He specifically mentioned that it's called Beso de negro. Beso de negro does not mean "n'ers kiss". If it did, the answer is pretty simple. Ofcourse, you'd rename it, and I can't believe anyone has to spell this out.
Jarrod Bowen under investigation for racist tweet
- Thread starter UncleBob
- Start date
As a person who left an homophobic youtube comment when I was 15 -not because I am homophobic, just because I wanted to act macho in youtube (i know how stupid that sounds)-,which still hunts me, I can see why and how a 15 years old kid can do something like this. Still, a punishment should be given, but I don't think it should skew our view towards Bowen and treat him as a racist scumbag.
Beso de negro is the Spanish name, I’m talking about the Hungarian name. And no, we won’t rename it.
Criticize him to your hearts content. Fining or banning him , no way. He was not a professional footballer and was 15 years old.
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I'm not advocating banning him. I'm question why some are taking umbrage to the possibility that someone would get criticized for using a racial slur when he was 15.
I agree that I wouldn't like to see someone in that position banned in any way.
I'm in the who cares camp, but those of you saying it was acceptable to tweet the n word give your head a wobble. 
surely it's translated as negroes kiss?
makes feckall sense to be translated that way
Speaking as a black man, I can tell you categorically, that is not true.
The Hungarian name translates to roughly the same thing (Negro/Black kiss) according to a lot of Hungarians. That's precisely why the poster is as addressing used that word.
Furthermore, your "we won't change" what you just interpreted as a racial slur isn't just pathetic, but irrelevant. The main point in all this seems to have gone over your head.
The fact that you think it's acceptable to have something called after the n word (by your interpretation) and feel comfortable to openly tell people "we won't change it" says a lot about you.
He can be criticized for it all day long by anyone and everyone if they want. Banning or fining him for it when it was so long ago and he was legally a child when it happened is absurd.
I agree with that. But this wasn't the point you made. You had an issue with the fact that it took place a long time ago, and I'm not sure why that makes the incident any less inappropriate.
It depends on what planet you were on. I can confirm on earth this is categorically untrue.
It was malicious prior to 2012. Perhaps you meant this sarcastically and the less-than-perfect syntax has given an inaccurate representation of what you were trying to say.
Of course its wrong to write that, at any age.
But Its a reason why you cant vote, or go to prison, in most european countires before you turn 18. An avarage male person fully develops the ability to think of consequences at 23.
But Its a reason why you cant vote, or go to prison, in most european countires before you turn 18. An avarage male person fully develops the ability to think of consequences at 23.
The whole thing is nothing short of a show. To trawl back and find something from 9 years which was posted as a child, rightly or wrongly, but as a child and then use that to beat him with shows how bad the state of affairs is in the UK. I am sure a lot of people, not all, but a lot have done things when they were a child that they regret, but the most important thing is that we grow as humans and learn from our mistakes.
Feck the FA.
Feck the FA.
Reading back, I think you’re right, I think he was referring to the following post:
We don’t have separate words for negro, n’a and n’er, néger can mean any of these. It’ definitely not the colour black. Younger people don’t ise it anymore in Hungary because it is offensive but we say it when referring to a traditional dessert because when the dessert was created this word was acceptable. And I’m saying we won’t change the name because even the idea is ridiculous. The dessert’s name is not a racial slur, the first part of it can be interpreted as a racial slur, but considering the time it was named, it is perfectly acceptable. And I don’t thing you should suggest foreigners what to do with their language.
Rename Montenibro too
This is what I posted.
By going after I am referring to the thread title which says he is under investigation for his tweet. Not sure why your only picking on the fact that I referenced how long ago it was, I also mentioned it was wrong and that he was a kid.
So this controversy is over a decade old tweet posted when he was 15 years old, where he didn't actually use the word N****r but Wigger?
Have i got this right?
Have i got this right?
Because people mature and grow up and realise a bit more right from wrong.
We can't hold things we said or done as kids against us when we are adults, unless of course we are still the same idiotic man baby.
You have to allow for growth as a person.
I am sorry if I did that. My intention was to highlight that in other cultures there are many expressions which can be mistunderstood as racist. I'm not sure if your translation is correct. It might be for the Spanish version, but the Hungarian version is surely means what I wrote since it's the Hungarian version of that exact word. We have another word for "black".
I also do not want to validate the use of that word, I just really wanted to give another perspective. At least in my country the word wasn't used with malicious intent in the past. Nowadays, we are living in a globalized world and since English is the main language, the English culture dominates other cultures. A few years later the treat might be renamed to fit in as it happened in Germany (from Negerkuss it became Schokokuss).
Anyway, Jarrod Bowen didn't use the N word. He used it with "W" which is reffered to a subculture which was widely known and freely parodised in popculture. Nine years later he is criticized for it and I am sure that many people already comdemned him as a racist. Furthermore, the first post is also misleading, because you can think he used the N word which I don't think was acceptable back then.
Nope
I see/hear people say worse than this nearly every day. Never mind the fact it was a decade ago when a) he wasn't even an adult and b) no one would have batted an eyelid at the tweet anyway.
