Is it disloyal if assistant managers wants to become head coaches?

[roonster09]

In the last few days, Gary Monk and Luis enrique called their assistant managers as disloyal for wanting to become head coaches, is it disloyal?

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For me it isn't. Everyone have different ambitions in their life, it's so silly to assume that assistant managers would want to be assistants forever.

 

[Schmiznurf]

There's nothing disloyal about wanting to move up, not everybody wants to be an assistant forever.

 

[Kostur]

In your coaching career it's pretty much a natural step even if you're working for the most decorated coach. It's like calling players who move from smaller leagues to bigger ones to give it a try, even if they are bound to fail, disloyal. It's small time thinking and speaks volumes about the two.

 

[Mr Anderson]

Nothing disloyal about it. It's progression up the ladder. Can't stand in anyones way for trying to make it at their dream job.

 

[horsechoker]

Yes, if I were a manager I'd have my assistant beheaded to send a message to anyone thinking they can rise up the ranks.

 

[Posh Red]

Monk is a dickhead. Never liked him

 

[humdinger]

Didn’t Fergie fall out with Brian Kidd for this?

 

[Ish]

There's nothing disloyal about showing ambition, or having ambition.

It's the manner in which you try and gain said promotion, or achieve your ambition, which could be construed as being disloyal or untrustworthy etc.

 

[kentafuji]

Quieroz left us to manage Real Madrid, because it was a fantastic oppertunity. Sometimes you just cant pass up the chance to manage, as it may not come again. He came back afterwards, so clearly no hurt feelings from United.

Monk should remember how he got his managerial chance though before criticising others. If it wasnt for a caretaker role at Swansea at the right time, he might not be a manager now. Clotet took an oppertunity that was presented to him, as why wouldn't he.

 

[Ødegaard]

You can go from assistant manager to manager without taking your bosses job.
Doing so well for him that you get a main gig is one option, helping in making him fail so you get a temporary chance is another one.

 

[Tom Cato]

In the last few days, Gary Monk and Luis enrique called their assistant managers as disloyal for wanting to become head coaches, is it disloyal?

For me it isn't. Everyone have different ambitions in their life, it's so silly to assume that assistant managers would want to be assistants forever.

Oh yes, very disloyal.

And not disloyal at all.

What Moreno did was incredibly disloyal. Enrique left the team to tend to family, and it was agreed that he would return. Literally seizing on the opportunity because of a sick child who later passed away, intending to continue as Manager after Enrique was ready to return, is just a very low way of going about it. Moreno had previously stated that he would step down and not be in Enriques way.

Of course assistant managers are allowed to aspire to become managers. But the right order of increase in rank is to become the manager of another club. Not the one you are currently in, actively ousting the very guy you are working for.

 

[R.N7]

Their egos just can't handle it.

 

[LilyWhiteSpur]

Nah its career progression, Monk is a grade A twat.

 

[Varun]

It's so obviously natural that it's downright bizarre anyone could think it's disloyal.

 

[He'sRaldo]

Too much talk of loyalty in football.

 

[lsd]

Its not the Mafia you get into the game to go as far as you can and if you are good enough to get a top position you should take it .

 

[youmeletsfly]

Luis Enrique talks more about the fact that his assistant knew he was going to go back and still wanted to be the head coach.
I don't know if there's any loyalty involved here, it's a bit of an exaggeration.

 

[DoomSlayer]

Oh yes, very disloyal.

And not disloyal at all.

What Moreno did was incredibly disloyal. Enrique left the team to tend to family, and it was agreed that he would return. Literally seizing on the opportunity because of a sick child who later passed away, intending to continue as Manager after Enrique was ready to return, is just a very low way of going about it. Moreno had previously stated that he would step down and not be in Enriques way.

Of course assistant managers are allowed to aspire to become managers. But the right order of increase in rank is to become the manager of another club. Not the one you are currently in, actively ousting the very guy you are working for.

I absolutely agree. It's obviously individual in every case though and I think Enrique has the right to feel a certain way about it.

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

Mourinho was probably the most classiest assistant in the game. He was always upfront with Van Gaal and Robson about his ambitions.

 

[VP89]

Mourinho said Giggs wanted to be manager when he left after LVGs sacking didn't he?

 

[DoomSlayer]

Mourinho said Giggs wanted to be manager when he left after LVGs sacking didn't he?

Yeah, but Giggs was basically hired by the club as part of LVG's staff, he wasn't with him before that so it's completely different.

 

[stevoc]

Didn’t Fergie fall out with Brian Kidd for this?

No i think they fell out for other reasons, Kidd trying to undermine him behind his back being one of them.

 

[0le]

With the exception of the assistant manager actively working behind the scenes to sabotage his superior, the manager, which seems pretty far-fetched, I fail to see how it could ever be considered disloyal.

 

[stevoc]

Its not disloyal for an assistant to want to become a head coach himself.

But there are certainly disloyal ways to go about achieving that ambition.

 

[youngrell]

I think it is disloyal if your ambition is to take your boss' job, after all you are employed to be his assistant. Unless there's an agreement that you will one day take over when the manager decides to call it quits, you should be looking at a manager's job elsewhere.

How can you trust an assistant who wants your job? They would be doing the very opposite of their role.

 

[sun_tzu]

I think it is disloyal if your ambition is to take your boss' job, after all you are employed to be his assistant. Unless there's an agreement that you will one day take over when the manager decides to call it quits, you should be looking at a manager's job elsewhere.

