Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

[Skåre Willoch]

While your list isn't wrong, it would be fair to ask whether some of those players were bound to improve due to them being young or settling in England. Also, Pogba, Rashford and Martial were always capable of a lot. It's about getting them to do it consistantly that's been the problem, and still is.

For the money spent on them - and fees do count, as we have to spend wisely - I'd say AWB and Maguire would probably need to be great and solve problems long term. They are not, and they are also creating problems. So that's definitely an issue.

All fair points, and I totally understand that many fans feel this way.

I'd add that while most of the players were/are young and/or settling in England, they still need an environment they can thrive in, and trust from the manager. Many of the players mentioned had either a lack of trust / being used as a scapegoat or had simply fallen out with the manager (Fred, Pogba, Shaw). McTominay was a laughing stock "lacking of United quality" according to many (I was probably in this camp as well). I don't think their progress or comebacks were automatic and foretold at all, really. Not all Ole, but not not Ole either.

The jury's out on AWB and Maguire it seems. While I think AWB is still quite lacking in some aspects, he's great in other. Instant upgrade on the RB (Valencia and... Young?), and I think he'll only get better with time, giving him maturity and confidence. I also think Maguire is a very solid signing, and that he can be our starting CB for years to come.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

I'd add that while most of the players were(are young and/or settling in England, they still need an environment they can thrive in

Probably the most important thing of all for a young players development I’d imagine.

 

[stw2022]

There is a lot more to a managers job than gobbing off on the touchline. Shouting on the touchline looks good (or does it?) but most of it is just going to be ignored.

By your logic we could just replace Ole with literally any bloke off the street until the end of the season, which is not only inaccurate, it is also pretty ignorant.

You interpret someone pointing out he isn't a huge influence on the touchline as someone advocating 'gobbing off'?

Okay.

And sure there's a lot more than a managers job than his influence on the touchlne, but that's important and includes how he tactically influences matches by how he instructs his team to play and the changes he makes both tactically and in terms of personnel - both of which the manager hasn't demonstrated a particular talent in. Or at least one beyond every single living person with a a coaching licence.

But sure there's a lot more to a manager's job than match day. There's also preparation, this too is something he has hardly shone at given how sluggishly and poorly we start matches, we're not a team with a hallmark of a manager/coaching staff that prepare them well for games.

It's part of a manager's job to get the best out of players. And there have been improvements in some, such as Shaw for example. But the list of those he's getting the best out of vs those whose future looks suspect due to their performances is a lot shorter.

There's also, as I mentioned, the issue of the manager being responsible for how we play. I don't know if you've watched us this season but rarely does it look as if we have any tactical plan beyond the hope Fernandes pulls something out of the bag. There's nothing Ole brings to us in that regard either than pretty much every single person currently in management couldn't bring.

The biggest argument for why he's the best man for the job is the fortune that Liverpool and Chelsea have had poor starts to the season. Hope I'm wrong but I suspect as this season progresses that'll start to become clearer.

 

[Skåre Willoch]

Probably the most important thing of all for a young players development I’d imagine.

Indeed. I guess that's why so Dortmund swoops up so many young talents, even the English ones. Sancho being starting most games for them at 17/18. Gio Reyna being an integral part of the squad at 17. Bellingham starting and playing very well in the CL knockouts yesterday (youngest english starter in the knockouts ever?). Moukoko already seeing first team action at 16 and a few days.

I totally understand why so many youngsters go there, as they will get trust, confidence and play with a great mix of young (potential) superstars and mature, good/great players with tonnes of experience.

Hopefully we can build something similar here, and become a destination for the next generation og world beaters.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Indeed. I guess that's why so Dortmund swoops up so many young talents, even the English ones. Sancho being starting most games for them at 17/18. Gio Reyna being an integral part of the squad at 17. Bellingham starting and playing very well in the CL knockouts yesterday (youngest english starter in the knockouts ever?). Moukoko already seeing first team action at 16 and a few days.

I totally understand why so many youngsters go there, as they will get trust, confidence and play with a great mix of young (potential) superstars and mature, good/great players with tonnes of experience.

Hopefully we can build something similar here, and become a destination for the next generation og world beaters.

With all due respect, feck building something similar to Dortmund.

