It's not like that at all - many on here have written us off before the season has even started. Which you are entitled to do, we are thus just explaining some of our new players have hardly kicked a ball for us yet and need time.
Kettle, Pot, Black.
Sorry but in every thread about Liverpool its the same thing. Heck half of you even go into the RAWK thread to defend them and yourselves.
Yeah no surprise one of you lot do exactly the same thing again. Defend yourselves by shooting the same crap straight back
We both do the same thing though.
This is the same guy who refuses to accept Sturridge is better than Welbeck.
Explains a lot. Conjecture or bias over reasoned debate and statistics any day
Don't think he has anywhere near the intelligence of Sterling. Ibe playing regularly wouldn't really worry me as an opposition supporter. He'd probably be good coming on as a sub in some games though
It's a case of wait and see in terms of the attacking stuff you discuss. However, the defence issue has been dealt with considerably. Can is a protective midfielder, Lovren is the leader at the back that's needed plus Moreno and Manquillo are being signed for FB positions. I'd say that's a significant upgrade. If Liverpool become a more solid proposition the attacking finesse of last season will not be so integral to success.
I don't think Ibe's had enough exposure to first team football to work out what kind of role he's going to have. He's exactly 12 months behind Sterling in age but about 18 months behind in terms of actual experience on the pitch.
Moyes was blamed for last season because he was the only differential between the title win and a 7th place finish, the players didn't go without blame either, Ferdinand was fairly obvious in his disapproval and he wasn't alone.It's just kind of odd that last season is being rationalised in such a way. There's such little doubt that it was the players' fault in any way. As long as Moyes can be totally blamed for the calamity we can all sleep easy.
Hmmm, no I don't because I'm not a whopper who makes grand predictions about football. What I do know is that for 12 months Liverpool's record has been rationalised in every which way on here.
Things I mostly read about why Liverpool did well:
It was Suarez... Massive factor.
It was those penalties... Well you did have a few but you create your own due to a higher rate of chances right ? Unless of course your United under SAF right ?
It was a weak league... Not weak as such but the changing of managers at the top helped no end.
It was Moyes... Yea no managerial blame here unless of course its your season under Brendy, ignore the Hodge/Daglish debacles in your reasoning though.
It was United's fixtures... You might find that was Moyes excuse, nobody bought it not even United fans, it was as tough a start as you could have asked for but let's leave that one for Arsene shall we.
It was Suarez... No of course he was just a cog in Rodgers machine, ignore his POTY award.
It was mostly luck... Even towards the end when you played City it was falling for you, Karma eh
It was lucky with no injuries...Well the squad was threadbare, you lost Lucas and Studge for a bit but your core stayed mostly fit.
It was a freak season... Two teams going from 7th to 2nd and vice versa isn't a freak season (scouse logic).
It was Liverpool's light schedule... Are you actually saying this isn't a factor because in the last half of the season most scousers were touting it as the reason they were "going to win the league"
It was Suarez... What were you saying the season United signed RVP and consequently won the league, I know what I put it down to and it was him
The only rationale that isn't consistently floated is that Liverpool are a very good team thriving under a talented manager.
Monday : doesn't matter, it may make the season for you but for the vast majority we recognise it for what it is. A pre-season work-out.
Finance : show me where I said we were at the same level ? What I said is that you are undervaluing our strength and that United haven't done much in the market so far.
Experienced Players : Vidic and Evra were two of your first choice back 4 last season. Even Ferdinand played in 14 games. Disparage their importance/contributions all you like, it doesn't change the facts that not only were they important players but important leaders you have lost. And you haven't replaced them.
Manager / Squad : you talk as if LvG is some sort of saviour and not just a good manager. Whilst a capable manager is very important he isn't on the pitch playing and if you check the United forum you'll see how many United fans want(ed) the likes of Cleverley, Anderson, Fellaini, Young, Nani, Fletcher sold (though I imagine there may be a 180 about turn on Young now). Add that to a 33 yo Carrick alongside Herrera. That is hardly a consensus on the quality of your squad, regardless of how you personally feel about them. Had they been that good then there would be not be such a split between the fans.
Herrera/Shaw : Shaw, at the moment yes, not so sure after we sign Moreno because both are at similar stages of their development. Herrera - where ? He isn't yet a top tier proven player, United and their fans are banking a lot on him but I wouldn't take him over Henderson (and Herrera isn't a DM) so maybe played alongside him, but that then restricts us using a more creative player there .. and Can looks like he can do the same job. So Herrera wouldn't walk into the team (or any of the Top 4 teams) just yet, let's see how his first season in the PL goes shall we ?
Kagawa : simply a pure platitude on your behalf commenting that it's "more of a showing of Uniteds squad strength that Kagawa can't nail down a first team slot." That really had me literally laughing out loud
Liverpool strengthening : Blinkered. Can't say anything else because clearly you are. Undoubtedly the attack is weaker but you are again undervaluing (spot a trend here ?) the contribution last season from our midfield and failing to recognise a change in the system. To deny the defence has improved considerably is pure denial. As is categorically stating the team as an entity is not better (though this remains to be proven the theory is sound).
