Probably shouldn't be, he ran a terrible campaign.
Does look like FF will be the kingmakers though so you're right. Interesting to see who they pick to get cannibalised by. Kind of looking forward to that
Irish Politics
- Thread starter JakeC
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Does look like FF will be the kingmakers though so you're right. Interesting to see who they pick to get cannibalised by. Kind of looking forward to that
Means nothing. A number of candidates get in in each constituency, between 3 and 5. They didn't come first but it doesn't matter, they're still in - it's just a bit embarrassing perhaps and also symbolic of how everyone is sick to death of their parties.
I wonder if Wicklow ever plan on finishing their count. Feck sake,
I'd be surprised if he didn't. The actual final result isn't near as bad for him as it looked like being a week ago, it hasn't been the sort of total meltdown that would prompt a dramatic rethink within the party, his national popularity wasn't polling at particularly disastrous levels and one suspects his popularity within FG hasn't been irreversibly eroded either. Can't see any of his potential rivals feeling sure enough to move against him at this point.
Both parties spread themselves too thin probably. They're both aiming for 40% ish representation when they'll have a hard time getting that collectively. Was reading that they had about 85% of first preference votes in the 1980's. Things have definitely changed.
No bother, also beware of hot takes on Twitter right now, I’m seeing some truly awful ‘analysis’ from some British journalists and commentators tonight.
Let me guess, they think it’s all about brexit
Stepaside Shane Ross!
Tbf FG thought that would be a major talking point as well
Of course both Healy-Raes get elected. Actual quote from Danny Healy-Rae: "To hell with the planet".
Joan Burton out. Good riddance to the hatchet-faced cow.
If SF refuse a coalition then they destroy the polls in a few months. Thats ridiculous
Labour in general did terriblly. I'm not sure what the point of them is when they seem to have next to no youth appeal.
Yeah i think they're done and dusted tbh. They seem to have lost most of their traditional support to other parties and have been left with unions. And i dont think unions have any meaningful power now. They need to start looking at merging with other parties to survive imo
What would the timeline look like for it to be decided which coalition we end up with? I take it this will roll on for weeks?
David McCullough on RTE just referred to SF’s Violet Anne Wynne as “Violent” Anne Wynne 
On RTE they've just looked at a list of newly elected SF TDs who couldn't even get elected into or hold onto their local council seat.
Now they're romping home in this general election. It's got to be a worry.
Are they almost better off missing out on power now and laying into FF and FG for another term while they build up a more competent group of candidates?
This is what I’ve been thinking. It might be a little bit too soon for them to jump into government, if/when things go wrong they may not have the foundations to retain their new status. Whereas spending the next few years as the main opposition party could allow them to build themselves up as a serious power-party with a basis for real longevity.
FG/FF coalition makes no sense, as mentioned by others here.
Interesting times ahead as it looks more likely, from what I’ve read, a FF/SF combo.
I wonder what that’ll do to/for the country.
Interesting times ahead as it looks more likely, from what I’ve read, a FF/SF combo.
I wonder what that’ll do to/for the country.
Josepha Madigan gets in. Disappointing
Pretty big news
Surprised to so much support among young voters.
Surprised to so much support among young voters.
If SF are in any form of government what will this do regarding reunification, if anything ?
Sinn Fein have previously said that they want a border poll within five years and that moves towards Irish unity would be a pre-condition for entering government. More recently they said it wasn't a red line but rather a political necessity, also saying that preparations for a referendum on Irish unity needed to begin.
Given that, it's hard to imagine that having SF in government won't see reunification higher on the ROI government agenda, even if that only extends to various bodies being set up to examine, discuss and plan for what's to come. If a border poll is inevitable at some point then this would certainly push the timetable forward.
That combined with Brexit must make reunification far more likely than anyone could have envisaged even a year or two ago?
Still won't be quick you wouldn't think.
Still won't be quick you wouldn't think.
Even if the referendum was a yes, and it would be tight either way I’d say, it would take years. NI is so entrenched in the civil service of the UK it’ll be a massive undertaking dismantling it.
That’s even before we discuss the economic realities
I'm surprised by that.
I think the next 5 years is far too soon as I don't think then dust has settled up there yet.
Even if it passed in NI, the majority of unionists could still be against it which could lead to all sorts of trouble kicking off again.
There’s a lot of other topics that need a lot of urgent attention - healthcare, housing etc. SF if they do go into government with someone need to prove themselves with those things and not get too distracted by this other massive topic concerning the whole island. People didn’t vote them in because they are republicans, people voted them in because they have socialist policies and promised they would take on the banks, childcare, housing, healthcare
Yeah it is, mostly down to the DUP.
Reunification would be a complete shitshow unless it's handled very carefully. It would likely take anywhere up to 50 years to fully happen from the moment the vote passes.
This election and talking to people in the run up to it and during the count has really annoyed me.
I admire what Sinn Fein have done and I can only imagine they are regretting not running more candidates. They'd have easily been the largest party in the 33rd Dáil if they had run another candidate in most constituencies. However, it is extremely worrying how many people voted for "the party". We have 7/8 new TD's who lost local council seats in the last 12 months. These people are surely not competent if they couldn't hold onto council seats and prove that you could literally have run anyone under the SF banner and they'd likely have topped the poll.
