thebelfastboy
Full Member
no doubt its fergie at his mind games, trying to push rio that extra 5%......
Thank you sir.Good post and I agree with almost all of it. Stam undoubtedly had a more taxing role than Vidic does, and I'd probably still rate him higher than Vidic, but by a razor thin margin. Stam was the best reactive (if that word even makes sense) defender I've ever seen. An incredible athlete with rdiculously good timing and bravery in the tackle. The more I see of Vidic though the more I think that he's got an edge in positional sense and possibly organisational skills, independent of him having better players alongside him or more favourable team tactics for a defender to excel in.
I can't argue with that.Very true!
But had Stam played for United in the last couple of seasons, I dont see us missing out the European cup. In the treble season after a jittery start, he was easily the most influential player at United after Roy Keane.
He is the best header of the ball in the world for my money.I Love Vida, for me he is as good or better than anyone in the air, I've spent full games just focusing on his aerial skills, wonderful aerial ability - think thats why ther Rio/Vida partnership works so well - Vida great with the ball in the air, Rio great with the ball on the floor.
As for Stam I Agree with Fergie, probably the best defender we have had under SAF, awesome tackler - Vidic is sometimes a little clumsy in the challenge.
If Rio improves any further, he might actually just explode.no doubt its fergie at his mind games, trying to push rio that extra 5%......
good old fergie, as predictable as a drunken scotsman going past a chippyFergie didnt say stam was the best outright...he just said he's never worked with better....there is a difference and fergie always gives himself these loopholes.
Wouldnt surprise me a few months down the line if he says rio's the best defender he's worked with. But he's just trying to make the point of how good stam was in my opinion.
Its certainly close between them
Erm, is he? Pique/Evans they are defenders that are learning their trade. Vidic is a world class defender.I don't think it's entirely fair to Nemanja to compare him with Stam just yet.
We haven't seen 15's best yet. Once we have then comparisons can be made. He's still learning his trade.
I think if you asked Vidic his opinion, he'd say he's still learning. That's what sets world-class defenders apart from the rest, they are tireless workers seeking to perfect their art. Nemanja's best is yet to come I believe.Erm, is he? Pique/Evans they are defenders that are learning their trade. Vidic is a world class defender.
Of course - Everyone can improve and Vidic will also continue to improve but his performances over the last 3 years have already shown him to be a world-class defender. There is no denying this.I think if you asked Vidic his opinion, he'd say he's still learning. That's what sets world-class defenders apart from the rest, they are tireless workers seeking to perfect their art. Nemanja's best is yet to come I believe.
he is "world class", but can still improve......Vidic was arguably our best player in the Champions League final. He has shown he is already world class.
Problem with the term "World Class", similar to "Legend" is that it is used too frequently. It one of those phrases that people band about too loosely. Both have been around longer than "football manager 1995" but the problem is it's just all just subjective.he is "world class", but can still improve......
by the way, where did that term originate (world class)??? football manger 1995 or something? its the most clueless description of a players talent ever imo
Stam was a lot of things, but a leader he was not. And I think his tactical nous and positional sense was found wanting on several occasions. Vidic is brilliant in that respect.I don't think Vidic could lead a back line in the way Stam did. And many seem to be forgetting that Stam had it all - pace, power, strength, awareness.
Crazy Berg?Come on now, you try playing in a back four with an aging Irwin, an error prone Silvestre, a raw and error prone Brown, an oft-injured Johnsen, that crazy Berg, and many others SAF had to use next to Stam before and after his injury. He never had that dependable partner Vidic has with Rio. The only constant was Gary and even he had his mental lapses back in the day.
The current back four is about as constant as a club could wish for.
That is a good point.Most of you are wearing rose tinted specs when it comes to Stam. He was a good CB with great physical presence and amazing pace for a big man. Once the pace diminished his limitations were brutally exposed and selling him for big bucks was a good decision.