The problem with over policing things to this point is you end up creating the problem rather than fighting it. No sane person would think punishing someone in these circumstances was just, and that just fuels anger and resentment towards whatever the cause is.
Going back in time to punish someone for something they said 9 yeard ago as a teenager, measured against the standards now rather than then. That's the sort of thing you do if you're out to get someone and just want to invent a reason to go after them. Or just like pretending to be angry about things that have no relevance. Not the sort of thing you do if you're genuinely concerned about an issue.
Imagine what you could find on here if you went back and looked at posts in the general forum from 2011.
The problem with over policing things to this point is you end up creating the problem rather than fighting it. No sane person would think punishing someone in these circumstances was just, and that just fuels anger and resentment towards whatever the cause is.
Going back in time to punish someone for something they said 9 yeard ago as a teenager, measured against the standards now rather than then. That's the sort of thing you do if you're out to get someone and just want to invent a reason to go after them. Or just like pretending to be angry about things that have no relevance. Not the sort of thing you do if you're genuinely concerned about an issue.
Imagine what you could find on here if you went back and looked at posts in the general forum from 2011.
So he posted the first one then?
Exactly
Ah ok fair enough.
Well what you state are separate issues that can be debated. My point is only directed at the possible outcomes of the post.
The FA have lost all semblance of common sense and are now dictated by what’s the current trend in public opinion. The sad part is that they set a precedent and Bowen will likely be the recipient of what they feel is justice
Do you know that as fact or is that pure conjecture?
As someone who’s been in education for just under 30 years I can tell you that grammar and a robust teaching of it has been part of the revamped syllabus for a number of years(September 2013). Tests of this begin as early as year 1 with a SATS test at year 2 and 6. There has been much criticism of the implementation of this with critics saying that it’s too much and children get bogged down in dogma.Simple rules such as “their, there and they’re” have been taught for generations. The distinction between the use of “them and those” still incurs problems in use most likely through the fossilisation of the wrong use by various communities over many years.
Grammar schools or selectives still exist but as you say few and far between. The National curriculum guidelines still have to be followed though those kids by the selection process will have learned the correct grammar usage to obtain a place in the first place. As an example, I did gain a place at a notable selective but correct use of English was drummed into me from and early age.
Based on experience of myself and others, as well as working in education.
I suppose it could also be how we define “grammar”. I was always taught to speak properly, but we were never taught the names of tenses or a technical way to structure a sentence. 16-year-old me would not be able to identify the adverb and adjective in a sentence, or say what a past participle is. Maybe I was just thick, but I got a “B” in English.
Perhaps the syllabi have changed in schools now, I did leave school a long time ago, but I’m sure I read an article recently that was arguing for schools to start teaching English grammar in order to make language learning easier.
I’ve learnt a couple of languages in my adulthood and I had to learn English grammar first, as the foreign languages were all explained technically.
people want to be outraged. He didn’t say n*gg*r now did he? What he did say was when two guys are being sarcastic. If you cant tell the difference then you probably shouldn’t be posting about the subject.
the phrase he used ends with an a and at the time was popularized by the Dave Chappelle show and rap songs. It was mostly used as a sarcastic response or two friends messing with each other.
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Another young white kid trying to sound 'gangsta'. West Ham probably doing the right thing by dealing with it internally and warning him about the image now that he is an employee of a huge institution. Now sure what the FA can do about it as I am unsure of their powers in actions involving school boys who weren't under FA guidelines at that time unless of course he was.......
Hey!!!
If you committed murder 9 years ago they could still send you down for it in many countries
#justsomefoodforthought
comitting murder. tweets. 9 yrs ago. teenager. sigh.sigh.sigh.
(yes i have been just been listening some pearls of the beat generation)
(yes i have been just been listening some pearls of the beat generation)
It seems like we have a bunch of white guys tripping over each other to feign outrage or virtual signal over a kid using a pop cultural phrase of the time.
And no, I’m not white and I find nothing offensive about what a teenager tweeted 9 years ago.
neighbor please!
And no, I’m not white and I find nothing offensive about what a teenager tweeted 9 years ago.
neighbor please!
I see racist dickhead Trevor Sinclair is demanding that Bowen is punished.
He's got some nerve.
He's got some nerve.
It was hardly a "demand", this is what he said...
"I feel for Jarrod Bowen because was a kid and I’m sure he’ll be embarrassed by it, and that will be an awkward changing room when he has to face his team-mates who are black.
It would be very dangerous to let him off with a slapped wrist after disciplining two other players for similar things. I think there’s got to be consistency from the FA and the authorities and I think that will be executed. Everyone makes mistakes and you have to hold your hand up, I’ve made a lot of mistakes.
I think if you accept responsibility for your errors and then move on and try and be a positive influence, that’s the best you can do and if that’s the case, we should forgive him.”
calm down Big Ron
I mean, it’s a silly thing to say as a white man (well, white boy) but it was 9 years ago, he was a kid & racial sensitivities/tensions weren’t anywhere near as high back then. An apology should be sufficient. An actual official punishment would be rather absurd in my opinion. If we were all held accountable as an adult for silly things we said/did as teenagers I think we’d all be in trouble, I know I certainly would.