Injury Crisis 2023/24 | Martínez and Casemiro back in training

saik

Full Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2016
Messages
2,875
Please let them go. Terrible deals.
40m for a 29-year old Varane wasn't as much as a terrible deal. No one thought he would be this injury prone.

60m for Casemiro rising to 70m is a terrible deal whichever way you look at it. And all we got was 1 good year out of him before he lost his legs. I still believe he was a panic signing by the club after there was no progress on the FDJ deal.
 

acnumber9

Full Member
Joined
Jun 21, 2006
Messages
22,290
Yes, cause that’s exactly what I meant. . . Sell those 2 & keep everyone else. Lindelof for captain in fact.
Then surely the first step in the right direction would be getting rid of the worse players. Casemiro and Varane out only means more of those two. That’s the reality of the situation.
 

MegadrivePerson

Full Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2022
Messages
1,550
40m for a 29-year old Varane wasn't as much as a terrible deal. No one thought he would be this injury prone.

60m for Casemiro rising to 70m is a terrible deal whichever way you look at it. And all we got was 1 good year out of him before he lost his legs. I still believe he was a panic signing by the club after there was no progress on the FDJ deal.
We got half a good season out of Casemiro at best. He was woeful in the second half of last season.
 

AFC NimbleThumb

New Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2019
Messages
8,363
Then surely the first step in the right direction would be getting rid of the worse players. Casemiro and Varane out only means more of those two. That’s the reality of the situation.
The ‘reality of the situation’ is we’re what 10 games into a season & bar a historic upturn in performance we aren’t even getting Top4. Performances with Varane [more often injured than not] & Casemiro [looking increasingly less durable & usually banned] aren’t stark enough that keeping them would change our fortunes much.

Varane & Casemiro aren’t saving this season, if there was an opportunity to move them on for money you take it. It also isn’t illegal to actually sign decent players in January as replacements, you know like well run clubs do.

I’m not sure why you mention Lindelof & Amrabat as I’d prefer none of the 4 be here next year.

I generally agree you get rid of your worst players first, the context of Varane, Casemiro, their decline & the season we’re having have to be taken into account though.
 

gerdm07

Thinks we should have kept Pereira
Joined
Aug 8, 2011
Messages
2,751
40m for a 29-year old Varane wasn't as much as a terrible deal. No one thought he would be this injury prone.

60m for Casemiro rising to 70m is a terrible deal whichever way you look at it. And all we got was 1 good year out of him before he lost his legs. I still believe he was a panic signing by the club after there was no progress on the FDJ deal.
I just don't understand the decision making for transfers. Real M were probably laughing after we gave them 60m for an aging Casemiro. We never learn. We did the same for Matic. Paid 40m and got a good 5 or 6 months out of him at most. This club is a joke. So much money wasted.
 

saik

Full Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2016
Messages
2,875
We got half a good season out of Casemiro at best. He was woeful in the second half of last season.
Wouldn't say woeful but he was average at best. I mentioned it in the past but he was already showing signs of losing pace during the end of last season. Tells a lot about our terrible recruitment.

Am I allowed to say that we funded their Bellingham signing? They were more than happy to let Casemiro go.
 

Idxomer

Full Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2014
Messages
15,242
Wouldn't say woeful but he was average at best. I mentioned it in the past but he was already showing signs of losing pace during the end of last season. Tells a lot about our terrible recruitment.

Am I allowed to say that we funded their Bellingham signing? They were more than happy to let Casemiro go.
Tchouaméni was his replacement and they got him for basically the same money if you factor in the wages.
 

acnumber9

Full Member
Joined
Jun 21, 2006
Messages
22,290
The ‘reality of the situation’ is we’re what 10 games into a season & bar a historic upturn in performance we aren’t even getting Top4. Performances with Varane [more often injured than not] & Casemiro [looking increasingly less durable & usually banned] aren’t stark enough that keeping them would change our fortunes much.

Varane & Casemiro aren’t saving this season, if there was an opportunity to move them on for money you take it. It also isn’t illegal to actually sign decent players in January as replacements, you know like well run clubs do.

I’m not sure why you mention Lindelof & Amrabat as I’d prefer none of the 4 be here next year.