Vidic is the perfect partner for Rio who is probably the best CB in the world at the moment. What more do you want?
You've said the same thing four or five times in this threadStam was better than Vidic. The latter still has nother level or two to go before he can be compared.
wordThat is a good point.
I'm sorry but why does everyone seem to think Vidic doesn't have good positioning and reading of the game? His positional game is awesome, for a guy who can get outpaced by most forwards they rarely ever get past him because his positional play is so spot on. People seem to think that all he does is head things out the way and knock strikers over. The guy can do it all, his passing is also underrated imo.Stam and Vidic and two similar yet different prospects. Stam's reading of the game and positioning was much better than Vidic's. Stam was no real threat from corners and the such (didn't he only score one goal?) but as an out an out defender Stam was more like Ferdinand than Vidic, in my opinion.
Adding to that i think that Stam Vidic would be a terrifying prospect for any attack.
It's probably because he's playing alongside the world's best defender!I'm sorry but why does everyone seem to think Vidic doesn't have good positioning and reading of the game? His positional game is awesome, for a guy who can get outpaced by most forwards they rarely ever get past him because his positional play is so spot on. People seem to think that all he does is head things out the way and knock strikers over. The guy can do it all, his passing is also underrated imo.
In our last game against Portsmouth, a physically brutal fixture, Vidic was miles better than Rio. He won EVERYTHING in the air and his positioning as always was exceptional. IMO without a doubt we need Vidic more in these fixtures. It's Rios biggest weakness and in the pre-Vida days we really struggled.It isn't close. Stam was a dominant stabilising force in the defence. In the Vidic-Ferdinand relationship Ferdinand I argue is the dominant force. Vidic is a great player - there is nothing wrong with him - but you wouldn't claim he is the best defender in the world just yet. You could claim that Stam was!
That's the difference.
Because I still can not believe people are discussing this.You've said the same thing four or five times in this thread
When we sold him he's pace had not deminished one iota and was still there at Lazio durring he's first season.Most of you are wearing rose tinted specs when it comes to Stam. He was a good CB with great physical presence and amazing pace for a big man. Once the pace diminished his limitations were brutally exposed and selling him for big bucks was a good decision.
Yes Rio and Vidic complement each other perfectly because even as awesome as Rio is Vidic makes up for he's deficiencies in the air and concentration wise whilst he's no non-sense approach is perfect for Rio stylish but risky approach.Vidic is the perfect partner for Rio who is probably the best CB in the world at the moment. What more do you want?
Rio in turn makes up for Vidic's lack of pace and the fact that Vidic is not a natural football(technical ability wise).
However Stam is a better defender individually than Vidic maybe not by a such margin as is being suggested in this thread, but certainly he is and for much the same reasons that Rio is individually a better defender than vidic.
Stam had pace, was terrific in the air and had positioning just as good as vidic. There were no obvious flaws in Stams game where as Vidic obviously has one major flaw which is he's lack of pace.
Rio's ability in the air is just unreal. It's not even close to being a weakness.In our last game against Portsmouth, a physically brutal fixture, Vidic was miles better than Rio. He won EVERYTHING in the air and his positioning as always was exceptional. IMO without a doubt we need Vidic more in these fixtures. It's Rios biggest weakness and in the pre-Vida days we really struggled.
Its not unreal. If its unreal how would you describe that of Vidic's game? Rio's game is prone to cracks when faced with physically tough away games. Before Vidic came along, as a united supporter, you almost feared those games. Away at Middlesborough or Pompey for example. Our defence would lose a lot in the air letting teams have a right go at us. Thats changed now. We're no longer bullied. Because unlike Rio, Vidic cant be bullied. Not saying hes the better defender, but in this respect he is.Rio's ability in the air is just unreal. It's not even close to being a weakness.
He's not, though. I bet you didn't watch McGrath live, but he was better. . .and I'd say Rio's better than both.Stam is the greatest ever defender ever to have player for United.