Martial is our most important player

Tel074

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It really is. I don't mean that I would not have him. Messi is the best player in the World but as I said Klopp wants players who will fulfill specific roles in his formation. Firmino is crucial to that formation. So which one of the front 3 would get dropped? I think Salah would be most likely.
It is the same with Martial, you know what you are getting with him. He will not run non stop for 90 mins like other strikers, but he is capable of moments of brilliance. What we have to do is either ensure that our formation caters to his style of playing or else find another number 9 who is capable of playing according to the formation and system that we want to play. No point in trying to fit round pegs in square holes and vice versa.

Mate Messi can be a fecking hexagon nevermind a round or square peg . He plays ahead of any of Liverpool's front 3 . I think you just used possibly the worst example of proving a point by using Messi .
I get your point but Messi fits into any team in the world
 

Kappa123

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So clearly you judge things on what you the last game?

Bruno is not a key player, he has played 2 games
Martial has scored 13 league goals this season btw.
Yeah but Bruno is much better than Martial so of course he's a key player going forward. I'm talking about the present and the future, not living in the past with your (incorrect) stats.

Martial won't be here because he's inconsistent and shite. We haven't been able to rely on him for the last 5 years so what the hell is going to change?
 

JPRouve

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Yeah but Bruno is much better than Martial so of course he's a key player going forward. I'm talking about the present and the future, not living in the past with your (incorrect) stats.

Martial won't be here because he's inconsistent and shite. We haven't been able to rely on him for the last 5 years so what the hell is going to change?
So a player that has done nothing is a key player because you are talking about the future?
 

TRUERED89

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Mate Messi can be a fecking hexagon nevermind a round or square peg . He plays ahead of any of Liverpool's front 3 . I think you just used possibly the worst example of proving a point by using Messi .
I get your point but Messi fits into any team in the world
Crazy statements aren't they? Messi sleep walks into any team on the planet regardless of system/personnel or tactics.
 

Van Piorsing

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Bruno is already an upgrade imo.
...and if Bruno gets injured we're back with playing Lingard and Pereira, because half of the forum wants Pogba gone without even remote news of signing someone as good as him.

One step forward, one step back. Doesn't sound like a good idea of building a strong team, even if Bruno is better footballer than Pogba after two games he played for United.

Half of the forum didin't want Haland, then Rashford gets injured and half of the forum suddenly screams to sign striker in last days of a window.
 

RedCurry

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Half of the forum didin't want Haland, then Rashford gets injured and half of the forum suddenly screams to sign striker in last days of a window.
:lol: Sorry I found this statement funny. Half the forum didn't want Haaland means the other half wanted Haaland. So the half that always wanted Haaland screams to sign him? Sounds about right!
 

Van Piorsing

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:lol: Sorry I found this statement funny. Half the forum didn't want Haaland means the other half wanted Haaland. So the half that always wanted Haaland screams to sign him? Sounds about right!
:lol: Indeed, no logical error at all.

People who wanted Haland had their point. I just hope we won't be in same situation in midfield after selling Pogba and I think we already witnessed something similar when we let go of Herrera and midfield's depth suddenly got reduced
to the point, we were often conquered by mid-table teams.
 

RedCurry

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:lol: Indeed, no logical error at all.

People who wanted Haland had their point. I just hope we won't be in same situation in midfield after selling Pogba and I think we already witnessed something similar when we let go of Herrera and midfield's depth suddenly got reduced
to the point, we were often conquered by mid-table teams.
Of course people who wanted Haaland had a point. I was one of them and I I am not even fully on board the Haaland hype train yet. We sold Lukaku and a much more suitable replacement would've cost us lesser than the fee we received from the sale. This is a pattern as you've suggested. We saw it with Fellaini and Herrera not being properly replaced.

We take half a step forward a two steps backwards.
 

Van Piorsing

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Of course people who wanted Haaland had a point. I was one of them and I I am not even fully on board the Haaland hype train yet. We sold Lukaku and a much more suitable replacement would've cost us lesser than the fee we received from the sale. This is a pattern as you've suggested. We saw it with Fellaini and Herrera not being properly replaced.

