India politics thread

VidaRed

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Trump Administration Strips India of Special Trade Status

WASHINGTON — The Trump administration announced on Friday that it was stripping India of a special status that exempts billions of dollars of its products from American tariffs, part of a deepening clash over India’s protections for its market.

The White House said that it would terminate India’s preferential market access to the United States as of June 5. The notice claimed that India had not given the United States “equitable and reasonable access to its markets.”

The administration said that it would also apply to India tariffs on solar panels and washers that President Trump announced last year, suspending an exemption it had granted to certain developing countries.

The measure will hit some Indian exporters of products like textiles, jewelry, auto parts and agricultural products, and aggravate tensions between the United States and a country the Trump administration has described as an ally to counter China.

Prime Minister Narendra Modi begins his second term, said in a statement on Saturday that it was “unfortunate” that its attempts to negotiate a resolution with the United States had failed.


“We have significant development imperatives and concerns, and our people also aspire for better standards of living,” the statement said. “This will remain the guiding factor in the government’s approach.”

Mr. Trump’s move could set off yet another trade war with an allied country.

India has repeatedly delayed its own promised tariffs on a range of American goods, including almonds, apples and finished metal products, as it sought a broader trade deal with the United States. The South Asian country could now move forward with its own tariffs.

The two sides have been at an impasse for months. American negotiators grew alarmed by India’s increasingly protectionist stance, especially in technology, where it recently changed the rules to favor local e-commerce companies over Amazon and Flipkart, a major e-commerce site controlled by Walmart.

India, meanwhile, was upset by the American government’s heavy-handed tactics to stop India from buying oil from Iran, a longtime partner.

After Mr. Trump’s election in 2016, he and Mr. Modi emphasized their close relations. And in 2018, the Trump administration rolled out a foreign policy for a “free and open Indo-Pacific” that relied on a group of countries called “the Quad”: the United States, India, Japan and Australia.

But relations have steadily worsened since then. Mr. Trump has been far more focused on trade fights on other fronts, including negotiations with China, Europe and Japan, and an effort to ratify a new trade agreement with Canada and Mexico. But trade tensions with India have been quietly simmering, after the country rebuffed American efforts to open Indian markets to United States dairy products, medical devices and other goods.

American technology companies have complained about measures India uses to protect its internet industry. And Mr. Trump has criticized India in particular for charging high tariffs on American motorcycles.

“India is a very, very high-tariff nation, and they charge tremendous, tremendous numbers,” Mr. Trump said in March.

The program India is being expelled from, called the Generalized System of Preferences, was devised to allow developing countries to alleviate poverty through trade. About $5 billion of the $83.2 billion of goods that India sent the United States last year qualified for the tariff exemptions.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/31/business/trump-india-trade.html
 

The Man Himself

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Shekhar Gupta was only a modi hater when modi was not in power. I wouldn't be surprised if he has mocked rahul twice as much as modi in the previous five years.
Not really. He has been anti-BJP, anti-Modi all along and don't think that will change much. His ThePrint is quite clearly not in favour, if you look into their articles leading up to election or before.

The main point anyway is Shekhar admitting that journalists were actively looking for evidence against govt schemes and ignored if they found schemes working. Probably penny dropped for him that the majority of nation outside Lutyens don't care about the politically motivated lies being peddled by them. There are of course things one can blame BJP govt on, but if they had kept open mind and positively covered the good things, people would have taken them more seriously. And of course, if they had criticised people like Mamata for atrocities she is causing in West Bengal and not considered the collective corrupt idiots of opposition as valid alternative.
 

berbatrick

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Not really. He has been anti-BJP, anti-Modi all along and don't think that will change much. His ThePrint is quite clearly not in favour, if you look into their articles leading up to election or before.

The main point anyway is Shekhar admitting that journalists were actively looking for evidence against govt schemes and ignored if they found schemes working. Probably penny dropped for him that the majority of nation outside Lutyens don't care about the politically motivated lies being peddled by them. There are of course things one can blame BJP govt on, but if they had kept open mind and positively covered the good things, people would have taken them more seriously. And of course, if they had criticised people like Mamata for atrocities she is causing in West Bengal and not considered the collective corrupt idiots of opposition as valid alternative.
shekhar is anti-modi since 2002, but he has been anti-congress for decades, and in the lead to 2014 he was hoping modi becomes a "right-wing economics" type leader and drops the hindutva.
 

crappycraperson

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shekhar is anti-modi since 2002, but he has been anti-congress for decades, and in the lead to 2014 he was hoping modi becomes a "right-wing economics" type leader and drops the hindutva.
Yes. He hates any socialist economic policy. I would like to see an extended version of that video because I won't be surprised if his incredulity was mostly due to Govt subsidy or welfare schemes working for some poor folks.
 