Anyway, I'm not overly concerned about that. They will tow the party line and vote however the Ard Comhairle tell them.
What has annoyed really annoyed me is the sense of entitlement that we see in Ireland at the minute. Are there problems in Ireland at the minute? Of course there are. We shouldn't have the number of homeless that we do, our health service needs a serious over-haul and house prices are far too high in general. There are plenty of other problems in Ireland too. But point to a country in the world where there are no problems? Where 100% of the people are utterly content with their lot.
It doesn't happen. There are no Utopias.
I work in the public sector. I have a house with a manageable mortgage. Do I get to the end of some months and look worryingly at my bank balance? I do. Would I look a few extra euro in my pocket? Of course I would. But I'm not struggling. Now I also count myself as pretty lucky. There are some people genuinely struggling.
However, there are also a huge cohort of people that have jobs, are paying rent or mortgages, have plenty of food on the table, go on a foreign holiday every year and are all over social media saying we need change and that Ireland is fecked. How entitled have we become in the space of a couple of decades. My parents' generation was a generation that genuinely struggled and they didn't complain like we do today.
I was talking to a nurse yesterday who has just bought a house with her husband, was in America twice last year as well as a couple of European city breaks in the past 12 months and I'm supposed to sit and listen to her tell me she's struggling?
There are numerous people that I know, first hand are not working, have no intention of working and between dole, rent allowance, children's allowance etc have a larger disposable income than me and are shouting from the roof tops about how FF and FG have ruined the country. These same people have the best of clothes, the best of cars. They go abroad every year. They are out in the town every week, while I can't afford to do the same? I don't complain about it. I budget and have my nights out when I can.
In government in the last few decades, there was incompetence, there was corruption, I'm not trying to say that everyone in government in the last 30 years was a saint. I know there were plenty of poor decisions, some mistakes, some downright devious. But we have a great little country in many ways and we are being fed the line that the country is ruined.
Tell me honestly, when was the general population of Ireland ever better off than they are right now? During the Celtic Tiger? Well I don't think anyone wants us to go back to those excesses. There are people genuinely struggling and we need to do a lot better for those people. They shouldn't be hungry or homeless in a country like Ireland in 2020. But in reality, the people hungry and homeless are a tiny fraction of our society.
I realise this probably comes across as very FF/FG defensive post. But it's not. I'd regard myself as centre-left economically. I personally would love to see us have a health service that isn't two tier, where you are treated based on your need and not what type of insurance you have. I'd love to see more Gardaí on the streets and Garda stations in smaller areas re-opened. I really feel for people who are working hard and genuinely struggling. It's just the entitlement of a portion of our population that annoys me.
I admire what Sinn Fein have done and I can only imagine they are regretting not running more candidates. They'd have easily been the largest party in the 33rd Dáil if they had run another candidate in most constituencies. However, it is extremely worrying how many people voted for "the party". We have 7/8 new TD's who lost local council seats in the last 12 months. These people are surely not competent if they couldn't hold onto council seats and prove that you could literally have run anyone under the SF banner and they'd likely have topped the poll.
Anyway, I'm not overly concerned about that. They will tow the party line and vote however the Ard Comhairle tell them.
What has annoyed really annoyed me is the sense of entitlement that we see in Ireland at the minute. Are there problems in Ireland at the minute? Of course there are. We shouldn't have the number of homeless that we do, our health service needs a serious over-haul and house prices are far too high in general. There are plenty of other problems in Ireland too. But point to a country in the world where there are no problems? Where 100% of the people are utterly content with their lot.
It doesn't happen. There are no Utopias.
I work in the public sector. I have a house with a manageable mortgage. Do I get to the end of some months and look worryingly at my bank balance? I do. Would I look a few extra euro in my pocket? Of course I would. But I'm not struggling. Now I also count myself as pretty lucky. There are some people genuinely struggling.
However, there are also a huge cohort of people that have jobs, are paying rent or mortgages, have plenty of food on the table, go on a foreign holiday every year and are all over social media saying we need change and that Ireland is fecked. How entitled have we become in the space of a couple of decades. My parents' generation was a generation that genuinely struggled and they didn't complain like we do today.
I was talking to a nurse yesterday who has just bought a house with her husband, was in America twice last year as well as a couple of European city breaks in the past 12 months and I'm supposed to sit and listen to her tell me she's struggling?
There are numerous people that I know, first hand are not working, have no intention of working and between dole, rent allowance, children's allowance etc have a larger disposable income than me and are shouting from the roof tops about how FF and FG have ruined the country. These same people have the best of clothes, the best of cars. They go abroad every year. They are out in the town every week, while I can't afford to do the same? I don't complain about it. I budget and have my nights out when I can.
In government in the last few decades, there was incompetence, there was corruption, I'm not trying to say that everyone in government in the last 30 years was a saint. I know there were plenty of poor decisions, some mistakes, some downright devious. But we have a great little country in many ways and we are being fed the line that the country is ruined.
