McTominay is the key!

DoomSlayer

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Not much of that around here tbh.
Why do you dislike McTominay so much, just because he may be overrated on the Caf? He's a top professional and still young for a CM, midfielders tend to develop their game longer as it requires reading the game a lot more, plus he had to change his style completely when his crazy growth spur occured.

He might raise his level further in the next year or two, at least he is very useful at the moment and even scores goals from midfield, which is a priceless trait to have.
 

Feed Me

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He’s not the perfect player, far from it.

But I have grown to bloody love McTominay.

If we had more with his desire and attitude, I think we’d be in a healthier position.

We always look a better team when he’s in.

A totally different player, but he’s a facilitator like Carrick used to be.
 

pratyush_utd

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His passing is below par for a CM. Need to improve that aspect. Most of the time it is overhit. He can carry the ball surprisingly well and complements Fred quite well. With Pogba he wouldn't have to play that final ball too often but it's a shame that Pogba hasn't been fit this season. Him, Pogba and Fred would have been decent CM.
 

mattsville

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He has been our best midfielder, has a bit of everything and is vocal and commanding which is great given his age.
 

Seaman

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The same was said about Fletcher, Liverpool fans no doubt said the same about Henderson, every team needs a McTominay type, they might not play every week but they're vital first team players to have in the squad and definitely the big games
Hard working physical midfielder tend to look good in bad teams. He is made to look better by how bad others are playing
 

Rozay

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Why do you dislike McTominay so much, just because he may be overrated on the Caf? He's a top professional and still young for a CM, midfielders tend to develop their game longer as it requires reading the game a lot more, plus he had to change his style completely when his crazy growth spur occured.

He might raise his level further in the next year or two, at least he is very useful at the moment and even scores goals from midfield, which is a priceless trait to have.
I don’t dislike him. To even say that is frankly annoying. Everything I have against him, I state, so there is no mystery here, it is simple football analysis.

I do also dislike what he represents or brings out with some fans though. I think he is an example of double-standardism and picking a choosing throughout the caf. He can do no wrong, due to the favouritism he receives is daily judged totally differently to all the other players. For ages people couldn’t give Fred any credit without basically implying Scott was pretty much propping him up and making him resemble a footballer, others are lambasted for poor passing yet his is swept under the carpet etc.

Him not being all that isn’t an issue. Him not being all that, but spoken as if he is, naturally causes those without this emotional investment in him to be constantly pointing out the inconsistencies with what posters say when it comes to him. Not very long ago I think the caf were dangerously close to declaring him better than Pogba and Fred, and me contesting such views isn’t ‘dislike’. I’m not going to get swept along with the euphoria, I’ll just say what I see. I’ve always spoken favourably towards him as a lad and nothing at all suggests I don’t like him, only that I don’t see him as some top class midfielder. In fact, at 23, he’s not what I’d consider a top class young midfielder either. I think he’s someone Ole has propped up and gambled upon because he couldn’t sign a midfielder in the summer, so the narrative of him being some great midfield prospect suits the club massively because he’s all we have now, when the reality is we should have much better. I have a fear of that narrative being run away with because the longer it lingers, the more likely we are to think ‘we can save a bit of money in midfield now because Scott has become ‘so important’ for us’, which I don’t want to see happen simply because I want our team to be better.

My issue has always been less with the player himself than the hyperbolic opinions I have read about him. Poor games tend to be quickly scrubbed from memory, and ‘despite all we have spent a kid from the academy is carrying the team’ etc - it’s just not true. I’ve even read that’s Roy Keane is back!

I have absolutely no reason to dislike Scott McTominay. I have a fear of us trying to label him some mainstay in the team so we can do it on the cheap, and I’m sure the club is loving the narrative in that respect. I’m a big Greenwood fan, and Ethan Laird for that matter, as they simply look the talent of young player who I feel should be coming through the academy and staking a claim in our first XI. McTominay is not in the same class as them, and due to our poor planning, is being pushed into the first XI on the sly. If he were Phil Foden I’d have no complaint. Harry Winks even.
 

11101

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More just having an actual technically capable central midfielder is key, rather than shoehorning Pereira there or an over the hill Matic.
 

MikeeMike

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I like McT . Against PSG away he grafted the whole game and showed a facet that Pogba could do with.