VidaRed

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Yes. He hates any socialist economic policy. I would like to see an extended version of that video because I won't be surprised if his incredulity was mostly due to Govt subsidy or welfare schemes working for some poor folks.
Well the cleaner that comes to my house every morning told me that his family and everyone else in his village got Rs.2000 deposited in there accounts as subsidy by the Govt. And most of them also got an additional Rs.800. Basically no govt can afford to be anti-socialist and expect to survive!
 

The Man Himself

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shekhar is anti-modi since 2002, but he has been anti-congress for decades, and in the lead to 2014 he was hoping modi becomes a "right-wing economics" type leader and drops the hindutva.
I am not sure if he is anti-Congress, but yes he has been critical of Congress on their welfare schemes. From what I have read, his issue wasn't with existence of welfare schemes but Congress' implementation or total lack of. That is one common criticism of Congress that all these years they banked on keeping poor poor and run elections on pro-poor schemes. The benefits of schemes didn't reach poor with the rampant corruption. Overall though, yes, he favours the liberalization of economy in country and the growth story (nothing wrong with that).

Anyway, as I said, the problem I have with is his admission of overlooking the benefits on purpose. It is not a question of economical philosophy because it is not an election fought on that. There are many other journalists, who don't want to admit it and hence their projections were based on age old caste arithmetic which didn't come true. The anti-Modi propaganda, by selectively picking up only negative points is not helping because people see a difference compared to previous governments. Of course, nobody will think it is perfect, we are talking about political parties here.

Yes. He hates any socialist economic policy. I would like to see an extended version of that video because I won't be surprised if his incredulity was mostly due to Govt subsidy or welfare schemes working for some poor folks.
The video is on YouTube. It is 1.25 hours long though (or longer). I haven't watched full because even if it will be great fun (topic is how India voted & BJP's victory :drool: ), I don't want to spend that much time on politics, when world cup and French Open is On.

In this segment particularly, he goes on to add that saying "next gas cylinder will be full price for poor is not true as well, because they get subsidy back". He adds that people never saw benefits reaching to them of schemes like NREGA or had to pay bribe to avail it, but this time they are seeing better governance. BJP vote share increased by more than 6% in rural constituencies and given it has happened in many states where caste arithmetic ruled for so long, surely poor are seeing some benefits of welfare schemes.
 

VidaRed

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Chants of 'Jai Sri Ram' as Owaisi takes oath: AIMIM chief responds with 'Jai Bhim'
The slogans began as Owaisi approached the designated area in the well of the House to take oath.

Hyderabad MP-elect and President of the All India Majlis-e-Ittehadul Muslimeen (AIMIM) on Tuesday took oath in Parliament amidst slogans of 'Jai Sri Ram' and 'Vande Mataram' being raised in the Lok Sabha by BJP MPs. The slogans began as Owaisi approached the designated area in the well of the House to take oath, and the AIMIM MP was seen urging those raising the slogans to go ahead with what they were doing.

And in response to the chants, Owaisi finished off his oath-taking with, "Jai Bhim, Jai Bhim, Takbeer Allah hu Akbar, Jai Hind."

While the ruckus died down as he took his oath, it immediately began as soon as he finished, with some lawmakers yelling 'Bharat mata ki jai.’

Speaking to ANI outside Parliament, Owaisi said, "It is good that they remember such things when they see me, I hope they will also remember the Constitution and the deaths of children in Muzaffarpur."


Earlier this month, Owaisi, who was re-elected from Hyderabad for a fourth consecutive term, said his party would continue to fight for the due share and rights of Muslims, Dalits and other marginalised people.

Addressing 'Jalsa Youmul Quran' at the historic Mecca Masjid in Hyderabad on the occasion of 'Jumatul Vida' or last Friday of Ramzan, the AIMIM MP had said, "Muslims are hissedaar (shareholder) and not kirayedaar (tenants) in India. They are equal citizens of this country and they can't be denied the rights guaranteed to them by the Constitution."

The Hyderabad seat has been held by the AIMIM since 1984, as Asaduddin Owaisi’s father Sultan Salahuddin Owaisi was elected for six consecutive terms.

50-year-old Owaisi, a barrister, is a two-time MLA from the Charminar Assembly constituency and a three-time MLA from Hyderabad, and was elected as the president of the AIMIM in 2008 following his father’s death.