Tell me honestly, when was the general population of Ireland ever better off than they are right now? During the Celtic Tiger? Well I don't think anyone wants us to go back to those excesses. There are people genuinely struggling and we need to do a lot better for those people. They shouldn't be hungry or homeless in a country like Ireland in 2020. But in reality, the people hungry and homeless are a tiny fraction of our society.
I realise this probably comes across as very FF/FG defensive post. But it's not. I'd regard myself as centre-left economically. I personally would love to see us have a health service that isn't two tier, where you are treated based on your need and not what type of insurance you have. I'd love to see more Gardaí on the streets and Garda stations in smaller areas re-opened. I really feel for people who are working hard and genuinely struggling. It's just the entitlement of a portion of our population that annoys me.
I'm not really sure where you live but I've never met a loaded welfare scammer who has the best clothes, cars and goes on holidays all the time, so I'm fairly dubious on that point.
I can't really comment on people moaning when they can go on holidays and buy houses etc but we are in the midst of a housing crisis, have an unprecedented number of families being made homeless and hospital waiting lists are as bad as they have ever been. You seem to be glossing over these as if they aren't an absolute disgrace.
The contention that ah sure we've a grand little country and we should just accept things as they are is ludicrous. People are entitled to be pissed off at the moment and if anything the Irish were too accepting in the past. As a people we really should protest a lot more than we do.
There is truth in what you’re saying. I know someone who moans about the mortgage payment on a house they have on the Navan Road in Dublin. They both work but they over stretched themselves when they got it back when the mortgage application was fiddled to make it look better.
Or there’s people like on that money show - a nurse who worked in UAE earning 4K a month tax free and came home a year later with no savings? Lives at home, pays no rent and lives out of her overdraft. Buy some common sense FFS.
We live in a shitty area but the mortgage only has about 55k left on it and mortgage payments are down to €600 a month. You couldn’t rent a room in this town for less than 800!
Anyway I digress - there is bits of the country which are fecked. Bed shortages for example. Waiting lists to see consultants. My son has been waiting over 2 years to get an eye test for his age. I’d hate to be looking for somewhere to rent in Dublin or the commuter towns, the competition is horrendous. Rents are sky high. And so on.
As regards SF, well now they will have to stand up and be counted. Lack of good experience may become an issue
I really, really, really hope that the Metrolink doesn't get cancelled now. FF have basically said they would do so and SF haven't made their position clear on it at all. Not investing in proper public transport in Dublin has been one of the biggest shambles of the Celtic Tiger years and I hope we don't make that mistake again.
Many voters vote for the interests of the country above their personal circumstances. Im a reasonably welll off farmer who voted SF due to the housing crisis amd shocking welfare system. I dont need to suffer to want action taken. If we did that then nobody would be here to stick up for them since FG surely wouldnt give a feck, steppong over those who are dying on our streets
We’re hoping to buy a house out in Santry this year as close to the proposed stop as possible, but it’s been in the pipeline for so long I’ve given up hope. Ballymun has been built, torn down, and built again in the same period.
Yeah it has to go ahead. I mean I get the cost but we have to free up traffic congestion and too many people reliant on cars in general
Just to show how awful this argument is, its the 1700's and I turn to you and say - ''I'm pretty sure the child labour we have in Ireland is awful and needs to go'' and then you say - ''Are there problems in Ireland at the minute? Of course there are. We shouldn't have the number of homeless that we do, we shouldn't have small children dying in factories and
You're argument is nothing but a nihilistic defence of the current state of things. If you actually care about homelessness, health services etc then you wouldn't be talking about utopias and slagging off people on the dole. Again it can't be understated that ''there is no Utopian's argument '' has been used to stop every gain we take for granted, be it the right for working men and women to vote, the american civil rights movement, LGBTQ rights, ending slavery, child labour, fighting against colonialism etc etc etc.
I never said anyone was a scammer or loaded. I said there are people on welfare who go abroad every year, wear nice clothes, have decent cars and have active social lives (The best of everything might have been an exaggeration alright). If you claim you don't know people like that then It's me who would be dubious.
I also never said we should accept anything. I have no problem with voting for change. I have no problem with Sinn Fein governing. I have a problem with many of their policies as I don't think many are even remotely doable or realistic.
I just said that there are many people who are living fine lives, but feel entitled to so much more. A civilised country owes it's citizens a decent standard of living. There are many who aren't being offered that at the minute and they deserve much, much better. There are far more though, that have a more than decent standard of living, but feel entitled to more, instead of looking to manage their money better or work harder, or at all.
The cost is 3bn which is nothing, really. That's only two NCH's. and a quarter of our yearly HSE expenses. Obviously it won't actually be 3bn because nothing ever is, but it is ridiculous not having a direct line to the city center from our national airport and one of Europe's busiest. If people want affordable housing in Dublin then projects like this need to go ahead in order to give people easier access to the city from more rural parts of it.
my worry with SF is that they've promised so much yet haven't mentioned how they'll actually generate the money, and Metrolink is an easy target because it's a FG project.