Holt's got a dodgy chin so I'll go Bradley by KO.
The RedCafe Boxing Thread
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Maybe if Khan shagged Frank's wife he'd put him in with Valero. Other than that not a chance. Incidentally, the guy who put up that stream switched to "Moms Turned Nymphos" after. If I didn't want to watch the Holt-Bradley fight I'd probably never log off that stream.
I'd turned off before that came on.These rounds are tough to score. I have it 4-3 to Bradley after seven, with points even due to Bradley's heavy knockdown in Round 1.
Bradley suffers another knockdown in round 12, but hears the final bell. I have it 114-112 to Holt.
EDIT - Official scorecards - 114-112, 115-111 and 115-111 all to Bradley!!
Wow, not sure about that scoring!
In fairness there were a number of very close rounds, and I gave more of them to Holt than Bradley. I think Bradley deserved the win as Holt's work-rate was poor but the knockdowns should have given Holt a close points win imo.
Bradley unifies WBC and WBO belts anyway. A good night of boxing.
EDIT - Official scorecards - 114-112, 115-111 and 115-111 all to Bradley!!
Wow, not sure about that scoring!
In fairness there were a number of very close rounds, and I gave more of them to Holt than Bradley. I think Bradley deserved the win as Holt's work-rate was poor but the knockdowns should have given Holt a close points win imo.
Bradley unifies WBC and WBO belts anyway. A good night of boxing.
I didn't score it round by round but 115-111 to Bradley seemed a bit off given the knockdowns. Glad he won it though as I can't stand Holt. Great talent but shit attitude and application.
Valero is a good powerful puncher but in terms of boxing good timing should be able to counter this as he looks like he can be out boxed as well as hit (he goes very square when throwing)
Bradley did well to get up from that hammering hook and I aint a massive fan of Holt, he has a rather big mouth so im rather pleased with how that fight turned out
Bradley did well to get up from that hammering hook and I aint a massive fan of Holt, he has a rather big mouth so im rather pleased with how that fight turned out
Valero hangs his chin out too much for my liking but flaws like that can be corrected. I think he'll be a monster. He reminds me a bit of a younger Pacquaio, only he's got a better range of punches and possibly hits even harder than Manny. Remains to be seen if he can iron out his flaws like Manny did though, and its hard to know at this stage if he'll wind up as another Manny or a bit of a flash in the pan like Freitas turned out to be. My gut instinct says he'll be a great.
Im not so confident I think Manny's main problem was how he went off balance when throwing and his reluctance to use his other hand but leaving your chin out to dry is the worst thing you can do lol Im the worst at doing it and many a morning i have woken up unable to open my mouth because I have been caught a few times in sparring.
In his defence he knows how to finish a fight but I am not taken in by him, a fighter like Juanma Lopez also has paralysing power but can box as well
I'm a sucker for punchers and brawlers so you could well be right. Reading various articles from journalists that have followed his career, most of them seem to think his fundamentals are far better than he's shown in recent fights. He wouldn't be the first big puncher to have fallen in love with his power. It might take a few big knockdowns or even a loss to make him tighten up his defence, if he's got it in him at all. I do think learning to tuck his chin should be easier than Manny overhauling his footwork and balance though. I'd have JMM as favourite if they were to fight now, but at the same time if he caught Marquez as frequently as Juan Diaz did when they fought it could easily be a blowout. He's just an unknown quantity at this point I guess.
Thats true but Marquez chin is under rated he rarely gets hit and is in la la land he might get hit or floored but always gets his head together and gets back to business.
Tucking your chin would be easier to learn but the lesson of learning is 10 times more costly. We are yet to see how good his chin or defence (apart from keeping his chin down) too. Like you said unknown quantity. I dont want to seem like im writing him off but he just doesnt appeal to me kayo artist or not
Tucking your chin would be easier to learn but the lesson of learning is 10 times more costly. We are yet to see how good his chin or defence (apart from keeping his chin down) too. Like you said unknown quantity. I dont want to seem like im writing him off but he just doesnt appeal to me kayo artist or not
So he gets his wish. What you reckon to that then?
