League Cup 2nd Round

Milton Keynes Dons 4:0 Manchester United

Stadium mk

Kick-off
Tue, 26 August 2014 @ 8:00pm BST
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    This. I feel as this may have been the last time we will see Welbeck, Hernandez or Anderson in a united shirt. Seems to me as he was giving them all one more chance before the end of the transfer window.
    Yup. Apart from Januzaj, Wilson and De Gea, I think most of them don't have futures here. Evans we'll see if he can stop getting injured and actually step it up, but I wouldn't be surprised if he never cements himself as a starter. Pereira looked alright so he has potential I think, but the others won't ever be important players for us IMO. Powell, he has a good shot, but nothing apart from that. Very raw and after reading shit like him getting his license suspended for drunk driving, does he have the mentality? Keane has never really looked too good I think. Can't really judge the other youngsters though.

    Agree with Hernandez and Anderson though, Hernandez especially. He was awful and has looked shit for a while. Anderson is shit we all know that. Welbeck should be doing a lot better then he did if he wants to be a key player here. Maybe he's just resigned to leaving though.
     
    Heres my source before you call me a spoofer:
    http://www.transfermarkt.com/shinji-kagawa/leistungsdaten/spieler/81785/saison/2013

    Now when did I compare him to Mata? I have not been arguing that he should start ahead of mata. Its mata position but is kagawa not an excellent backup/competition for him. So I see no benefit to seling him.

    Before you say it, no rooney and/or Januzaj are not better than kagawa at #10.

    Ps.. Mata has been shocking in the last 3 games including Liverpool. He played his best football with kagawa in the team. ie. Norwich, aston villa, newcastle

    no he isn't excellent back up to anyone because as you are so quick to tell us, he is incapable of playing anywhere else on the pitch.

    you compared him to mata when you complained that he hasn't been given a fair chance. the single only position he can play in is mata's position.

    you clearly don't take into account the fact he offers next to no goals or assists from his favoured position so i'll try this one. in his 13 games at AM last year, united won 5, lost 6 and drew 2. united reached 5 wins in the first 6 games Mata played at AM.
     
    I've just come out of work and seen it. Just how bad was it? Out of everything I could have imagined 4-0 MK Dons seems a bit mad.

    Literally every goal was a result of a United defender giving the ball away in our half with a horrific pass or first touch and a well-played but basic counter attack by MK Dons. In order, Evans, Keane, James, Vermijl.

    Other than that we defended okay I suppose.

    Anderson looked as rusty as useless as you'd except as the holding mid, Powell swanned around like sort of Gibson/Riquelme hybrid. His lack of desire to close down players and mark them was palpable and suggests a player who can only play in an attacking position and not one who will ever figure for us.

    Kagawa went off after 10 minutes with an injury. Januzaj came on for him and played okay as a 10 then poorly as an RWB in the 2nd half.

    Pereira's passing was wayward but his technical skills are obvious and high-level. He beat his man repeatedly with a simple fake. Looked really exciting, though very raw.

    Welbeck showed good movement and if we are persisting with this 3-4-1-2 his pace and willingness to run might mean today made him look a viable starter with RVP and Rooney lacking the movement/pace to play together. Hit some decent passes, too. On the other hand, he looked like a reverse Van Nistelrooy times in the box when a set piece fell near him. All flailing and inability to control the ball or whack or divert it at goal.

    Hernandez was poor. This formation drags him deeper and wider and so he looked clueless and wasn't really able to compensate by hitting a decent cross or two as he has been doing lately in this formation.

    Wilson hit a good shot and did seem to want to play football, so MOTM.

    Overall, the 3-5-2 looked a mess that put our defenders into awkward positions where they had to control a ball, had nobody ahead to pass to and so coughed up the ball and then MK dons. Our players also have no idea how to pass and move the ball around the pitch.

    Evans looked a shell of himself and even Januzaj didn't really give a feck. It was truly depressing stuff.
     
    To be fair, it was a team full of kids and the senior players just don't cut it. Out of everybody on the pitch today who'd start in our first 11? Januzaj, De Gea, Evans(lol). I seriously hope we go 4-3-3 with Jones as a DM until Carrick is fit.
     
