They are queuing to play for Jose?
So let's talk about Eddie Howe....
- Thread starter Wayne's World
- Start date
Well, save for currently 11 players on the pitch.
Ah yeah, just as long as he tries its alright isn't it
Howe and Moyes are the same, too big of a step up to manager a big club. The only managers that can instantly manage a top club without a proven record are top former players that instantly earn the respect of the players they are managing.
Realistically there's no chance of us appointing Howe unless he manages a bigger club than Bournemouth first, like Spurs or someone.Ah yeah, just as long as he tries its alright isn't it
Howe and Moyes are the same, too big of a step up to manager a big club. The only managers that can instantly manage a top club are top former players that instantly earn the respect of the players they are managing.
My point is that even if Moyes had done really well with a club like Spurs and actually earned his appointment here, his ideas on football would still have been ill-suited to United. The same wouldn't apply to Howe.
That's an important distinction given that many fans recognised that even someone with Mourinho's stature was a poor fit stylistically. By your logic all active managers bar a handful are the same as Moyes, which is silly. Some have qualities that others don't and Howe certainly has qualities that Moyes never did.
Meanwhile he probably thinks our players are a joke and wouldnt get into his Bournemouth side.
I think people are scared of another Moyes happening, but I'm not sure that's the case. Moyes never played exciting football at Everton, but Bournemouth play some really good stuff, and are very well drilled. I think the respect part is a bit overblown, we want young, hungry, talented players in the team anyway...
Howe to Spurs
Poch to Man Utd .
Poch to Man Utd .
Ah yeah, just as long as he tries its alright isn't it
Howe and Moyes are the same, too big of a step up to manager a big club. The only managers that can instantly manage a top club without a proven record are top former players that instantly earn the respect of the players they are managing.
Not even close. Also being a former top player doesn't matter that much. Howe would be an excellent appointment IMO.Didn't people say the same about David Moyes? "Chosen One" who got Everton competitive on a shoestring budget and stuffs...
The amount of snobbery is embarrassing and comparison to Moyes? Have you guys ever watched a Moyes team before he came to United?
Howe has done a better job regardless. Everton's base level was always a mid level PL team when Moyes took over. Bournemouth were a mid level team in league two when Howe first took over and have stabilised and progressed them to a mid level PL team, doing it while playing attractive football.
Howe has done a better job regardless. Everton's base level was always a mid level PL team when Moyes took over. Bournemouth were a mid level team in league two when Howe first took over and have stabilised and progressed them to a mid level PL team, doing it while playing attractive football.
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You seem to not understand context at all. Howe is a different manager from Moyes obviously, but its the same for a club like United. Both would not even be considered because they don't have he pedigree or quality for it. Howe can't organise a defense to save his life, which completely discounts him. Moyes is the other way round.
And that logic is perfectly fine, it makes perfect sense actually. The vast majority of managers are not fit to manage United. They need to be able to get the team to score lots of goals and concede very few goals.
If you want an up and coming manager take Poch who has shown competency in most areas of the game. It's quite easy for mid table managers to attack endlessly because they have nothing to lose from doing it. They are safe from relegation and have no chance overcoming the financial gap. It happens all the time and most of these managers don't make the step up.
One plays closer to Sam Allardyce, one plays closer to Pep
But Pep modelled his game on Allardyce's Bolton?
Lazy comparison solely because he's British. Their football style is completely different. Plus, Moyes took Everton from lower-midtable to upper-midtable, Howe took Bournemouth from League 2 to an entertaining mid table Premier League side. They aren't even remotely similar.
Based on the team setting up with an attacking ethos rather than a defensive one. When you aren't shopping in the supermarket of World's Best Players you have to make compromises somewhere. On the very rare occasions when he has sent us out to try and get a draw rather than a win they've actually done pretty well at keeping teams out. However, that isn't the way he approaches the game. I'm really having to reach to recall games when he has done that.
If you gave him a squad of players of significantly higher quality you would expect him to get more from them. In that case I would expect a much more solid base but keeping the attacking intent in place.