But thats why, in my opinion, this team is failing. A team needs more than one key !!

He has been one of the most consistent for me but he needs a solid and consistent group around him.
 

charlenefan

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Hard working physical midfielder tend to look good in bad teams. He is made to look better by how bad others are playing
Is that why Fletcher and Henderson look good then? Because they play(ed) in bad teams?
 

mattsville

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Fred has been superior I’d say.
Not for me, McT has scored goals, stopped goals, created goals and displayed some kind of leadership which has been very lacking, not dismissing Fred though, he has improved hugely with energy and tenacity and it is just a shame that we cannot get him, McT and Pogba on the pitch at the same time.
 

ravi2

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He’s an alright player, not ‘the key’ for Manchester United by any stretch, outside of the context of ‘if we don’t play him, we’ll have to play Pereira/Matic’. Which of course, is far from where the bar should be.
This could be a thread in RAWK, its almost comical how far we have fallen
 

Paul_Scholes18

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Is that why Fletcher and Henderson look good then? Because they play(ed) in bad teams?
Not with Fletcher, but with Henderson it is true. They are a bad team which makes all players look good even if not and VAR give them wins on top of that. Had they been a good side Van Dijk would never look as good as he does. Chelsea was a good side and they sold Salah, but he is now doing well in Liverpool because they are shit. This kind of logic makes total sense.
 
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BR7

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I’ve watched the lad come through the ranks and in my humble opinion he will be a really valuable player in a couple of years but in all honesty he hasn’t had a Keane or a Robson to learn from or play alongside. He’s had Fred and pereira, it’s a surprise he’s got that level of passion in him. He will get considerably better but we’re relying too heavily on kids.

Be patient with this one, he’s not like Drinkwater or Norwood, he is much much better. His close control and long stride which enable him to poke the ball away or get ahead of his man with surprisingly good feet and can tackle, useful in the air not afraid, and oh yeah how many goals has Fred scored? How many shots has he had? This is one youth product we won’t be letting the doom mongers run out of the club. (Bye Jesse though...)
 

SweetRightFoot

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With Maguire out for 2 months were gunna see threads saying 'Maguire is key!', likewise for when any of our competent players get injured and have to be replaced with the gash on our bench. The only position I feel we have genuine backup for is GK and that's disgusting for any club.
 

DoomSlayer

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I don’t dislike him. To even say that is frankly annoying. Everything I have against him, I state, so there is no mystery here, it is simple football analysis.

I do also dislike what he represents or brings out with some fans though. I think he is an example of double-standardism and picking a choosing throughout the caf. He can do no wrong, due to the favouritism he receives is daily judged totally differently to all the other players. For ages people couldn’t give Fred any credit without basically implying Scott was pretty much propping him up and making him resemble a footballer, others are lambasted for poor passing yet his is swept under the carpet etc.

Him not being all that isn’t an issue. Him not being all that, but spoken as if he is, naturally causes those without this emotional investment in him to be constantly pointing out the inconsistencies with what posters say when it comes to him. Not very long ago I think the caf were dangerously close to declaring him better than Pogba and Fred, and me contesting such views isn’t ‘dislike’. I’m not going to get swept along with the euphoria, I’ll just say what I see. I’ve always spoken favourably towards him as a lad and nothing at all suggests I don’t like him, only that I don’t see him as some top class midfielder. In fact, at 23, he’s not what I’d consider a top class young midfielder either. I think he’s someone Ole has propped up and gambled upon because he couldn’t sign a midfielder in the summer, so the narrative of him being some great midfield prospect suits the club massively because he’s all we have now, when the reality is we should have much better. I have a fear of that narrative being run away with because the longer it lingers, the more likely we are to think ‘we can save a bit of money in midfield now because Scott has become ‘so important’ for us’, which I don’t want to see happen simply because I want our team to be better.

My issue has always been less with the player himself than the hyperbolic opinions I have read about him. Poor games tend to be quickly scrubbed from memory, and ‘despite all we have spent a kid from the academy is carrying the team’ etc - it’s just not true. I’ve even read that’s Roy Keane is back!