    Don't think it's the score line that people are upset about it's the manner it which we lost, our passing was again woeful, it doesn't matter what system the team plays in if you can't get the basic principles of the game right i.e. passing to your team mate (not an opponent) and playing the ball in the direction of the opponents goal (not backwards or sidewards) then we are not going anywhere. It's not all doom and gloom though it's only a few months till Christmas and remember we play better after Christmas! Keep believing...Supporters were a credit to the club tonight.
     
    no he isn't excellent back up to anyone because as you are so quick to tell us, he is incapable of playing anywhere else on the pitch.

    you compared him to mata when you complained that he hasn't been given a fair chance. the single only position he can play in is mata's position.

    you clearly don't take into account the fact he offers next to no goals or assists from his favoured position so i'll try this one. in his 13 games at AM last year, united won 5, lost 6 and drew 2. united reached 5 wins in the first 6 games Mata played at AM.
    Was Kagawa playing with mata in them games?
    Do you not see how shocking your first statement is. I never once mentioned mata except the last post. He is an excellent replacement for Mata full stop.
    Him not been given a chance was not in any way related to mata. Mata only joined last January, and as you said kagawa has been here 2 years.

    Of course I take his lack of productivity into account (however as I pointed out a lot of this depends on the person on the receiving end), that's why I have no complaint with mata starting ahead of him. So if and when mata's glorious stats diminish, kagawa can compete with him.
     
    It's time to ditch Evans, Keane, and Hernandez. Bit of respect for Anderson in order. Shocking result.
     
    No, this time we'll just have to take it on the chin.

    Just ignore emails/text messages and hope you do not see these people. I've already got more than 10 emails and text messages about this. All ABUs are piss taking.
     
    Regardless of the result I have 100% confidence in LvG to turn the situation around. It was never going to be a quick fix and he said that from the start.

    I think the pre-season raised expectations but I believe we will benefit from the false start in the long run.

    When fit we have a very strong first team that is couple of signing away from being very competitive. If we can sign a good midfield player I would still fancy us to finish top 4. Confidence plays a big part in football, If we can get a run of good results this team will look totally different.
     
    Well one thing that this match shows is that Fletcher and Cleverly are much much better than our reserve midfielders. I am shocked to see people saying Anderson is better than either of them. If Ando played against Sunderland, they'd also have been able to put 3-4 past us.
     
    Well one thing that this match shows is that Fletcher and Cleverly are much much better than our reserve midfielders. I am shocked to see people saying Anderson is better than either of them. If Ando played against Sunderland, they'd also have been able to put 3-4 past us.
    Not particularly hard to be honest. Individual error from our defenders cost us this game, I would play a fit(:lol:) Anderson over fletcher for sure, he is capable of finding that defence splitting pass. The through ball he played to Hernandez today was good but unfortunately Hernandez just doesn't have the technique
     
    BTW, what is the lowest average rating any player has got in a match in caf history?

    1.7 to Evans and Hernandez has to be close to that record (Caf does not allow 0 ratings BTW).
     
    Just seen all of the goals as I missed the match, I was actually at the Swansea game thank god! :lol:

    Each of the 4 goals we conceded had at least one feck up from someone. The defence is absolutely pathetic.

    I just can't get my head around this result.

    Unbelievable :wenger:
     
    We were shit, no one could play how LvG wanted. Bad luck, we will change at a point, better to be patient than just sacking managers after 6 months and starting over. Let's just try and survive this period of shitness :)
     
    Not particularly hard to be honest. Individual error from our defenders cost us this game, I would play a fit(:lol:) Anderson over fletcher for sure, he is capable of finding that defence splitting pass. The through ball he played to Hernandez today was good but unfortunately Hernandez just doesn't have the technique

    A fit Anderson does not exist. :lol::lol::lol:
     
    Yup. Apart from Januzaj, Wilson and De Gea, I think most of them don't have futures here. Evans we'll see if he can stop getting injured and actually step it up, but I wouldn't be surprised if he never cements himself as a starter. Pereira looked alright so he has potential I think, but the others won't ever be important players for us IMO. Powell, he has a good shot, but nothing apart from that. Very raw and after reading shit like him getting his license suspended for drunk driving, does he have the mentality? Keane has never really looked too good I think. Can't really judge the other youngsters though.