So when he was still approaching the matches the same way when we were right in the relegation mire last season how does that stack up?
If I'm honest, I'm very happy if your board dismiss him so readily. We'll keep him!
He went gun blazing on the first 20 minutes and hoped to score 2 or 3-0 but once they got only 1 and the team got tired it was one way forward for us. Bournemouth struggled to keep the same intensity for the whole 90 minutes which he should have predicted. Could have played it more smartly, but he's surely a good manager and good prospect. However, still needs lots of learning before getting a top job.
It is not normal and it is not quite easy. Mid-table teams take every chance they get to close down a game. They are usually in danger of going down towards the relegation zone and it's not like mid-table teams don't harbour the ambition of advancing higher up the table.
Your logic does not make sense imo. In football, there's everything to lose when you are ahead. You need to win games before you get to midtable. It's not like there's any team that starts a season in, and is guaranteed to finish in midtable. Closing down wins or going for more goals when winning depends on the manager. City don't keep attacking because they are midtable and have nothing to lose, but because Pep sees it as the best chance to close the game. It's the same with Howe. He doesn't have players as superior, so it backfires at times.
Despite Howe being severely handicapped, his team play as, if not more positive football than Poch's team.
His team concedes more because he doesn't have the players and he doesn't play defensive football like every other coach in his position would do.
Howe is class and plays football very similar to that of top modern managers.
Moyes took a mid table team to upper mid table. Poch, from top six to top six. Howe, from bottom League one to top League one, to top Championship, to top 10 EPL with limited funds. Give him a good EPL team and you'd expect him to move them to the top of the EPL. There's little to zero comparison between Moyes, Howe and Poch.
Howe have the better history of taking a team to another level. Poch should be the one compared to Moyes if anything.
It can’t be underestimated how good a job this bloke has done at Bournemouth.
I mean, they’re still playing Simon fecking Francis at right back and win matches playing tidy football. The biggest question mark surrounding Howe is actually his transfer record. They win in spite of it.
I mean, they’re still playing Simon fecking Francis at right back and win matches playing tidy football. The biggest question mark surrounding Howe is actually his transfer record. They win in spite of it.
Half their regular 11 was with them in league one, Francis, Cook, Daniels, Surman, Pugh (although he only plays cups).
They are very well coached. Don't see why they can't go for 7th if europa goes down that low.
Is the job Howe is doing at Bournemouth that much difference to Poch at Southampton? He had more top level experience from his playing days but I dunno Spurs took the punt and right club right time clearly.
I think Pochettino is a better manager. Better in the transfer window too. But yeah Howe is doing a great job at Bournemouth.
Excellent point.
And every manager who is excelling at mid level clubs isn't Moyes btw. I know we've been permanently scarred by that 9 months, but let's have some perspective people!
I do think his level of coaching/style of football would translate much better at a top level club than someone like Dyche who has more basic gameplan.
Just plumps to who would take a chance on him. Chelsea never appointed a British manager as Abramovich simply dosen't rate them, Arsenal are also firmly established in the continental route. Maybe Liverpool after Klopp? They tend to give managers time and did plump for Rodgers in similar circumstances who struggled at the end but nearly won Liverpool the league.
Worth remembering if he did come into Man. United in near future he'd be joining a club who've reguarly been finishing 4th-7th since 2013 so little bit difference to Moyes coming in and following Fergie.
Just plumps to who would take a chance on him. Chelsea never appointed a British manager as Abramovich simply dosen't rate them, Arsenal are also firmly established in the continental route. Maybe Liverpool after Klopp? They tend to give managers time and did plump for Rodgers in similar circumstances who struggled at the end but nearly won Liverpool the league.
Worth remembering if he did come into Man. United in near future he'd be joining a club who've reguarly been finishing 4th-7th since 2013 so little bit difference to Moyes coming in and following Fergie.