Looks like a winnable fight for him. I'm not a fan but it would be good to see a British superfight between him and Hatton at light-welter in the future. With Hatton crushing him.
He said Kotelnik is the worst title holder on setanta a few months ago and that he could beat him so lets see how he fairs
edit:
edit:
I think its's a good choice of opponent from Warren and Khan. Kotelnik is a smart, technically good boxer but doesn't possess knock out power and I reckon Khan's speed in particular will see him run out a fairly comfortable winner on points.
You'd think he would then make a mandatory defence of his title before possibly attempting to unify a couple of belts against someone like Bradley. Do that and he'll have legitimised himself as a boxer in the eyes of the British public and a fight against Hatton then becomes an extremely lucrative proposition for both men.
It will be interesting to see if the extra five pounds in weight helps his punch resistance. It certainly wouldn't be the first time that such a move has done that.
thats what everyone is saying unifiy with bradly. i think he needs to face some mandatories, for some reason i can see him facing witter also. I would love for him to succed at the weight but from nowhere the light welter division is becoming uber competitive. If he faces vicious Victor Ortiz for instance who is fresh but fairly ranked by the alphabets i can forsee bad things.
just got my second opponent for an april 30th bout a 32 year old guy, should be interesting
just got my second opponent for an april 30th bout a 32 year old guy, should be interesting
fecking hell thats irrepairable damage right there
The Ledgers
Paul Williams
Age: 27
Title: WBO Interim Junior Middleweight
Height: 6’1
Hails from: Aiken, South Carolina
Record: 36-1, 27 KO
Record in Title Fights: 3-1, 2 KO
Previous Titles: WBO Welterweight (2007-08; 2008, 0 Defenses)
Current/Former World Champions/Titlists Defeated: 3 (Antonio Margarito, Carlos Quintana, Verno Phillips)
Vs.
Ronald “Winky" Wright
Age: 37
Title: None
Height: 5’10 ½
Hails from: St. Petersburg, Florida
Record: 51-4-1, 25 KO
Record in Title Fights: 11-4-1, 3 KO
Previous Titles: WBO Jr. Middleweight (1996-98, 3 Defenses; IBF Jr. Middleweight 2001-04, 5 Defenses; Lineal World/WBC/WBA/IBF Jr. Middleweight, 2004-05, 1 Defense)
Current/Former World Champions/Titlists Defeated/Drawn: 6 (Bronco McKart, Keith Mullings, Shane Mosley, Felix Trinidad, Jermain Taylor (Draw), Ike Quartey)
Current/Former World Champions/Titlists Faced in Defeat: 4 (Julio Cesar Vasquez, Harry Simon, Fernando Vargas, Bernard Hopkins)
Pre-Fight Grades
Speed: Williams A-; Wright B+
Power: Williams B; Wright B-
Defense: Williams B-; Wright A
Intangibles: Williams B+; Wright B+
The lack of fights from Wright since his July 2007 loss to Hopkins makes this a difficult fight to forecast. Williams, even with a close decision loss to Carlos Quintana, has been as hot as any fighter in Boxing since capturing a decision over Antonio Margarito in August 2007. The Quintana loss was erased in a single round and, bouncing between Welterweight, Jr. Middleweight, and Middleweight, Williams has emerged on many an educated list of the sports best overall fighters.
In his last bout, the test of the dependable and proven veteran was passed. Williams stopped Verno Phillips for the first time in a generation. Wright is a different category of fighter. This isn’t a dependable veteran; it’s one of the better fighters in the middle weight classes over the last decade. While his last outing featured a fade down the stretch, the fade came against Hopkins and, no matter how long it’s been since, a Hopkins loss being a last previous appearance can’t be seen as too big a setback.