I have absolutely no reason to dislike Scott McTominay. I have a fear of us trying to label him some mainstay in the team so we can do it on the cheap, and I’m sure the club is loving the narrative in that respect. I’m a big Greenwood fan, and Ethan Laird for that matter, as they simply look the talent of young player who I feel should be coming through the academy and staking a claim in our first XI. McTominay is not in the same class as them, and due to our poor planning, is being pushed into the first XI on the sly. If he were Phil Foden I’d have no complaint. Harry Winks even.
You are entitled to your opinion, no problem here. But you just described your agenda yourself. You dislike him because people sometimes give him more credit than Fred or Pogba. What I would say, without discussing the ability of the mentioned players, is that if he deserves it, I see no problem with that and if you think there is more in that than pure performances, it's just an agenda. Not a dig at you, but it's a fact, you are kind of hurt that he gets treated better than Pogba whilst not being as talented as him.

Also, unfortunately you shot yourself in the leg right at the end by mentioning Winks. Surely there is no way you believe that Harry Winks is levels above McTominay? If you truly do, it just further proves that you have a specific agenda against Scott. It's not a big deal, because basically every poster has some sort of agenda in one way or another. I think McTominay will prove you massively wrong in the next couple of seasons, he might never be world class, but he will be a vital part of our squad and would bring a lot more positives to us than negatives.
 

Rozay

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You are entitled to your opinion, no problem here. But you just described your agenda yourself. You dislike him because people sometimes give him more credit than Fred or Pogba. What I would say, without discussing the ability of the mentioned players, is that if he deserves it, I see no problem with that and if you think there is more in that than pure performances, it's just an agenda. Not a dig at you, but it's a fact, you are kind of hurt that he gets treated better than Pogba whilst not being as talented as him.

Also, unfortunately you shot yourself in the leg right at the end by mentioning Winks. Surely there is no way you believe that Harry Winks is levels above McTominay? If you truly do, it just further proves that you have a specific agenda against Scott. It's not a big deal, because basically every poster has some sort of agenda in one way or another. I think McTominay will prove you massively wrong in the next couple of seasons, he might never be world class, but he will be a vital part of our squad and would bring a lot more positives to us than negatives.
Seems you haven’t listened to me. I do not dislike him. Are we children?! Because I dislike the fact that he is given more praise than Fred and Pogba does not mean I dislike him. Secondly, I don’t appreciate your telling me that my opinions are some form of ‘agenda’, but I guess this is the caf today, you are either in the category of ‘hater’ or ‘fanboy’. You saying his performances ‘deserve’ him being praised more is pure opinion, and my disagreeing with that is my own. I do not think his performances deserve that, which doesn’t mean Doom Slayer is right and I have an agenda. When I read for months people berating Pogba for giving the ball away for example, and not doing it of Scott, it doesn’t tell me that this is because McTominay does it less. Because I watch the games too. It tells me that people have less of an issue with McTominay doing it.

I also haven’t shot myself in any foot here. Harry Winks is a far better player than McTominay to me, he looks after the ball so much better and is of much greater technical capacity. Not that there is one way to play football, but he’s a midfielder who could play in a Pep side, whereas McTominay is not. There’s no fecking agenda for anyone not agreeing with your ridiculously hyperbolic views on Scott McTominay.

Scott McTominay taking a couple of years to become a ‘not world class midfielder but one who offers positives to the squad’ will not prove me wrong in anyway, as that is exactly the player I see him as, both now and in the future. If you have your own agendas, please speak for yourself going forward. I am more than capable of explaining, in whatever level of detail required, what my views are on any player and why I hold them, so don’t dismiss my views as an agenda because you can’t be bothered to process them or share a different one.

I am also not ‘hurt’ that he is treated more favourably than Pogba, despite not being as talented than him (or not being as good a player as him, to call it as it is). That highlights an issue with others, not with me. What I will do though, is call out hypocrisy when one player is praised as doing well when being guilty, often to a greater degree, of the same things another is criticised for. This particular issue just gives me a platform to do so. Posters can post what they like, I know that there is no world where McTominay is as good a player as Pogba, and any poster who even wants to use a roundabout way to imply as much should not be throwing words like ‘agenda’ at anyone else.
 