Ok not all his signings worked out, but getting in Wilson, Ake, Cook and Brooks (all very talented players) suggests he does indeed have a good eye! They are all top eight players if not better imo
Yep as a wise Portuguse man once said, "this is football HERITAGE"
Excellent system coach
Problem with comparing him to Moyes, Moyes had peaked 2? Years before, when Everton were actually playing some decent stuff and had made the CL. We appointed him on the downward slope. Similar to LVG and possibly Jose as well.
It makes me laugh when people say Howe is poor in the transfer market. It's like judging Alex Ferguson's record on Bebe and Veron. Considering the improvements made in the squad and the money spent, relative to the market at the time, his record is actually rather good.
As a comparison to today I looked for our nearest corresponding fixture when we first came up to the PL.
Team on 1st November 2015:
Federici
Daniels
Distin
Francis
A Smith
Pugh
Gosling
Surman
Ritchie
Arter
Murray
Subs:
MacDonald
King
Kermorgant
Stanislas
Allsop
Tomlin
Cargill
Team today:
Begovic
Francis
S Cook
Aké
A Smith
Stanislas
L Cook
Lerma
Fraser
Brooks
Wilson
Subs
Boruc
Gosling
Surman
Mousset
Ibe
Daniels
Defoe
Even allowing for the fact that the first team would have included Boruc, Wilson and Gradel if they weren't out injured in 2015 and today would have included King for the same reason that's massive progression of the squad.
Our bench might still be significantly weaker than yours but surely that's to be expected? Never mind the improvements in the first eleven, the subs are also a huge step up from before.
It's worthy of note that of the 16 today, Howe signed every player apart from Francis, S Cook and Daniels. So he can't be all that bad!
As a comparison to today I looked for our nearest corresponding fixture when we first came up to the PL.
Team on 1st November 2015:
Federici
Daniels
Distin
Francis
A Smith
Pugh
Gosling
Surman
Ritchie
Arter
Murray
Subs:
MacDonald
King
Kermorgant
Stanislas
Allsop
Tomlin
Cargill
Team today:
Begovic
Francis
S Cook
Aké
A Smith
Stanislas
L Cook
Lerma
Fraser
Brooks
Wilson
Subs
Boruc
Gosling
Surman
Mousset
Ibe
Daniels
Defoe
Even allowing for the fact that the first team would have included Boruc, Wilson and Gradel if they weren't out injured in 2015 and today would have included King for the same reason that's massive progression of the squad.
Our bench might still be significantly weaker than yours but surely that's to be expected? Never mind the improvements in the first eleven, the subs are also a huge step up from before.
It's worthy of note that of the 16 today, Howe signed every player apart from Francis, S Cook and Daniels. So he can't be all that bad!
His team are great on the eye and his youthful enthusiasm is really cool but I just can't shake the feeling that he's at his proper level already.
Think it's more Bournemouth have a settled way of playing so some of the signings do seem a bit overpriced when that player can't settle into the gameplan.
They signed Brad Smith from Liverpool for 8m, he played about 5 games and now I think he's on loan in Australia.
Rico is left back they signed from Levante for 18m and didn't make the squad today after playing midweek so seems like he's struggling to adapt (although Robertson was the same this time last year at Liverpool).
Ibe came for decent amount from Liverpool and just a squad player for them. Tyrone Mings also came for a fair bit and another who struggles to make their squad although he did get injuries.
Lerma and Brooks look good for them though and that's example of expensive signings that do lift the first 11 in quality.
AFAIK no manager has 100% record in the transfer market.
They signed Brad Smith from Liverpool for 8m, he played about 5 games and now I think he's on loan in Australia.
Rico is left back they signed from Levante for 18m and didn't make the squad today after playing midweek so seems like he's struggling to adapt (although Robertson was the same this time last year at Liverpool).
Ibe came for decent amount from Liverpool and just a squad player for them. Tyrone Mings also came for a fair bit and another who struggles to make their squad although he did get injuries.
Lerma and Brooks look good for them though and that's example of expensive signings that do lift the first 11 in quality.
AFAIK no manager has 100% record in the transfer market.
Brad Smith was 3m potentially rising to 6m (https://www.skysports.com/football/...ournemouth-sign-Liverpool-defender-brad-smith). Safe to say those clauses were never activated! It was a punt but with PL tv money 3m isn't that big a punt. They won't always come off and he certainly didn't and is now on loan to the MLS.
Rico was around 10m not 18m (https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/44931851) and has only been here a few months. I like what I see in some aspects of his game but others need working on to adjust to the English game. One reason why he isn't in the side at the moment but we'll see on that front in time. Way to early to call it anything but a recent signing.
Ibe is the millstone that often gets referenced. His first season was so bad I don't even want to think about it. Last season he actually started to show something, really started growing into the team and was behind a lot of our good forward play that year. I was expecting him to start the season in the first 11 and was hoping he could continue to make progress but unfortunately for him in our last preseason friendly we totally smashed Marseille. Howe then gave the same 11 players that tore them to shreds the chance to start the season. That team included Brooks in Ibe's place and fair to say Ibe is well down the pecking order now as Brooks has been a revelation. I'm not sure where that leaves Ibe but I think his career with us may have a problem. However, as you say not everyone has 100% record.
Mings was signed as LB and did his cruciate within 15 mins of his debut. He has never played left back since and has instead been moved to a central role. Makes me think there is some lingering damage now stopping him from twisting and turning in the same way anymore. Anyway, since he came back from injury his spot in the team has been blocked by Ake who has pretty consistently been our best player since he signed so I can't see him breaking through until Ake moves on. From the little we've seen he actually looks pretty good, it's just a combination of bad injuries and bad luck that have stopped him having a proper chance. I don't think there are any AFCB fans out there unhappy that he is in the squad though. Definitely looks decent!
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Eddie Howe isn't going to move north of the M4.
Two good posts @Will Dance For Chocolate.
This is a bit of a sniff test assessment but I have a feeling it's been Howe's 'under the radar' signings that have really improved you guys as a squad as much as the bigger names. Although, Ake has been great.
This is a bit of a sniff test assessment but I have a feeling it's been Howe's 'under the radar' signings that have really improved you guys as a squad as much as the bigger names. Although, Ake has been great.
True
He's got 'Next Spurs Manager' written all over him when Poch decides to move onto bigger and better things.
He'll join Spurs after we lure Poch to OT. It's practically etched in stone.
He's done an incredible job for Bournemouth. His players give him 101% every single week.
I would take eddie howe over poch. Fans seem to overrate poch a lot. He is a big game bottler, eddie howe may not have experience managing big clubs but his style of play is better than pochetino.
I don't see a risk in getting him here a head coach. We would need to find a clear playing philosophy and style. A director of football who knows that type of players that would fit into this style. Not always superstars, but solid cogs who can play attacking football.
When Fergie was manager, we had a manager who ran everything. His was more of a mindset rather than style of football. The mindset was to win at all costs and build on success. He added a personal touch with everyone at the club. Like a godfather.
We've been trying to replicate this with Moyes, LVG and Mourinho.
The reality is that we might get another Sir Alex Ferguson or Matt Busby one day. But it's also unlikely. This is why we need to stop relying on a saviour and start taking risks and doing things that no other clubs would dare. That's what made us great.
If we could just solidify what we want from a playing style at the club from top to bottom, we can then start hiring coaches to implement that style. We would have happier players, because they are coming to play a particularly exciting style. What we have right now is a pedantic, defensive coach with an outdated style which frustrates players.
Look at Barcelona
It's not like they are hiring someone based on their experience.
Pep in 2008 would be seen as a risk on the Caf in 2008. Mourinho auditioned with PowerPoint for the role. But they thought he didn't fit the Barcelona way.
Tito was a risk. He was just an assistant manager to Pep. Ed would never have dared go with him.
Martino was not that well known. He's the only truly unsuccessful one.
Luis Enrique was a risk. But he still fitted a particular style. Won a European Cup. We would never have taken a risk of that level.