    Agree with Hernandez and Anderson though, Hernandez especially. He was awful and has looked shit for a while. Anderson is shit we all know that. Welbeck should be doing a lot better then he did if he wants to be a key player here. Maybe he's just resigned to leaving though.

    Completely agree.
     
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    I missed the match because I was in a queue in the DMV for more than two and a half hours. For once, I thank the DMV for their shit service.
     
    I was at work and I missed this live. Now, I'm really glad about that!

    This is beyond a joke now :( How come the players aren't ashamed by that? What do they earn millions for? Playing like that and losing to MK fecking Dons?
     
    I was at work and I missed this live. Now, I'm really glad about that!

    This is beyond a joke now :( How come the players aren't ashamed by that? What do they earn millions for? Playing like that and losing to MK fecking Dons?


    Not just losing. Losing 4-fecking-0.
     
    All of em barring kagawa, januzaj and de gea can go for me...that wasn't a man utd team, they've no place pulling wages from us

    Oh, and 200 million isn't nearly enough
     
    Come on people, we can't overreact after a game like this, where most of the team consisted of the u21 squad and the few first teamers that did play(save for Januzaj and De Gea) are the ones that are in most danger of being shipped out/benched and most likely won't be starters in our remaining games. Welbeck wasn't too bad and he started the game well but he just didn't seem to have the motivation nor ability to turn things around after the first goal. Kagawa looked good for the short amount of time he was on but he probably won't be a starter, either. Pereira showed potential. I think the three things that we can take away from this match that do matter is:

    1. Hernandez does not have what it takes to be a starter, or even a back up option anymore. Specially with Wilson coming through. He was woeful and has been for a while.

    2. Evans looked completely lost out there and considering he was captain and the most experienced player today, he really lacked in his leadership ability not to mention he was at at fault for two of the goals. He made Afobe look like messi when he came on and that is just unacceptable, first game back from injury or not. His knack of picking up injuries also doesn't help eiher and I think it would be wiser to give Jones(also a better leader) and Smalling more game time in order to allow them to develop. They are both younger, and Imo have more potential than Evans did in the first place.

    3. Wilson and Pereira should play a role in the first squad this season.


    I wish people would stop with the doommongering and slamming of LVG. This game really is nothing to worry about. When you consider our strongest line up which in a 3-5-2 , I believe is this(with everyone fit):
    -------------------De Gea---------------
    -------Jones-----Smalling(new CB)-------Rojo--------
    -Rafael---------------------------------Shaw-----
    ------------Herrera-----Carrick(new CM)-----------
    ---------------------Mata------------------
    --------------Di Maria-----RVP-------------

    What I would rather see:
    -----------------De Gea-------------
    Rafael-----Jones(New CB)----Rojo--------Shaw--
    ----------------Carrick(New CM)----------------
    -----------Di Maria---Herrera------
    -----------------Mata-------
    -------------RVP----Rooney-----

    In both formations a new CB and a new CM are a must imo.

    None of these players(in both line ups), except for De Gea, played today and is the reason we cannot go overboard with the pessimism just yet. Yes,hwe also have problems regarding injuries and squad depth, which should be addressed with new players in the positions I mentioned above. De Jong would do nicely to rotate with Carrick and maybe someone like Garay(can't really see anybody else currently attainable at a high level) to add abit of experience and quality at the back.

    Yes, we need a couple of more additions but the point stands. What we saw today though was a u21 squad mixed with a few bench warmers on the most part. Our first team with a couple of additions will look a lot more refreshing and entertaining.

    Also as I said before, this game seemed to me more of a test for certain players and LVG will have certainly got his answers. The U21's will still have a lot of time to prove their worth but unfortunately for some of the senior players that played, this could be the end for them.