DoomSlayer

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Seems you haven’t listened to me. I do not dislike him. Are we children?! Because I dislike the fact that he is given more praise than Fred and Pogba does not mean I dislike him. Secondly, I don’t appreciate your telling me that my opinions are some form of ‘agenda’, but I guess this is the caf today, you are either in the category of ‘hater’ or ‘fanboy’. You saying his performances ‘deserve’ him being praised more is pure opinion, and my disagreeing with that is my own. I do not think his performances deserve that, which doesn’t mean Doom Slayer is right and I have an agenda. When I read for months people berating Pogba for giving the ball away for example, and not doing it of Scott, it doesn’t tell me that this is because McTominay does it less. Because I watch the games too. It tells me that people have less of an issue with McTominay doing it.

I also haven’t shot myself in any foot here. Harry Winks is a far better player than McTominay to me, he looks after the ball so much better and is of much greater technical capacity. Not that there is one way to play football, but he’s a midfielder who could play in a Pep side, whereas McTominay is not. There’s no fecking agenda for anyone not agreeing with your ridiculously hyperbolic views on Scott McTominay.

Scott McTominay taking a couple of years to become a ‘not world class midfielder but one who offers positives to the squad’ will not prove me wrong in anyway, as that is exactly the player I see him as, both now and in the future. If you have your own agendas, please speak for yourself going forward. I am more than capable of explaining, in whatever level of detail required, what my views are on any player and why I hold them, so don’t dismiss my views as an agenda because you can’t be bothered to process them or share a different one.
Okay, okay, you are taking this way further than my intentions were. Sorry if you got offended.

My agenda is that I like Scott McTominay and I think he is at least as good as someone like Winks, if not better. You comparing him to someone like Pogba and criticising him for not being as talented or not being lambasted for losing the ball makes sense, I guess. I'm not up for this kind of debate with you because it seems you are taking it personal. I respect you so you win, no worries.
 

Rightnr

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If he's the key, our United house has more public access than a bloody park on hot summer's day.
 

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Let's chunk things up a level.

McTominay's absence (as well as Pogba's) makes us a significantly worse team.

Matic improved our midfield in the second half, yesterday (though I felt City eased off a little, have battered us ruthlessly in the first) - Matic is not a great player, these days, but he is organised, experienced and calm.

This demonstrates how bare our midfield cupboard is.

Conclusion, we need to strengthen midfield immediately to make a serious challenge for top 4.
 

Rozay

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Okay, okay, you are taking this way further than my intentions were. Sorry if you got offended.

My agenda is that I like Scott McTominay and I think he is at least as good as someone like Winks, if not better. You comparing him to someone like Pogba and criticising him for not being as talented or not being lambasted for losing the ball makes sense, I guess. I'm not up for this kind of debate with you because it seems you are taking it personal. I respect you so you win, no worries.
Fair enough, and yes, let’s not take this where it doesn’t need to go. And yes, I don’t appreciate my opinions being put into some sort of box one way or another, they are just my football observations, and I just find it a little insulting after explaining myself to be told I just have an agenda, but let’s not cry about that :). I too enjoy our conversations here.

I’m not even comparing him to Pogba per se, they are not the same level of player and shouldn’t have the same level of expectation. I appreciate that. I just use Scott as an example when, as I have read, people constantly banging on about Pogba giving the ball away. He is the best at keeping the ball that we have! So it just begs a question as to whether the issue is so much about a United player losing the ball, or a Paul Pogba issue (and the conversation in which it arises is usually a mixture of personal and football attack on Pogba). My simple point on this is that McTominay can have a 70% pass completion and be praised by the same people who have decided to nitpick Pogba, who could have left the pitch with 88% and gave it away a couple of times. My only point with Scott here is to question these sorts of views, as there are inconsistencies.

You speak as if ‘liking Scott’ is unique to you, or if it’s a red corner or blue corner camp to be in. I like McTominay too! He’s a Manchester United player. Currently one of the better ones we have in his position too. He’s not a top player though, and as a United man, naturally I want us to have the best. It alarms me when I read the hyperbole on him, because I get worried that we’ll end up keeping him in the XI despite him being easily improved upon. To give an extreme example, it worries me in a way it may worry you if loads of pundits and the manager kept going on about how good a player Jesse Lingard is, and how he’s a key part of the team. I’m sure you don’t hate Lingard, and may even be cool with him being a squad player, but such comments may cause you to fear that perhaps he’s going to be a fixture in the team, despite not being good enough to be so. That’s how I feel when I hear what I hear about Scott. By all means, he should stay here, but we need a player who can handle the ball to a higher level, dribble better, keep it moving with one-touch play, in tight spaces, and pass it better, both under pressure and without. When I watch Scott, this isn’t the player I see, and I don’t think it’s what anyone else sees either, I just think they don’t care right now because he’s likeable for a number of other reasons. For me, I don’t have the sentimental view of it, there will be another youth player after him and another again and again - after a while you are just more concerned with the standard. Especially when the team is struggling, you are more desperate for the ones that can get us back to the top. If Scott was Phil Foden I’d be championing him as much as the next poster. He isn’t though, which is fine, because we aren’t obligated to have a youth player there - we can go and buy someone of Foden-level talent if we don’t have one.

