Solskjaer's legacy and his future

Kag

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This is rewriting history.

He himself rejected advice from his own coaching staff to not sign Ronaldo.
Ronaldo was a club signing made by the suits. A self-congratulatory dick measuring contest in which we could wheel out Ferguson and wallow in our pre-determined greatness.

Ole will have been happy with the signing, I’m sure, but I’m willing to bet he’d have wanted a defensive midfielder or two a whole lot more.
 

Giggsy13

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If you call us Ole inner, who base our opinion on facts rather then feelings, then you should call yourself Ole haters.

We came second because we were better then Liverpool last year in Premier League. Not hard to understand.
You must have been so excited to hang up that “we finished ahead of Liverpool 2020/21” plaque last season. Gutted it didn’t work out this season though when they had their strongest players back from injuries.
 

Bondi77

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Ronaldo was a club signing made by the suits. A self-congratulatory dick measuring contest in which we could wheel out Ferguson and wallow in our pre-determined greatness.

Ole will have been happy with the signing, I’m sure, but I’m willing to bet he’d have wanted a defensive midfielder or two a whole lot more.
Ole actually said that after the arrival of Sancho and Varane that he had strengthened the parts of his squad that he wanted to and anything else was a bonus. I don't think he would have said that if he wanted a DM in that window and I reckon he was hoping his existing midfield would come good but they are simply not up to it.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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Ronaldo was a club signing made by the suits. A self-congratulatory dick measuring contest in which we could wheel out Ferguson and wallow in our pre-determined greatness.

Ole will have been happy with the signing, I’m sure, but I’m willing to bet he’d have wanted a defensive midfielder or two a whole lot more.
Ole wanted the signing too.

To say otherwise reeks of delusion.
 

devilish

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Ole did a reasonable job for a good period of time. It all came crashing down, and he had to go in the end, but we let him down in the market last summer in pursuit of vanity and money-making.

He was also working miracles from a player management point of view. I never bought into the downing tools narratives in the past. I honestly thought the players put in the graft in spite of the managers we had. But this lot… pathetic and spineless and now have nowhere to hide.

The players must have fecking loved Ole. Whipping boy.
That's rewriting history. First of all Ole/Murtough built this side. They spent over 400m into this mess so they should take responsibility of it. Secondly Varane/Ronaldo signings were SAF's former targets/recommendations which goes in line to a big chunk of all signings made by Ole. Pellistri was Forlan's recommendation, James was Giggsie's, VDB was VDS's reccomendation etc.
 

Bobcat

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These are just more excuses to absolve him.

No manager here was let down by players. It's unreal how some of you choose to absolve the manager of anything like they're a deity.

They all failed.

Moyes failed.

Van Gaal failed.

Jose failed.

Ole failed.
Not mutually exclusive though. Considering the quotes from McTominay and Lindgard it's clear we have massive issues at the club besides the managers

The fabled rebuild never gets completed because the squad is irrelevant if the culture stinks
 

90 + 5min

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That is true, but Ole should have kicked them up the ass and if that sidnt work get shut of the troublemakers. He kept Lingard when he could have sold him to WHU. By coddling them and renewing some contracts he gave them carte blanche to do as they please. Thats why it all gradually come unstuck.
I agree that he should have kicked out couple of players.

You must have been so excited to hang up that “we finished ahead of Liverpool 2020/21” plaque last season. Gutted it didn’t work out this season though when they had their strongest players back from injuries.
I was excited for this season because of the progress we made previous sessions. This season it all fell apart. We should not be ashamed for coming 2nd last season. We deserved that.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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Not mutually exclusive though. Considering the quotes from McTominay and Lindgard it's clear we have massive issues at the club besides the managers

The fabled rebuild never gets completed because the squad is irrelevant if the culture stinks
The managers played their part in ensuring the culture stinks.

The players can be blamed, but the manager is more to blame for a poor culture.

Especially ones that were given more time/money to shape the squad.
 

Avero

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That’s such a lazy question, reminiscent of Priti Patel asking if others have better options and, like the other user said, especially difficult to remember who was available at the time.

I do seem to remember Nagelsmann and Rose were available at the time. But frankly you could have thrown a dart at a board with pictures of available managers and landed on a better option.
Again, I have no idea who was available at the time or what they were doing. The type of manager I would have liked would have been in the progressive, modern manager mould. So someone of ETH's ilk. Maybe someome like Marco Rose or Nagelsmann, though I'm not sure what they were doing at the time.