    As they say, you learn a lot more from your mistakes than your success and I'm pretty sure LVG sees it the same way. It has to get worse before it can get better
     
    All of em barring kagawa, januzaj and de gea can go for me...that wasn't a man utd team, they've no place pulling wages from us

    Oh, and 200 million isn't nearly enough

    I'd add Welbeck, Januzaj, Wilson, and Pereira to the list. I think Keane did play well against Sunderland, and Evans has shown his quality before.

    I guess this means curtains for the Man Utd careers of the likes of Hernandes Ando and Powell, however.
     
    De Gea should have done better with one or two of the goals, but the defence in front of him was woeful.

    Keane looks out of his depth at times.
    Evans had the massive cock up with the first goal.
    Vermijl was good and bad.

    James is just too slow to be a wing-back. He can't beat a man, and it doesn't help that he has to run the full length of the wing when he can barely pass a player when he's not out of breath anyway.

    Anderson and Powell completely lost the midfield battle. Passing was off, but they actually attacked the space which is the only encouraging thing from them.

    Januzaj hasn't found his form yet.

    Welbeck looked fantastic at the start, but became like a ghost as the game went on.

    Hernandez was just useless. What was he thinking with that chance at the end?

    Wilson and Pereira were the only positive notes of the whole night. Showed more effort and talent than the rest in the cameo appearances they had.

    Really is an embarrassing night. I don't like using that word, but it really is. 4-0 to MK Dons is just unbelievable. Improvement has to be shown against Burnley. It's not right that we've actually deteriorated since pre-season.
    Everything went downhill the moment Kagawa left the pitch.
    People should know already that there's more to Kagawa's play than just creativity, he's a damn playmaker that dictate the tempo of a team. Even our best games last season were games he was at his best, dropping deep into the midfield to link up from the no 10 position or on the left, e.g Bayern, Swansea game e.t.c
    It wasn't a coincidence Mata's performance improved with Kagawa on the pitch last season because he had Kagawa dropping deep from the left to support him and fortunately for him, Moyes gave Kagawa a free role on the left which allows him drop deep into the midfield to support Mata, e.g the Aston Villa, Newcastle, Westham games e.t.c.
    Yesterday game was no exception, he was basically the brain behind the tempo which provided space for Powell and Anderson to attack, just like he did for Mata last season. Not a surprise everything went to shit as soon as he was off.
    I also have my doubt about Van gaal, not because of today's game but because of other things. First, he should know there's a difference between 3-5-2 and 3-4-1-2 tactic, and should stop believing they are same because there's a clear difference! The same way he talks of 4-3-3 and 4-2-3-1 as one whereas they are different.
    Secondly, he talks of our midfield lacking organization and instead of signing a playmaking midfielder, Di Maria was signed. What he failed to realize is there's no difference between Di Maria and Herrera as a midfielder because both don't offer control in the midfield but energy with their driving runs. Basically, both are box-box CM. Maybe, he planned using Di Maria as a winger but the problem is Di Maria's best performance has always been in the midfield for both Madrid and Argentina. Moroever, the team as a whole doesn't only need a controller in the midfield but also, a holding midfielder to act as a shield for the defence.
    Lastly, I can't still get my head around how Kagawa didn't play to his philosophy when he was one of our best player every game he played in the preseason, whether in the midfield or as a no 10 and despite playing with the B-team.
    Van Gaal even mentioned of the team wining the midfield battle against Roma in the 2nd half, which coincided with Kagawa coming into the midfield at that time. Should we talk of the team's improved performance as soon as Kagawa came on against Inter or the numerous lovely chances he fashioned out against Madrid & Inter?
    And not forgetting how Kagawa dictated the tempo against Galaxy which contributed to the team having better chances created in the 2nd half of the Galaxy match after the first disruptive 15 mins of the 2nd half due to many changes. However, all Vangaal saw were Kagawa having average to decent performance and a player who ventured out of his philosophy or could it be a prejudice because he was part of the Dortmund team that usurped his Bayern team which led to his dismisal.
    Whatever it is, my take is Van gaal's attitude of shoehorning players around different position which in turn, disrupt and confuse the whole team and formation is quite worrying. The faster he tells each player their specific and definite role in the team, the better for the team.
    In short, I'm not seeing any improvement in the team or any new system for the team. It's as if it's getting worse than before.
     
