It's a horrible thought. They'd dominate the league and contend for the CL. Plus they'd do it in style and gain all the attention they crave. Ew.
Lionel Messi - Performances
- Thread starter Rado_N
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
The irony, even then refs were ignoring the shirt ripping from the defender but sending off Messi for trying to break free rather than actually look to much less connect with the player's face/chin. Not much has changed, for such an honest player he doesn't get anywhere near the calls he should be or that many others would for far less
It would be a nice win for the talent over the money , bad thing is Barca have a very short bench
GOAT.
Do you think that in the same way we used to moan about Rooney's Hollywood passes out to the right wing, Barca fans moan about Messi's threaded passes inside the opposition right back? You know, 'Getting bored of those assists, can't he show something different?!'
Great bit of writing about last night. We should cherish every game we watch this guy play. We'll miss him when he's gone.
Yup, that's why I watch every Barcelona game I can. Who knows how much longer he has?
In no particular order whatsoever (half asleep atm lol):
Xavi, Riquelme, Pirlo, Scholes, Zidane, Iniesta, Rui Costa, Xabi, Kroos, KDB
...and that's without naming any older legends like Laudrup/Maradona/Platini/Zico/Zizinho (sp?)/Luisito/etc who were absolute masters of passing the ball.
The latter true as well. It's kind of difficult to differentiate since Messi does a lot of layoffs and through balls and like you said is mostly based off of the final third. Imo if someone calls Messi arguably the best passer of all time, then it opens the door for a player like Ronaldinho as well. No knock on him as he's one of the most skilled players ever and a great passer himself, but I'm talking more overall strict playmaking ability and all time passing ability.
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Messi is as good as any of them at passing.
The guy has done such astonishing things on the field that goals like the one he scored yesterday or the first one against Espanyol basically had no effect on me. It will truly be soul destroying if he ever comes to City. Urgh.
Same, would just stop watching football. If they get Messi they will be the most exciting team by far in the league and will establish a sizeable fan base which would actually justify the inflated deals they have.
Great read, yep.
I know it's not new, but the part where he is compared to Federer is very apt. When I watch Federer play, it's not so much about him winning as it is about how he wins. It is a joy to watch him, as it leaves you wowing and drooling with moments which show such a comfortable mastery of the game that others, no matter how successful, can only dream of. As a corollary, the Nadal/Ronaldo comparison would be apt, too. They are both based on sheer mentality, determination and physical commitment. They can both beat Federed/Messi to a game or an individual accolade, but they can never be as good at the game itself as the latter.
Let's put it this way, if you had to watch an hour of tennis/football without taking sides and knowing that the result wouldn't count - you would pick Federer/Messi every single day over Nadal/Ronaldo, for the sheer love of the game itself.
Having Messi join City would be like Federer joining and becoming the mascot for a new gulf-money-backed Qatar Open over the usual Grand Slams.
I go even further, he would be the best in the world at any outfield position he chose - Messi has all the attributes of the complete footballer on top of having a relentless will & motor to dominate. He's a freak, there's nothing like him in any sport - an absolute anomaly
Like with anything, no one will fully appreciate just how special he is until he actually isn't playing any longer. I'll be there again at Camp Nou for at least a dozen matches this season to enjoy him live, it's a spectator's nirvana
Are there genuinely any people (other than Ronaldo fans and I guess Portugal/Madrid) fans who actually deny that he's the greatest we've watched in our generation by far? Only Messi would be able to make this current Barca team not look completely useless.
Exactly. Ronaldo is the greatest finisher I've ever watched and yet Messi takes his goal stats and combines it with some unreal passing, dribbling, close control and just overall dominance on a game.
He may equal or even better his goal stats in La Liga. In the CL knockouts it's a completely different matter and those are the bigger games of the season.
Passing, dribbling and ball control aren't the only things that matter in football, the fact that so many people here seem to judge players on those 3 things is mindboggling. Crossing, heading, set pieces, off the ball movement, athleticism, two footedness, etc..
They have some of the best players in the world in pretty much every position... Argentina still look useless when he's in the team so it's not like he magically turns shit into gold.
Two fantastic games against Espanyol and a severely weakened Juventus team and it's like he just won a World Cup. One more great game and we'll be back to 'Ronaldo isn't fit to tie his laces' territory. Not that he doesn't deserve praise, he's had an incredible start to the season.
he's untouchable on his day. easily the best.
Couldn't agree more. He's absolutely unique. There's nobody out there who can do what he does. Anyone who loves football, even Ronnie fanatics should really just enjoy this lad before he's gone.
If you haven't already, check some Laudrup passing compilations. Watching the TV angle, you can see everyone but still can't see the pass Laudrup picks.
Platini is another who's passing deep and in the final third were top notch. There have been plenty of others too, but Messi definitely deserves to be in their company when it comes to passing in the final third.
Come on now, that's hyperbole surely.
Messi is also great at crossing, set pieces (his freekicks are far better than Ronaldo's, who quite frankly sucks at them), off the ball movement (you don't score over 500 goals with poor movement), and he's incredibly athletic and can use both feet.