I absolutely understand why the likes of Haaland want to use them as a stepping stone, for a start they will always be amongst the best in a slightly weaker league. The chance to play well at Dortmund with less pressure is much greater than at the big clubs, and as you say, they create a great environment for them to thrive, something a true top top club could never offer, there will always be a massive extra pressure here and rightfully so.

 

[Skåre Willoch]

With all due respect, feck building something similar to Dortmund.

I absolutely understand why the likes of Haaland want to use them as a stepping stone, they will always be amongst the best in a slightly weaker league, so the chance to play well is much greater than at the big clubs, and as you say, they create a great environment for them to thrive, something a true top top club could never offer, there will always be a massive extra pressure here and rightfully so.

I realized once I pressed "post" that it could easily be misunderstood/ I wasn't clear enough.

I agree 100% with you. Feck building similar to Dortmund.

What I want is for us to be the preferred landing spot for the great talents in Europe, and actually win trophies with them every year. Not to become perennial league ***** for all eternity, which seems to be the Dortmund way.
Haaland, Bellingham and Sancho could've/should've come here instead of going to Germany.
I understand why they made the decisions they did at the time, but it doesn't have to be that way.

I guess what I want is to become the Manchester United of the 90's and early 00's. Nostalgia gets the best of me, sadly.
Buying the best players and the best talents in the premier league whenever we wanted to (Rio, Cantona, Berg, RVP, Saha), and buying great players/talents from abroad when the talent pool was lacking in the league, or a player beneficial to our style was found by our scouting network at the time (RvN, Ronaldo, Stam, Vida, Ole, etc.)

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

I realized once I pressed "post" that it could easily be misunderstood/ I wasn't clear enough.

I agree 100% with you. Feck building similar to Dortmund.

What I want is for us to be the preferred landing spot for the great talents in Europe, and actually win trophies with them every year. Not to become perennial league ***** for all eternity, which seems to be the Dortmund way.
Haaland, Bellingham and Sancho could've/should've come here instead of going to Germany.
I understand why they made the decisions they did at the time, but it doesn't have to be that way.

I guess what I want is to become the Manchester United of the 90's and early 00's. Nostalgia gets the best of me, sadly.
Buying the best players and the best talents in the premier league whenever we wanted to, and buying great players/talents from abroad when the talent pool was lacking in the league.

I disagree though, I don't think our environment can ever be as good for Halland, Bellingham and Sancho at that stage of their careers. The league is too hard and the pressure is too high.

No doubt Halland could have come to United and absolutely smashed it, we all see that now, but the decision to go to Dortmund will always be the right one in my eyes. This summer or next Summer, the lad can basically name his club. Bayern, Real, Barca, Juventus, Inter, United, City, PSG, Liverpool, Chelsea. The fact that he got them to include that low release clause means there will be a huge scramble for his signature, and the wages will be through the roof.

If he'd joined United from Austria, those options wouldn't be there. What options do we really think Mbappe has this Summer due to joining PSG? He wants Madrid, we know that, but do Madrid have the finances to pay what an oil club will want? I doubt it.

 

[Skåre Willoch]

I disagree though, I don't think our environment can ever be as good for Halland, Bellingham and Sancho at that stage of their careers. The league is too hard and the pressure is too high.

No doubt Halland could have come to United and absolutely smashed it, we all see that now, but the decision to go to Dortmund will always be the right one in my eyes. This summer or next Summer, the lad can basically name his club. Bayern, Real, Barca, Juventus, Inter, United, City, PSG, Liverpool, Chelsea. The fact that he got them to include that low release clause means there will be a huge scramble for his signature, and the wages will be through the roof.

If he'd joined United from Austria, those options wouldn't be there. What options do we really think Mbappe has this Summer due to joining PSG? He wants Madrid, we know that, but do Madrid have the finances to pay what an oil club will want? I doubt it.

You're arguing from the players perspective, though. Which, again, I agree with.

What I'm arguing is from the clubs perspective. We can indeed become a more attractive club for great talent, and still win trophies at the same time. It's all about the balance (which we used to be the very best at). That doesn't mean we can start all the kids all the time ("You can't win anything with kids"), but I'd rather have a young, potentially great CM/DM in the squad than Matic for example. Or Haaland instead of Cavani, even straight from Austria. Or Sancho over... whoever was our RW at the time he went to Dortmund. Would their careers/bank accounts benefit more from tearing up the Bundesliga and leaving for peanuts and a big personal payday? Sure. But that's not my point. My point is that Man United would benefit from buying them for peanuts early on, winning trophies with them, and letting them go whenever the time is right (which again, we used to be the very best at).