Trust me, you will get over your affection for Scott. All that will be left then, is the footballer you have. How good is he. It happens with all of our kids. People wanted Cleverley to play all the time, they hyped him, Jesse has gone from hero to zero, Jonny Evans was this and that. I don’t care anymore. If Scott becomes a top player, great, but if not, until then, I’d prefer he made way for someone who is. Greenwood is different class, and a young player I’m more than happy to see in the team, as I don’t think we could realistically get a better young striker than him even if we tried. After this, the fact he’s one of our own strengthens the affinity towards him even more for me. I was vocal in not wanting Haaland because of Mason. I wouldn’t share that view if we were targeting say, Tonali or Pellegrini because of Scott, not for personal reasons, simply for footballing ones. He can do no wrong now, and I wish him well, but as I said, I doubt it would be too long before the pitchforks are out and the ‘just a local lad who runs around’ stuff comes out by people who were too invested and ‘hopeful’ to see it earlier. Under any normal circumstances, Scott wouldn’t be a regular for us - we shouldn’t have a 23 year old from the academy playing every week saying ‘if he can just learn to pass a bit better’. Just like that he will lose his Young academy kid privilege like those who have gone before him and then what will we have? Take that away, he really isn’t all that, and would not be playing at a club of this level I don’t think.

Even whatever affection you probably think I have for Paul Pogba is probably overstated. I like him first and foremost because he’s a top player, and one I recognise will be near enough impossible for us to equal let alone better if he left. That’s the main of it. I also think l, mainly in light of this said ability that he has, that he gets way too much shit, and a lot of it is based on some weird personal issues. If he wanted to leave and we could get KDB, I’d do the deal in an instant. I just want us to have the best players. He is one of them, and I desperately want midfielders on a similar level with him, rather than have to have a one in one out policy on top midfielders. Feck why couldn’t we have gotten F De Jong!
 

Jeppers7

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McT is a player I like. I like his attitude in games against Liverpool particularly. That being said if he’s the key.....we aren’t going back to 99
 

mu4c_20le

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With Maguire out for 2 months were gunna see threads saying 'Maguire is key!', likewise for when any of our competent players get injured and have to be replaced with the gash on our bench. The only position I feel we have genuine backup for is GK and that's disgusting for any club.
Not too different than genius insights such as "We would be better off keeping Lukaku!"
 

amolbhatia50k

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While true, what does it have to do with Ole as the manager? Would another manager make the likes of Pereira and Matic better players or something?
A better manager makes the team better which in turn makes the players better (or visa versa). It happens all the time and yet people pretend as if it's an alien concept.
 

Rozay

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A better manager makes the team better which in turn makes the players better (or visa versa). It happens all the time and yet people pretend as if it's an alien concept.
How much better? He has them just outside the top 4, with some very impressive performances under their belts. I’m not sure he’s too far off where he should be with what he’s had to work with so far. Maybe switch places with Chelsea potentially, which may we’ll still happen.

Also, if you read the post I responded to then perhaps you’d have found more sense in what I’d written.
 

MikeeMike

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Not for me, McT has scored goals, stopped goals, created goals and displayed some kind of leadership which has been very lacking, not dismissing Fred though, he has improved hugely with energy and tenacity and it is just a shame that we cannot get him, McT and Pogba on the pitch at the same time.
Agree mostly but you cannot count 2 last season and 3 this as “Scored Goals” inferring regularly.
 

DoomSlayer

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Fair enough, and yes, let’s not take this where it doesn’t need to go. And yes, I don’t appreciate my opinions being put into some sort of box one way or another, they are just my football observations, and I just find it a little insulting after explaining myself to be told I just have an agenda, but let’s not cry about that :). I too enjoy our conversations here.