I generally agree you get rid of your worst players first, the context of Varane, Casemiro, their decline & the season we’re having have to be taken into account though.
I mention them because they are the alternative. The reality is that for our form to improve we need our better players to play better. They are more likely to regain form than Lindelof and Amrabat are all of a sudden going to play at a level they’ve never shown to be capable of.
 

mu4c_20le

Full Member
Joined
Jul 7, 2013
Messages
43,535
I just don't understand the decision making for transfers. Real M were probably laughing after we gave them 60m for an aging Casemiro. We never learn. We did the same for Matic. Paid 40m and got a good 5 or 6 months out of him at most. This club is a joke. So much money wasted.
 

Gordon Godot

New Member
Joined
Feb 19, 2016
Messages
1,374
40m for a 29-year old Varane wasn't as much as a terrible deal. No one thought he would be this injury prone.

60m for Casemiro rising to 70m is a terrible deal whichever way you look at it. And all we got was 1 good year out of him before he lost his legs. I still believe he was a panic signing by the club after there was no progress on the FDJ deal.
Except maybe RM did, why sell a defender arguably in his prime
 

saik

Full Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2016
Messages
2,875
Except maybe RM did, why sell a defender arguably in his prime
Maybe they did yea. In hindsight we can say that now. But at that time, it wasn't a terrible deal looking at the going rate for defenders.

All things considered our recruitment team should know better(whether he had injury issues). There's no excuse for making these kind of deals year on year and then look for replacement after just 1 year. It's not sustainable at all as we already saw this summer.
 

Northstand

Full Member
Joined
Mar 31, 2009
Messages
2,850
Missed the game today (thankfully), and just seen the line-up. What’s the story with Rashford?
 

Someone

Something
Joined
Oct 21, 2007
Messages
7,949
Location
Somewhere
Do we have any news on Shaw and Martinez? Remember hearing that they're expected to return in Nov but haven't seen any news lately.
 

Fahad Jawaid

Full Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2013
Messages
1,192
Do we have any news on Shaw and Martinez? Remember hearing that they're expected to return in Nov but haven't seen any news lately.
We really need to have Shaw, Varane and Martinez back. We can’t continue playing like this shit on stick football. Because today we got lucky, on other days it would either be a draw or a narrow loss.

We need to increase our standards again to those old times where we used to be cruising at half and would take off our first team players around 70 mins and watching us on weekends would take away the stress of the whole week and watching Utd was the highlight of the week. Instead it makes me go nuts watch our matches and feels like I have become a mental patient.
 

elmo

Can never have too many Eevees
Joined
Jul 14, 2008
Messages
13,359
Location
AKA: Slapanut Goat Smuggla
Do we have any news on Shaw and Martinez? Remember hearing that they're expected to return in Nov but haven't seen any news lately.
Martinez’s back in November was before they announced he had to undergo surgery no? Don’t think we’ll see him back till Jan.
 

Iker Quesadillas

Full Member
Joined
Mar 12, 2021
Messages
3,989
Supports
Real Madrid
Except maybe RM did, why sell a defender arguably in his prime
Because he wanted to leave and didn't renew.

Real Madrid signed Alaba and Rudiger after Varane's departure. They are both older than him and have missed a similar amount of days to injury (according to Transfermarkt).

Alaba played a similar amount as Varane last season, 3000 minutes vs. 2670 minutes, 39 games vs. 34.
 

croadyman

Full Member
Joined
Mar 9, 2018
Messages
34,654
Do we have any news on Shaw and Martinez? Remember hearing that they're expected to return in Nov but haven't seen any news lately.
Reckon we might see Shaw against Everton in the first game after international break
 

Irwin99

Full Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2018
Messages
9,333
Our top scorer is out until xmas :(

I know he hasn't been great this season but it's still a big loss to lose Casemiro for that long, particularly as he usually takes a long time to get going after a period out. Hopefully better news with Shaw to come.
 

Gabriel Djemba-Bebe

Full Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2018
Messages
2,312
Ffs. I remember reading that he barely missed any games through injury at Madrid, so I was confident he wouldn't be another Varane. 2 injuries at this stage of the season (one of which is a long term injury) is not what we had in mind when we splurged all that money on him.
 