Echo : If you bothered to read the words rather than see the source and disregard it, then your knowledge of how Liverpool are playing, and the player's roles within the team, may improve. Let's face it, your constant denial of anything positive to do with Liverpool is not only biased conjecture but wishful thinking in the extreme.
Regardless of all your negativity the fact remains that Liverpool are a very good team thriving under a talented manager. Plus I expect him to be around a lot longer than LvG and the Chelsea bloke.
You also expected Suarez to hang about too but this is a modern era of football as big business. If Rogers turns out to be the chosen one then it won't be long before Barca, Madrid or another of footballs big clubs come knocking.
You really were near the back of the line weren't you. Shall I get out the Alphabet blocks ? I said the managers wereYour posts really are a blizzard of bullshit aren't they, that last bolded paragraph is particularly damning, you have stated just a few posts up in fact that Uniteds pre season form and the football they play means nothing because it's only pre season yet in that same post you quoted an article from the echo that was underlining Liverpools playing style, your now using Liverpools pre season games to show how Liverpool are playing. You have opened your post stating pre season is nothing more than "a work out" and ended it by contradicting you first paragraph.
So using your logic can we asses how a team is playing and the roles within the team from pre season games or can we not
. I said clearly that results don't matter, however you can see the style of play being developed (hence quoting the Echo article). There, was that so difficult to understand ?
Yet again you are way off the reservation spouting shxte. Go and find a SINGLE post where I have said ANYTHING about Rodgers in this context.
As expected, claw out a negativity, it's what you do bestest...
Yep but the season before he was also Chelsea's best player. And it wasn't like Mata played poorly Jose already had his mind made up.
You probably should ask a parent to do that for you by the sounds of it.
08 is kind of mirrored to a degree, they ran it so close and in the end bottled it, the following Summer saw their best performer of the season feck off to Spain.
What? In 05 we won the CL. Gerrard was our best performer then and he didn't leave.
I give up. WhyTF do I need to read this thread to find comments about Rodgers from other posters - that you then decide to use to obfuscate the debate and somehow deem it attributable to me and use as a valid point in our debate ? Talk about tangents ! And from your response it's absolutely transparent that you STILL fail to comprehend the difference, that I've explained twice, between pre-season results and simply noting the systems of play in use ... am I writing in tongues here by the way ? Please God tell me that this poster called Gasmanc is just a figment of my disturbed imagination, that's got to be better than the alternative !
Ah didn't mean to mar your 05 I did mean the last time you came 2nd, 08 was it, the lad put 05 in his post and it stuck.
Easily the most honest and scouse post of the day.
This injury doesn't sound worrying but his constant knocks and niggles are pretty concerning. It would be a risk to have only Sturridge and Lambert as our strikers in any circumstances but even more so with Sturridge's fitness record.
I doubt it. I think he could do it but as you said I think it would be a waste of his other qualities. Ideally he'll probably end up as a number 10, but at this stage he's so versatile that his position could be anything. He's looked impressive in every position he's played so far, even right back!
He nearly did though..
He looks like the pressure of playing for Liverpool is weighing heavily on his shoulders. Still trying too hard. However missing his penalty against Milan was a moment of pure genius .... who wouldn't want to open their account for the club with a winning goal in a cup final against United ?
It still makes no sense. We didn't bottle it at all and the situation isn't really comparable to this year. Our best players (Gerrard and Torres) both stayed as well. 2002 is a more apt comparison, but even then there are huge differences.
Alonso was probably the best and most consistent player in the league that season, he was terrific for you, the very reason you threatened the league and his link passes to Torres one of the reasons your striker was so potent, players seem to get underrated the minute they leave your establishment and over rated the minute they're linked. Remy for some reason, was being touted as the next Ian Rush by my scouse drinking partners, soon as he failed his medical he was fecking shit.
This definitely happened.
He wasn't and he certainly isn't undervalued by our supporters. He's still a massive favourite amongst many of them. The only way the Rush comparison happened was if they were drunk.
I sense sarcasm, your quite a cheerful bastard these days, aren't you.
The person I actually addressed the post to seemed to understand fine. Maybe the problems with you.
Liverpool fans love facts though. Here are the facts.
Rafa Benitez likes this.
New managers ? Well United have one of those right now but it's being seen as the second coming and a free ticket back to greatness.
Genuinely think the 'luck' angle is the last refuge of the rival fan. It's such a selective way of qualifying a rival's success. It picks on certain incidents but ignores others. I hate it when Liverpool fans do it and I don't buy it about Liverpool last season.
Somewhere? But you're happy to identify 'luck ' as a more significant factor? Ok.