We take half a step forward a two steps backwards.
Totally forgot about Lukaku, after he vanished what we got is all pressure on Greenwood kid and Ighalo who's strongest club he played for was probably Udinese. This club is sometimes really slow in the market and if we ever want to return to Champions League and playing there year after year Ed, Ole and Glazers of all really need start being serious.

Martial have now all the time in the world prove his worth with Rahsford injured, he'll probably play every game, if he and Bruno catch chemistry then who knows... maybe we'll have a real attacking lineup someday.
 

romufc

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pressure on Greenwood kid and Ighalo who's strongest club he played for was probably Udinese.
What pressure has Greenwood got? I dont see the manager, the fans or anyone putting any pressure on him whatsoever?

Liverpool have a CB and LW who's best team was Southampton beforehand

A LB whos best teal was Hull.
 

KristianMackle

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Martial is in our top 5 most important players but nowhere near most important.
I get that this thread was started a while ago but the list now goes:
1) Rashford
2) DDG
3) AWB
4) Mctominay
5) Martial
 

Van Piorsing

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What pressure has Greenwood got? I dont see the manager, the fans or anyone putting any pressure on him whatsoever?

Liverpool have a CB and LW who's best team was Southampton beforehand

A LB whos best teal was Hull.
With more players injured in attack and you know it can happen because United's luck is truly remarkable when it comes to uncalled injuries, the pressure may and probably will rise even further.

Ighalo's 30 years old, don't you think some bigger club would already scouted him if he was the real deal. Forgive me if I reserve optimism with someone who's ambition when still in his 20s was to go to China. He got things to prove here, not other way around.
 

romufc

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With more players injured in attack and you know it can happen because United's luck is truly remarkable when it comes to uncalled injuries, the pressure may and probably will rise even further.

Ighalo's 30 years old, don't you think some bigger club would already scouted him if he was the real deal. Forgive me if I reserve optimism with someone who's ambition when still in his 20s was to go to China. He got things to prove here, not other way around.
That is something different if we have more injuries. If our luck is that bad even with Lukaku he would have the same pressure, if Lukaku got injured.

We looked at him during LVG era. Barca wanted him too. He is a reserve option, not a first choice ST.
 

Zlatans Knee

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Mate Messi can be a fecking hexagon nevermind a round or square peg . He plays ahead of any of Liverpool's front 3 . I think you just used possibly the worst example of proving a point by using Messi .
I get your point but Messi fits into any team in the world
Well since discussing this I have had the chance to talk to a mate who is a die hard ‘Pool fan. He says this discussion has come up many times on their forums and the concensus is that there is no chance that they would drop Firmino. If anyone would be dropped it would be Salah. But the majority would not swap any of their front 3 for anyone. Deluded possibly, but it is also hard to argue with their results.
 

Van Piorsing

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That is something different if we have more injuries. If our luck is that bad even with Lukaku he would have the same pressure, if Lukaku got injured.

We looked at him during LVG era. Barca wanted him too. He is a reserve option, not a first choice ST.
Exactly. We lost our main goal source in Rashford and what we have in return is a very talented kid and reserve option that never completed his big club move until now.

This is the type of pressure I'm talking about. If only we could fully focus on signing Bruno in the summer instead of wasting time on Eriksen and Dybala, we could have all winter in searching for a fully proper striker that can take the pressure of situation we are in and we'll need points badly by the way. Another season in Europa can finally result in Adidas starting looking elsewhere, then both Ole and Ed will be in trouble.

