppose. I know I do.
Only the chance to play UCL's Round of 16.
From his "awful season" to Ole's "season of the rebirth and miracles".
This thread is not going down well. Good luck OP.
Zero. Now to the next thread.
Actually he can take abit credit for McTominay. Nowt esle.
Actually he can take abit credit for McTominay. Nowt esle.
This has to be one of the dumbest questions ever asked. Moaninho deserves 0 credit for Ole's success. 0. Should have been fired after Sevilla debacle and remarks during press conf.
Great thread for flushing the Caf Ultras. Of course Mourhino and indeed Van Gaal before him contributed to the club, and to the defensive solidity. We had less injuries with Mourhino too, which I find interesting. This does not mean that Ole is not doing a great job. He is. But yea, of course, I am sure the players, even those who dont like him, would agree that he made improvements in some respects.
Jose made some decent signings and let some average ones leave. It's a contribution to progress but Ole clearly worked with the players better.
OP is this something that you truly ponder about?
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Things seem to have fallen perfectly in place for Solskjaer to come in and work his magic. Everything happens for a reason, but thats as far as you can take it really, if you have to find a way to feel good about our last managers post SAF. To talk about if they deserve credit for Ole's work is beyond stupid.
No thing.
Mctominay and Lindeloff.
That's it.
That's it.
He bought in quite a few of the players and we're undeniably much tougher mentally than we were before Jose took over. I think you have to give him some credit for that.
Everything since Ole has taken over though has been down to him and the players.
Everything since Ole has taken over though has been down to him and the players.
Both LVG and Mourinho played low risk football and so it might help us do well when we have a good result that they have learned some things from them. In order how to attack and break teams down you need to give Ole full credit though. He has totally changed the way we attack and given us a much more attacking mentality.
I just think more of when Jose took over. We were a team that crumbled at the first sign of pressure or difficulty. There was a game fairly early on in his reign where we were 2-0 down and almost accidentally got a goal back near the end, and our players just moped back to the halfway line as if they were annoyed that they'd now have to fight for the remaining few minutes instead of give up.
By the end of Jose's second season you almost expected us to mount a fightback at 2-0 down. I think it's daft to say he didn't improve anything, but equally he doesn't get credit for the improvements since Ole has taken over.
Jesus you are right.
Said this on the pod a few times and in some threads. I think Mourinho still has an eye for talent but zero concept of how to utilize it optimally within the context of modern football strategies and concepts.
Conte won the league after inheriting a Jose squad that finished
tenth. I seem to recall Madrid won the Champion's League the season after he left. It's almost like there's a pattern to these total coincidences...
tenth. I seem to recall Madrid won the Champion's League the season after he left. It's almost like there's a pattern to these total coincidences...
He should be on the scouting/executive side of things rather than managing. He has always had a good eye for talent, at every stage of his career. Somewhere along the line he just couldn't figure out how to manage it.
DoF? As long as it's somewhere else, that would be fine. I actually agree with the poster who suggested he had the demeanor of someone suffering a mental breakdown or midlife crisis. He had the vibe of a man on anti depressants.
Lindelof has been exceptional this season and i am Mourinho is the reason, but he really stepped up. He certainly has to be the most improved player. I hope he keeps this up for years to come.
Mourinho is the reason we have Ole as or manager (caretaker if you will) right now. Have we had a different manager who knows we might have never seen Ole in the club.
Mourinho is the reason we have Ole as or manager (caretaker if you will) right now. Have we had a different manager who knows we might have never seen Ole in the club.
Yeah it tells us that after working under Mourinho every every manager seems like the best ever. The pattern is Mourinho leaving.
Yes.
The pattern is that he goes to clubs that spend a lot of money, with which he achieves less than is desired and is consequently sacked, then the next manager has an easy time achieving more with what Jose failed with as the new manager instantly brings a less toxic environment that the players enjoy more, so they play better.