It's been sickening watching the likes of Liverpool and City play really progressive brands of successful football, while we have gone for managers with no real style whatsoever. LvG was the closest we got to a manager who had a clear tactical identity, but that didn't work out. Funnily enough, he allegedly wanted Mane and VVD while both were at Southampton, so interesting had he gotten both.
Nagelsmann was 31 years old and in his first managing job at Hoffenheim at that point, I don't think you wanted him that badly at the time. Rose also pretty much had his first managing job.

My point is that it's very easy to look back and criticize decision made in the past, and I don't really like people who criticize and don't offer any options or opinions themselves other than the criticism.

The dressing room was extremely toxic and Ole as interim manager was what the club needed at the time. It is also understandable that he was given a full time contract based on the massive interim success and amazing atmosphere when the decision was made.

Some quotes from Wikipedia:
"Solskjær's first match was against his former club, Cardiff City, on 22 December 2018, with United finishing as 5–1 winners. This was the first time United had scored five or more goals in a Premier League game since a 5–5 draw with West Bromwich Albion in Ferguson's final game in charge before his retirement in May 2013. Victories in his next four league games made Solskjær the first Manchester United manager to win his first five league games in charge since Sir Matt Busby in 1946."

"Solskjær's successful first full month as Manchester United manager resulted in him being named as the Premier League Manager of the Month for January 2019, during which time his team earned 10 points from a possible 12 in the league, making him the first Manchester United manager to win the award since Ferguson in October 2012."

"Two consecutive away wins in the league against Leicester City and Fulham gave United six consecutive away victories in all competitions for the first time since May 2009, and sent them into the top four of the league table."

"Having picked up 25 points since taking over, Solskjær earned more points than any other manager has managed in his first nine games in charge of a single club in the Premier League."

"A 3–1 win at Crystal Palace on 28 February 2019 set a club record of eight consecutive away victories in all competitions."

It's time to look forward. As we all know, there are a lot of rotten apples in the squad. We have now signed an interesting up and coming manager and the summer transfer window will be extremely important.
 

Bobcat

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The managers played their part in ensuring the culture stinks.

The players can be blamed, but the manager is more to blame for a poor culture.

Especially ones that were given more time/money to shape the squad.
A football club is a huge organization and while managers matter a lot he's just one man. We've turned into a poison chalice

Unless we get rid of all the bad apples we won't go anywhere and will continue to burn through managers until no one wants to touch us
 

Lecland07

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One thing he doesn't get criticised for is his love of old players:

Varane - 28
Ighalo - 30
Cavani - 33
Ronaldo - 36
Heaton - 35
Telles - 28
Maguire - 28
Grant - 36

That is 8/14 signings of age 28 and over.

2 of those signings were nothing but youth players (Pellistri and Amad), meaning he only brought 4 players in that were meant to be integrated into the first team and also serve as long term. Those being Wan Bissaka, Sancho, De Beek, and Fernandes.

Average age of striker signings was 33
 

Kag

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Ole wanted the signing too.

To say otherwise reeks of delusion.
Signing Ronaldo wasn’t part of the plan, was it?

I don’t mind him being back here either.

Ole had a hand in recruitment, but the whole structure was (and probably still is) set up to fail. That’s clear now.
 

Slysi17

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It was lazy before Solskjaer came. He did make them play better for 2 years before they went back to how they were before him. Why do you think players stopped playing for Mourinho? Because he started to call them out. It is on players. Not managers.
So Ole made no mistakes. He never gave the bench players any chances and kept picking players who were playing rubbish. Also made Harry Maguire captain. Those decisions turned out well didn't they. What a fecking stupid opinion. Ole is not fully to blame but is culpable.
 

elmo

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I agree that he should have kicked out couple of players.


I was excited for this season because of the progress we made previous sessions. This season it all fell apart. We should not be ashamed for coming 2nd last season. We deserved that.
What progress? The football was getting worse, we started scoring lesser and conceded more goals the longer Ole's reign went on. No matter how people spin it, that's not progress.
 

90 + 5min

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So Ole made no mistakes. He never gave the bench players any chances and kept picking players who were playing rubbish. Also made Harry Maguire captain. Those decisions turned out well didn't they. What a fecking stupid opinion. Ole is not fully to blame but is culpable.
Now show me where I have said that Solskjaer never did anything wrong?
 

stevoc

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One thing he doesn't get criticised for is his love of old players:

Varane - 28
Ighalo - 30
Cavani - 33
Ronaldo - 36
Heaton - 35
Telles - 28
Maguire - 28
Grant - 36

That is 8/14 signings of age 28 and over.