I’m not even comparing him to Pogba per se, they are not the same level of player and shouldn’t have the same level of expectation. I appreciate that. I just use Scott as an example when, as I have read, people constantly banging on about Pogba giving the ball away. He is the best at keeping the ball that we have! So it just begs a question as to whether the issue is so much about a United player losing the ball, or a Paul Pogba issue (and the conversation in which it arises is usually a mixture of personal and football attack on Pogba). My simple point on this is that McTominay can have a 70% pass completion and be praised by the same people who have decided to nitpick Pogba, who could have left the pitch with 88% and gave it away a couple of times. My only point with Scott here is to question these sorts of views, as there are inconsistencies.

You speak as if ‘liking Scott’ is unique to you, or if it’s a red corner or blue corner camp to be in. I like McTominay too! He’s a Manchester United player. Currently one of the better ones we have in his position too. He’s not a top player though, and as a United man, naturally I want us to have the best. It alarms me when I read the hyperbole on him, because I get worried that we’ll end up keeping him in the XI despite him being easily improved upon. To give an extreme example, it worries me in a way it may worry you if loads of pundits and the manager kept going on about how good a player Jesse Lingard is, and how he’s a key part of the team. I’m sure you don’t hate Lingard, and may even be cool with him being a squad player, but such comments may cause you to fear that perhaps he’s going to be a fixture in the team, despite not being good enough to be so. That’s how I feel when I hear what I hear about Scott. By all means, he should stay here, but we need a player who can handle the ball to a higher level, dribble better, keep it moving with one-touch play, in tight spaces, and pass it better, both under pressure and without. When I watch Scott, this isn’t the player I see, and I don’t think it’s what anyone else sees either, I just think they don’t care right now because he’s likeable for a number of other reasons. For me, I don’t have the sentimental view of it, there will be another youth player after him and another again and again - after a while you are just more concerned with the standard. Especially when the team is struggling, you are more desperate for the ones that can get us back to the top. If Scott was Phil Foden I’d be championing him as much as the next poster. He isn’t though, which is fine, because we aren’t obligated to have a youth player there - we can go and buy someone of Foden-level talent if we don’t have one.

Trust me, you will get over your affection for Scott. All that will be left then, is the footballer you have. How good is he. It happens with all of our kids. People wanted Cleverley to play all the time, they hyped him, Jesse has gone from hero to zero, Jonny Evans was this and that. I don’t care anymore. If Scott becomes a top player, great, but if not, until then, I’d prefer he made way for someone who is. Greenwood is different class, and a young player I’m more than happy to see in the team, as I don’t think we could realistically get a better young striker than him even if we tried. After this, the fact he’s one of our own strengthens the affinity towards him even more for me. I was vocal in not wanting Haaland because of Mason. I wouldn’t share that view if we were targeting say, Tonali or Pellegrini because of Scott, not for personal reasons, simply for footballing ones. He can do no wrong now, and I wish him well, but as I said, I doubt it would be too long before the pitchforks are out and the ‘just a local lad who runs around’ stuff comes out by people who were too invested and ‘hopeful’ to see it earlier. Under any normal circumstances, Scott wouldn’t be a regular for us - we shouldn’t have a 23 year old from the academy playing every week saying ‘if he can just learn to pass a bit better’. Just like that he will lose his Young academy kid privilege like those who have gone before him and then what will we have? Take that away, he really isn’t all that, and would not be playing at a club of this level I don’t think.

Even whatever affection you probably think I have for Paul Pogba is probably overstated. I like him first and foremost because he’s a top player, and one I recognise will be near enough impossible for us to equal let alone better if he left. That’s the main of it. I also think l, mainly in light of this said ability that he has, that he gets way too much shit, and a lot of it is based on some weird personal issues. If he wanted to leave and we could get KDB, I’d do the deal in an instant. I just want us to have the best players. He is one of them, and I desperately want midfielders on a similar level with him, rather than have to have a one in one out policy on top midfielders. Feck why couldn’t we have gotten F De Jong!
Great post, to be fair, I appreciate you elaborating in such detail what your thoughts on the subject are. I'm happy when people can show me different angles to look at, I try to be as objective as possible in life, though football is emotional in nature, so you can't truly escape that factor.

