I you can't read and you can't add up maybe refrain from making silly claims until you can.
Smoking
- Thread starter Big Andy
- Start date
Not at the level they are now. I can only speak from personal experience but beer gardens weren’t that big a thing in Belfast. Now every bar in the city is a glorified outside space.
I didn’t. The cost to NHS is much less than the tax revenue. The facts prove you are wrong. You came in acting like a smart arse and got it horribly wrong. Pretending otherwise won’t make it true.
I personally see ‘beer’ gardens at a much higher level than they ever were before. Could be just my experience but they’re much more prevalent and busy than they were before the smoking ban. Every bar round here re-purposed their alleyways and have expanded and expanded since then.
When are people going to understand that prohibition doesn't work?
Another red flag against your coolness!
Anyone unlucky enough to be in A&E on a friday or saturday night will see absolutely loads of drunks there. Its a huge strain on the NHS and it's dangerous for night workers and other people trying to enjoy themselves.
You know once it's too late. My 16 year old self didnt give a feck.
i read that there's a soon-to-be-released blockchain vape, powered by AI, that is going to completely replace smoking anyway
No it's a different thing entirely. The former approach was introduce controls and disincentives on smokers within a legal framework, because being legal meant it could be regulated. That has worked. Now, the proposal is to control smoking by criminalising it, which has never worked. It is not a "logical next step", it's an entirely different category of thing.
It will give smugglers and criminals a new revenue stream and incentives to market and distribute cigarettes or similar to grow the market.
Even a cursory look at the various wars on drugs/alcohol will show what a provably stupid idea this is.
We don't even know whether it's working in NZ or not. Why not wait til we see what happens there first? You know, make an evidence based decision.
I'll drag you up to my level mate.
I don't really think a law like this is needed. Smoking is definitely less cool than it was and vaping is the new trend. I don't see many young people smoking at all anymore compared to those who vape.
I'm aware it's a different thing entirely. I also think it's a logical next step. Unlike alcohol and other illegal drugs, the incentives for people to take up/keep smoking are uniquely low. The only "high" is easing the withdrawal symptoms. So you're not banning something for which there will always be a strong demand.
See above. What if NZ decided to wait and see if it works somewhere else first? Somebody will always have to be an early adopter with policies like this.
Those two things are not the same. When something is legal, you can indeed, if you are so minded, reduce its impacts with a huge range of incentives and disincentives. When it's illegal, you can't.
Feel free to show me where I went wrong because I saw;
Tax receipts = £10bn
Cost to the country estimates = £12-17bn
Well it does, we prohibited lead from being used in paint
That was what you responded to. The cost to the country ignores the revenue it brings from people buying the product. The initial point was that tax revenue greatly exceeds the cost to the NHS. You said it was a myth. In the face of evidence you stick your fingers in your ears.
Sorry, the cost to the NHS is what number?
Did you read it or not? It says £2.4b with an additional £1.2b in social care costs.
Whats not the same? It's illegal to be drunk and disorderly in a public place.
If the smoking age was raised annually, anyone under that age smoking would also be breaking the law.
I'd also like to add anyone under that age caught with cigarettes ought to be fined £100. It'd be a good money spinner and act as a deterrent.
I'm sure the stats would correlate with this, but I'm still surprised by how many young people I see smoking. I used to work at a 6th form college, and now I work at a university, and it does feel like I see way more students smoking now than I did back when I was a student. They recently extended the smoking area by one of the cafeterias where I work, which I don't think I've ever seen happen anywhere.
In such a social environment, it's weird to me that people willingly want to make themselves smell that bad, when you're going to be in close vicinity and collaborating with others. I used to sit next to a smoker in an old job, and he would smell wretched after coming back inside from a cig break. I'd honestly rather sit next to someone who hasn't showered for a week, than sit next to a smoker.
I'm surprised by that. Most people I see now are vaping rather than smoking.
In the city, and out where I live, I do seem to see more vaping and less smoking overall, but on campus it flips. Probably worth noting that it's about 65% international students across the board where I work. So British youth are likely smoking less, but perhaps non-British youths aren't?
I also find it noticeable among tourists when I visit London. It feels like I'm in a minority of non-smokers when I'm there, particularly in tourist-heavy places like the southbank or Oxford Street.
Alcohol is legal so we are able manage its effects through law (not always very well but that's another story). Fining people for being drunk and disorderly is one of the ways we do that. Arresting people for drunk driving is another. Banning alcohol is another potential way we could do that, but we don't because it's dumb and doesn't work.
I appreciate it's a subtle argument for people who would prefer we gave the police more powers to smash in a few faces instead.
All the control freaks are out on this thread I see. My god, what a license for harassment that would be. Imagine being fined for being 34 and not 35 years old. Ludicrous.
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Since we actually have an early adopter in NZ, and therefore an evidence point, we should wait for that evidence unless you want to be accused of banning things because your gut instinct says it's a good idea, which is kind of the vibe I am getting here. I'd expect it from a Tory politician, but not rational people.
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Disgusting habit. I grew up in a two parent with a pack a day habit house. If you moved anything hanging on the wall like a picture, it looked like a golfer's tan, white behind the picture & a dark tan color as the dominant color (our walls were painted an eggshell color).
Can't count how many girls I didn't hook up with because they smoked. I would occassionally try to accommodate a smoking girlfriend to get off my high horse, but no relationship lasted more than a couple of months untiI bailed.
Can't count how many girls I didn't hook up with because they smoked. I would occassionally try to accommodate a smoking girlfriend to get off my high horse, but no relationship lasted more than a couple of months untiI bailed.
We shouldn’t deny kids the unrivalled feeling of looking incredibly cool smoking a rolly
vaping is lame, bring back real fags
vaping is lame, bring back real fags
We should totally ban stuff that you personally find disgusting and avoid hooking up with girls that you personally find distasteful.
So, not the verifiable negative impact to people's health?
Yes and grimmer for people actually trying to quit
I bet cigarettes will attain a near-mythical coolness not long after they are banned.
Teens gathering in basements all over the country to share three smokes they managed to get a hold of for £30.
Teens gathering in basements all over the country to share three smokes they managed to get a hold of for £30.
18 year old adults in the US
In 30 years time we will see documentaries of how the industry fooled everyone substituting vaping for cigarettes' making more profit and being as harmful while telling us that is less harmful. Like those documentaries from 20 years ago when tobacco companies in the 70 got doctors to say that smoking was even healthy
Where in my post did I mention banning?
There are already laws and penalties (including fines) in place for people partaking in anti-social behaviour under the influence of alcohol or not.
What do you define as anti-social behaviour that isn't being punished already though?
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Soon to be hugely restricted here as well. Importing banned in most circumstances except by pharmacies. Nicotine based vaping by prescription only. Disposable vapes banned.
Smoking?
Smoking?
