Shaw lacks the attacking ability to play as a wingback. Which is going to prove a real problem for us.
So the 3-5-2
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) was joined by comedian Ali Woods to look back at the best and worst moments of a rollercoaster season with the annual United Hour Awards.
Has Ten Hag been sacked yet? We're not sure and we hope not, but it's looking more likely as the days pass.
Who should replace him and why is it taking so long to make a decision?
Or may be he was in his first match in a new system, lets give him pre season atleast.
To pay £30m for him and then to convert him into a centre back is such a complete waste, I really wonder why he gave the go ahead for this signing, I'm just hoping that he has watched him enough.
Even at Southampton he's never looked anything other than average going forward, his strength in his defence, I've rarely seen a better one on one defender than him, especially not at his age.
It's not from one match. Shaw isn't the Ashley Cole type fullback. He's more similar to our very own Gary Neville that he is reliable defensively and decent going forward.
I think 3-5-2 would suit Rafael because he is more attack orientated.
Hopefully. The thing with Shaw is that it's his defensive solidity which has impressed us all. Ashley Cole was never the very best going forward, it was his consistency in his defending that made him so good, so reliable. Shaw is cut from the same cloth, and I'd hate to see him struggle in a formation that was never really intended to suit his strengths.
If playing with wingbacks was an idea Van Gaal thought was a realistic one for united, I can't see why he approved the Shaw signing tbh.
If we do play this then Rafael would certainly be a better fit on the right then Valencia. Rafael does have better technique as well when Valencia looked a little out of his depth.
Hope the United support will be patient with Shaw. He is still a boy and like with De Gea we will have to accept that he makes mistakes in the first 2-3 seasons. He is going to be our left back for over a decade if we are patient!
if we're going to play it we really do need to buy another center back, or maybe two.
Still, I won't overblow things because of a good performance against a pretty poor team.
Still, I won't overblow things because of a good performance against a pretty poor team.
Why would it be a waste if he turns out to be a great centre back?
Was it a waste to turn Thierry Henry from a winger into a striker or Paul Scholes from a striker into a midfielder?
I'm not a huge fan of the formation myself, don't think it encourages the most expansive of football, at least not with our personnel.
If we indeed had to play it, then Welbeck must be one of the two strikers.
If we indeed had to play it, then Welbeck must be one of the two strikers.
Ashley Cole was very good going forward. I thought Chelsea ruined his attacking instincts. But he was brilliant attacking wise at Arsenal.
I can't believe we let Evra and even Buttner go and play a formation that would have suited them more than Shaw.
How so?
Do I really need to spell it out? You don't make someone the most expensive teenager of all time, to not play him in the position and role he's already proven himself to be great at. You go out and buy an established fecking center half with that fee instead. Henry cost £11m and wasn't already established as great in a position. Scholes was a youth team product.
Van Gaal is our coach and with his belief in youth i'm confident i'll oust you out of the 10 position.
So he looked average in a friendly and now people are not sure why van Gaal signed him.
Only on the cafe.
He is going to be a tremendous player.
Only on the cafe.
He is going to be a tremendous player.
Also when did either arsenal or Chelsea ever play him as a wingback?
Yeah, no. If you bothered reading just a few posts up, you'd see what you've posted is utter shite but yeah carry on.
Nobody said anything about average. I just don't feel he is attacking enough to be a wingback.
We going to get a lot of games where teams park the bus and our wing backs will be important in those games.
No one is saying he isn't a great left back because he already is. It's just that people are rightfully questioning if he has ever shown the attacking attributes to be a left wing back.
Well, you could see how well it worked for Holland in the WC, and while we did trash LA last night, one match is not really enough to make an informed opinion. As far as i am concerned, it relies on two key points.
1. Wingbacks being very tactical sound. They need to know when to bomb forward, and when to stay back. Pretty much any team who plays fullbacks and wingers will have outnumber us on the flanks, so it's important to have wingebacks who know how to defend in this system.
2. Central defenders who know how to play in a threesome instead of in pairs. Also they need to be comfortable on the ball as well and pick a pass instead of hoofing it up.
Also, three at the back is a very flexible formation and gives you a great deal of freedom higher up the pitch. You can pack the middle with 3-5-2, play with aggressive wingers in a 3-4-3 formation and so on. My biggest concern right now, is that we are short on central defenders for this particular formation. With both Vidic and Ferdinand out the doors, it just leaves Smalling, Jones and Evans as players with real experience.