2 of those signings were nothing but youth players (Pellistri and Amad), meaning he only brought 4 players in that were meant to be integrated into the first team and also serve as long term. Those being Wan Bissaka, Sancho, De Beek, and Fernandes.

Average age of striker signings was 33
Maguire and Telles were 26 and 27 respectively when they were signed.

And Mourinho signed Grant.
 

90 + 5min

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You said it is on the players. Not the manager. That's pretty much absolving Ole from any blame.
Of course the mess is on players. For every day it goes it shows. That doesn’t mean Solskjaer did everything right or how I should have done.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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Signing Ronaldo wasn’t part of the plan, was it?

I don’t mind him being back here either.

Ole had a hand in recruitment, but the whole structure was (and probably still is) set up to fail. That’s clear now.
Well once he was available, they planned on bringing him in.
 

Slysi17

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Of course the mess is on players. For every day it goes it shows. That doesn’t mean Solskjaer did everything right or how I should have done.
Then how is Ole not partly to blame when he did things wrong. The players are self entitled twats and deserve alot of the blame. Your argument is not making sense. Your are essentially absolving Ole from blame.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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A football club is a huge organization and while managers matter a lot he's just one man. We've turned into a poison chalice

Unless we get rid of all the bad apples we won't go anywhere and will continue to burn through managers until no one wants to touch us
This seems to imply that we ruin managers though.

What have our ex-managers amounted to since being sacked? Absolutely nothing. They were all hired at the wrong time(or never should have been) and proceeded to show their levels of incompetence in 1 way or another.
 

Jericholyte2

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Nagelsmann was 31 years old and in his first managing job at Hoffenheim at that point, I don't think you wanted him that badly at the time. Rose also pretty much had his first managing job.

My point is that it's very easy to look back and criticize decision made in the past, and I don't really like people who criticize and don't offer any options or opinions themselves other than the criticism.

The dressing room was extremely toxic and Ole as interim manager was what the club needed at the time. It is also understandable that he was given a full time contract based on the massive interim success and amazing atmosphere when the decision was made.

Some quotes from Wikipedia:
"Solskjær's first match was against his former club, Cardiff City, on 22 December 2018, with United finishing as 5–1 winners. This was the first time United had scored five or more goals in a Premier League game since a 5–5 draw with West Bromwich Albion in Ferguson's final game in charge before his retirement in May 2013. Victories in his next four league games made Solskjær the first Manchester United manager to win his first five league games in charge since Sir Matt Busby in 1946."

"Solskjær's successful first full month as Manchester United manager resulted in him being named as the Premier League Manager of the Month for January 2019, during which time his team earned 10 points from a possible 12 in the league, making him the first Manchester United manager to win the award since Ferguson in October 2012."

"Two consecutive away wins in the league against Leicester City and Fulham gave United six consecutive away victories in all competitions for the first time since May 2009, and sent them into the top four of the league table."

"Having picked up 25 points since taking over, Solskjær earned more points than any other manager has managed in his first nine games in charge of a single club in the Premier League."

"A 3–1 win at Crystal Palace on 28 February 2019 set a club record of eight consecutive away victories in all competitions."

It's time to look forward. As we all know, there are a lot of rotten apples in the squad. We have now signed an interesting up and coming manager and the summer transfer window will be extremely important.
Yes his caretaker period was good, we played some great attacking football. But even that slowed down as soon as the PSG game happened and we’d limped on ever since. Let’s not forget the embarrassment that was the 4-0 defeat to Everton after he signed his new contract, when Ole famously mentioned that many who played wouldn’t still be with the club.

If you want to define a 3.5yr tenure by the first three months then go ahead, but for a manager going on about a cultural reset, about doing things ‘the United way’ his signings averaged out at about 27yrs old and the way the team played quickly stagnated even within his first year!

Yes we need to move on and look forward but the first stage of looking forward is acknowledging that there was a problem in the past.
 

Robbie Boy

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Nagelsmann was 31 years old and in his first managing job at Hoffenheim at that point, I don't think you wanted him that badly at the time. Rose also pretty much had his first managing job.

My point is that it's very easy to look back and criticize decision made in the past, and I don't really like people who criticize and don't offer any options or opinions themselves other than the criticism.