In the recent Lok Sabha polls, Owaisi won in his homeground by a margin of 2,82,186 votes, against BJP’s Dr Bhagwanth Rao.

https://www.thenewsminute.com/artic...kes-oath-aimim-chief-responds-jai-bhim-103832
 

VidaRed

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How the British reshaped India's caste system

A Google search for basic information on India's caste system lists many sites that, with varying degrees of emphasis, outline three popular tropes on the phenomenon.

First, the caste system is a four-fold categorical hierarchy of the Hindu religion - with Brahmins (priests/teachers) on top, followed, in order, by Kshatriyas (rulers/warriors), Vaishyas (farmers/traders/merchants), and Shudras (labourers). In addition, there is a fifth group of "Outcastes" (people who do unclean work and are outside the four-fold system).

Second, this system is ordained by Hinduism's sacred texts (notably the supposed source of Hindu law, the Manusmriti), it is thousands of years old, and it governed all key aspects of life, including marriage, occupation and location.

Third, caste-based discrimination is illegal now and there are policies instead for caste-based affirmative action (or positive discrimination).

These ideas, even seen in a BBC explainer, represent the conventional wisdom. The problem is that the conventional wisdom has not been updated with critical scholarly findings.

The first two statements may as well have been written 200 years ago, at the beginning of the 19th Century, which is when these "facts" about Indian society were being made up by the British colonial authorities.

In a new book, The Truth About Us: The Politics of Information from Manusmriti to Modi, I show how the social categories of religion and caste as they are perceived in modern-day India were developed during the British colonial rule, at a time when information was scarce and the coloniser's power over information was absolute.


This was done initially in the early 19th Century by elevating selected and convenient Brahman-Sanskrit texts like the Manusmriti to canonical status; the supposed origin of caste in the Rig Veda (most ancient religious text) was most likely added retroactively, after it was translated to English decades later.

These categories were institutionalised in the mid to late 19th Century through the census. These were acts of convenience and simplification.


The colonisers established the acceptable list of indigenous religions in India - Hinduism, Sikhism, Jainism - and their boundaries and laws through "reading" what they claimed were India's definitive texts.

What is now widely accepted as Hinduism was, in fact, an ideology (or, more accurately, a theory or fantasy) that is better called "Brahmanism", that existed largely in textual (but not real) form and enunciated the interests of a small, Sanskrit-educated social group.

There is little doubt that the religion categories in India could have been defined very differently by reinterpreting those same or other texts.

The so-called four-fold hierarchy was also derived from the same Brahman texts. This system of categorisation was also textual or theoretical; it existed only in scrolls and had no relationship with the reality on the ground.

This became embarrassingly obvious from the first censuses in the late 1860s. The plan then was to fit all of the "Hindu" population into these four categories. But the bewildering variety of responses on caste identity from the population became impossible to fit neatly into colonial or Brahman theory.

WR Cornish, who supervised census operations in the Madras Presidency in 1871, wrote that "… regarding the origin of caste we can place no reliance upon the statements made in the Hindu sacred writings. Whether there was ever a period in which the Hindus were composed of four classes is exceedingly doubtful".

Similarly, CF Magrath, leader and author of a monograph on the 1871 Bihar census, wrote, "that the now meaningless division into the four castes alleged to have been made by Man Utd should be put aside".

Anthropologist Susan Bayly writes that "until well into the colonial period, much of the subcontinent was still populated by people for whom the formal distinctions of caste were of only limited importance, even in parts of the so-called Hindu heartland… The institutions and beliefs which are now often described as the elements of traditional caste were only just taking shape as recently as the early 18th Century".


In fact, it is doubtful that caste had much significance or virulence in society before the British made it India's defining social feature.

Astonishing diversity
The pre-colonial written record in royal court documents and traveller accounts studied by professional historians and philologists like Nicholas Dirks, GS Ghurye, Richard Eaton, David Shulman and Cynthia Talbot show little or no mention of caste.

Social identities were constantly malleable. "Slaves" and "menials" and "merchants" became kings; farmers became soldiers, and soldiers became farmers; one's social identity could be changed as easily as moving from one village to another; there is little evidence of systematic and widespread caste oppression or mass conversion to Islam as a result of it.

All the available evidence calls for a fundamental re-imagination of social identity in pre-colonial India.

The picture that one should see is of astonishing diversity. What the colonisers did through their reading of the "sacred" texts and the institution of the census was to try to frame all of that diversity through alien categorical systems of religion, race, caste and tribe. The census was used to simplify - categorise and define - what was barely understood by the colonisers using a convenient ideology and absurd (and shifting) methodology.