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

My point is that Man United would benefit from buying them for peanuts early on, winning trophies with them, and letting them go whenever the time is right (which again, we used to be the very best at).

Which I firmly disagree with.

If Diallo becomes a superstar, I want him to spend his career here.

 

[Skåre Willoch]

Which I firmly disagree with.

If Diallo becomes a superstar, I want him to spend his career here.

I don't even know if that's disagreeing with me? If he becomes a superstar, we keep him until he's no longer a superstar. If that happens when he's 27 (he's passed his peak) or 47 (he simply retires as a club legend), doesn't matter, we get rid when the time is right.

I haven't said otherwise?

 

[Amir]

I'd add that while most of the players were/are young and/or settling in England, they still need an environment they can thrive in, and trust from the manager. Many of the players mentioned had either a lack of trust / being used as a scapegoat or had simply fallen out with the manager (Fred, Pogba, Shaw). McTominay was a laughing stock "lacking of United quality" according to many (I was probably in this camp as well). I don't think their progress or comebacks were automatic and foretold at all, really. Not all Ole, but not not Ole either.

I absolutely agree that we have the environment for players to thrive. At the same time, I have doubts over the ability of our coaching to take them up to the next level. Which is kind of what was expected from Rashford, Martial and Pogba after the positive signs of last season (and what would be expected from Shaw for instance after his recovery this season and McTominay).

The jury's out on AWB and Maguire it seems. While I think AWB is still quite lacking in some aspects, he's great in other. Instant upgrade on the RB (Valencia and... Young?), and I think he'll only get better with time, giving him maturity and confidence. I also think Maguire is a very solid signing, and that he can be our starting CB for years to come.

Yeah, Maguire is solid, but it's just not enough. We've seen City and Liverpool spend big on centerhalves who completed them and transformed their defence. We went and spent big - and now we have to find a centerhalf to partner that expensive players and compensate for his weaknesses (which won't be going away anyway). AWB is an improvement on what we had, but again, for that money you want more than just that. He's got good defensive qualities alongside weaknesses in that department, and of course there's the attacking issue.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Way to project, you're one of the quickest to complain in here.

I never said anything about one side being better, I only said that yes I have seen some of pro Ole people becoming a bit more cranky in their posting over time, after first responding to the person saying they never saw anyone "Ole out" using bad language or fake fans callout to the "other side". Me also calling out ole inners was to address that not all of them are angels so that people wouldn't accuse me of defending just one side.

Fair enough but I respectfully disagree. From day one there's been fans who are super positive towards Ole and ones that have had doubts. Over time, these two groups grated on each other and caused the divide we see today. No one started out as an extreme supporter on either side and people supported Ole from day one, some more so than others.

Some might not like it, but whether you think he's infallible or terrible (extreme cases, obviously) both sides are Manchester United fans who want what's best for the club. Sure, they have totally opposite views, but such is the nature of opinions. I also suspect both extreme camps post extreme views to wum the other side and there's far too many personal battles being played out. I suspect away from here, these posters actually hold more balanced opinions.

 

[Skåre Willoch]

I absolutely agree that we have the environment for players to thrive. At the same time, I have doubts over the ability of our coaching to take them up to the next level. Which is kind of what was expected from Rashford, Martial and Pogba after the positive signs of last season (and what would be expected from Shaw for instance after his recovery this season and McTominay).

Yeah, Maguire is solid, but it's just not enough. We've seen City and Liverpool spend big on centerhalves who completed them and transformed their defence. We went and spent big - and now we have to find a centerhalf to partner that expensive players and compensate for his weaknesses (which won't be going away anyway). AWB is an improvement on what we had, but again, for that money you want more than just that. He's got good defensive qualities alongside weaknesses in that department, and of course there's the attacking issue.

I guess we are on the same page, relatively speaking.

Let's see how the rest of the season goes for all involved, and hopefully we can see further progress and a few acquistions before and during next season.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

I don't even know if that's disagreeing with me? If he becomes a superstar, we keep him until he's no longer a superstar. If that happens when he's 27 (he's passed his peak) or 47 (he simply retires as a club legend), doesn't matter, we get rid when the time is right.