Velverde was a slight risk. Mourinho or Conte would have been "safer" options. But he seems to delivering now.
It's all down to Barcelona having an identity. This is what City is trying build. That's why their players didn't have an issue adapting Pellegrini to Pep. Same with Arsenal. Despite struggling replicate his form between 1997-2004, one thing Wenger did leave was a style of play.
Ajax has this as well. This makes it easier to promote players more seamlessly from the youth teams as well.
I love Eddie Howe's style of play, his approach to players and the way he coaches them. I also love Jardim's approach and style. Or Poch.
All of these managers bring air of positivity. Play good football.
We need to be going for these coaches and building a philosophy which can seamlessly replace players and coaches without hiccups.
I think Ed Howe would fit like a glove if we can just get the DOF.
When Fergie was manager, we had a manager who ran everything. His was more of a mindset rather than style of football. The mindset was to win at all costs and build on success. He added a personal touch with everyone at the club. Like a godfather.
We've been trying to replicate this with Moyes, LVG and Mourinho.
The reality is that we might get another Sir Alex Ferguson or Matt Busby one day. But it's also unlikely. This is why we need to stop relying on a saviour and start taking risks and doing things that no other clubs would dare. That's what made us great.
If we could just solidify what we want from a playing style at the club from top to bottom, we can then start hiring coaches to implement that style. We would have happier players, because they are coming to play a particularly exciting style. What we have right now is a pedantic, defensive coach with an outdated style which frustrates players.
Look at Barcelona
It's not like they are hiring someone based on their experience.
Pep in 2008 would be seen as a risk on the Caf in 2008. Mourinho auditioned with PowerPoint for the role. But they thought he didn't fit the Barcelona way.
Tito was a risk. He was just an assistant manager to Pep. Ed would never have dared go with him.
Martino was not that well known. He's the only truly unsuccessful one.
Luis Enrique was a risk. But he still fitted a particular style. Won a European Cup. We would never have taken a risk of that level.
Velverde was a slight risk. Mourinho or Conte would have been "safer" options. But he seems to delivering now.
It's all down to Barcelona having an identity. This is what City is trying build. That's why their players didn't have an issue adapting Pellegrini to Pep. Same with Arsenal. Despite struggling replicate his form between 1997-2004, one thing Wenger did leave was a style of play.
Ajax has this as well. This makes it easier to promote players more seamlessly from the youth teams as well.
I love Eddie Howe's style of play, his approach to players and the way he coaches them. I also love Jardim's approach and style. Or Poch.
All of these managers bring air of positivity. Play good football.
We need to be going for these coaches and building a philosophy which can seamlessly replace players and coaches without hiccups.
I think Ed Howe would fit like a glove if we can just get the DOF.
Cheers for correcting the fees, didn't realise we had a Bournemouth fan on here. I was also going to mention Lewis Cook, another who took a season to fully establish himself in the team. People were calling for him to get an England call up when he wasn't even starting for you guys, do you think he's good enough for that level now he is a regular starter?
Young and they play good football but he has full stability at Bournemouth. If he leaves his comfort zone and does well elsewhere then he could be a possibility.
He's one of those players who if he was at Arsenal or similar would be a fixture in the England set-up. At times he just oozes class, the reverse pass today to set the ball down the line to be crossed in for us to score was a good example. Not many English midfielders woulds spot that or nail it perfectly. He can also be really good on the ball in tight situations and can glide past players when he's on it. However, there are also times when he can drift out of a game. Today again being an example, he was barely visible in the second half until he was subbed.
I'll be honest, most of my life I've been watching L1 football so can't call myself an expert on watching England internationals in the making but from what I can see he seems to have all the attributes you'd need to make an impact at that level. He just needs to put them together more consistently but that's nothing unusual at his age. I would hope Southgate can see the player that he could be and want him around the set-up in the same way similar players at bigger clubs are given that chance.
In the summer I said that if him and Ake repeat their performances of last season for this season then next summer they'll both be off somewhere for rather large sums of money.