Our away form against the top 12

PoTMS

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Dec 15, 2016
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Arsenal - 3-2.
City - 6-3.
Newcastle - 2-0.
Spurs - TBA.
Brighton - TBA.
Brentford - 4-0.
Liverpool - 7-0.
Villa - 3-1.
Fulham - 1-2.
Chelsea - 1-1.
Palace - 1-1.

Awful. Either got hammered or dominated. One win where we got a last minute winner that we completely didn't deserve.
 
It's a worry for sure.

And Fulham was a last min winner too
 
PoTMS said:
Arsenal - 3-2.
City - 6-3.
Newcastle - 2-0.
Spurs - TBA.
Brighton - TBA.
Brentford - 4-0.
Villa - 3-1
Fulham - 1-2.
Chelsea - 1-1.
Palace - 1-1.

Awful. Either got hammered or dominated. One win where we got a last minute winner that we completely didn't deserve.
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Absolutely diabolical and there has to be significant improvement next season if we want to finish in Champions League places
 
Thankfully just 2 games left in this group. We're good in 75% of our games. Garbage in 25% which are these. 9 of the remaining 11 in games where we tend to do well
 
Yeah. And we can't say we were unlucky in any of those defeats - we were outplayed in almost all of these games.

Can't expect anything more than zero points from Brighton and Tottenham, too.
 
TMDaines said:
At the moment, the Carabao final feels like an anomaly rather than the neutrality being something that could be relied upon…
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Not sure. Our away performances vs the top half in the league have been pathetic, but in the Europa League they've been fine (and vs Barcelona was excellent), our performance in the final was fine... I dunno. There's a different dynamic in the league vs cups. It's a cup final, neutral ground while in the league the others are chasing us as we had that cushion and it led to some horror shows.
 
bosnian_red said:
Not sure. Our away performances vs the top half in the league have been pathetic, but in the Europa League they've been fine (and vs Barcelona was excellent), our performance in the final was fine... I dunno. There's a different dynamic in the league vs cups. It's a cup final, neutral ground while in the league the others are chasing us as we had that cushion and it led to some horror shows.
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How mentally weak are this lot then? Depressing thought.
 
The only saving grace is we have mostly home games this month. Only Spurs away as real test.

Brentford (H)
Everton (H)
Sevilla (H)
Forest (A)
Sevilla (A)
Brighton (Wembley)
Spurs (A)
Villa (H)

Hopefully we will have Casemiro and Eriksen back in midfield and Martial up front the next time we play away from home.
 
Neville was spot on when he said that if you can't turn up for and perform in the big games away then Man Utd is not the club for you.

Unfortunately we have so many players in that category right now.
 
TMDaines said:
How mentally weak are this lot then? Depressing thought.
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It's definitely still an issue. Mentally not ready to be a top team. It isn't wrong to think that we had a cushion and that a defeat doesn't really stop us from being favourites from achieving our goals. But as players, they can't let that thinking come in, and it clearly does.
 
We are not at the level where we can expect to go to tough away grounds and dominate.

Expecting that prematurely is setting yourself up for failure and disappointment.
 
Wow, please take each game into context, Utd lost to Brentford and City at the start of the season, Lfc beat us easy but Arsenal and Palace was last minute goals,
 
adexkola said:
We are not at the level where we can expect to go to tough away grounds and dominate.

Expecting that prematurely is setting yourself up for failure and disappointment.
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But this season we go to tough away grounds and get absolutely dominated instead. Yeah, we can't expect going to Anfield or Etihad and win 3-0 with 70% possession but conceding 13 goals is quite extreme. And even in the result-wise tight Arsenal game we were pretty much played off the park, if we're honest.
 
Siorac said:
But this season we go to tough away grounds and get absolutely dominated instead. Yeah, we can't expect going to Anfield or Etihad and win 3-0 with 70% possession but conceding 13 goals is quite extreme. And even in the result-wise tight Arsenal game we were pretty much played off the park, if we're honest.
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Ignore the scorelines for a second... We lost 3 away games to

2 teams challenging for the league, likely to finish with point totals above 90, and

A bitter rival known for game raising

The nature of the results were annoying, sure, but 3 defeats at the Etihad/Anfield/Emirates? If that comes with 2 trophies and a top 4 finish I'd still label EtH as being on track.
 
It will take serious investment to replace some of the jokers masquerading as footballers in this team.
 
adexkola said:
The nature of the results were annoying, sure, but 3 defeats at the Etihad/Anfield/Emirates? If that comes with 2 trophies and a top 4 finish I'd still label EtH as being on track.
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I agree! But the performances in these games are worrying. We collapse too easily, we offer too little threat, we have next to no control. There's a lot to be done.
 
Away form is a issue, we went unbeaten away from home few years ago, that form hasn't been shown.. home form has been better... its a progression in terms of some performances. We won a trophy. The league form has been patchy .. I thought we would get 80 + points thus season ..it now looks we could struggle to get 70.... if we get over 70 top 4 should be OK.

Then go into next season with a good window again .
 
PoTMS said:
Arsenal - 3-2.
City - 6-3.
Newcastle - 2-0.
Spurs - TBA.
Brighton - TBA.
Brentford - 4-0.
Liverpool - 7-0.
Villa - 3-1.
Fulham - 1-2.
Chelsea - 1-1.
Palace - 1-1.

Awful. Either got hammered or dominated. One win where we got a last minute winner that we completely didn't deserve.
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That is not realy correct.

We were better team against Fulham, Chelsea, Crystal Palace and Aston Villa. Those two last mentioned had some very strange decisions against us.
We were equal against Arsenal. Here to, we had some wierd decision going Arsenal way.
Liverpool, ManCity, Newcastle and Brentford deserved wins. Should be said that Brentford was start of the season with new manager.
 
90 + 5min said:
That is not realy correct.

We were better team against Fulham, Chelsea, Crystal Palace and Aston Villa. Those two last mentioned had some very strange decisions against us.
We were equal against Arsenal. Here to, we had some wierd decision going Arsenal way.
Liverpool, ManCity, Newcastle and Brentford deserved wins. Should be said that Brentford was start of the season with new manager.
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We were equal against Arsenal in the 1st half. In the 2nd half they absolutely battered us until they deservedly got the winner. Also don't know what game you watched against Villa but we were by no means the better team.
 
PoTMS said:
Arsenal - 3-2.
City - 6-3.
Newcastle - 2-0.
Spurs - TBA.
Brighton - TBA.
Brentford - 4-0.
Liverpool - 7-0.
Villa - 3-1.
Fulham - 1-2.
Chelsea - 1-1.
Palace - 1-1.

Awful. Either got hammered or dominated. One win where we got a last minute winner that we completely didn't deserve.
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How many of these games did Casemiro play?
 
We made Villa look like fecking Real Madrid and that's probably the least one-sided of those losses.

I wonder how good our home record is given how bad this is and how we're actually having a decent season overall.
 
V.O. said:
We made Villa look like fecking Real Madrid and that's probably the least one-sided of those losses.

I wonder how good our home record is given how bad this is and how we're actually having a decent season overall.
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We are 4th in the away league table. We do well vs the bottom half. Everyone struggles vs top half (not as much as us in terms of we just get battered). Arsenal the exception where they have 34 points away. City on 27. Newcastle 21, United on 20. Our home form similar to Liverpool and Spurs.
 
V.O. said:
We made Villa look like fecking Real Madrid and that's probably the least one-sided of those losses.

I wonder how good our home record is given how bad this is and how we're actually having a decent season overall.
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To answer my own question:

table.png


Strangely, we've got the 4th best home record and the 4th best away record... I suppose that must mean we're at least beating the shite away if nothing else.
 
Siorac said:
Yeah. And we can't say we were unlucky in any of those defeats - we were outplayed in almost all of these games.

Can't expect anything more than zero points from Brighton and Tottenham, too.
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We were most definitely unlucky against Palace, but your point still stands. We've been absolute garbage most of these games.
 
Welcome to where midfields are important. Away games are all about controlling and taking some of the sting out of a raucous home crowd and fired up home side. We employ a captain that plays like he has a timer on his watch that will shock him if he doesn't get rid of the ball, and don't employ a single possession minded midfielder that excels in ball retention, along with a keeper that's petrified when the ball is at his feet and a striker that might as well play for the other side. So you go to these tougher away grounds and get dragged into some end to end dogfight. We gave the ball away a comical amount through unforced errors today, and it happens quite often in these types of games.
 
DutchSerb said:
We were most definitely unlucky against Palace, but your point still stands. We've been absolute garbage most of these games.
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Well, yeah, we should have had a penalty at 1-0. But the overall performance was dogshit, really.
 
I'm having trouble trusting ourselves to make top 4. These crumble so easily
 
PoTMS said:
Arsenal - 3-2.
City - 6-3.
Newcastle - 2-0.
Spurs - TBA.
Brighton - TBA.
Brentford - 4-0.
Liverpool - 7-0.
Villa - 3-1.
Fulham - 1-2.
Chelsea - 1-1.
Palace - 1-1.

Awful. Either got hammered or dominated. One win where we got a last minute winner that we completely didn't deserve.
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Because we aren’t a complete side and had our main midfielders missing for some of them
 
Yes this is pretty shocking. What matters is where we finish, though.

Maybe I was overly pessimistic because of all the other failed managers, but I honestly didn't expect us to be top 4 at this stage and even have a trophy. Ten Hag is still doing a better job than expected. Let's just hope that it lasts until the end of the season.
 
Basically, if you’re playing us at home and you have a team, a manager and fans who are in unison, you’ve got a really decent chance of taking points off us - because we can’t seem to (consistently) rally against that momentum.

Our next away game at Nottingham Forest (straight after Sevilla) looks dicey.
 
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So six of our next seven are away from Old Trafford, with that set to be seven out of eight should we progress in the Europa League. On that run we play Brighton twice, Spurs, West Ham, Sevilla and potentially one of Sporting or Juve. The wheels could truly be off by the end of that, or we could still be on for a trio of trophies and 3rd place.

Time for the squad to get used to the lack of home comforts and to develop the ability to grind out results, if they really want to compete for any of the big trophies next season.
 
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