I haven't said otherwise?

But when you post:

We can indeed become a more attractive club for great talent, and still win trophies at the same time. It's all about the balance (which we used to be the very best at). That doesn't mean we can start all the kids all the time ("You can't win anything with kids"), but I'd rather have a young, potentially great CM/DM in the squad than Matic for example. Or Haaland instead of Cavani, even straight from Austria. Or Sancho over... whoever was our RW at the time he went to Dortmund. Would their careers/bank accounts benefit more from tearing up the Bundesliga and leaving for peanuts and a big personal payday? Sure. But that's not my point. My point is that Man United would benefit from buying them for peanuts early on

Well of course we would benefit, so unless you meant we do a Dortmund and ship them when they at at or approaching peak we're back at step 1 again, why would those players ever chose a big club at that stage? United will never, and by their very nature, can never be anywhere near as attractive a club for great talent as Dortmund.

If we're the best United we can be, competing for league titles, we cannot offer Sancho what Dortmund could when he left City, or what Haaland wanted when he left Austria, nor Bellingham from Birmingham. Could United ever offer Haaland a shop window like the Dortmund one? It was the move of a lifetime for him, never will a player in history at his age and talent have his absolute pick of the football World.

 

[Skåre Willoch]

But when you post:



Well of course we would benefit, so unless you meant we do a Dortmund and ship them when they at at or approaching peak we're back at step 1 again, why would those players ever chose a big club at that stage? United will never, and by their very nature, can never be anywhere near as attractive a club for great talent as Dortmund.

If we're the best United we can be, competing for league titles, we cannot offer Sancho what Dortmund could when he left City, or what Haaland wanted when he left Austria, nor Bellingham from Birmingham. Could United ever offer Haaland a shop window like the Dortmund one? It was the move of a lifetime for him, never will a player in history at his age and talent have his absolute pick of the football World.

But, this is just what I think we can, or at least could at the time.

We didn't have a proper RW (for a fecking decade), and Sancho was a well know great talent in that position in our very own city. Even I, from a different country, knew about him and his talent before he went to Dortmund. Of course we could offer him playing time, at least the same 685 league minutes he got in his first season at Dortmund. The problem is that we had Mourinho in charge at the time, who threw a hissy fit over not getting bloody Perisic instead.

Many of us had been crying out for a proper number 9 for ages, of course we could've promised Haaland a fair chance and loads of minutes after watching him tear it up in the CL. If it's true that the release clause was the reason for us not getting him (Ed trying to save face) or himself choosing different (his own words), nobody really knows.

This doesn't mean that I think we should ship them elsewhere when approaching their peak. This means that I want to get them before they peak, and keep them until we can get better players for their position (i.e. after they've peaked). And with a decent strategy, that player is already at the club due to good recruitment of talent and a good academy.

 

[AgentSmith]

A brilliantly managed game.

Everything was spot on - the selection, the performance, the tempo, the tactics, the subs and the result all perfect.

Much needed and will let us rest the big guns next week before the crucial Chelsea game.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Rotated brilliantly. Delighted with everything from tonight, very pleasing indeed.

 

[anant]

Felt like a pretty routine win despite winning 4-0. Hell, it could have been 6-0 and even then I wouldn't have been shocked.

 

[croadyman]

Got most things right tonight but wish he had thought at 3-0 we are in control and can now bring on both Amad & Shoretire to give them a proper taste of the action but hopefully could get more proper gametime next week

 

[Paul_Scholes18]

Very good performance. I can't help, but feel the spanish league has declined a huge amount.
All spanish teams conceding goals for fun in europe.

Still 4-0 is very good and could have been more. We can certainly go all the way if we focus on it.

 

[90 + 5min]

Taking huge steps during this season. One step back, 3 steps forward.

 

[Shark]

Rotated brilliantly. Delighted with everything from tonight, very pleasing indeed.

As long as we beat Newcastle that is. We're such a strange team under Ole that we could look completely off the boil the next game after winning 4-0.

 

[Red & White]

Rotated nicely and the performance was spot on. Completely controlled the game and he should be able to rest more players next week now after that result, which is exactly what we need before the Chelsea game.