I'll only address the McTominay part of the discussion, because we will go too much off topic otherwise and I have already been heavily involved in other threads concerning Lingard or Pogba. Personally, for me McTominay does not need to have the talent of a Pogba, a Foden or a De Jong. Of course it's extremely subjective, but the mix of footballing ability, mental fortitude and physical traits always plays a part. I strongly believe what Scott lacks in pure talent can be outweighed by his attitude and his stature in terms of presence on the pitch. For example, and this is not a dig at Pogba but just outlining what I believe McTominay's strong attributes are, Scott is a very brave player, both defensively and offensively. His mindset is very straight forward and he doesn't mind putting his body on the line in every sort of situation, whilst also rarely doubts his own ability or whether the outcome of his decision making will prove to be the right one. I think one of the main reasons his passing stats are sometimes low is because he tries to be adventurous even if he doesn't naturally possess the skill to make a lot of difficult passes and cutting through balls. But on the other hand, this has enhanced his ability to draw fouls because he is also not scared to try and dribble with the ball, driving forward in situations where it seems like it's doing the wrong thing. Pogba can also do that and sometimes does, but in my opinion he could improve on that by just being more direct, more brave and using his physicality more efficiently because he has a similar build to McTominay but also has the added world class ability on the ball. I do agree that Pogba gets more scrutinised more for one reason or another, I admit of being someone who judges him more harshly and having a love-hate relationship with him due to the expectations put on him, that's for another thread though.

If we have to compare the players, McTominay will probably never reach a level of pure ability like the one Pogba possesses, some things just come naturally to footballers. But at the same time, I feel Pogba can never fully have the mentality of a player like McTominay, which again is not a diss. Pogba is a flair player that wants to enjoy football, "Joga Bonito" or The Beautiful Game as Cantona used to say in those famous videos that I loved to watch as a young kid. Scott is more of a fighter, a player that enjoys doing the dirty work and excels in that area strongly. I don't think you can have only players like Pogba, KDB and D. Silva or B. Silva in your team, unless you are Pep Guardiola. There will always be a need for players like McTominay and I fully believe that he can reach a higher level, even if it's not world class in footballing ability i.e. having an incredible passing range and consistency of being accurate with it.

You are correct that comparing McTominay with Lingard is kind of extreme and not very appropriate. Scott seems to be a lot more level-headed than Jesse, who I think let his fame get to him too much. And the former seems to be relishing the chance of being somewhat of a leader in a young squad, whilst the latter has shrunk and hidden from the responsibilities of being a more senior player and that has hugely affected his confidence. I was actually surprised at how grown-up McTominay sounds like in interviews, for example, because I never though he had that in him initially when Mourinho was bringing him in, I was definitely not a fan of his back than and he proved me massively wrong. He might prove me wrong again in the future by not hitting the highs I hope he can, but right now I honestly prefer to be positive about him, because I really like him as a player and as a personality. Being a youth player and United through and through helps a lot of course, because even though Pogba can have the same tag put on him, he did come with the expectations of being the record club transfer in terms of the fee and his wages are on the level of the best players in the world. It's just how football works, like I said, I try to be objective, but when it comes to this sport, a lot of emotion is involved and irrational behaviour is very common due to how invested you get into the club, the history, the traditions and expectations.

I might end up being totally wrong after all, I just want McTominay to develop into being good enough as a long-term mainstay as he would deserve it and it would be a great sentimental story, as you said it. I also want Pogba to stay for a long time and be successful here, despite what I might have said sometimes in the heat of the moment. But I don't know if either of those scenarios will come true, it would be very unfortunate if they don't. Apologies if I have been rambling a bit, I may be a little drunk so I'm not sure how well I have put across all of this. :lol:
 

Seaman

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Is that why Fletcher and Henderson look good then? Because they play(ed) in bad teams?
similar player as those, not as good or talented. But this shows how far the club has fallen when players like this are celebrated
 

romufc

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Just because he is not a £100m signing that doesnt mean he is not key.

We can sign the best midfielders in the world they still are not the key.

The reason McT is key to us:

1. Lack of options.
2. His attitude is better than most
3. Leadership
4. provides balance to this team


A key player does not need to be the most talented one. Until fans don't understand this, we will always be crap.
 