IMO the "best" squad we could have for this formation right now is:
--------------------DDG-------------------
----Smalling-------Evans----------Jones---
-------------------------------------------
Rafael-----Carrick-----Herrera--------Shaw
-----------------Mata--------------------
-------------RvP-------Rooney------------
Not to shabby looking, but we haven't really seen Rooney/RvP set the PL at fire as a striker partnership, so the jury is still out on this one. Also, it leaves little room for Kagawa/Januzaj
1. Wingbacks being very tactical sound. They need to know when to bomb forward, and when to stay back. Pretty much any team who plays fullbacks and wingers will have outnumber us on the flanks, so it's important to have wingebacks who know how to defend in this system.
2. Central defenders who know how to play in a threesome instead of in pairs. Also they need to be comfortable on the ball as well and pick a pass instead of hoofing it up.
Also, three at the back is a very flexible formation and gives you a great deal of freedom higher up the pitch. You can pack the middle with 3-5-2, play with aggressive wingers in a 3-4-3 formation and so on. My biggest concern right now, is that we are short on central defenders for this particular formation. With both Vidic and Ferdinand out the doors, it just leaves Smalling, Jones and Evans as players with real experience.
IMO the "best" squad we could have for this formation right now is:
--------------------DDG-------------------
----Smalling-------Evans----------Jones---
-------------------------------------------
Rafael-----Carrick-----Herrera--------Shaw
-----------------Mata--------------------
-------------RvP-------Rooney------------
Not to shabby looking, but we haven't really seen Rooney/RvP set the PL at fire as a striker partnership, so the jury is still out on this one. Also, it leaves little room for Kagawa/Januzaj
Shaw is very good going forward, he just needs a bit of time to settle in the system.
He was, but I think Cole will be remembered more for his defending than his attacking. I don't think he'd have been all that successful as a wing back. Perhaps more so than Shaw though, I take your point.
He really really isn't "very good", he's average at best. What he is very good at though is his defending.
But Evra/Buttner would suit a wingback?
They would be a nightmare, an absolute nightmare as wingbacks, Evra could barely get back into a defensive position as a full back.
Rafael won't be playing in it!
So where is Evra playing at Juve?
Average at best is a euphemism for poor, which isn't what I'd call him Re his attacking. His final ball wasn't great when I saw him for Southampton, but his touch in attacking areas, his engine for going up and and down and most importantly his willingness to push forward were all fine. I'm relaxed that his final ball will improve as he develops and I think the other parts to his game were perfectly fine.
Actually, yes it is based on the first friendly only. We still have so many players missing who haven't joined preseason. And others out injured as well.
The longer term picture might change as more players return to the fold and LvG decides which transfers he wants in place. This will affect the final outcome.
What comments did he say, anyway?
No issue with the formation really, but we only have what three CB. All of which spend large periods of the season normally on the treatment table. Hardly ideal and I wouldn’t be comfortable having to rely on one of the kids or fletcher/carrick stepping into that role on a consistent basis. So to play the three at the back, we will really have to either role the dice on our youth or bring in at least two CB in my mind.
not to mention our distinct lack of LWB
not to mention our distinct lack of LWB
That 3-4-3 will be our first choice this season, with 4-3-3 as a backup plan.
The lack of pace in a front 3 of Mata, Rooney and van Persie is a slight concern for me. At least with either Welbeck or Hernandez there's more of a threat in behind. We'll see though.
Oh, he actually said that in a press conference?
Officially declare the 3-4-3 /4-3-3 as our formation?
If that is true, then I apologize as I have been ignorant and busy at work today.
To be honest that's a problem whether we play 4-4-2 or 4-3-3 with Mata joining them up front. A trio of Mata-Rvp-Rooney in attacking areas has certain qualities, but pace isn't one.
1 more top class defender needed, and 1 more top class midfielder.
We still need to change the formation every now and then to give Januzaj and Kagawa some gametme.
We still need to change the formation every now and then to give Januzaj and Kagawa some gametme.
Robben.
Yes.Oh, he actually said that in a press conference?
Officially declare the 3-4-3/4-3-3as our formation?
Might do well there for them in a slow paced Italian game.
In the PL I think he would struggle and had to be replaced anyway.
Guess we'll never know.
That doesn't make any sense. With 3 CB's they'd have less defensive responsibilities and Evra already played as advanced as possible in the back-four. They would both be better, if played as wing-backs in Van Gaal's 3-4-1-2.