Mason Greenwood | Please be respectful and stay on topic

[Cassidy]

And this was my point. I don't disagree with @Pexbo 's take at all, I was just making the point that the only other side is that. It's the only other plausible explanation. Either he is guilty or she lied.

Which is what I've said all along, either way this was always going to be the only decision to be made. Throwing the women under the bus, blaming social media, all that nonsense needs to die. Mason in his own words started these events, and the club have exacerbated them with the terrible handling.

But whatever way you want to look at it, someone or both have been incredibly stupid to say the very least.

Pretty much

 

[Redlambs]

I mentioned this yesterday, it’s clear that they didn’t plan for worst case scenario

Which is completely baffling then why they didn't start preseason parading him around on a good will tour? If they believe he is innocent and wanted to keep him, why didn't they ease him back in PR style rather than drop that god awful statement out of the blue?

None of that side makes sense...unless, of course, they wanted to keep him away from certain questions.

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

So it's MORALLY OKAY for him to play with any other club - just not at United ?!

You’re wasting your time with this question. People are playing all levels of mental gymnastics on this one.

It’ll hit home when he eventually plays in England again in a few years & The Athletic aren’t manipulating that fanbase into a fury. There are very valid arguments on here as to why he shouldn’t play & it’s been a topic on members tongues since it all came out but the facts are the United fanbase spans far bigger than the internet & at no point in the past 18 months were people as compelled as they have been in a week.

 

[LARulz]

So it seems he is still under contract but will be loaned/sold right?

If so, I wonder if they are hoping he goes on loan somewhere decent and has a fantastic season (somehow despite no match fitness for nearly 2 years). Either we get a big fee or they are hoping people change their minds which is rightfully a extreme long shot

 

[golden_blunder]

Right or wrong, I hope that this decision sends a warning down to young players - you are not bigger than the club. You will face consequences. Hopefully that message sinks in and touches a nerve not just at United but across football

 

[spiriticon]

They have Alvarez, even as a joke it doesn't make sense.

I was thinking more like Spurs, or Everton

What has Alvarez done? Sorry I can't keep track of all these naughty footballers

 

[FrankDrebin]

This is what I believe. If you do not think he is guilty, then you should stick by your principles. Why take 7 months and waste all that time, to just come to that conclusion. It is a cop out. I would have liked him to stay and the club to take the slow rehabilitation process or make a more definitive decision much earlier.

Different topic, but our preparation for this season is now completely shot. It is clear the Ten Hag was assured that Greenwood was coming back and now we are left with Antony who is crap.

My next off topic, is that this club needs new governance. New owners who are more proactive. This is just shambolic.

But for how long ?

 

[Steve 007]

mason was not declared innocent. Charges were dropped due to the removal of evidence from the key witnesses. No we can’t try him. However if you have heard that recording and you are ok with it, you need to go look in the mirror and stay away from women because the contents are not ok. I’m not saying he’s guilty of the charges but that recording is disgusting and as a dad of a young female if my daughter played me that I’d be in the car and on the warpath.

 

[mu4c_20le]

What has Alvarez done? Sorry I can't keep track of all these naughty footballers

Nah just meant they play similar position and don't need him

 

[Redlambs]

Good point. But that won't stop people speculating like they were instant experts on every aspect of this sorry saga.
This has become worse than the worst soap.

Yep, people sure are too stubborn to learn and change the way they think. Even in the face of logic and reason, they'll stick to their guns no matter what.

Same as it ever was.

 

[golden_blunder]

You’re wasting your time with this question. People are playing all levels of mental gymnastics on this one.

It’ll hit home when he eventually plays in England again in a few years & The Athletic aren’t no manipulating that fanbase into a fury. There are very valid arguments on here as to why he shouldn’t play & it’s been a topic on members tongues since it all came out but the facts are the United fanbase spans far bigger than the internet & at no point in the past 18 months we’re people as compelled as they have been in a week.

Quite possibly because nothing seemed to be happening and it looked like the club was trying to sneak him back into the playing squad

 

[DixieDean]

You’re wasting your time with this question. People are playing all levels of mental gymnastics on this one.

It’ll hit home when he eventually plays in England again in a few years & The Athletic aren’t no manipulating that fanbase into a fury. There are very valid arguments on here as to why he shouldn’t play & it’s been a topic on members tongues since it all came out but the facts are the United fanbase spans far bigger than the internet & at no point in the past 18 months we’re people as compelled as they have been in a week.

I actually think Jamaica are going to make a play for him. We know Southgate won't pick him. Something to keep an eye on, anyway.

 

[NicolaSacco]

Can't wrap my head around this. If they believe strongly enough he didn't do it they should have stuck to their convictions and brought him back and told everyone exactly what they found.

Complete shambles.

Based on what's public its the correct, only decision.

I don’t think that they say that though. It’s a deliberately vague statement.

 

[Devil You Know]

So it's MORALLY OKAY for him to play with any other club - just not at United ?!

Criminals and people charged but never convicted deserve a second chance. Just not in my back yard.

 

[pocco]

It implies there is evidence that is contrary to what we saw online.
People don't want to believe so because they already made up their mind, but the fact is that's 2 separate sources now that have said there is evidence to the contrary that is not in the public domain.
Still despite this, people will still stick to their guns and pretend they know what went on

I'm not going to suggest I know what happened, but this new evidence could be a change in statement from the victim. Which would make sense since she wanted to get back with him and I'm guessing she wanted a relationship outside of prison.

 

[Cheimoon]

I'm going to answer you even if your answer don't deserve it.

What where missing and who commit the wrong doings "when innocent women were drowned or burned at the stake"? (hint)

The reason we today have a police force and a legal system is to prevent innocent people to be "drowned and burned at the stake". Maybe it's unfamiliar to you but the legal system is one of the most important corner stones for a modern democracy.
When we let the "mob" act as both prosecutors, defense lawyers and judges then is when we have a problem.

The mob 400 years ago or so mostly didn't give these "innocent women" a chance.
You probably didn't like it. I didn't like it and judging by our history most decent people didn't like that sort of mob mentality. .

The legal system couldn't convict Mason (based on lack of witnesses and eveidence) but "the mob" on social media doesn't care because they want him punished no matter what, even if there's not enough evidence to be 100% sure he's guilty.

Maybe now you see some of the similraties now.

The police only consider the legality of a situation though, not the morality. If something isn't illegal that doesn't mean that we have to like it. For example, if a player would say (consciously, seriously, unjokingly) that they hate all sexual and racialized minorities and would be happiest if they would all die tonight - then there is nothing the police would do, but presumably (hopefully) most people would want that player to leave their club. What would you say then? Still 'I don't care as long as there is no conviction' ?

I obviously took an exaggerated example, but these situations can apply to all kinds of statements and behaviours that are legal, but morally/ethically problematic. There is obviously a continuum stretching out all the way from 'this is fine' to 'this is horrendous'; it's not binary. But so the point is that a lot of people think that Greenwood's behaviour in this case is to be placed on the wrong side of that continuum - and you (or anyone else) bringing up the lack of legal consequences has no bearing on that.

 

[CloneMC16]

The right decision has been made. There is no way he could have come back to play for us. Wasn't worth it for him or the club. We can move on.

Trial by social media is strong.

 

[Redfan94]

This has been handled horribly by the club. All it would’ve taken is a simple phone call to any half decent PR firm who would have told the club of the backlash they’d face regarding Greenwood’s reintegration.

the statement last week as a measuring stick of people’s attitudes, followed by today’s 180 makes the club look completely devoid of any morals, and the phrasing of today’s statement reads as tone deaf.

This is symptomatic of a wider problem in Football though, where talent and monetary value outweigh all other considerations with young players.

 

[DixieDean]

The Utd statement does basically say that they're getting rid of him because of the bad press and not because they think he's guilty.

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

Got to say that seeing the amount of upset or sad or angry reactions online is...an eye-opener.

Personally thinks it’s because all sides haven’t really been heard on this in the media.

Right or wrong, I hope that this decision sends a warning down to young players - you are not bigger than the club. You will face consequences. Hopefully that message sinks in and touches a nerve not just at United but across football

Football has access to Greenwood, for whatever reason it was deemed that United should not. Rightly or wrongly as you say.

This past week has been a message to Greenwood & United, football came a distant 3rd.

 

[Leftback99]

I still can't believe the club thought they were going to get away with bringing him back. How out of touch are they if the backlash surprised them?

So badly run.

 

[mu4c_20le]

I'm not going to suggest I know what happened, but this new evidence could be a change in statement from the victim. Which would make sense since she wanted to get back with him and I'm guessing she wanted a relationship outside of prison.

Heard this theory before, but according to Richard Arnold, she asked police to withdraw the investigation as early as April 2022.

 

[JPRouve]

You’re wasting your time with this question. People are playing all levels of mental gymnastics on this one.

It’ll hit home when he eventually plays in England again in a few years & The Athletic aren’t no manipulating that fanbase into a fury. There are very valid arguments on here as to why he shouldn’t play & it’s been a topic on members tongues since it all came out but the facts are the United fanbase spans far bigger than the internet & at no point in the past 18 months we’re people as compelled as they have been in a week.

What level of mental gymnastic? Some of you make no sense, why would someone that doesn't want Greenwood at United legislate on whether he should play for someone else?

When you decide that you don't want to be associated with someone, do you also tell every parties that have nothing to do with you whether they should associate with someone you don't care?

 

[RedTiger]

Yeah, there were apparently loads of posts and it was well known how mutually toxic the relationship was. I think the United statement intimates that.

Here are a couple of the forum posts. I've edited out the girl invoved's name:

1

2

There were 15 screenshots on Reddit. Orla Sloan, the girl they mention a few times, was the girl who was recently in court for stalking Mason Mount.