There's just 1 thing I have to criticize Messi for and that's him being far too casual at times. Doesn't seem to have the same incredible drive and lust for winning that Ronaldo has shown lately.
Indeed. It's harsh to label Messi as lazy, but he can be somewhat lax with his movement at times.
Though his movement is more subtle than Ronaldo's and has its advantages as well.
The cringe, now that's the end-all stat to compare them, right? Because no one cared 8 months ago when they were 37-42. Disregard career stats where Messi wins, THAT single stat is the one who shows who's the better scorer.
Everything you've said Messi does well, he's the best as a 9 or false 9, the best in the Right Wing and still looks like the best in his lately transition into more of a 10 both with Barcelona and Argentina. This guy isn't just 21st century Muller or 21st Century Maradona, Messi has the stature to fill Maradona's role as the focal point of a team while scoring at Muller's pace.
Argentina are so useless with Messi that they change from WC finalists to worst team in the CONMEBOL qualifiers depending if he's playing or not
The cringe?
They were 37-42 because of the round of 18. From the quarters forwards it's not even close even if you take last years goals out.
Career stats are obviously massively skewed by Ronaldo's initial years where he played a much bigger number of games. In the last 10/11 years the numbers are pretty much the same.
They might have won more games with him on the team, but they still look like crap in this qualification when he's playing. That's obviously not his fault and he's been their best player, I was just stating the obvious fact that Messi won't turn a useless team into a great team like the poster I replied too was insinuating.
If anything, it's a great testament to Ronaldo that he's been able to keep up and surpass Messi's goalscoring in some stages.The cringe?
They were 37-42 because of the round of 18. From the quarters forwards it's not even close even if you take last years goals out.
Career stats are obviously massively skewed by Ronaldo's initial years where he played a much bigger number of games. In the last 10/11 years the numbers are pretty much the same.
They might have won more games with him on the team, but they still look like crap in this qualification when he's playing. That's obviously not his fault and he's been their best player, I was just stating the obvious fact that Messi won't turn a useless team into a great team like the poster I replied too was insinuating.
Far more important attributes than the other ones you offered, if you asked any average player now that you can make their passing, dribbling and ball control world class or the ones you mentioned world class what would they pick? Obviously the first ones, so yes they do matter more.
That's one aspect I appreciate in him more than Messi, an unrelenting pursuit of being the best he can. Leo can be too casual at times.
Too true. If Messi had that mentality, he'd have reached 1000 goals
That may be so, but I think that's arguable and it will depend on the team around them and how they play. If you play counter attacking football with a lot of wing play then crossing, heading, athleticism, off the ball movement, etc. might be more important. Obviously passing and ball control must still be pretty good to be able to make it at a top level but if it's more important or not it's not really easy to say in my opinion.
The fact that Messi and Ronaldo's strengths are so different yet they've both been able to be the 2 faces of this generation is a testament to the fact that there are many different ways you can dominate and be very successful in football.
How exactly is Messi too lax or too casual? Maybe he's just too unselfish and that is why he's not gotten to 1000 goals or whatever the unrealistic target is. He's not playing in a team setup with the pure goal of ensuring he scores. He's in a team where he creates shit loads for the likes of Neymar and Suarez to miss and also scores bucketloads (creating a lot of them himself) himself.
No he wouldn't. Unless he avoided choosing any defensive positions in which case yeah, you're right.
That's not true at all, or have you done a survey of professional players around the world?
Clearly being 5'6"or 7" makes for a great defender.
Career stats are not skewed because they say the same thing if we start counting since Ronaldo joined Real MadridThe cringe?
They were 37-42 because of the round of 18. From the quarters forwards it's not even close even if you take last years goals out.
Career stats are obviously massively skewed by Ronaldo's initial years where he played a much bigger number of games. In the last 10/11 years the numbers are pretty much the same.
They might have won more games with him on the team, but they still look like crap in this qualification when he's playing. That's obviously not his fault and he's been their best player, I was just stating the obvious fact that Messi won't turn a useless team into a great team like the poster I replied too was insinuating.
It isn't open to second interpretations, he wins the overall comparison, and everyone with at least one eye and some football sense can see the way Messi likes to get involved in his team play and how Ronaldo has been playing since years ago. The diference is getting bigger as they grow older with Ronaldo playing more isolated as a lone killer while Messi steps closer to the midfield to become more involved.
Anyway, I'd love to talk about this in the vs. thread instead of here, I try to not start these debates in the Ronaldo thread because I think that's like trying to undermine/diminish his performances, I'd rather not talk about the same thing over and over again here because in that same manner I think comparing him to Ronaldo in his dedicated thread can be seen as diminishing Messi. I think we both understand this point very well as "fanboys" of them
Seconded. It's a great way to pass 20 minutes. His vision was just astonishing. Messi is one of the very few that has that same eye for the unexpected pass
It's fairly obvious IMO, what would you class as the most important attributes in football? List your top 5 for example.
I watched Messi play yesterday and was struck with how clinical a finisher he is. Messi around the goal box just kinda maneuvers into a shooting position and tucks the ball into the net without any fuss. He does not belt the ball just gently places it beyond the goalie. I would love to see him at Manchester United as I think he would be great off the bench for times when Felliani needs a break.