Just shy of two years off from the ring could be. Williams has exceptional speed given his height and long limbs and gets his punches off in rapid succession. If he establishes his jab, he’ll get off before Wright. The jab is an 'if' though; Williams often sacrifices his size advantage and goes to the inside, overly committed to his offense. Wright could use his aggression to shake off the rust in the early rounds, popping his southpaw right jab and circling, forcing Williams to constantly reset.
The fight is unlikely to come down to power punching but if it does it should favor Williams. As a volume puncher, Williams doesn’t always leverage his blows but has proven he can. In the Quintana rematch, he seemed to have a mid-ring epiphany, realizing he could get his man out of there if he just slowed down a step. Against Wright, even a more patient approach is highly unlikely to produce a first round knockdown but it could force Wright to wonder why he came back after such a long layoff.
Williams can’t be too patient if he is at all. Wright, with a high, tight guard which picks off shots to the head with gloves and to the body with wisely placed elbows, isn’t going to be an easy target. Against Phillips, Williams went to the body with authority and needs to be similarly effective with Wright. The length of his arms will allow him to come around the guard of Wright and test a 37-year old pair of legs.
In terms of intangibles, each fighter has positives to point to. Williams didn’t just pass tests against Phillips or in the Quintana rematch. After a slowly developed career which began in 2000, Williams emerged as a potential superstar against Margarito and did so by showing the ability to accelerate with his back to the wall. He bounded to an early lead only to face the gut check of a hard charging (and hard handed…take that however) veteran. In round eleven, Williams looked ready to go only to suck it up and command the final frame to pull out the victory. He falls short of an “A” because the first Quintana fight showed that he can still be outsmarted against a fighter whose experience and physical tools are applied effectively.
Wright has shown a number of looks over the years. He got off the floor five times against Vasquez in his first fight and never quit. He used his biggest platforms, against Mosley (the first time) and Trinidad to stamp himself on his times as more than just a rumor of highest quality. However, he has also shown the ability to snatch victory from himself. Against Simon, Vargas, Taylor and Hopkins, early advantages became losses in the closing rounds as aggressive opponents found a decelerating Wright in front of them. Having not competed since 2007, and with Williams the pre-supposed star of the future, Wright cannot afford a letdown if he is position to win after the first eight or so rounds this weekend.
The Pick
There is a reason Williams is presupposed as a star of the future. His size and speed are rare qualities in the middle classes. It doesn’t mean Wright will be easy. A long layoff can provide rust but, for a 37 year old fighter, it can also mean rest. We’ve seen too many examples recently of old men fighting young to count Wright out and he’ll show up with his career on the line. After all, lose and while there will be those who want to fight him for name value, what network will want to invest? It’s not like Wright has been a consistent thriller.
Ultimately, youth should prevail this weekend. Wright just won’t be able to match the pace Williams sets and Williams appears to have learned his lessons about southpaws against Quintana. It will be close, but Williams should edge this one by decision.
Paul Williams
Age: 27
Title: WBO Interim Junior Middleweight
Height: 6’1
Hails from: Aiken, South Carolina
Record: 36-1, 27 KO
Record in Title Fights: 3-1, 2 KO
Previous Titles: WBO Welterweight (2007-08; 2008, 0 Defenses)
Current/Former World Champions/Titlists Defeated: 3 (Antonio Margarito, Carlos Quintana, Verno Phillips)
Vs.
Ronald “Winky" Wright
Age: 37
Title: None
Height: 5’10 ½
Hails from: St. Petersburg, Florida
Record: 51-4-1, 25 KO
Record in Title Fights: 11-4-1, 3 KO
Previous Titles: WBO Jr. Middleweight (1996-98, 3 Defenses; IBF Jr. Middleweight 2001-04, 5 Defenses; Lineal World/WBC/WBA/IBF Jr. Middleweight, 2004-05, 1 Defense)
Current/Former World Champions/Titlists Defeated/Drawn: 6 (Bronco McKart, Keith Mullings, Shane Mosley, Felix Trinidad, Jermain Taylor (Draw), Ike Quartey)
Current/Former World Champions/Titlists Faced in Defeat: 4 (Julio Cesar Vasquez, Harry Simon, Fernando Vargas, Bernard Hopkins)
Pre-Fight Grades
Speed: Williams A-; Wright B+
Power: Williams B; Wright B-
Defense: Williams B-; Wright A
Intangibles: Williams B+; Wright B+
The lack of fights from Wright since his July 2007 loss to Hopkins makes this a difficult fight to forecast. Williams, even with a close decision loss to Carlos Quintana, has been as hot as any fighter in Boxing since capturing a decision over Antonio Margarito in August 2007. The Quintana loss was erased in a single round and, bouncing between Welterweight, Jr. Middleweight, and Middleweight, Williams has emerged on many an educated list of the sports best overall fighters.