    Some of the reactions today are more depressing for me today than the result especially wrt to some players.

    Better beat Burnley.
     
    Some of the reactions today are more depressing for me today than the result especially wrt to some players.

    Better beat Burnley.

    What did you expect the reaction to be. Yay!! Some league 1 club beat us by four goals.

    I see over reactions on the caf quite often, but this is reaction was deserved.
     
    I came home from work (I live in California) to watch a heroic performance. Never in a million years would I think it was MK Dons who would deliver it.

    It's best to forget this one, mates.
     
    What did you expect the reaction to be. Yay!! Some league 1 club beat us by four goals.

    I see over reactions on the caf quite often, but this is reaction was deserved.

    No i was talking about writing off certain players based on 1 game, especially some of the younger players without looking at each individual or overall context even.

    Honestly i think the senior players who were out there and LVG messed up today.
     
    BTW, what is the lowest average rating any player has got in a match in caf history?

    1.7 to Evans and Hernandez has to be close to that record (Caf does not allow 0 ratings BTW).
    Since we started during the world cup giving ratings probably that.
     
    Couldn't watch the game thankful and I find it hard to believe the score. Can someone tell me what happened, were we just utter rubbish, or just sloppyness that cost us goals and then getting hit on the counter?

    Also any of the players actually perform at all last night?
     
    Couldn't watch the game thankful and I find it hard to believe the score. Can someone tell me what happened, were we just utter rubbish, or just sloppyness that cost us goals and then getting hit on the counter?

    Also any of the players actually perform at all last night?
    Overall we were fecking dog shit (and that's being generous), but most of the squad was made up of young players that hardly/never played in the first team and the few "experienced" players we had were fringe players.
     
    Overall we were fecking dog shit (and that's being generous), but most of the squad was made up of young players that hardly/never played in the first team and the few "experienced" players we had were fringe players.
    Hardly an excuse considering the side that just beat them. We should be beating MK Don's even with the kids.

    Just watched the highlights and my god that was some horrible defending for three of them. Evans, Anderson and whoever was number 36. At least their third goal was decent and not just down to us being useless.
     
    Couldn't watch the game thankful and I find it hard to believe the score. Can someone tell me what happened, were we just utter rubbish, or just sloppyness that cost us goals and then getting hit on the counter?

    Also any of the players actually perform at all last night?
    Well Evans for the 1st passed it straight to them 18 yards out under no pressure, The 2nd was a chest into the net from a cross from 10 yards out, 3rd and 4th where just unbelievable defending by us (also the 1st) Evans had his worst game for us ever and Keane looked like a Sunday League player. If you want to know how bad we were going forward it took us 60mins to have a shot on target. No players performed but Wilson looked like a player when he came on and Pereira was decent, Even Januzaj looked crap. Anderson was woeful and so was James. Our passing was worse than Sunday and was the worst I have ever seen us play and that is no lie.
     
    What did you expect the reaction to be. Yay!! Some league 1 club beat us by four goals.

    I see over reactions on the caf quite often, but this is reaction was deserved.

    It is a bit of an overreaction. Altogether 7 senior players featured, only 1 of which is a guaranteed starter in De Gea.As for the others, Januzaj looked good, not amazing, although that shot which hit the woodwork was world class. Evans by no means has his place cemented now with the arrival of Rojo who is also a left footed, ball playing CB. Kagawa was good, until he came off. Welbeck was average but he suffered from a lack of service and is probably on his way out anyway. As for Anderson and Hernandez I strongly believe this was a test for them and they both failed with flying colours. The rest were all part of a very inexperienced u21 squad. So basically what I'm trying to say is that such a performance with a team that consisted of 6 bench warmers (3 of which didn't play that badly ) and u21s , even if it was MK Dons, is nothing to get over worried about.

    Only De Gea is a guaranteed starter in the first team and he can't be blamed for today's performance. If we lose and get outplayed by Burnley next week, with the strongest team we have at our disposal( which doesn't resemble today's team in the slightest, even with injuries) , then that would warrant this kind of reaction IMO. It's still early days, anyway. Chill out people.
     