The dressing room was extremely toxic and Ole as interim manager was what the club needed at the time. It is also understandable that he was given a full time contract based on the massive interim success and amazing atmosphere when the decision was made.

Some quotes from Wikipedia:
"Solskjær's first match was against his former club, Cardiff City, on 22 December 2018, with United finishing as 5–1 winners. This was the first time United had scored five or more goals in a Premier League game since a 5–5 draw with West Bromwich Albion in Ferguson's final game in charge before his retirement in May 2013. Victories in his next four league games made Solskjær the first Manchester United manager to win his first five league games in charge since Sir Matt Busby in 1946."

"Solskjær's successful first full month as Manchester United manager resulted in him being named as the Premier League Manager of the Month for January 2019, during which time his team earned 10 points from a possible 12 in the league, making him the first Manchester United manager to win the award since Ferguson in October 2012."

"Two consecutive away wins in the league against Leicester City and Fulham gave United six consecutive away victories in all competitions for the first time since May 2009, and sent them into the top four of the league table."

"Having picked up 25 points since taking over, Solskjær earned more points than any other manager has managed in his first nine games in charge of a single club in the Premier League."

"A 3–1 win at Crystal Palace on 28 February 2019 set a club record of eight consecutive away victories in all competitions."

It's time to look forward. As we all know, there are a lot of rotten apples in the squad. We have now signed an interesting up and coming manager and the summer transfer window will be extremely important.
I said in that kind of mould tbf. Ole had a great interim period as I've previously alluded to. It all felt great but still never felt anything more than he galvanised a broken squad and got a fantastic 'new manager bounce'. The football never looked particularly sophisticated or like we could maintain it, and that was a problem. By the time he got the full time gig, our performances and results had badly drifted. I remember that watching us was becoming a-bit of a chore again.

At the end of the day, the club took the lazy way out by appointing Ole as permanent manager. The talk back then was of a thorough interview processes to identify a suitable candidate, and promises of structural changes. It's basically what we're doing now; 3-years later than promised. Part of the fun-factor of Ole's interim period was the promises of huge changes within the club at the end of his tenure. If the club really thought that an ex-Cardiff and Molde manager was the right choice to preside over a rebuild project, with the aim of toppling Pep and Klopp, then fml.

Nobody is saying his interim period wasn't fantastic; but history has shown that giving the permanent gig to an under-qualified interim after a good new manager bounce, won't end well. A-lot of fans at the time were looking forward to a modern, progressive manager taking the reigns after Ole, and it was clear that Ole wasn't that man. There's a reason why a-lot of fans felt extremely underwhelmed by the time he was made permanent manager, and it was because that new bounce had worn off and he had shown his limitations. It was obvious to anyone that he wasn't good enough, and that's why we looked pretty clueless from then, until Bruno came in.

Sure, he tried his best or whatever but he was never going to be remotely good enough. He probably exceeded what I thought he could do, but my standards under him were admittedly rock bottom. The best I could do was cling onto any minor positive, because it was always obvious that he wasn't taking us anywhere. Yes, we need to move on, and we all need to admit that he was a massive failure like every other post-Fergie appointment. We can also critisise the mistakes the club made by appointing him. The club have thankfully admitted their mistakes - internally, at least - as we are finally making those positve structural changes and due diligence was taken when appointing Ole's successor. Poch would have been the choice in days gone by; so appointing ETH shows a positive shift by thr club. Had all this been done 3-years ago as promised - while Ole was an interim - I'm pretty confident that the club would be in a much better place both on and off the field.
 

Kush

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Not one of those players was needed as much as we needed a central midfield. Dreadful recruitment and now we need about seven players.

Recruitment is more than the manager alone. It’s structural failure (and yes, Ole is partly culpable for that).

He got sacked. Get over it.
Ronaldo was a club signing made by the suits. A self-congratulatory dick measuring contest in which we could wheel out Ferguson and wallow in our pre-determined greatness.

Ole will have been happy with the signing, I’m sure, but I’m willing to bet he’d have wanted a defensive midfielder or two a whole lot more.
You're just re-writing history and conjuring narratives out of thin air. Defensive midfielder wasn't a high priority for Ole as it was for you or other fans, or he'd have spent some of it in his £400m spree. He's repeatedly mentioned he liked the duo of Fred/McTominay and rest of his midfield options.

Pretending club betrayed him by not giving him the DM he was so desperate for, only to force Ronaldo on him is utterly laughable. And, goes against everything he's said on his own. Ole had no idea about squad building, and wasted 3 years and a lot of money here. No decent club is touching him with a barge pole, which says everything.
 