 

[Robbie Boy]

As long as we beat Newcastle that is. We're such a strange team under Ole that we could look completely off the boil the next game after winning 4-0.

And therein lies the problem, I'll be buzzing going into Sunday against a piss poor Newcastle. But we could conceivably be utter shite. It really is a rollercoaster

 

[Manncunian]

The perfect antidote to the West Brom performance today. Great selection.

My only criticism would be not bringing Diallo on 10 minutes sooner. Would have been nice to get more of a taste of what he’s about.

Please please please don’t be cowardly against Newcastle on Sunday.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

Honestly it was a performance not dissimilar from Sevilla in the semi-final. We battered them too and missed chance after chance before they nicked it. Similar game here except we put them away with much better execution.

Really interesting set up too as it felt more like Bruno was playing as a CF/ false 9 and Mason was told to just float everywhere while Rash and James just constantly burned it from the wings.

 

[Foxbatt]

He got everything right. I thought he should have brought on the two young subs instead of Mata but I guess he had to give Mata more chance that Shoretire.

 

[rotherham_red]

Only 13 posts (including this one) about the manager after a good win?

I thought this was the performance thread, and not the "let's pile on to the manager after every dodgy game to make up for the inadequacies I feel in my own life" thread?

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Only 13 posts (including this one) about the manager after a good win?

I thought this was the performance thread, and not the "let's pile on to the manager after every dodgy game to make up for the inadequacies I feel in my own life" thread?

It’s harder to come into a manager’s thread though innit, after beating an alright side.

You can analyse and banter about Bruno, Maguire, Rashford and their moments in the game but popping in to a manager’s thread to say “good team selection” is never really going to be so popular.

But I’ll try making you happy:

“Well managed game, good win, great getting James minutes and Diallo.”

Yup, was as boring as I expected.

 

[Robbie Boy]

It’s harder to come into a manager’s thread though innit, after beating an alright side.

You can analyse and banter about Bruno, Maguire, Rashford and their moments in the game but popping in to a manager’s thread to say “good team selection” is never really going to be so popular.

But I’ll try making you happy:

“Well managed game, good win, great getting James minutes and Diallo.”

Yup, was as boring as I expected.

So much this

Some just have to find a reason for a good ouel moan. Just enjoy the win ffs!

 

[AshRK]

He should trust the squad more. James has to be subbed more and start odd games.

 

[Mainoldo]

Good team selection. Was nice to have faith in the Daniel James’s.

I’ll give Ole a solid 9 for today. He would have got a 10 if he put Diallo on at 70mins instead of 80mins. But such is life

 

[Matriac]

Only 13 posts (including this one) about the manager after a good win?

I thought this was the performance thread, and not the "let's pile on to the manager after every dodgy game to make up for the inadequacies I feel in my own life" thread?

Don't you know that you can only really truly evaluate a manager once the season is over?*

*Unless we lose or draw a game (no matter our placement or progress from last season) then you best believe we'll immediately evaluate the heck out of how the manager was always doomed because reasons.


_________

My dumb joke would have fit better if it was replying immediately after your post, but we've already had a few frequent flyers above, that after certain results camp the thread, say that saying positive things about the manager is impossible/boring. Even if the attempted examples are the exact opposite of what the thread is usually flooded with after a not so favorable result.

 

[Skåre Willoch]

Great game by Ole and the coaching team. We got to rest some players, and got some others going as well. Good rotation during the game as well, even though Mata and Diallo might have come on a bit earlier.

With this result we can field a backup XI for the return leg at home to be ready for the Chelsea game a few days after. Essential.

 

[Bobcat]

Very happy about last night. That result means we can rest everyone in the return leg. Hopefully Henderson gets to start at the weekend

In fact i think James should start too. I know no one rates him, but i thought he was exellent last night and deserves to start ahead of Martial

 

[Sylar]

Only 13 posts (including this one) about the manager after a good win?

I thought this was the performance thread, and not the "let's pile on to the manager after every dodgy game to make up for the inadequacies I feel in my own life" thread?

Not at all surprising. If it's a game by game discussion, this game makes it difficult to discuss Ole if you have an opinion already formed.

Ole has faults but when he gets it right, he equally deserves praise and credit.

The perfect antidote to the West Brom performance today. Great selection.

My only criticism would be not bringing Diallo on 10 minutes sooner. Would have been nice to get more of a taste of what he’s about.