Inigo Montoya

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He can stay for now as he is a good honest battler , sell pogba and get Bale ,at least he knows where the opposition's goal is. With him galloping upfront and the pace we have in our forwards it would have some impact. He isn't top draw he is just puts in a shift.
Get Bale:lol:

Sanchez mark 2 waiting to happen
 

DanClancy

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Anyone got the stats from this season from when he starts and when he's missing?
 

RedIan

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Scotts appearances 48 games, wins 26 games. - we have lost and drawn plenty when he plays so its no so simple as play him we win...
he is a decent young player with good potential but he is not key... we are missing the key and thats quality creative midfield play-makers who can feed the forwards. I dont think Scott or Fred can do that, they are both grafters who run tackle and pass but both lack any real creative ability.
The key is still missing form this team, it could be Pogba...... but.... hes injured most of the time and not sure hes interested enough a lot of the time when he plays.
 

RedIan

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More scottt stats

played 48
goals 5
shots on target 15
big assists 2
through balls 4
passes per match 34

underlines he is not a creative midfielder. A good player but not creative.
 

Ikon

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If McT is considered the key then no wonder we’re so shite
I'd rate McT as a good MF, but no more than a good MF, and yet, he is our best MF.....?!?!? :rolleyes:
 

OleBoiii

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He's a very solid midfielder who plays his heart out. We are very lucky to have him.

He only really needs to improve one thing to be considered top class in his role: his passing. He could of course improve in other aspects as well(like dribbling and shooting), but the only thing that's really lacking, is the ability to play a defense-splitting pass. But with a top class no.10 in front of him this ability will become less important.
 

RedNed77

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similar player as those, not as good or talented. But this shows how far the club has fallen when players like this are celebrated
Not as good as they were at the same age, or not as good at 23 as those players were/are at their peak?
 

spiriticon

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He is our current best central midfielder but that's not saying much because let's be honest, the standard isn't very high at the moment.
 

Rolaholic

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I don’t dislike him. To even say that is frankly annoying. Everything I have against him, I state, so there is no mystery here, it is simple football analysis.

I do also dislike what he represents or brings out with some fans though. I think he is an example of double-standardism and picking a choosing throughout the caf. He can do no wrong, due to the favouritism he receives is daily judged totally differently to all the other players. For ages people couldn’t give Fred any credit without basically implying Scott was pretty much propping him up and making him resemble a footballer, others are lambasted for poor passing yet his is swept under the carpet etc.

Him not being all that isn’t an issue. Him not being all that, but spoken as if he is, naturally causes those without this emotional investment in him to be constantly pointing out the inconsistencies with what posters say when it comes to him. Not very long ago I think the caf were dangerously close to declaring him better than Pogba and Fred, and me contesting such views isn’t ‘dislike’. I’m not going to get swept along with the euphoria, I’ll just say what I see. I’ve always spoken favourably towards him as a lad and nothing at all suggests I don’t like him, only that I don’t see him as some top class midfielder. In fact, at 23, he’s not what I’d consider a top class young midfielder either. I think he’s someone Ole has propped up and gambled upon because he couldn’t sign a midfielder in the summer, so the narrative of him being some great midfield prospect suits the club massively because he’s all we have now, when the reality is we should have much better. I have a fear of that narrative being run away with because the longer it lingers, the more likely we are to think ‘we can save a bit of money in midfield now because Scott has become ‘so important’ for us’, which I don’t want to see happen simply because I want our team to be better.

My issue has always been less with the player himself than the hyperbolic opinions I have read about him. Poor games tend to be quickly scrubbed from memory, and ‘despite all we have spent a kid from the academy is carrying the team’ etc - it’s just not true. I’ve even read that’s Roy Keane is back!

I have absolutely no reason to dislike Scott McTominay. I have a fear of us trying to label him some mainstay in the team so we can do it on the cheap, and I’m sure the club is loving the narrative in that respect. I’m a big Greenwood fan, and Ethan Laird for that matter, as they simply look the talent of young player who I feel should be coming through the academy and staking a claim in our first XI. McTominay is not in the same class as them, and due to our poor planning, is being pushed into the first XI on the sly. If he were Phil Foden I’d have no complaint. Harry Winks even.
Quality post