In his last bout, the test of the dependable and proven veteran was passed. Williams stopped Verno Phillips for the first time in a generation. Wright is a different category of fighter. This isn’t a dependable veteran; it’s one of the better fighters in the middle weight classes over the last decade. While his last outing featured a fade down the stretch, the fade came against Hopkins and, no matter how long it’s been since, a Hopkins loss being a last previous appearance can’t be seen as too big a setback.
Just shy of two years off from the ring could be. Williams has exceptional speed given his height and long limbs and gets his punches off in rapid succession. If he establishes his jab, he’ll get off before Wright. The jab is an 'if' though; Williams often sacrifices his size advantage and goes to the inside, overly committed to his offense. Wright could use his aggression to shake off the rust in the early rounds, popping his southpaw right jab and circling, forcing Williams to constantly reset.
The fight is unlikely to come down to power punching but if it does it should favor Williams. As a volume puncher, Williams doesn’t always leverage his blows but has proven he can. In the Quintana rematch, he seemed to have a mid-ring epiphany, realizing he could get his man out of there if he just slowed down a step. Against Wright, even a more patient approach is highly unlikely to produce a first round knockdown but it could force Wright to wonder why he came back after such a long layoff.
Williams can’t be too patient if he is at all. Wright, with a high, tight guard which picks off shots to the head with gloves and to the body with wisely placed elbows, isn’t going to be an easy target. Against Phillips, Williams went to the body with authority and needs to be similarly effective with Wright. The length of his arms will allow him to come around the guard of Wright and test a 37-year old pair of legs.
In terms of intangibles, each fighter has positives to point to. Williams didn’t just pass tests against Phillips or in the Quintana rematch. After a slowly developed career which began in 2000, Williams emerged as a potential superstar against Margarito and did so by showing the ability to accelerate with his back to the wall. He bounded to an early lead only to face the gut check of a hard charging (and hard handed…take that however) veteran. In round eleven, Williams looked ready to go only to suck it up and command the final frame to pull out the victory. He falls short of an “A” because the first Quintana fight showed that he can still be outsmarted against a fighter whose experience and physical tools are applied effectively.
Wright has shown a number of looks over the years. He got off the floor five times against Vasquez in his first fight and never quit. He used his biggest platforms, against Mosley (the first time) and Trinidad to stamp himself on his times as more than just a rumor of highest quality. However, he has also shown the ability to snatch victory from himself. Against Simon, Vargas, Taylor and Hopkins, early advantages became losses in the closing rounds as aggressive opponents found a decelerating Wright in front of them. Having not competed since 2007, and with Williams the pre-supposed star of the future, Wright cannot afford a letdown if he is position to win after the first eight or so rounds this weekend.
The Pick
There is a reason Williams is presupposed as a star of the future. His size and speed are rare qualities in the middle classes. It doesn’t mean Wright will be easy. A long layoff can provide rust but, for a 37 year old fighter, it can also mean rest. We’ve seen too many examples recently of old men fighting young to count Wright out and he’ll show up with his career on the line. After all, lose and while there will be those who want to fight him for name value, what network will want to invest? It’s not like Wright has been a consistent thriller.
Ultimately, youth should prevail this weekend. Wright just won’t be able to match the pace Williams sets and Williams appears to have learned his lessons about southpaws against Quintana. It will be close, but Williams should edge this one by decision.