How can you trust an assistant who wants your job? They would be doing the very opposite of their role.

yeah pretty much this - but I would say there is nothing wring n them wanting to do a great job because they love the club and in doing so put themselves in pole position to be the natural successor in the future
It becomes wrong if they start trying to accelerate that process and brief against the manager to players or management

 

[VeevaVee]

Seems egotistical to think others wouldn't want to move on and be in the same position as them. Gatekeeping, I think they call it.

 

[Ikon]

In the last few days, Gary Monk and Luis enrique called their assistant managers as disloyal for wanting to become head coaches, is it disloyal?

It's disloyal when your assistant is sneakily taking every opportunity to stab you in the back and take your job....

 

[Inigo Montoya]

In the last few days, Gary Monk and Luis enrique called their assistant managers as disloyal for wanting to become head coaches, is it disloyal?

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For me it isn't. Everyone have different ambitions in their life, it's so silly to assume that assistant managers would want to be assistants forever.

Scenario:
I'm an assistant head at a school. The school is outstanding and I work brilliantly with the Head; we make a good team.

An opportunity comes up to go for a headship at another school. The school in question would like me to take over based on the good work I've done at the previous secondary. I think it's time for me to be a Head rather than an assistant and it's also more money. I'm interviewed and accept the position.

My current head calls me disloyal for taking a promotion.

How absurd does that sound? What's the difference between that and an assistant coach taking on a head coach role?

 

[nore1975]

Moreno is completely in the wrong here. He was Enrique’s assistant. Enrique’s 9 year old daughter is then diagnosed with terminal cancer. Moreno steps up as interim manager on the understanding that at a time of Enrique’s choosing the latter will come back. Ambition is one thing moving the goal posts is another. Given the extraordinary circumstances in which he got the job he should have just reverted to the number 2 position, as was the plan, gracefully and then post Euro 2020 considered his position at that point. It’s Lopetegui all over again only different circumstances

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

I think Enrique's being a bit of a cnut here to be fair.

 

[Superden]

'loyalty in professional football' is an oxymoron. egos and thus self interest first always. i would imagine it would be difficult to be successful without a ruthless ego.

 

[stepic]

I think Enrique's being a bit of a cnut here to be fair.

how so? the agreement was that he could return at any time.

 

[tomaldinho1]

In general answer to OP if of course not. Enrique's case is different in that it's more he feels he's been betrayed by the person - if Moreno had even 1% thought he'd not be keen to drop back down to assistant when Enrique came back he should never have accepted.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

What Moreno did was incredibly disloyal. Enrique left the team to tend to family, and it was agreed that he would return. Literally seizing on the opportunity because of a sick child who later passed away, intending to continue as Manager after Enrique was ready to return, is just a very low way of going about it. Moreno had previously stated that he would step down and not be in Enriques way.

Of course assistant managers are allowed to aspire to become managers. But the right order of increase in rank is to become the manager of another club. Not the one you are currently in, actively ousting the very guy you are working for.

This with bells on, disloyal and a shitty human being to boot.

Wanting to become a manager is what you want from an assistant though, just shows ambition.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

I think Enrique's being a bit of a cnut here to be fair.

Whaaaaaaaaatt?

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

how so? the agreement was that he could return at any time.

With his statements calling him disloyal when Moreno is a huge reason why he's able to waltz back into the job in the first place. That agreement doesn't happen if Enrique was replaced with anyone else after he stood down. No other manager would accept those terms. He claims to understand his motives but then calls him disloyal and say's "oh, I'd never do that sort of thing".

Whaaaaaaaaatt?

As above. It seems Enrique agrees with me:

I am not the good guy in this, but I am definitely not the bad guy either.

So, I'd say a bit of a cnut is a fair assessment.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

With his statements calling him disloyal when Moreno is a huge reason why he's able to waltz back into the job in the first place. That agreement doesn't happen if Enrique was replaced with anyone else after he stood down. No other manager would accept those terms. He claims to understand his motives but then calls him disloyal and say's "oh, I'd never do that sort of thing".

As above. It seems Enrique agrees with me:

So, I'd say a bit of a cnut is a fair assessment.

His kid died man!

He took leave on an agreement that he could return when things were "resolved". The guy is supposed to be a long term friend and trusted colleague that has Enrique to thank for a being in the position he was in rather than the other way around as you bolded, Moreno NEVER gets the job without Enrique and then only gets it because a 9 year old is on her death bed.... I literally couldn't think of a more cnut thing to do @Dwazza Gunnar Solskjær

 

[sullydnl]

If Enrique is a cnut then Moreno is a mechagodzilla level cnut.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

His kid died man!

He took leave on an agreement that he could return when things were "resolved". The guy is supposed to be a long term friend and trusted colleague that has Enrique to thank for a being in the position he was in rather than the other way around as you bolded, Moreno NEVER gets the job without Enrique and then only gets it because a 9 year old is on her death bed.... I literally couldn't think of a more cnut thing to do @Dwazza Gunnar Solskjær

It goes both ways, as you seem to be ignoring. Sure, Moreno isn't in that position without Enrique stepping down but equally, Enrique doesn't get to come back when he wants to without Moreno being in that position. No other managerial candidate would have agreed to that arrangement.

Moreno had a contract until the end of the Euros, I don't see it as an unreasonable ask to take the team to the tournament and then step down to allow Enrique to return. Enrique's response (sacking him, calling him out as disloyal and claiming he'd never do anything like that) is a bit over the top, hence my assertion that he's being a bit of a cnut, which he evidently agrees with.