Adisa

likes to take afvanadva wothowi doubt
Joined
Nov 28, 2014
Messages
50,367
Location
Birmingham
Will keep saying it, club needs to give sacrifice. We are cursed.
 

Red in STL

Turnover not takeover
Joined
Dec 1, 2022
Messages
9,702
Location
In Bed
Supports
The only team that matters
http://www.skysports.com/share/13002801

How long til Shaw is back ? I can see him playing centre back once fit, Malacia is surely also back soon and Regulion is already fit and that’d give us a natural balance even if not at our strongest.
Malacia won't play much when he comes back I reckon, he's missed an entire pre-season - this season is probably more-or-less a write-off for him, I suspect we'll extend the Regulion loan to the end of the season
 

horsechoker

The Caf's Roy Keane.
Joined
Apr 16, 2015
Messages
52,046
Location
The stable
Malacia won't play much when he comes back I reckon, he's missed an entire pre-season - this season is probably more-or-less a write-off for him, I suspect we'll extend the Regulion loan to the end of the season
What if Big Ange says "yeah nah"?
 

Cutch

Full Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2008
Messages
16,401
Location
Northern Ireland. Stretty W3102, Row 2, Seat 129
We seem to get so many injuries where a player will play a first half, we won't even notice he's injured at half time, doesn't reappear then is out for ages, never just a precaution and back the next game.

Also rarely seem to get the straightforward 2 week hamstring strains, always serious and out for months despite never looking as bad as say Van de Ven for Spurs last night.
 

NewGlory

United make me feel dirty. And not in a sexy way.
Joined
Jul 13, 2019
Messages
4,349
Will keep saying it, club needs to give sacrifice. We are cursed.
Truer words have never been posted on this forum.

Can we "sacrifice" Richard Arnold and John Murtough, if not Glazers themselves?
 

BluesJr

Owns the moral low ground
Joined
May 15, 2013
Messages
9,052
Casemiro being out isn’t a loss. He’s finished.
 

sullydnl

Ross Kemp's caf ID
Joined
Sep 13, 2012
Messages
34,063
Ffs. I remember reading that he barely missed any games through injury at Madrid, so I was confident he wouldn't be another Varane. 2 injuries at this stage of the season (one of which is a long term injury) is not what we had in mind when we splurged all that money on him.
The key difference being that Madrid had him as a 21-30 year old. Whereas we spent £60m+ to sign him for his 30+ years. Hardly surprising that his body was more likely to start breaking down with us.

Add in the fact that he was always a player whose strengths were heavily dependent on physicality and you reap what you sow. It's not like there weren't people pointing out the extremely obvious risk of the deal ending up being very short term at the time.
 

K Stand Knut

Full Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
5,183
Location
Stretford End
Malacia won't play much when he comes back I reckon, he's missed an entire pre-season - this season is probably more-or-less a write-off for him, I suspect we'll extend the Regulion loan to the end of the season
Probably one of the worst takes on a football player that I’ve ever read or heard. And I talk a lot of shit personally so have experience
 

K Stand Knut

Full Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
5,183
Location
Stretford End
The key difference being that Madrid had him as a 21-30 year old. Whereas we spent £60m+ to sign him for his 30+ years. Hardly surprising that his body was more likely to start breaking down with us.

Add in the fact that he was always a player whose strengths were heavily dependent on physicality and you reap what you sow. It's not like there weren't people pointing out the extremely obvious risk of the deal ending up being very short term at the time.
And the additional fact that the majority of games in Spain for him would have been a literal stroll in the park
 

Reddevildans

Full Member
Joined
May 14, 2012
Messages
1,251
Location
Beyond the Wall
If changes at the top are coming the casemiro and varane signings will be the last of their kind I believe. Former world class players on thier last paycheck. We should never buy these type of players again and never on such ridiculous salaries.
 

SER19

Full Member
Joined
Apr 15, 2008
Messages
12,624
Basically we need to make it to the New Year no further from the top 4 than we are now, and hope we have a fit squad for second part of season. There's no way we're closing the gap with our current injury list so just have to hang in there.