Curious to see if Chelsea will get into a similar situation as Bayern, where they have trouble finding managers of the required level due to those red flags.
Pochettino | Leaves Chelsea by mutual consent
- Thread starter Bastian
- Start date
I think the whole environment of the forum has unfortunately gone into extremes recently. You're either very very bad or very very good (myself included in doing that) and there's no middle ground. When in reality of all contexts you'd probably say Poch did alright, nothing more and nothing less.
Lampard next?
He is more than good enough. He is a top tier PL manager with a strong track record of getting his teams to perform better than the sum of its parts and he runs rings around Erik Ten Hag in the coaching department. If we hired him and not the clown Ten Hag (like we should have), we would be in a far better position right now. Chelsea are complete boneheads for firing him when he managed to get that team three points off 5th after the dumpster fire of a situation that the owners put him in. Ten Hag would have had that Chelsea squad fighting for relegation.
Pochettino is a good coach but he also has a loser mentality. I wouldn't mind him as a bridge head coach but that's about it.
What is this loser mentality you speak of?
4th apparently.
It's not remotely unexpected though, Poch himself was talking about leaving in the last few weeks.
He has the mentality of a loser.
Yep exactly this. They had a scattergun recruitment approach and still failed to address the depth of the striker situation. He had to gel all of the new players together in a coherent system and when he finally finds one and shows some form, they sack him. Any fan with a brain would have known that with the amount of signings they made it would take time and this season would be a sort of transition into the next.
So now that transition is over, can't Chelsea look for better options?. Bournemouth got lot of shit when they changed manager, looks at them now. Clubs should take the risk and different approach if they believe they can do better than their current manager just like they sign better players.
I preferred Poch over ETH two years ago, mainly because I thought he would be better at whipping the dressing room into shape. But Im not really sure whether he would be a good shout right now.
I think the aim is to move to a first team coach model, with an increasing amount of managerial responsibility devolved to other people in the club, a bit like Brighton do. However we're not there yet and the manager will have a fairly large responsibility for at least another season or two while new people and new systems get bedded in. Poch is the kind of manager that likes to be involved in everything, so I can see that it might work as an interim measure. But it may cause problems down the road.
I think the aim is to move to a first team coach model, with an increasing amount of managerial responsibility devolved to other people in the club, a bit like Brighton do. However we're not there yet and the manager will have a fairly large responsibility for at least another season or two while new people and new systems get bedded in. Poch is the kind of manager that likes to be involved in everything, so I can see that it might work as an interim measure. But it may cause problems down the road.
On a serious note, Pochettino has a loser mentality. He is one of the few actually good manager that goes around and complains about expectations being too high, claiming that trophies are for egos or being upset that his team is expected to win every game when he is managing a team that is the best in the league. On the latter people will make excuses for it but all big clubs expectation is to win every game they start, it's unlikely to happen but they treat every loss as a setback. Pochettino will try to water down any sort of ambition.
And the quotes a week ago from Postecoglou were interesting in that context because the issue that he had with some people within the club wouldn't have been an issue for Pochettino.
I don't disagree really, and I do think that Poch wasn't going to be the man to win them the title but also think another year of him wouldn't have been a bad approach either to keep that momentum. Rumours are though it's about him wanting more control over transfers so it makes sense to part ways because of that short term aura he has concerning his abilities to win stuff.
He is managing the best team in the League? are you referring to his stint with PSG?
On a serious note, Pochettino has a loser mentality. He is one of the few actually good manager that goes around and complains about expectations being too high, claiming that trophies are for egos or being upset that his team is expected to win every game when he is managing a team that is the best in the league. On the latter people will make excuses for it but all big clubs expectation is to win every game they start, it's unlikely to happen but they treat every loss as a setback. Pochettino will try to water down any sort of ambition.
And the quotes a week ago from Postecoglou were interesting in that context because the issue that he had with some people within the club wouldn't have been an issue for Pochettino.
If the part about transfers is real then it's easy decision for club. Unless manager proves to be elite and gains the trust of club, clubs shoulder bend over and sign players wanted by manager alone. Hope ManUtd are taking notes. We wasted so much money signing EtH players.
Also, yes one more year wouldn't have hurt them much but their overall season and Poch talking about how this is not his team and his general tone in PC meant the decision was made and they were waiting for season to be done.
Wasn't the transition finding a manager with a system which works which he has done at the second half of the season? This would then to structured recruitment in specific areas e.g striker and then onto the next season. Their structure of signing a bunch of players without thought will just ensure they are back to square one again.