I think if Khan wins his next fight, and Pacquiao beats Hatton, we might just see Khan vs Hatton.
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=CIZMIGXR
Hatton Pacquiao 24/7
Hatton Pacquiao 24/7
Yep I have this to watch tomorrow. HBO do a great job with their boxing dont they, I mean compared to our equivalent Setanta anyway.
i cant believe no one picked up Wright Williams
Picked up?
yeah I mean showed it over here no setanta no sky, nothing!
Williams smoked him over 12 rounds and got the UD
Williams smoked him over 12 rounds and got the UD
Tyson Fury (5-0, 5KOs), the 6'8 much-hyped heavyweight rookie from the UK, has taken a few slight shots at former undisputed cruiserweight champion David Haye, who challenges WBO/IBF heavyweight champion Wladimir Klitschko on June 20 in Germany. It's not often that a fighter from the UK is going against his own countryman, but Fury is making a name for himself in the trash-talking department and maybe he wants to set up a potential fight with Haye down the line.
Fury thinks it's a good fight. He just doesn't think Haye has any chin to stand on, and sees a knockout win for Wladimir.
"It's a good fight and Haye has achieved a lot and I respect what he has done at cruiserweight and that but for me he has no chin whatsoever and I can see him getting exposed to be honest. Despite his achievements I don't see him as a 'proper' fighter. Don't get me wrong he can punch but at the top level you can't go swimming without getting wet and I think Klitschko is knocking him out," Fury told ITV.
Fury thinks it's a good fight. He just doesn't think Haye has any chin to stand on, and sees a knockout win for Wladimir.
"It's a good fight and Haye has achieved a lot and I respect what he has done at cruiserweight and that but for me he has no chin whatsoever and I can see him getting exposed to be honest. Despite his achievements I don't see him as a 'proper' fighter. Don't get me wrong he can punch but at the top level you can't go swimming without getting wet and I think Klitschko is knocking him out," Fury told ITV.
5-0 and already a big mouth, why dont you come back when you have fought someone thats a 'proper' fighter. This is the guy who is self proclaimed as better than George Foreman.
I just ordered my Cotto/Clottey tickets
Oscar De La Hoya's popularity as a fighter is indisputable. He set every pay-per-view record imaginable, and it all started with the terrific work done by promoter Bob Arum and his Top Rank Inc. A day after De La Hoya announced his retirement, Arum on Wednesday intimated that much of what transpired early on in De La Hoya's career was a set-up job that worked incredibly well.
"None of it came by accident," said Arum, who promoted De La Hoya for roughly two-thirds of his 17-year career. "It was all a lot of hard work by a lot of people. A lot of innovative stuff.
"The women that suddenly appeared, going crazy for Oscar, that wasn't an accident. That was something we took out of the Frank Sinatra book. You stir it up and then the fire starts and then you can step back and let it be natural. But it doesn't start naturally.
Anyone who thought it did was naive.
"The way we played to the Hispanics and then we were able to cross over into the mainstream. That took a lot of work and a lot of effort. That also took a lot of work from Oscar because he enabled it to happen. He had the personality and the looks and the story that helped us create this. By the time we were no longer involved with Oscar, he was, in effect, a finished product."
The "story" Arum referred to was De La Hoya - of East Los Angeles - winning the gold medal in the 1992 Barcelona Games not quite two years after his mother, Cecilia, died of cancer.
Arum said that the only regret he had for the way he engineered De La Hoya's career was that he let De La Hoya dictate some of what went on with the selection of his opponents. For example, Arum said De La Hoya absolutely "refused" to fight a southpaw on the way up the ladder.
Well, De La Hoya did beat the left-handed Jimmi Bredahl in his 12th fight in March 1994 to win his first world title, but Bredahl was no real threat.
Then De La Hoya took on Pernell Whitaker four years later - in April 1997 - and won a unanimous decision.