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    Couldn't watch the game thankful and I find it hard to believe the score. Can someone tell me what happened, were we just utter rubbish, or just sloppyness that cost us goals and then getting hit on the counter?

    Also any of the players actually perform at all last night?

    We started off well and looked threatening for a while without actually creating much except Powell shots, then Evans made a bad error leading to their goals and we became rubbish for the rest of the half. Also, Kagawa got injured in between which hurt the transition and momentum.

    2nd half we started off okay, and then were building some momentum before LVG made a slightly weird change which ended up resulting in Pereira playing midfield with a tired and almost non existent Ando for last 30 minutes. Then another few errors lead to their 2nd goal and we just became total shit from that point and just collapsed except bright play here and there by a few subs.

    Wilson did well in his cameo appearance. Pereira did reasonably well too considering the role he was put in. Rest all were ranging from poor to total rubbish. I thought Powell was decent considering his first game back, and playing CM with Ando but others seem to disagree.
     
    It is a bit of an overreaction. Altogether 7 senior players featured, only 1 of which is a guaranteed starter in De Gea.As for the others, Januzaj looked good, not amazing, although that shot which hit the woodwork was world class. Evans by no means has his place cemented now with the arrival of Rojo who is also a left footed, ball playing CB. Kagawa was good, until he came off. Welbeck was average but he suffered from a lack of service and is probably on his way out anyway. As for Anderson and Hernandez I strongly believe this was a test for them and they both failed with flying colours. The rest were all part of a very inexperienced u21 squad. So basically what I'm trying to say is that a team of bench warmers and u21s playing this badly, even if it was MK Dons, is nothing to get over worried about.

    Only De Gea is a guaranteed starter in the first team and he can't be blamed for today's performance. If we lose and get outplayed by Burnley next week, with the strongest team we have at our disposal( which doesn't resemble today's team in the slightest, even with injuries) , then that would warrant this kind of reaction IMO. It's still early days, anyway. Chill out people.
    Agree with this mostly but Januzaj did not look good. He looked lost imo
     
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Player Ratings

3.2 Total Average Rating

Highest Rated Player

Lowest Rated Player

Compiled from 437 ratings.

Score Predictions

489,120,24
  • Man Utd win
  • MK Dons win
  • Draw

Detailed Results

  • 16% MK Dons 0:3 Man Utd
  • 14% MK Dons 0:2 Man Utd
  • 12% MK Dons 1:3 Man Utd
  • 9% MK Dons 1:2 Man Utd
  • 8% MK Dons 0:4 Man Utd
  • 8% MK Dons 5:0 Man Utd
  • 6% MK Dons 0:5 Man Utd
  • 5% MK Dons 1:4 Man Utd
  • 3% MK Dons 1:0 Man Utd
  • 3% MK Dons 0:1 Man Utd
  • 3% MK Dons 2:1 Man Utd
  • 2% MK Dons 0:0 Man Utd
  • 2% MK Dons 2:3 Man Utd
  • 2% MK Dons 2:0 Man Utd
  • 1% MK Dons 1:1 Man Utd
  • 1% MK Dons 2:4 Man Utd
  • 1% MK Dons 1:5 Man Utd
  • 1% MK Dons 4:0 Man Utd
  • 1% MK Dons 3:1 Man Utd
  • 1% MK Dons 2:2 Man Utd
  • 1% MK Dons 3:0 Man Utd
  • 0% MK Dons 3:2 Man Utd
  • 0% MK Dons 5:1 Man Utd
  • 0% MK Dons 3:5 Man Utd
  • 0% MK Dons 5:2 Man Utd
  • 0% MK Dons 4:1 Man Utd
  • 0% MK Dons 4:2 Man Utd
  • 0% MK Dons 4:5 Man Utd
Compiled from 633 predictions.
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Match Stats

  1. MK Dons
  2. Man Utd
Possession
48% 52%
Shots
11 14
Shots on Target
7 4
Corners
0 10
Fouls
8 10

Referee

Stuart Attwell