Could be biased because I've been here for more than a decade but the newer posters are really giving the promotion system a bad name.
6
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 42
- Goals
- 6
- Assists
- 6
- Yellow cards
- 9
- Status
We where in the running for the title until Pogba got injured.
Now I'm sure we still would have fell off like we did but not by as much.
We are very simply much better with him than without him.
Kept us in the Europa League as well.
By comparison Fred is praised by so many and is arguably one of the biggest reasons we got knocked out of the CL and without a doubt is the biggest reason we lost to Leicester in the FA cup.
He gave the ball away so much in dangerous positions that the panic set in and killed us.
We need Pogba. And if we goes we need 2 replacements for him. An attacking minded Midfielder like Grealish and a DM like Rice or Bissouma
Now I'm sure we still would have fell off like we did but not by as much.
We are very simply much better with him than without him.
Kept us in the Europa League as well.
By comparison Fred is praised by so many and is arguably one of the biggest reasons we got knocked out of the CL and without a doubt is the biggest reason we lost to Leicester in the FA cup.
He gave the ball away so much in dangerous positions that the panic set in and killed us.
We need Pogba. And if we goes we need 2 replacements for him. An attacking minded Midfielder like Grealish and a DM like Rice or Bissouma
Over the course of 6 group games, it is ridiculous to say Fred is the biggest reason we were knocked out of the CL. Over the course of one PSG game, it is also ridiculous to blame him for getting sent off for a legal tackle.
Why bring Fred into it at all? Are you incapable of praising Pogba without putting down another one of our players?
Bit harsh to generalise.
Renewing his contract is one of the MOST important pieces of business we could do in the summer.
Exactly. Really the biggest reason we were knocked out was because our defence had a collective mindfeck against Istanbul.
I think that'll happen. But we have to get both right - renew his contract and ensure we get the best out of him for the duration thereof. If we do the former and not the latter, it'll be another expensive mistake by the club.
Was superb 2nd half and some nice bits in the first half. Should of had 2 assists.
Come on now. Everytime you're asked to provide an objective evaluation or justification for your strongly held opinions you dodge it.
I'm still waiting to hear what metrics and standards you think a midfielder should be judged on. You have to admit that in the absence of any objective frameworks, you're very likely just reflecting a bias when you stick to these subjective evaluations of a player where you insist he hasn't been good but you can't explain why.
Well because he should have been sent off for the first one tbf. Ole was also mad not to take him off. PSG where always going to sell his tackles because a second yellow was going to so easy to get and VAR can't overturn it.
He and Ole got baited in that game. Equally bad by the both of them.
That's why Fred is in if the big reasons but not the biggest for the CL. But he was the biggest reason against Leicester in my opinion.
If Pogba out up those two performances to knock us out of two trophies he would never live it down.
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It's relevant. My comment is on the perception of Players on here.
How some are given much more leeway by fans than others. And why is that? Because Fred would never leave as he could only ever go to a worse team.
Again that's not bashing Fred it's merely factual.
Pogba is a player that is undoubtedly overcriticised and hated beyond a reasonable manner by so many. It makes sense to compare him to other players in the team in that respect.
Cant see it myself. Why would he resign when he can start negotiating with foreign clubs from Jan and pick up a massive signing on bonus and good wages next season.
Pogbas never been about money as far as anyone can tell. He left us to get game time.
There are valid reasons to both stay and leave for him right now. I wouldn't begrudge either decision.
You dont think we need a DM like Rice or Bissouma if he stay?
For me this is really important if we want to get moore out of Pogba!
And if he leavs we still need it....
Perhaps because there are things other than his salary that he may consider?
I think we need one to replace Matic, as Fred/Mctominay can't play every match together.
Pogba seems to be doing a good job in the more attacking positions, he plays like Grealish from the left side.
Some people are forgetting about Raiola....
Money matters in this for sure....
Big Z said he was working for Raiola before. In USA he said its now time for Raiola to work for him and get him a contract in the club he loves.
Of course it is the same with Pogba and Haaland and all the others in Raiols team....
But please Woodward! Signe the extension and pay what he wants....or close at least.... :0)
Money matters in this for sure....
Big Z said he was working for Raiola before. In USA he said its now time for Raiola to work for him and get him a contract in the club he loves.
Of course it is the same with Pogba and Haaland and all the others in Raiols team....
But please Woodward! Signe the extension and pay what he wants....or close at least.... :0)
All footballers have agents. And you would imagine that all agents work to the same mandate, which is to try and het their client the best deal. Only Raiola has profile.
Money obviously matters, but there is no suggestion that we will not offer market rate salary anyway. It appears clear though that if it were just as simple as matching a number, we would have probably agreed a deal a while ago. It seems it’s a case of the player deciding he wants to stay here more than anything else.
Yes of course we do. But I see people saying if we sell Pogba get Rice. Rice can't replace Pogba.
This team needs a DM with Pogba staying and a DM and attacking CM if he goes.
Personally I'd buy a DM over a CB if I had to choose.
I'm not dodging anything, I've given you my opinion a good few times, not sure what else you're after. You guys are just so hyper sensitive to anything other than praise for Pogba that you're doing silly things like asking for objective evaluations, metrics etc.