Please please please don’t be cowardly against Newcastle on Sunday.

Had no issue with the way he used the subs. Personally I agree but ole has seen what amad is capable of and how long he can go. Ole has made mentions of how he's almost ready
I think we will see him more next leg, and this game gives us the perfect opportunity to do so

Honestly it was a performance not dissimilar from Sevilla in the semi-final. We battered them too and missed chance after chance before they nicked it. Similar game here except we put them away with much better execution.

Exactly how I felt especially with some of the early Rashford misses. And then going 1 up thinking we need a second to kill their hope

 

[Robbie Boy]

Don't you know that you can only really truly evaluate a manager once the season is over?*

*Unless we lose or draw a game (no matter our placement or progress from last season) then you best believe we'll immediately evaluate the heck out of how the manager was always doomed because reasons.


_________

My dumb joke would have fit better if it was replying immediately after your post, but we've already had a few frequent flyers above, that after certain results camp the thread, say that saying positive things about the manager is impossible/boring. Even if the attempted examples are the exact opposite of what the thread is usually flooded with after a not so favorable result.

Or else it's fairly basic logic, no? I came in and praised him straight after, but like no one is going to quote me really so there's nothing to discuss. After a loss or draw it's full of drama queens from both sides bickering which takes up a-lot of pages. So, no arguing among drama queens = less pages.

It applies in all walks of life though, a good news story will get buried pretty quickly whereas something controversial, negative etc. will garner far more discussion, air-time etc.

 

[Bilbo]

Or else it's fairly basic logic, no? I came in and praised him straight after, but like no one is going to quote me really so there's nothing to discuss. After a loss or draw it's full of drama queens from both sides bickering which takes up a-lot of pages. So, no arguing among drama queens = less pages.

It applies in all walks of life though, a good news story will get buried pretty quickly whereas something controversial, negative etc. will garner far more discussion, air-time etc.

Its interesting how human beings are so readily programmed to criticise than to praise though isn't it? There is a hypothetical thread about whether Pep would have won the title with us that has had almost as many posts in the same amount of time as a post match thread after a 4-0 away win in Europe. I honestly have never understood why more people can't just pop in with sentence or two of praise about an actual game of football. Isn't this all ultimately supposed to be about the actual football?

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Its interesting how human beings are so readily programmed to criticise than to praise though isn't it? There is a hypothetical thread about whether Pep would have won the title with us that has had almost as many posts in the same amount of time as a post match thread after a 4-0 away win in Europe. I honestly have never understood why more people can't just pop in with sentence or two of praise about an actual game of football. Isn't this all ultimately supposed to be about the actual football?

Why? Because "talking points", debating if Pep would succeed at United or whether or not Bailly should have rushed in on Isak create debates, and therefore pages.

Debates aren't created in manager threads after enjoyable wins agains average sides. Who is really gonna to debate the standard boring as feck "Good team selection, nice win, happy Diallo got minutes"?

Yet ivaldo's in a thread pretending Bailly got "saved by Maguire" and "beaten all ends up", gifs were posted, bollocks was spouted by all, I'm pretty sure one fella threw in some algebra, Lindelöf then joined the mix, and no-one called him Victoria which was a huge relief for everybody involved. Try creating a similar debate about last night and the management team and I'm all in, gif of Phelan anyone?

 

[Bilbo]

Why? Because "talking points", debating if Pep would succeed at United or whether or not Bailly should have rushed in on Isak create debates, and therefore pages.

Debates aren't created in manager threads after enjoyable wins agains average sides. Who is really gonna to debate the standard boring as feck "Good team selection, nice win, happy Diallo got minutes"?

Yet ivaldo's in a thread pretending Bailly got saved by Maguire and beaten all ends up, gifs were posted, bollocks was spouted by all, I'm pretty sure fella threw in some algebra, Lindelöf then joined the mix, and no-one called him Victoria which was a huge relief for everybody involved. Try creating a similar debate about last night and the management team and I'm all in, gif of Phelan anyone?

Yeah, I don't disagree. I just find it a little hard to understand why a good win is not worthy of debate. Its not even that replies are way down after a win, its actual views of the thread. People aren't even bothering to visit. Its the first thing I do after the final whistle. I guess I'm the weird one. I did have my suspicions.