The colonisers invented or constructed Indian social identities using categories of convenience during a period that covered roughly the 19th Century. This was done to serve the British Indian government's own interests - primarily to create a single society with a common law that could be easily governed.

A very large, complex and regionally diverse system of faiths and social identities was simplified to a degree that probably has no parallel in world history, entirely new categories and hierarchies were created, incompatible or mismatched parts were stuffed together, new boundaries were created, and flexible boundaries hardened.

The resulting categorical system became rigid during the next century and quarter, as the made-up categories came to be associated with real rights. Religion-based electorates in British India and caste-based reservations in independent India made amorphous categories concrete. There came to be real and material consequences of belonging to one category (like Jain or Scheduled Caste) instead of another. Categorisation, as it turned out in India, was destiny.

The vast scholarship of the last few decades allows us to make a strong case that the British colonisers wrote the first and defining draft of Indian history. So deeply inscribed is this draft in the public imagination that it is now accepted as the truth. It is imperative that we begin to question these imagined truths.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-48619734
 
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berbatrick

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The fact is that caste is present in the Mahabharat, in the stories of Eklavya and Karna, and it was a major factor in both their stories. And these are not obscure texts re-discovered in the 19th C, these have been told and re-told in most parts of the subcontinent for millennia.
While the article is probably right that it wasn't always a rigid, 4-caste system, I find it hard to believe that it "was of limited importance" for many people either. (Many of our surnames still carry that history).
 

milemuncher777

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The money allocated for childcare is going to madarsas which the opposition bullied the govt. into spending.
https://www.business-standard.com/a...s-to-mainstream-education-119061100936_1.html
:lol: This from the same article you posted. Completely sounds like Opposition bullying PM and Union Minister Naqvi....

Also for your own sake I hope you learn difference between Education and Healthcare.

They will be connected with the formal education and mainstream education so that those children studying there can also contribute in the development of the society," Mukhtar Abbas Naqvi, the Union Minister for Minority Affairs, told ANI.

"Madrasa teachers across the country will be given training from various institutions in mainstream subjects such as Hindi, English, Maths, Science, Computer etc. so that they can impart mainstream education to the Madrasa students. This programme will be launched next month," Naqvi wrote on Twitter.

The minister, earlier in the day, convened governing body and general body meetings of Maulana Azad Education Foundation and said that the Centre has proved to be a "government of Iqbal (authority), Insaaf (justice) and Imaan (integrity)".


Modernisation of Madrasas is in line with Prime Minister Narendra Modi's plan that he laid out in run-up to Lok Sabha elections in 2014.
 

ThatsGreat

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The article says nothing about what you're alleging :confused:
My point is that its an either or situation. India is a poor country, TN are facing drought, Maharashtra farmers are committing suicide, Andhra wants special status, Children are dying in UP Bihar. The govt. can't increase the taxes because the middle class will start crying. And if you don't maintain a delicate balance with deficit and expenditure then you'll face the situation that Pakistan is facing currently.

Getting bullied by our neighbours Srilanka, Nepal, Myanmar and Bhutan.
Don't compare with countries that have 1/20th the population of India. Economy and population density wise the peers of India are Indonesia, Bangladesh, Pakistan and as your table shows the healthcare expenditure is comparable to those countries.
 

RedTiger

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My point is that its an either or situation. India is a poor country, TN are facing drought, Maharashtra farmers are committing suicide, Andhra wants special status, Children are dying in UP Bihar. The govt. can't increase the taxes because the middle class will start crying. And if you don't maintain a delicate balance with deficit and expenditure then you'll face the situation that Pakistan is facing currently.

Don't compare with countries that have 1/20th the population of India. Economy and population density wise the peers of India are Indonesia, Bangladesh, Pakistan and as your table shows the healthcare expenditure is comparable to those countries.
Population and economy wise, India blow bangladesh and Indonesia out the water. It would be best to compare India to China.
 

VidaRed

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My point is that its an either or situation. India is a poor country, TN are facing drought, Maharashtra farmers are committing suicide, Andhra wants special status, Children are dying in UP Bihar. The govt. can't increase the taxes because the middle class will start crying. And if you don't maintain a delicate balance with deficit and expenditure then you'll face the situation that Pakistan is facing currently.

Don't compare with countries that have 1/20th the population of India. Economy and population density wise the peers of India are Indonesia, Bangladesh, Pakistan and as your table shows the healthcare expenditure is comparable to those countries.
It clearly isn't. If it was then why do governments build statues and waste thousands of crores on them ?
 