It's an opinion on a footballer. An opinion. There is no objective evaluation. It's all subjective.
If you just relax and unclench the buttocks you'll find that having a different opinion to yourself doesn't = a lazy narrative.
If you want to give a game by game breakdown every time you rate a player go at it. I don't think there's any need. You've watched the games and told me you think Pogba has been excellent. That's fair enough. I don't agree but I won't be demanding you provide a peer reviewed study either.
It's a game guys and we're just chatting about a guy playing football. Try not to take it so personally.
It feels like Ole has found a way to get more consistent performances out of Pogba. It is to push him more forward and towards left. He has generally tended to perform well for us in this role. But that does mean we need someone else to bring in CM position to provide creativity from the deep.
My thoughts exactly on the matter, I'd also prefer Bissouma over Rice for the DM role.
Fred didn't play when we lost to Istanbul and when we lost to RB Leipzig. Fred played when we beat PSG, RB Leipzig and Istanbul though and also played yesterday vs Spurs. You are making biased points here. Matic played vs Leicester, Matic played vs RB Leipzig when we lost, he also played vs Istanbul when we lost. Not sure why Fred has to take the blame here.
Pogba's biggest influences this season has been when he played in that front four anyway so if you want to make comparison then don't involve Fred in it. The key of Pogba in our front four is that we have much more balanced front four as we have 2 goal scorers (Cavani & Rashford) and 2 creators (Pogba & Bruno).
I agree. Hope he does as the team is looking on the up and up and we are more likely to win stuff with him then without.
I find it amazing that there are still people that want rid of him because of the media. He has never caused an issue and is a brilliant player.
Hoping we keep him along with our other better players and continue to build. He was magnificent in the second half against Tottenham.
Hoping we keep him along with our other better players and continue to build. He was magnificent in the second half against Tottenham.
No thanks I will involve him as I was not comparing their position as if they are the same player.
I was comparing performances and effect on major parts of the season and the subsequent treatment of each player by the fans.
How one is over defended and the other over criticised.
Would be a good case study.
What's clear to me is he is far better as a lhs playmaker than in our double pivot. We really need to strengthen the double pivot position players this off season.
Look at Fred's thread, he's been criticised a lot. You are making biased comparison. We lost 9x this season. And 6 of those loses were without Fred.
I never asked you for a game by game and you've never had any problems expressing your opinions quite vocally untill I asked a very simply question. How do you evaluate a player? Answering that would take a quarter of the time you've jus used up ranting.
What's sensitive about asking you why you hold an opinion? It's a forum for discussion and if you find it hard stating the rationale for your strong opinions don't blame the people who question you. Rather, question why you have strong opinions with no reasons.
Really? That's actually mad, go on Fred.
Yeah of course, he will want big wages to stay but I think he will realise that these are the peak years of his career, if he wants to win things we need to get the best from him.
I also believe we will see the best of him when we have a stronger DM in the side and further quality additions around him.
Ok let me see if I can simplify it for you, without needing to give any reason, can you name me the players in our squad you believe have been more than decent this season?
I think the next transfer window will be very telling. If we have a very good transfer window, I'm sure he will stay.
Adds a different dynamic to the team when he’s healthy and motivated. Hope we can get his contract renewed and keep him here for the next four/five years.
His best position is not on the left wing. His best attribute is that he can ping a ball from 50 years to create big chances from our own half (especially when Rashford is playing and makes those runs) and playing him on the wing takes that away from his play.
He can 100% perform from deep in a pivot like he always does with France and like he's done with us many times, but he needs to be given the license to push forward which I feel he only gets when we're chasing for a goal in the second half. If we had a better DM, say someone like Fabinho, he would be allowed to push forward a lot more and that would allow him to use his long passing as well as all his other strengths
He can 100% perform from deep in a pivot like he always does with France and like he's done with us many times, but he needs to be given the license to push forward which I feel he only gets when we're chasing for a goal in the second half. If we had a better DM, say someone like Fabinho, he would be allowed to push forward a lot more and that would allow him to use his long passing as well as all his other strengths
We play a double pivot with rotational 6/8 roles. Not a fixed 6 & 8 as you're suggesting. I agree with you in a fixed 6 & 8 but for now he's better for us as a more advanced play maker starting from the left, he has more freedom that way.
Here’s an even simpler point: most people don’t care enough to engage in some kind of point scoring game over Pogba. I think Pogba’s great. Whether someone else disagrees with that opinion doesn’t really bother me, and it definitely doesn’t motivate me to forensically examine his performances to prove my superior knowledge and evaluation. That’s pretty normal. If you think people are being evasive when taking that position, you’ve fallen down the rabbit hole.
One thing's for sure if signs a new contract, it will break our wage structure.
Sanchez level wages at around 400k/week, with a massive 20-30m signing on bonus for him and Raiola, probably a release clause if we miss CL as well.
This is the peak of his career, Raiola will have his pound of flesh.
Sanchez level wages at around 400k/week, with a massive 20-30m signing on bonus for him and Raiola, probably a release clause if we miss CL as well.
This is the peak of his career, Raiola will have his pound of flesh.
- Status