It's also why I'm not in the hurry in selling Martial or Pogba without properly looking into market and signing the real deal to not be in situation of putting pressure on Greenwood or Ighalo... perhaps I'm wrong and Ighalo and Greenwood will give us more goal producing than Martial. This scenario can be also possible and would be best thing ever for this club.
 

romufc

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If only we could fully focus on signing Bruno in the summer instead of wasting time on Eriksen and Dybala, we could have all winter in searching for a fully proper striker that can take the pressure of situation we are in and we'll need points badly by the way. Another season in Europa can finally result in Adidas starting looking elsewhere, then both Ole and Ed will be in trouble.
Oh do not get me started, what you have described there is good transfer and business sense, you cannot expect that from Ed.

If only we can learn from mistakes, starting looking for a RW, CM, ST now in readiness for next season. But we all know, Ed is not capable of that.

It's not like other clubs can do it, Real last year, Chelsea with Ziyech.
 

Hammondo

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...and if Bruno gets injured we're back with playing Lingard and Pereira, because half of the forum wants Pogba gone without even remote news of signing someone as good as him.

One step forward, one step back. Doesn't sound like a good idea of building a strong team, even if Bruno is better footballer than Pogba after two games he played for United.

Half of the forum didin't want Haland, then Rashford gets injured and half of the forum suddenly screams to sign striker in last days of a window.
Yea I want more players, but our replacement first choice is already here.
 

Van Piorsing

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Yea I want more players, but our replacement first choice is already here.
Great, now think about that club like Manchester United can have truly quality squad depth where Pogba and Bruno can support the same position if one gets injured or simply play together to overwhelm opponent with creativity and both of them capable of scoring from midfield.

I presume, even in sulking state Martial could benefit from that and produce more.
 

Van Piorsing

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It's not like other clubs can do it, Real last year, Chelsea with Ziyech.
Won't be surprised if we offer Ighalo contract this summer, because more than half of budget will be thrown at Borussia for Sancho.
 

Yagami

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whether he's our most important player is up for debate, but he's pretty dang important. Two goals out of nothing these past two games.
 

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Its amazing how difference his performance is before and after a goal.

He goes from not being able to trap anything and giving the ball away to a silky touch and linking everything.

Was the same against Chelsea
 

tomaldinho1

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Yeah but Bruno is much better than Martial so of course he's a key player going forward. I'm talking about the present and the future, not living in the past with your (incorrect) stats.

Martial won't be here because he's inconsistent and shite. We haven't been able to rely on him for the last 5 years so what the hell is going to change?
How can you even type this, he's played a single game for us. Martial, despite being 24 years old, playing in poor attacking sides and being maligned under Mou, has still scored over 60 goals for the club and has over 30 assists.
 

Gasolin

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Its amazing how difference his performance is before and after a goal.

He goes from not being able to trap anything and giving the ball away to a silky touch and linking everything.

Was the same against Chelsea
Probably confidence, morale, all? But he's still a very skilled player in a very unconventional role right now. We need some other scorers to help him with the runs, etc...
 

SmallCaine

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Imagine if he could show that attitude for 90 minutes.
What attitude did he show? That was a lucky goal thanks to an error from opposition, if we want our striker to score maybe create something for him. Running around like an idiot for 90 mins does not make one a good footballer, it just makes a lingard.
 

Gasolin

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What attitude did he show? That was a lucky goal thanks to an error from opposition, if we want our striker to score maybe create something for him. Running around like an idiot for 90 mins does not make one a good footballer, it just makes a lingard.
He scored the same goal against Newcastle I think? It's something he's starting to pay attention. And Lingard compared to Martial? Come on, you are not serious. This is a guy who has a shot accuracy higher than Rashford right now. Almost similar number of goals, if not more than Rashford, for the same number of games. He's not the problem.
 

SmallCaine

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He scored the same goal against Newcastle I think? It's something he's starting to pay attention. And Lingard compared to Martial? Come on, you are not serious. This is a guy who has a shot accuracy higher than Rashford right now. Almost similar number of goals, if not more than Rashford, for the same number of games. He's not the problem.
I am not comparing lingard and martial rather questioning the logic behind these presumptions that if you close down a player you show good attitude and running around like a headless chicken makes you a good player.
 