Foxbatt

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I said that Ole is not good enough elite coach but the players stabbed him in the back too. This bunch of players can play much better than they played in the last few games under him. There was a lack of effort and the lack of pride and fight. You put them 11 players and even without a coach they should have been able to beat some of the teams that beat us.
 

RiqCantona

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Think that Ole was too weak to deal with the shit show that has gone on behind the scenes. All this didn't happen in one day. He didn't have the guts to challenge the players and lay down the law. He also never questioned the board. That's probably why he got the sack. The players stopped listening to him - the same players who are now turning out to be the problem.

I think he was afraid of losing his job and wanted to play it safe. The only person that comes to mind is Greenwood when he dropped him for a length of time. He was just too 'nice". He was just happy to be manager of United.
 

SmashedHombre

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We'd have more points if he'd stayed. But we also probably would have never taken the knife to this squad, which we desperately need.
 

Foxbatt

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We'd have more points if he'd stayed. But we also probably would have never taken the knife to this squad, which we desperately need.
Why should we? We were in free fall when he got sacked. We still would have lost Martial, DVB and Greenwood and Cavani. Rashford was still sulking when Ole was sacked.
 

SAFMUTD

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We'd have more points if he'd stayed. But we also probably would have never taken the knife to this squad, which we desperately need.
Would we? We've won 33 points in 20 games with Rangnick. We won 21 points in 14 games with Ole. We have actually got more points per game with Rangnick than with Ole this season.
 

RopersReturn

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As much as I liked Ole as a player and in interviews he made a dreadful manager.
Despite signing Sancho, Fernandes & Varane, there were as many disappointing signings in Telles,AWB and Ighalo (remember him?)
But his legacy will always be that he bought Maguire for £80m, then awarded him the captaincy, that was an unforgivable error of judgment.
 

United_98

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Sorry I don't agree, he bought United to a decent position
Ole let down by the board, but he really do everything he can

3rd + 3 semi
2nd + Europa League 2nd + Semi

The only wrong-doing is that he didn't make a sub in Europa League final.

Signing Ronaldo is not wrong, as we are not going to sign anyone anyway.
Remember we even sign Ighalo? That show something wrong with us, we focus on romance, the story... more than building a team

Everything is pointing to the board, I guess...
 

fergiewherearethou

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Think that Ole was too weak to deal with the shit show that has gone on behind the scenes. All this didn't happen in one day. He didn't have the guts to challenge the players and lay down the law. He also never questioned the board. That's probably why he got the sack. The players stopped listening to him - the same players who are now turning out to be the problem.

I think he was afraid of losing his job and wanted to play it safe. The only person that comes to mind is Greenwood when he dropped him for a length of time. He was just too 'nice". He was just happy to be manager of United.
The reason why he was kept for so long was because he was always mister "nice guy". Maybe that's his character or maybe he knew he will never get a job like that if he fails. After all that was his dream job, he loved Utd and still does, he is a true Utd fan and would have done anything to succeed here. The reality is that he was never good enough to be a successful manager.
 

Foxbatt

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Eventually someone is going to write a book and we will know what happened.
 

BlueHaze

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His signings have all been abyssmal apart from Bruno and Ronaldo but many even argue these 2 were bad too. The worst part for me is the £130m on Maguire and AWB. They are both 2 incredibly limited players. Telles for me is also an outright flop. I cannot believe he was here for so long and ignored the midfield but that was probably for the better because he'd sign trash there as well.
 

BlueHaze

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Sorry I don't agree, he bought United to a decent position
Ole let down by the board, but he really do everything he can

3rd + 3 semi
2nd + Europa League 2nd + Semi

The only wrong-doing is that he didn't make a sub in Europa League final.

Signing Ronaldo is not wrong, as we are not going to sign anyone anyway.
Remember we even sign Ighalo? That show something wrong with us, we focus on romance, the story... more than building a team

Everything is pointing to the board, I guess...
Let down by the board you say. He was the most backed manager in the transfer market post SAF.
 

Dante

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You must have been so excited to hang up that “we finished ahead of Liverpool 2020/21” plaque last season. Gutted it didn’t work out this season though when they had their strongest players back from injuries.
Yes. So should anyone who claims to be a Manchester United fan.
 

Bebestation

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I wonder where Xavi's legacy may be after his managerial stint :rolleyes: