[roonster09]

Worldies are now banned. All footballers should be joyless sideways passing drones

Next time any player who wants to shoot should check xg value before going ahead.

Messi and Ronaldo are the dumbest players in top 5 leagues btw, they attempted more shots from outside the box. Why would they even attempt from 0.02 scoring position? FFS.

 

[Zehner]

Have you ever heard of result oriented thinking?

It went in but it wasn't the right decisions based on the odds of it going in. Actually quite an easy concept.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

Why would anyone judge CM playing in midfield 2 in a 4-2-3-1 on goals? His job is to create chances, spray passes. We have 4 attackers to score goals.

He's not the DM so still needs to chip in with goals. What a ridiculous statement. 1 goal in over 20 games isn't good enough mate. I will grant him somewhat of a pass with him being injured a lot but next season he's got to do better than that. 4 assists isn't anything spectacular either is it so the creativity wasn't there either.

 

[Zehner]

Next time any player who wants to shoot should check xg value before going ahead.

Messi and Ronaldo are the dumbest players in top 5 leagues btw, they attempted more shots from outside the box. Why would they even attempt from 0.02 scoring position? FFS.

Easy, they don't. Cristiano used to but no more.

 

[cyberman]

Are we finally going to get the real Paul Pogba to stand up and be counted next season? I seriously hope so.

This year has been difficult due to injuries but because of the covid break he's still managed to play over a third of our games. 1 goal in 23 games is simply not good enough for a player with his ability. 4 assists isn't either.

Next season there can be no more excuses made for him. No more ifs and buts. He's got to finally deliver a consistent season from start to finish.

He is playing well. Hes a CM holding his position while he feeds the ball wide or to our attackers. He cant run beyond Bruno because he tries that many risky passes that it would be a disaster if he were caught ahead of the ball.
The ill discliplined Pogba who should keep it simple is a much more discliplined midfielder who keeps it a lot simplier and still people aren't happy.

 

[roonster09]

Easy, they don't. Cristiano used to but no more.

Messi attempted 84 shots from outside the box, Ronaldo 81. That's the highest in top 5 leagues. KdB 8th in the table.

 

[roonster09]

He's not the DM so still needs to chip in with goals. What a ridiculous statement. 1 goal in over 20 games isn't good enough mate. I will grant him somewhat of a pass with him being injured a lot but next season he's got to do better than that. 4 assists isn't anything spectacular either is it so the creativity wasn't there either.

He played around 1200 mins which is around 13 games. He has 4 goal contributions which is 1 goals in every 3 game for a CM and that's not good enough?

Ridiculous statement is judging CM on goals, especially the double pivot ones who plays deeper role.

Funny how Pogba contributed so many goals in last 2 seasons but criticism was on something else, now that he is playing deeper role, criticism is back to goals and assists for a CM.

 

[roonster09]

Have you ever heard of result oriented thinking?

It went in but it wasn't the right decisions based on the odds of it going in. Actually quite an easy concept.

Yeah, luckily football is not played on paper and laptops. These players score ridiculous goals in their careers.

Players shoot as they back their ability, they don't check papers and laptops.

 

[Rozay]

Or, you know, people see football different to you and genuinely criticize him for his wastefulness. I have no agenda against Pogba, why would I? I'm not a United fan, not even a fan of an English team. But everytime I watch him play I see the same stuff that would absolutely infuriate me if I was in fact a United supporter - and it infuriates me if our players do it, too.
The scenes I listened I are dumb decisions of him. Not in a certain system but in general. Why does he take a shot that has an xG of maybe 0.02? Why does he play passes that are impossible to get at the end of? Why does he play a 40m long ball with his weak foot to a marked and isolated Rashford when he could play a short pass? Why does he play through balls in spaces that are defended or through lines that are marked? Why does he decide to turn into two players instead playing an easy sideways pass to retain possession?

Those aren't "yes, he could've retained the ball but the possibility of creating a chance justified the risk" situations. Those are "well, even my grandmother could've predicted that this ball will end up in the opponent's feet" situations.

The main midfielder in a top team can't allow himself such stuff. If he does, his output must be exceptional like de Bruyne's - and even he is less wasteful - and Pogba's isn't. Don't underestimate ball retention. Especially against teams that like having the ball and play long passing sequences, it is deadly if you give it back to them so easily and unprovoked. At least let them work for it.

Pogba barely shoots at all. If you want to complain about low percentage shooting, try Bruno or Rashford.

‘Why does he play passes that are impossible to get on the end of?’ - is that the take you have on his passing. He’s a fecking brilliant passer, and people get on the end of his passes, regularly.

‘Why does he play a 40m pass with his weak foot to a ‘marked and isolated’ (whatever that means) Rashford when he could play a simple sideway pass?’ - again, this is a spun narrative, one that I see a lot of. Firstly - Pogba, every single game, plans tons of simple sideway passes. Literally. If you chose to watch his next game and say ‘I want to see how many sideway passes he makes to keep/circulate possession’ - there are loads.

Secondly, he plays these passes because he can. That’s the whole point of having a player who CAN pass like him there as opposed to someone who can only play sideways passes. You seem to not care that most of these weaker foot 40 yard passes actually fond their target either. Perhaps your issue is just the sheer progressiveness of it?

‘Why does he play through passes in spaces that are defended or through lines that are marked? - again, because he can! That is the whole point of him! I’m sure you are not new to watching football, but through passes typically involve threading a ball through opponents. They are, by nature, difficult to achieve, but the best passers can make them. Including Pogba. Or do you not watch him every game pull off brilliant passes? And even then, he attempts far less through passes than Bruno, for example, and completes more than him. It’s a strange criticism. Should Pogba, Bruno, KDB and Ozil stop attempting these passes or something?

Pogba doesn’t try and turn into two players instead of playing an easy pass. He does obviously trust his ability to beat players (with good reason, you would find, if you have seen him play more than a few games) - but if a pass is on, I don’t see him turning passes down.

In summary, you seem to prefer a player with the passing of McTominay or something to Pogba’s. Playing penetrative passes are to be discouraged, and sideways ones are to be championed. Although Pogba plays plenty of those anyway. I thought the whole idea of everyone preferring ‘this Pogba’ was they like the way he ‘keeps it simple’ anyway. Apparently, he doesn’t after all, or still not simple enough.

Or as you said, perhaps people just see the game differently. When people watch Pogba and what they take away is a list of issues with his passing, it is weird to me. There’s probably no better passer in the game.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

He is playing well. Hes a CM holding his position while he feeds the ball wide or to our attackers. He cant run beyond Bruno because he tries that many risky passes that it would be a disaster if he were caught ahead of the ball.
The ill discliplined Pogba who should keep it simple is a much more discliplined midfielder who keeps it a lot simplier and still people aren't happy.

Is that what we get for £90m?

I'm sorry but that's not good enough then if this is all you expect. I have a go at Pogba a lot BECAUSE i expect so much more from him. If all you want is somebody deep to spray passes about then why did we spend £90m to do it? Plenty of players around Europe who can do that.

I want Pogba further up the pitch more like he did for 10 weeks when Ole first took over. That's the Pogba I want to see.

 

[Zehner]

Messi attempted 84 shots from outside the box, Ronaldo 81. That's the highest in top 5 leagues. KdB 8th in the table.

Outside the box can mean much. How often have you seen Messi take a shot from 25+ meters? Cristiano used to do that but already stopped doing that when he won all those CLs.

The shot I was criticizing from Pogba was from around 25 meters, against his running direction and from a static situation. The chances for a goal would've been bigger if he had passed it sideways and the team had waited for a better opportunity to finish the attack. It's not a good decision and even if it would've gone in, like in the clip you posted, it remained the same. The outcome doesn't determine if a decision was good or not, the probability does.

 

[roonster09]

Is that what we get for £90m?

I'm sorry but that's not good enough then if this is all you expect. I have a go at Pogba a lot BECAUSE i expect so much more from him. If all you want is somebody deep to spray passes about then why did we spend £90m to do it? Plenty of players around Europe who can do that.

I want Pogba further up the pitch more like he did for 10 weeks when Ole first took over. That's the Pogba I want to see.

Yeah, we paid 90 million means Pogba should turn into superman so that he can fly and reach every possible position quickly.

You don't expect a lot, you expect unrealistic things that no one in football can achieve.

You want Pogba further up the pitch but manager don't and that's want matters in the end. He should play for his manager, not for his goals and assists.

 

[Withnail]

Yes, it was a dumb move.

00:18: As I said (and as you quoted me saying): Not his fault.
00:48: No, he turned into two defending players although he had the option to pass to the CB.
03:13: Yes, because he could take that shot 50 times and it would go in maybe once
03:54: No, Rashford headed that ball out of the field.

And as I said, this game proved that he can do better so I don't get why you're pointing out all the other stuff. I said that he's too wasteful in possession for a top midfielder and actually played good when he decided to keep it simple. And no, "keeping it simply" doesn't mean just easy sideway passings. He created the chances for Martial by playing simple.

00:18: If it's not his fault because he didn't actually lose possession, why are you including it at all?

00:48: Ok so he shouldn't attempt to turn and go forward in case he slips? He should pass to the CB and 'keep it simple'

03:13: Football would be a very joyless game if players didn't attempt worldies every now and again.

03:54: No, Rashford headed that ball out of the field (Ok the vid cut off before I could see what happened but sometimes cross-field passes don't come off )

Obviously every player can do better but you're not even a United supporter, why do you care so much? You are nit-picking as he was our best player on the night, the stats back that up and show that the bad outweighs the good.

As for this I mean come on:

Yes, it was a dumb move.

 

[Rozay]

Is that what we get for £90m?

I'm sorry but that's not good enough then if this is all you expect. I have a go at Pogba a lot BECAUSE i expect so much more from him. If all you want is somebody deep to spray passes about then why did we spend £90m to do it? Plenty of players around Europe who can do that.

I want Pogba further up the pitch more like he did for 10 weeks when Ole first took over. That's the Pogba I want to see.

So why are you blaming him and not the coach who has given him such a role? The fact is, the role that he HAS been given - he is doing it. But you don’t care, you think he should abandon that and just play as our furthermost midfielder?

 

[roonster09]

Outside the box can mean much. How often have you seen Messi take a shot from 25+ meters? Cristiano used to do that but already stopped doing that when he won all those CLs.

The shot I was criticizing from Pogba was from around 25 meters, against his running direction and from a static situation. The chances for a goal would've been bigger if he had passed it sideways and the team had waited for a better opportunity to finish the attack. It's not a good decision and even if it would've gone in, like in the clip you posted, it remained the same. The outcome doesn't determine if a decision was good or not, the probability does.

Stop with mental gymnastics now and also moving goal posts. Almost all outside the box shots have low xg values and your problem was low value shots. Now don't come up with 25+ meters thing.

What Messi shoots might have 0.02 or 0,04, that doesn't change the point. It's a low value shot, so Messi is the dumbest player in top 5 leagues going by that ridiculous logic.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

Yeah, we paid 90 million means Pogba should turn into superman so that he can fly and reach every possible position quickly.

You don't expect a lot, you expect unrealistic things that no one in football can achieve.

You want Pogba further up the pitch but manager don't and that's want matters in the end. He should play for his manager, not for his goals and assists.

I honestly think you'd make excuses for him no matter what and will continue to do so. So far has he been a success at this club for what we paid? Yes or no? If you answer yes you're just blatantly biased. He's not lived up the hype or price tag. He's got the ability though but we rarely see it for more than a few patches a season. He's got to improve.

 

[TrustInOle]

He played around 1200 mins which is around 13 games. He has 4 goal contributions which is 1 goals in every 3 game for a CM and that's not good enough?

Ridiculous statement is judging CM on goals, especially the double pivot ones who plays deeper role.

Funny how Pogba contributed so many goals in last 2 seasons but criticism was on something else, now that he is playing deeper role, criticism is back to goals and assists for a CM.

People will always find something to moan about. If they arn't Messi/ Ronaldo consistent then their not good enough. Unfortunately the world we live in now. People want him gone, says everything

 

[Withnail]

So why are you blaming him and not the coach who has given him such a role? The fact is, the role that he HAS been given - he is doing it. But you don’t care, you think he should abandon that and just play as our furthermost midfielder?

Can you imagine the posts if he just abandoned his position, starting running all over the place, getting ahead of the ball and vacating the middle of park?

 

[Nou_Camp99]

So why are you blaming him and not the coach who has given him such a role? The fact is, the role that he HAS been given - he is doing it. But you don’t care, you think he should abandon that and just play as our furthermost midfielder?

I do hold Ole partly to blame for that. But i remember lots of people on here saying that City have played with two attacking mids so why can't we? I don't think Pogba looks very good in this role. Always thought he was better further up the pitch.

But then there's a good number of fans on this thread who think he's better than KDB so why i'm bothering to put my points across I will never know.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

People will always find something to moan about. If they arn't Messi/ Ronaldo consistent then their not good enough. Unfortunately the world we live in now. People want him gone, says everything

So you're perfectly happy with him then and think he's lived up to the hype and price tag? Has he had the impact you wanted and expected?

 

[roonster09]

I honestly think you'd make excuses for him no matter what and will continue to do so. So far has he been a success at this club for what we paid? Yes or no? If you answer yes you're just blatantly biased. He's not lived up the hype or price tag. He's got the ability though but we rarely see it for more than a few patches a season. He's got to improve.

Why ask a question and then come up with bs like "blatantly biased if you say Yes". You posts just don't have any logical thinking, as simple as that. You are blaming Pogba for playing the role his manager asked him to, you want Pogba to play like your dream player where he mops up everything in defense, plays passes like Xavi and Scholes and end up scoring like Lampard. There is no player who does all that.

Pogba played in attacking role (Not attacking mid btw) and he scored lot of goals and assists. He still got plenty of criticism as he didn't score in every game and didn't control every game. Now he is getting criticism because he is not scoring enough, completely ignoring his role.

 

[roonster09]

I do hold Ole partly to blame for that. But i remember lots of people on here saying that City have played with two attacking mids so why can't we? I don't think Pogba looks very good in this role. Always thought he was better further up the pitch.

But then there's a good number of fans on this thread who think he's better than KDB so why i'm bothering to put my points across I will never know.

Partly? fecking hell, what do you want Pogba to do? Ignore all the roles and play as he wish?

City plays like that as their manager sets them to play like that. We play 4-2-3-1 with 2 CMs in deeper role.

 

[Zehner]

Pogba barely shoots at all. If you want to complain about low percentage shooting, try Bruno or Rashford.

‘Why does he play passes that are impossible to get on the end of?’ - is that the take you have on his passing. He’s a fecking brilliant passer, and people get on the end of his passes, regularly.

Didn't deny that. He's got great passing range, it's his decision making I'm criticizing. Look at the first pass in the video. He plays passes where the lines aren't there. Those are impossible to receive, regardless of the pass or the touch.

‘Why does he play a 40m pass with his weak foot to a ‘marked and isolated’ (whatever that means) Rashford when he could play a simple sideway pass?’ - again, this is a spun narrative, one that I see a lot of. Firstly - Pogba, every single game, plans tons of simple sideway passes. Literally. If you chose to watch his next game and say ‘I want to see how many sideway passes he makes to keep/circulate possession’ - there are loads.

I don't care how many sideway passes he played up until then. If the alternative is that he plays a pass that is highly likely to lead to a possession loss, he should play another sideway pass. And the pass he played was incredible difficult. That it still was so precise tells you how good his technique is even with his weaker foot but the decision was still dumb because it placed Rashford in a situation in which he was highly likely to lose the ball.

Secondly, he plays these passes because he can. That’s the whole point of having a player who CAN pass like him there as opposed to someone who can only play sideways passes. You seem to not care that most of these weaker foot 40 yard passes actually fond their target either. Perhaps your issue is just the sheer progressiveness of it?

Again, it's not his passing ability but his decision making I'm criticizing. He's far too risky at times. That's what I mean with "dumb". He plays passes that are predestined to fail. There's literally no scenario that justifies that unless you want to lose possesion in order to get into counter pressing situations.

‘Why does he play through passes in spaces that are defended or through lines that are marked? - again, because he can! That is the whole point of him! I’m sure you are not new to watching football, but through passes typically involve threading a ball through opponents. They are, by nature, difficult to achieve, but the best passers can make them. Including Pogba. Or do you not watch him every game pull off brilliant passes? And even then, he attempts far less through passes than Bruno, for example, and completes more than him. It’s a strange criticism. Should Pogba, Bruno, KDB and Ozil stop attempting these passes or something?

Unless he can just magically make defenders feck up, he can't, no. And that's not what KdB, Özil, Messi etc. are doing. They are looking for lanes. I've seen several times in this game alone that Pogba attemped a pass that was bound to fail since the lanes didn't align properly. That can happen at times if you misjudge but he does that so often that it has to do with risk assessment.

Pogba doesn’t try and turn into two players instead of playing an easy pass. He does obviously trust his ability to beat players (with good reason, you would find, if you have seen him play more than a few games) - but if a pass is on, I don’t see him turning passes down.

Well, he literally did. He was moving towards his own goal around the half way line with the ball at his feed and could've played it back to the CB. Instead he turned into two midfielders chasing him, slipped, and lost possession.

In summary, you seem to prefer a player with the passing of McTominay or something to Pogba’s. Playing penetrative passes are to be discouraged, and sideways ones are to be championed. Although Pogba plays plenty of those anyway. I thought the whole idea of everyone preferring ‘this Pogba’ was they like the way he ‘keeps it simple’ anyway. Apparently, he doesn’t after all, or still not simple enough.

No, I encourage progressive passing. What I don't encourage is playing passes that have a high likelihood of failure, especially when other options are on the table. For the same reason I don't rate crosses or long shots. It's about patience. Don't play the first pass you spot but assess if it makes more sense to be patient, circulate the ball and wait for a better opportunity with a higher likelihood. Those are actually the basics of playing football.

Or as you said, perhaps people just see the game differently. When people watch Pogba and what they take away is a list of issues with his passing, it is weird to me. There’s probably no better passer in the game.

Again, passing technique vs. decision making. Nobody is criticizing Pogba's passing technique. At least not me, I can guarantee you that. Take a Thiago, Kroos, Modric, de Jong etc. They are all playing through balls and are very progressive passers but not even close to Pogba in terms of wastefulness.

 

[roonster09]

People will always find something to moan about. If they arn't Messi/ Ronaldo consistent then their not good enough. Unfortunately the world we live in now. People want him gone, says everything

Yeah, some of them are just ridiculous. They want him to ignore Ole and play attacking role just because he can.

 

[Rozay]

I do hold Ole partly to blame for that. But i remember lots of people on here saying that City have played with two attacking mids so why can't we? I don't think Pogba looks very good in this role. Always thought he was better further up the pitch.

But then there's a good number of fans on this thread who think he's better than KDB so why i'm bothering to put my points across I will never know.

I share your views about what I would LIKE to see. But it is clear to even the most reluctant onlookers that he is not being asked to play as an attacking midfielder. Ultimately, it matters little that City play with two attacking midfielders. We, under instruction from our manager, do not. For that, you can’t hold Ole ‘partly’ to ‘blame’ - he is entirely responsible! As you mentioned from last season, Pogba has shown, in the version of him that you say you would prefer to see - that he CAN play further forward and get the numbers you desire in the process. He is now showing he can play a deeper and more reserved role - probably the sort of ‘simple’ role many of the same critics demanded he played while he was rampaging forward last season! Ultimately, it isn’t the role I’ve beem given.

And there are a good number of fans on this board who even put Scott McTominay above Pogba, so like you, I do ask myself why I bother at times.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

Partly? fecking hell, what do you want Pogba to do? Ignore all the roles and play as he wish?

City plays like that as their manager sets them to play like that. We play 4-2-3-1 with 2 CMs in deeper role.

He's been frustrating in different midfield roles though. He's not been a success for us has he? In fact Bruno has been the much bigger success for me. Admittedly that's only over 5 months but he's had the impact I thought Pogba would when he rejoined.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

I share your views about what I would LIKE to see. But it is clear to even the most reluctant onlookers that he is not being asked to play as an attacking midfielder. Ultimately, it matters little that City play with two attacking midfielders. We, under instruction from our manager, do not. For that, you can’t hold Ole ‘partly’ to ‘blame’ - he is entirely responsible! As you mentioned from last season, Pogba has shown, in the version of him that you say you would prefer to see - that he CAN play further forward and get the numbers you desire in the process. He is now showing he can play a deeper and more reserved role - probably the sort of ‘simple’ role many of the same critics demanded he played while he was rampaging forward last season! Ultimately, it isn’t the role I’ve beem given.

And there are a good number of fans on this board who even put Scott McTominay above Pogba, so like you, I do ask myself why I bother at times.

And those fans are equally delusional. Pogba has bags more ability but he needs to start performing consistently. End of.

 

[roonster09]

He's been frustrating in different midfield roles though. He's not been a success for us has he? In fact Bruno has been the much bigger success for me. Admittedly that's only over 5 months but he's had the impact I thought Pogba would when he rejoined.

I never saw Bruno playing in midfield 2 alongside Matic and then judged based on how many times he gave away possession or how he didnt track runners. That's the different standards that are applied.

Make no mistake, I rate Bruno very highly and he is 9 or 10/10 signing but last season people moaned about Pogba penalties boosting his goals but this season people go with "Bruno scored 11 goals" without coming up with same excuses.

 

[TrustInOle]

So you're perfectly happy with him then and think he's lived up to the hype and price tag? Has he had the impact you wanted and expected?

I am indeed happy with him, other than injuries this is the kind of player I expected, he has been more than good enough. People should stop putting so much emphasis on price tag. Paul Pogba isn't a problem, only fans and pundits seem to think so.

 

[Rozay]

Didn't deny that. He's got great passing range, it's his decision making I'm criticizing. Look at the first pass in the video. He plays passes where the lines aren't there. Those are impossible to receive, regardless of the pass or the touch.



I don't care how many sideway passes he played up until then. If the alternative is that he plays a pass that is highly likely to lead to a possession loss, he should play another sideway pass. And the pass he played was incredible difficult. That it still was so precise tells you how good his technique is even with his weaker foot but the decision was still dumb because it placed Rashford in a situation in which he was highly likely to lose the ball.



Again, it's not his passing ability but his decision making I'm criticizing. He's far too risky at times. That's what I mean with "dumb". He plays passes that are predestined to fail. There's literally no scenario that justifies that unless you want to lose possesion in order to get into counter pressing situations.



Unless he can just magically make defenders feck up, he can't, no. And that's not what KdB, Özil, Messi etc. are doing. They are looking for lanes. I've seen several times in this game alone that Pogba attemped a pass that was bound to fail since the lanes didn't align properly. That can happen at times if you misjudge but he does that so often that it has to do with risk assessment.



Well, he literally did. He was moving towards his own goal around the half way line with the ball at his feed and could've played it back to the CB. Instead he turned into two midfielders chasing him, slipped, and lost possession.



No, I encourage progressive passing. What I don't encourage is playing passes that have a high likelihood of failure, especially when other options are on the table. For the same reason I don't rate crosses or long shots. It's about patience. Don't play the first pass you spot but assess if it makes more sense to be patient, circulate the ball and wait for a better opportunity with a higher likelihood. Those are actually the basics of playing football.



Again, passing technique vs. decision making. Nobody is criticizing Pogba's passing technique. At least not me, I can guarantee you that. Take a Thiago, Kroos, Modric, de Jong etc. They are all playing through balls and are very progressive passers but not even close to Pogba in terms of wastefulness.

Well you have a lot of analysis for a game where he had 89% pass completion. None of it makes any sense. You can keep talking about decision making and low percentage passes, but when he is completing that many of them, it begs the question of what exactly your problem is, especially as you say you have no issue with progressive passing.

Every single time Pogba switches the play 40 yards, or drops one over the top, it will always be a lower percentage pass than just turning around and passing to Maguire. Perhaps that’s what he should be doing. And it is exactly what KDB does by the way. He tries many extremely low percentage passes, as does Bruno, both of whom do it far more than Pogba, and in the case of Bruno in particular, are far less successful with it. Yet both of these players seem to be drawing praise for he attempt.

The fact that Pogba generally has a high pass completion contradicts almost everything you have said in your post. Whether you want to call it decision making or technique.

 

[DWelbz19]

“Why does he take a shot with an xG of 0.02”

FFS, man. I hate it here.

 

[roonster09]

“Why does he take a shot with an xG of 0.02”

FFS, man. I hate it here.

Dont worry we will see players like this from now on.

"Of it's 0.02, I wont shoot"
"Martial, ffs it was 0.6 xg, why didnt you shoot"

 

[TrustInOle]

Yeah, some of them are just ridiculous. They want him to ignore Ole and play attacking role just because he can.

Nothing is good enough from him, never has been. We are clearly a better side with him the team. Deep or advanced.

 

[krautrøck]

Every player should have an xG implant that sends live data to their HUD.

 

[Rozay]

And those fans are equally delusional. Pogba has bags more ability but he needs to start performing consistently. End of.

But that isn’t ‘end of’ for you though. The complaint is usually a different one every game. Like, take Sevilla, for example. What is your specific issue for this game?

He played well. We shouldn’t be having this debate at all. The fact that we are is why he will appear, over time, to be inconsistent and not playing well for you. We struggle to even ‘give him’ this game, where he was probably the best player on the pitch. Of course he will never be good enough, over time.

It’s about perspective and narrative. You said Bruno is what you want from Pogba. Pogba would not have gotten away with a large majority of his performances. You are okay with Bruno turning over possession. You have repeatedly brought up goal stats. Bruno has scored from open play in two games since he’s been here, and played as almost a second striker. I’m not having a go at him. I am also happy with how he’s played, but my point is, it’s easier to be happy when everything is viewed through a certain prism. Poor passes are recognised as part of the game etc. Poor shots are part of the game. I promise you that if you choose to apply a similar prism to Pogba, you would be a lot happier than him. Because passing, dribbling etc - he gets a lot more of it right than he gets wrong. It’s just always ‘yea but. What DIDN’T he do?’ And that’s even on a good game. So when there’s an opportunity to talk about something he DID do wrong, it will of course never be missed.

 

[Zehner]

Well you have a lot of analysis for a game where he had 89% pass completion. None of it makes any sense. You can keep talking about decision making and low percentage passes, but when he is completing that many of them, it begs the question of what exactly your problem is, especially as you say you have no issue with progressive passing.

Every single time Pogba switches the play 40 yards, or drops one over the top, it will always be a lower percentage pass than just turning around and passing to Maguire. Perhaps that’s what he should be doing. And it is exactly what KDB does by the way. He tries many extremely low percentage passes, as does Bruno, both of whom do it far more than Pogba, and in the case of Bruno in particular, are far less successful with it. Yet both of these players seem to be drawing praise for he attempt.

The fact that Pogba generally has a high pass completion contradicts almost everything you have said in your post. Whether you want to call it decision making or technique.

Jesus. I already explained that he had great sequences in his game where I thought that's exactly the Pogba I want to see. That doesn't change at all that he lost the ball at least 10 times in dumb fashion. I'd say that Kroos exemplarily had lost zero of those balls since his decision making is in another league while their passing technique is on par.

And yes, de Bruyne attempts many passes and sometimes he misjudges but he's also got the stats to back that up. Messi also plays lots of passes he misjudges but a) in different situations (he takes the risk when there's actually much to gain) and b) he has enough output to justify it.

Pogba's pass completion rate in general isn't good whatsoever, by the way. He's at 85% which is okay for a midfielder but not good. Compare that with Thiago, Kroos, Modric, Gündogan, Fernandinho, Wijnaldum, de Jong, Rakitic, Verratti, Pjanic etc. and they are all over 90%. That 85% to 90% means that Pogba plays 1.5 times as many misplaced passes than them, by the way. The difference between 85% and 90% is more than you intuitively think. Kroos exemplarily is at 6.2 failed passes per 100 while Pogba is at 14.5. That's more than twice as much. Kroos by the way is at 1.7 key passes per game, Pogba at 1.9 so it's not like his more risky decision making seems it pay off big time.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Can anyone furiously defending Pogba remind me the last time he came close to scoring a goal? Shouldn’t a player who is so tall, physically imposing and skilful (and who clearly isn’t in the team for his work rate and defending!) be a regular goal threat? Compare and contrast with Bruno who works the keeper in every game he plays. Feck it, even Fred seemed to have more efforts at goal against Sevilla.

The fact Pogba’s been such an impotent goal threat for so much of his United career is just another piece in the Pogba puzzle. A player who consistently fails to deliver what we want/expect from him based on his obvious talents.

 

[Bestie07]

Pogba's pass completion rate in general isn't good whatsoever, by the way. He's at 85% which is okay for a midfielder but not good. Compare that with Thiago, Kroos, Modric, Gündogan, Fernandinho, Wijnaldum, de Jong, Rakitic, Verratti, Pjanic etc. and they are all over 90%. That 85% to 90% means that Pogba plays 1.5 times as many misplaced passes than them, by the way. The difference between 85% and 90% is more than you intuitively think. Kroos exemplarily is at 6.2 failed passes per 100 while Pogba is at 14.5. That's more than twice as much. Kroos by the way is at 1.7 key passes per game, Pogba at 1.9 so it's not like his more risky decision making seems it pay off big time.

Pass completion rate gives a very incorrect image of a player's wastefulness. A better metric would be pass failure rate.

 

[cyberman]

Is that what we get for £90m?

I'm sorry but that's not good enough then if this is all you expect. I have a go at Pogba a lot BECAUSE i expect so much more from him. If all you want is somebody deep to spray passes about then why did we spend £90m to do it? Plenty of players around Europe who can do that.

I want Pogba further up the pitch more like he did for 10 weeks when Ole first took over. That's the Pogba I want to see.

A players with Pauls ability in CM is worth a lot more than Paul playing further forward. France have won a WC based on it.
Theres a genuine shortage of excellent, ball playing CMs in the world at the moment. We have seen what Pogba brings with our performances pre lockdown and post lockdown and I wouldnt swap hom for any other similar player in the world right now.
Thanks to Paul we aren’t just a counter attack side anymore

 

[Rozay]

Can anyone furiously defending Pogba remind me the last time he came close to scoring a goal? Shouldn’t a player who is so tall, physically imposing and skilful (and who clearly isn’t in the team for his work rate and defending!) be a regular goal threat? Compare and contrast with Bruno who works the keeper in every game he plays. Feck it, even Fred seemed to have more efforts at goal against Sevilla.

The fact Pogba’s been such an impotent goal threat for so much of his United career is just another piece in the Pogba puzzle. A player who consistently fails to deliver what we want/expect from him based on his obvious talents.

Funny that he has the same goals per game as Kevin De Bruyne in the PL then.