If you’re being completely honest you have to take into account the level of opposition we’ve faced versus teams above us. We aren’t a plucky underdog, 12 points from the 6 games we’ve had isn’t impressive.
Who's to say the don't challenge him?
Our league form is shockingly bad, if we're being honest. We've faced nothing but fodder teams so far. When we hit the tough fixtures such as City, Chelsea, Liverpool, etc back to back then you can talk about some form. If we continue to drop points to such easy teams, we'd better start worrying about another battle for top 4 and forget about any titles or whatever.
Runners up last season / near top of the table at present / Defence looking rock solid for the first time in years / exciting players brought in to play the United way / far more offensive than any team since SAF’s reign.
I've looked for positives at ever turn under OGS but these will run out eventually. The defence doesnt look solid to me - villa should have scored 3 at the weekend. We however created 0 guilt edge chances. It's so incredibly disjointed and with the quality we have the coaching must be questioned.
Come on bud. You make it sound all doom and gloom. We’re near top of table and have been playing well.
Shining examples mate. Aside from Pep, what exactly did their respective clubs do? If it ain't working, it's about damn time to move on.
13 from 6 is not shockingly bad even despite the fixtures. It's neither exceptionally good as well. It's right at the par level. The thing is big teams will drop points vs smaller teams and they will continue to do so consistently. It's happened every year, and will continue to happen. As long as we get 14 from the next 7, even though we'd end up a few points behind leaders, I'd be quite comfortable in the title race, because our games post that Chelsea/Arsenal game are all favourable and we should go on a run there
The Athletic ran a story on him telling the players in pre season that we were changing formation, and then didn't. Just genuinely trying to work out why he changed his mind.
it's not just about one defeat though the performances have been largely crap so far this season
We mostly haven't though sadly
Can I have what you're drinking
Most of us said at the beginning of the season that we had to win these first 6 games to show our muscle and now the goalposts have changed thanks to all our rivals taking points off each other. With the squad we have, we should be on 18 points and leading the charge for the title.
Games aren't won on paper. I'd have wanted to be on 15-16 points, but 13 isn't unacceptable. Ofcourse, this means that we need to get ~14 from the next 7 and the scope of error has reduced, but it's not the end of the world like people are proclaiming here
There’s the draw to Southampton, loss to Young Boys and West Ham and Villa as well it’s been a poor start which on paper should have been straight forward.
How come other manages have no problem bringing players up to speed?
The only comedy in here is you calling the defence rock solid
Great post
This is something you see every year and is what you might call the "We're in it mathematically" fallacy. Where people think that, as long as you're within a few points of the leaders mid-season, you're in the race, without actually looking at the trajectory of both teams.
One of the features of the title winning teams in recent years has been long winning runs. The title winners best run of consecutive wins over each of the last 5 seasons.
That's the point I was mentioning earlier. I dont mind being a few points behind the pack after 13 games, as long as we do what is expected of us in the next 14 - each one of them being winnable. If we manage to get 2.5 ppg from that run (which isn't impossible), I'd say we'll be in the running for the title.
My point is that, if we've averaged 2.1 points over several years, we're not going to suddenly step up mid-season to 2.5. By the way we'd need to sustain that 2.5ppg over the entire rest of the season, not just a short run in the middle. That kind of step increase is very rare - I can't think of a time when its happened before off the time my head.
I don't expect us to touch 90, and if we're being honest I don't expect this to be another season where the champions get 95+ points. The City and Pool sides are weaker now than what they were 2 years ago, and I'd still say that City is the team to beat.
We won't. 0-0 incoming I would bet. They're undefeated in normal time so far this season
Someone who is such a stickler for facts should probably take more care to put the correct points total in their post, no? Just a thought
I'm pretty sure you're purposely lowering the bar here tbh. If we reach the point where we have played 13 games and have 27 points, we won't be putting up much of a title challenge. I've also seen nothing so far to suggest that we would be capable of going on any sort of amazing run to claw points back, while our rivals simultaneously drop points. The reality is, we would probably be anywhere between 6 and 7 points off of where we should be, and it isn't really good enough.
I think anything other than a win would cause a shit storm tbh. One point out of 6 with a double header against Atalanta to come, would leave us in a bad position. I think the best we get out of that double header is 4 points. So 5 points on the board with 4 played, would be very fecking nervy coming into our final two games, one of which will be Villarreal away.
Agreed, 95+ probably wont be the figure this time, but I'm assuming 90 will be. City got 86 last season after a diabolical start. They've started better this season and have already played Chelsea (a), Spurs (a), Leicester (a) and Arsenal (h). 12 goals scored, 1 conceded... I think 90 points is about where they're headed, based on previous seasons.
Unless this is another 95+ point season we'd be within touching distance if we're at 27 after 13 - maybe 4-5 points behind at max (Should Pool win all their next 7 games, they'll be at 35, but it's fairly likely they'll drop points maybe even this week). The thing is as long as we can get 35 from the next 14, we're doing fine. It's about just keeping pace during the tough run and we'd be fine.
I think 80 will be borderline for him. Unless ofcourse we do something amazing in CL or win the FA Cup (although I find it stupid to judge a Utd manager on their FA Cup/LC record)
Looking at those fixtures, I think we would certainly be 6 points off where I would have expected us to be, anyway. It's all a matter of opinion, of course, but that's honestly how I would see it. I think our rivals have looked far stronger than us so far, for the most part - so I honestly wouldn't really fancy us in a game of catch up with them. I believe if we have 27 points and our football hasn't improved, the atmosphere won't be good. As I said, if we have 27 points and our football drastically improves, then the outlook may be slightly different.