For that sentence yes but the point is about his entire career, he has done it everywhere.
Chelsea the new Watford?
The squad wasn't built for Poch. They have signed bunch of very good talents and players. They have couple of holes but that's for their DoF to sort it out.
Next manager will have talented squad that he can work with. This new manager means again signing lot of players is just a ManUtd thing or very few clubs thing. They have signed players that most managers would love to work with.
I have to say, although I wasn’t his biggest fan at times, I think he did enough to merit giving him another year. Disappointed to see him leave so early, when things were just starting to click.
Pochettino’s sacking, alongside the rumours that the club are now focussing their search on a ‘young’ manager, suggests to me that the Board & Sporting Directors ultimately just want a yes man who won’t call out their BS in public.
I don’t think Pochettino will be out of work for long, and I wish him well in future (until he inevitably ends up back at Spurs at some point).
Pochettino’s sacking, alongside the rumours that the club are now focussing their search on a ‘young’ manager, suggests to me that the Board & Sporting Directors ultimately just want a yes man who won’t call out their BS in public.
I don’t think Pochettino will be out of work for long, and I wish him well in future (until he inevitably ends up back at Spurs at some point).
Was a bit surprised at the timing, did well to finish as high as they did given their first half of the season imo.
Maybe they can hire ETH?
Maybe they can hire ETH?
I have to disagree with you about their transfer policy, its been a scattergun approach with no thought process and signing a bunch of new players to make a starting 11 out of them.
It was scattergun approach or at least looked like it but now they have settled squad. They have built a new squad and I don't see them signing lot of players for Chelsea. Maybe few for their other clubs.
Whatever his attitude with the press, his teams play good football on the field. He gets them to play as a team.
I’d absolutely take him.
Chelsea have started looking ok at the tail end.
Honestly think we should have chosen him over ETH
Chelsea have started looking ok at the tail end.
Honestly think we should have chosen him over ETH
If we do bring back Amadeus!
I just thought to myself "I wouldn't mind Poch at Bayern", but then I remembered, that this would make Amadeus a regular in the Bundesliga/Bayern thread...
Don't look now, but Chelsea basically just had the exact same season United had last year, just with less individual talent
I'd take Pochettino in a heartbeat. I've even learned to spell his name now, I'm emotionally invested, get him in.
Like a lot of managers do, being a winner and instilling a winning mentality is crucial for top team's managers. Otherwise we may as well target the likes of Bosz, Gourcuff, Fonseca or Pimienta.
Brilliant stuff
On a serious note, Pochettino has a loser mentality.
If Nicolas Jackson and others could finish they would be top 4 without question, every time I watched them they would create a lot of opportunities, they were a bit open in the back line though
Fundamentally disagree. Poch is never going to challenge for major titles because he's just not good enough. I'd rather not waste time with him to only come to this conclusion later.
I genuinely don't think it's that difficult to prepare for City if you are willing to cede possession? I'm much more concerned with the fact that Poch actively seeks to create chaos and limit the control the team has. Games against City aren't what let you climb the table; Poch's tactical naivete hurt us consistently in second halves all year.
At one point we had a bench with 1 senior player on it and we were cancelling promising loans in January due to the need for depth. Neither of us had a bloated squad at all.
Winning mentality can't possibly just be that. When the players play to the best of their abilities and as a unit, its much easier to instill whatever mentality there is to instill. Manager can keep talking about winning and positive attitude but a day comes when CAF calls him deluded.
Poch brings a team together, improves them and puts the team in contention. Spurs fired him cause he wanted transfers, PSG stint can hardly be counted as they are expected to win the league, and now with chelsea he has turned a squad with low morale into a group of players challenging on all fronts. Too bad the season got over, or i am sure he would have made much more progress.
I'm ETH in, but in a case he gets sacked, I would want Poch to take over.
Not a good move this. Poch' was doing ok with a v v young, limited squad...of players not of his choosing.
Good luck to any manager taking that role. The club has gone mad.
Good luck to any manager taking that role. The club has gone mad.
If PSG doesn't count then you are talking about a manager that has won literally nothing and has literally stated that he doesn't care about winning stuffs because it is only for egos.
I don't even know why you are trying to debate against the man's own words and his own resume. As I said he is a good coach but he is also a loser, I have no issue with you wanting him but it won't change his mentality.
cheeky punt on Enzo Fernandez?
United finished 3rd, got into 2 cup finals and won 1. Chelsea scraped into Europe with a few games left, possibly only the Conference League, didn't challenge for anything all whilst being by far the biggest spenders.
You're right, exactly the same.