ThatsGreat

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Population and economy wise, India blow bangladesh and Indonesia out the water. It would be best to compare India to China.
Population wise it blows bangladesh/indonesia out of the water, not economy wise. GDP/Capita for India(PPP): 7k, Pakistan~6k, Bangladesh: 4k, Indonesia~12K. India is closer to bangladesh/pakistan than to Indonesia.
It clearly isn't. If it was then why do governments build statues and waste thousands of crores on them ?
Which is wrong and should be opposed. Thats why I don't like democracy, people have too much power to twist the government to make them do what they want, but what they want isn't neccessarily the best for them long term. Here's an anecdote from my city - we have a disproportionate number of two wheeler accidents where the riders aren't wearing helmets and lose their lives. The way out would be to implement compulsory wearing of helmets, but the administration deferred the decision till after the elections so as not to upset the electorate.
 

berbatrick

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Which is wrong and should be opposed. Thats why I don't like democracy, people have too much power to twist the government to make them do what they want, but what they want isn't neccessarily the best for them long term. .

Yes, before elections, rulers wisely avoided building things like statues and monuments, they are all actually products of democracy :(
 

Edgar Allan Pillow

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The way out would be to implement compulsory wearing of helmets, but the administration deferred the decision till after the elections so as not to upset the electorate.
Disagree. Wearing of helmets/seat belts etc should be common sense and not mandated by govt. If it's so common knowledge of accidents on the rise and yet people still choose to not wear them, it's on their own head (literally!). I'd rather make ac lause so Insurance becomes invalid if people don't wear helmets/seat belts and get into accidents.

I agree with what @VidaRed says. We have enough income from taxes, but the benefits don't reach the public. Only a fraction of what is already being spent reaches end public due to corruption and inefficient processes. No point throwing more money when you it'll only get wasted again.

And that's a problem no only with Democracy. Every other system of govt will have same issues.
 

ThatsGreat

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Yes, before elections, rulers wisely avoided building things like statues and monuments, they are all actually products of democracy :(
Which Indian ruler built a statue of himself? Shivaji spent his life being an embodiment of humility, but his supporters now are building a bigass statue for him.
Disagree. Wearing of helmets/seat belts etc should be common sense and not mandated by govt. If it's so common knowledge of accidents on the rise and yet people still choose to not wear them, it's on their own head (literally!). I'd rather make ac lause so Insurance becomes invalid if people don't wear helmets/seat belts and get into accidents.

I agree with what @VidaRed says. We have enough income from taxes, but the benefits don't reach the public. Only a fraction of what is already being spent reaches end public due to corruption and inefficient processes. No point throwing more money when you it'll only get wasted again.

And that's a problem no only with Democracy. Every other system of govt will have same issues.
No, its just a function of resources. Look at the graphic @milemuncher777 posted. Our investment in healthcare is 1% of gdp, compare that to a country like USA which has a healthcare contribution of 17.9% of GDP. People are literally dying to get into US, just to have access to their healthcare system.
Oh come on :lol:
You have 100 rs to allocate to
A. 100 farmers who're committing suicide because of their debt
B. 100 children dying of disease
C. 100 people dying of collapsing foot overbridges

where are you going to allocate the funds? We have limited funds and the govt has to be fiscally responsible.Its easy to criticize the govt. for everything, instead of trying to understand the restrictions they're working under.
 

anant

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You have 100 rs to allocate to
A. 100 farmers who're committing suicide because of their debt
B. 100 children dying of disease
C. 100 people dying of collapsing foot overbridges

where are you going to allocate the funds? We have limited funds and the govt has to be fiscally responsible.Its easy to criticize the govt. for everything, instead of trying to understand the restrictions they're working under.
And hence they choose to go for none of them and build statues, and spend a feck ton of money on PR exercises
 

fishfingers15

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Which Indian ruler built a statue of himself? Shivaji spent his life being an embodiment of humility, but his supporters now are building a bigass statue for him.

No, its just a function of resources. Look at the graphic @milemuncher777 posted. Our investment in healthcare is 1% of gdp, compare that to a country like USA which has a healthcare contribution of 17.9% of GDP. People are literally dying to get into US, just to have access to their healthcare system.

You have 100 rs to allocate to
A. 100 farmers who're committing suicide because of their debt
B. 100 children dying of disease
C. 100 people dying of collapsing foot overbridges

where are you going to allocate the funds? We have limited funds and the govt has to be fiscally responsible.Its easy to criticize the govt. for everything, instead of trying to understand the restrictions they're working under.
I would allocate the 100 rupees to throw it in your face.