Corresponds with what a friend of mine from the club scene in Manchester said last year.

 

[arnie_ni]

I don’t think that they say that though. It’s a deliberately vague statement.

I mean they did:
"Mason did not commit the offences in respect of which he was originally charged".

They didn't need to say half of what they said in the statement. Honestly it raises more questions than it gives answers.

 

[izak]

Imagine your career going to shit because you were stupid enough to land yourself in this sort of mess, but you're still actively sharing the same space and now have a baby with the same girl that's at centre of all this drama.

Menh love is really blind and toxic as feck.

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

Quite possibly because nothing seemed to be happening and it looked like the club was trying to sneak him back into the playing squad

Quite possibly.

That would sure be a lot of disinterested United fans though, considering what the player once represented.

 

[GreatDane]

Right or wrong, I hope that this decision sends a warning down to young players - you are not bigger than the club. You will face consequences. Hopefully that message sinks in and touches a nerve not just at United but across football

We can only hope, but then at least something good would have come from this mess.

 

[golden_blunder]

Which is completely baffling then why they didn't start preseason parading him around on a good will tour? If they believe he is innocent and wanted to keep him, why didn't they ease him back in PR style rather than drop that god awful statement out of the blue?

None of that side makes sense...unless, of course, they wanted to keep him away from certain questions.

They knew what the public would say, they probably got mixed messages from their sponsors too.
they should have taken a much quicker decision, the fact that it’s almost 2 years is bonkers. No way it would have dragged on this long if it was a nobody from the youth team. Would have been fired a long time ago for bringing the club into disrepute. The fact that MG was valued once upon a time at 100m swayed their process

 

[JezChan]

I don’t think that they say that though. It’s a deliberately vague statement.

Agreed. Club statement says they don't believe Mason committed the offences he was charged with, but doesn't go out to name mistakes that the player committed leading to him not re-starting his footballing career with Manchester United. Just because they don't think he did what he was charged with, doesn't mean the club and MG don't think that what happened was misogynistic and they want nothing to do with that misogyny.

Could very well be that the club is wanting to protect the player, the victim, and the families involved from further scrutiny - painting him in as positive a light as possible under the circumstances so everyone can move on with some semblance of dignity and honour.

 

[Howl]

Yeah, there were apparently loads of posts and it was well known how mutually toxic the relationship was. I think the United statement intimates that.

Here are a couple of the forum posts. I've edited out the girl invoved's name:

1

2

There were 15 screenshots on Reddit. Orla Sloan, the girl they mention a few times, was the girl who was recently in court for stalking Mason Mount.

What the heck? What forum is this?

 

[Redlambs]

Quite possibly.

That would sure be a lot of disinterested United fans though, considering what the player once represented.

It was banned for discussion on here, but twitter and reddit carried plenty of chatter still.

 

[Guapa]

Gutted

 

[arnie_ni]

I still can't believe the club thought they were going to get away with bringing him back. How out of touch are they if the backlash surprised them?

So badly run.

They only way this had a chance of happening was by publicly releasing their full report including the other evidence that they have found.

 

[CM]

I half think Richard Arnold leaked the Greenwood reintegration plan to Crafton to gauge the reaction of the fans and general public and then went onto make his decision to move Greenwood away from the club. If so, well played.

You're giving him far too much credit. It's consistent with the shitshow demonstrated in the general running of the club. Arnold wanted to bring Greenwood back until he realised the heat would be turned up on both him and the club. It was pure cowardice.

 

[Rhyme Animal]

The Utd statement does basically say that they're getting rid of him because of the bad press and not because they think he's guilty.

That’s exactly what it says.

 

[OverratedOpinion]

So it's MORALLY OKAY for him to play with any other club - just not at United ?!

If someone does something horrendously immoral I am not going to invite them over for dinner. If someone else chooses to then that is their decision.

 

[Redlambs]

They knew what the public would say, they probably got mixed messages from their sponsors too.
they should have taken a much quicker decision, the fact that it’s almost 2 years is bonkers. No way it would have dragged on this long if it was a nobody from the youth team. Would have been fired a long time ago for bringing the club into disrepute. The fact that MG was valued once upon a time at 100m swayed their process

Oh of course, but still if you are going to try you do it properly.

It's just further proof of how low we've sunk in club management.

 

[pocco]

The Utd statement does basically say that they're getting rid of him because of the bad press and not because they think he's guilty.

One factor that we need to remember is that the muppets running this club only think of one thing..£££.

They have released a statement that allows plan B, which is to get rid and make money off his sale.

 

[mu4c_20le]

You're giving him far too much credit. It's consistent with the shitshow demonstrated in the general running of the club. Arnold wanted to bring Greenwood back until he realised the heat would be turned up on both him and the club. It was pure cowardice.

Exactly. Richard fecking Arnold playing 4d chess. I would actually be impressed!