Kappa123

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Bruno is way better than Martial tbf, and most importantly he gives a great impression of himself each and every game. Working hard to make something happen for the team.

The reason I'll never consider Martial a key player for us again is that he doesn't give a feck, and he can't be trusted to turn up and do his job to a bare minimun standard. We've literally seen this for years so I'm not sure why it would surprise anyone that I hold this kind of opinion. Martial to me is not someone a title contending club would ever consider to be a core member of the starting 11.
 

JPRouve

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Isn’t a key player though, don’t forget.
Can you imagine how many goals and assists both Rashford and Martial didn't play +3 months without eachothers having the suffer the likes of Pereira, Lingard and James as their main partners? Statistically they are both doing as well as we could expect under these circumstances, they are both going to outperform 18/19 Lukaku with worse support.
 

RedMilo

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What attitude did he show? That was a lucky goal thanks to an error from opposition, if we want our striker to score maybe create something for him. Running around like an idiot for 90 mins does not make one a good footballer, it just makes a lingard.
Never a truer statement said re Lingard
 

Andersonson

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My mistake, 9 league goals in a team that doesn't create much and injured for 2 months of the season.

If he gets 15 goals this season, it would be a decent return.
Agreed. 15 would be good. Next season he must get 20+ if we're going to go somewhere.
I like that he's been very positive lately. Actually found the net in games where he hasnt been any good either, so thats a big plus.
 

Quinzaine

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Let's summarise Martial's season up statistically:
14 goals and 5 assists in roughly 2200 minutes this season.

- Same number of non penalty goals (13) and assists (5) as Rashford this season, having played 100 mins less than Marcus.
- Same number of combined Goals and Assists (19) this season as Harry Kane, having played exactly the same number of minutes.
- More combined G+A than Aubameyang and Griezmann who are on 18 and 17 respectively for the season (having played less minutes than both).
- 4 more goals than Firmino in all competitions.
- One goal fewer than Tammy Abraham (15) in all competitions, having played 200 mins less than the Chelsea striker.

He's by no means flawless, but a player that can put up numbers like that playing for possibly the most disjointed United side in recent history should be appreciated, and you really wonder what kind of numbers he'd have put up if he had the chance to play with likes of Pogba, Rash and Bruno more than he has been able to so far this season. He's a super talent and he's getting more confident as a goalscorer. If we were a rational fanbase, it would be commonly accepted that he's literally almost the least of our worries.

If he's not our most important player, he's very clearly up there. Our worst run of form this season remains the period in September-October when he was injured. Him and Rashford carry us offensively.
 
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It was weird seeing him miss chances after Christmas. Quite uncharacteristic, as he's usually very clinical with his chances. Good to see him get over that hump
 

lenny_1248

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Let's summarise Martial's season up statistically:
14 goals and 5 assists in roughly 2200 minutes this season.

- Same number of non penalty goals (13) and assists (5) as Rashford this season, having played 100 mins less than Marcus.
- Same number of combined Goals and Assists (19) this season as Harry Kane, having played exactly the same number of minutes.
- More combined G+A than Aubameyang and Griezmann who are on 18 and 17 respectively for the season (having played less minutes than both).
- 4 more goals than Firmino in all competitions.
- One goal fewer than Tammy Abraham (15) in all competitions, having played 200 mins less than the Chelsea striker.

He's by no means flawless, but a player that can put up numbers like that playing for possibly the most disjointed United side in recent history should be appreciated, and you really wonder what kind of numbers he'd have put up if he had the chance to play with likes of Pogba, Rash and Bruno more than he has been able to so far this season. He's a super talent and he's getting more confident as a goalscorer. If we were a rational fanbase, it would be commonly accepted that he's literally almost the least of our worries.

If he's not our most important player, he's very clearly up there. Our worst run of form this season remains the period in September-October when he was injured. Him and Rashford carry us offensively.
Well said.
Martial, as you said, is not flawless by any means, but the amount of hate he gets is ridiculous. He became a scapegoat since Pogba doesn't play.