“The only one he ever fought was Whitaker and he was a dead man," Arum said. "And he nearly beat Oscar. That is why I was so convinced that (Manny) Pacquiao would beat him and beat him badly and knock him out. I really believed that. It wasn't just promoter's talk; I wasn't going to embarrass myself.
"I knew he couldn't fight southpaws and as a consequence, he got the s**t kicked out of him."
De La Hoya was stopped after eight rounds by Pacquiao - who is promoted by Arum - last December in what would be De La Hoya's last fight.
What Might Have Been
De La Hoya did fight most, if not all, of the big names during his career. But he lost more big fights than he won. Arum suggested that was De La Hoya's fault.
"Oscar was a great attraction, the biggest attraction of his time and he was a very good fighter that fought all the competition that was around at the time," Arum said. "But he was never a great fighter. Later on in his career, when he wouldn't or couldn't push himself like a Manny Pacquiao does in training, he ended up losing fights that he should have won.
"I thought he won the (Felix) Trinidad fight, but it never should have been that close. Same thing with the second ("Sugar" Shane) Mosley fight. Should not have been that close. Once he established himself and once he was a big box-office draw, he was unable or unwilling to push himself to the next step to achieve true greatness.
"Look at the difference in the work ethic of a Manny Pacquiao and an Oscar. There is not even a comparison."
Can Pacquiao pick up slack?
With De La Hoya gone, it will be interesting to see what transpires in the pay-per-view world as well as the overall popularity of boxing. Arum said he isn't making any predictions, but he is hopeful that Pacquiao can pick up where De La Hoya left off. Arum said he will continue to promote Pacquiao's "uniqueness" and that it is his dream that he will be able to "exceed what Oscar has accomplished, what Oscar has achieved. Do I know that for sure? No. But that is my game plan. That is what I hope with Manny we can accomplish.
"And I really believe it is feasible or I wouldn't say it."
Pacquiao-Hatton
Since Pacquiao will be taking on Ricky Hatton on May 2 at MGM Grand in Las Vegas on an HBO pay-per-view card, Arum was asked how important it is for the pay-per-view numbers in this fight to be high in the aftermath of De La Hoya's retirement.
"It's important because a good showing on pay-per-view establishes the viability of the business," Arum said. "The way it's going, I really expect a tremendous number of homes and I think we have a shot to do better than De La Hoya-Pacquiao."
Arum said De La Hoya-Pacquiao did between 1.25 and 1.3 millions buys.
"The reason I say that is because this is expected to be a much more even fight," Arum said. "The big problem we had on De La Hoya and Pacquiao was that nobody gave Pacquiao a shot. Ninety percent of the guys thought it was a mismatch."
De La Hoya made Lopez proud
About 15 minutes before Tuesday's Los Angeles news conference began announcing De La Hoya's retirement, actor/comedian George Lopez spoke about De La Hoya, with whom he has become good friends. Strictly from the standpoint of De La Hoya's record-breaking pay-per-view numbers as well as being the only fighter to win titles in six weight classes, Lopez spoke with great admiration.
"The fact that he's a Latino speaks (volumes) because there hasn't really been a place for us," said Lopez, who, like De La Hoya is Mexican-American and grew up in San Fernando (near Los Angeles). "Some of the greatest fighters in boxing ever have been non-Latinos.
"From Joe Louis to Muhammad Ali to (Joe) Frazier to Rocky Marciano to Jack Johnson. You know, there hasn't really been a place for us."
Lopez said that, yes, there have been other great Latino fighters. He mentioned Alexis Arguello, and he could have mentioned many more. "But no one who has surpassed what have been considered to be the greatest fighters of all time, but that's what Oscar has done," Lopez said.
Taffet's two cents
Like Lopez, HBO executive Mark Taffet spoke to us about De La Hoya minutes before De La Hoya said he was retiring. Since De La Hoya made HBO a ton of money with those 14.1 million pay-per-view buys and $696 million in pay-per-view revenue, it wasn't surprising to hear Taffet sing De La Hoya's praises.
"Oscar made unprecedented contributions to the sport, inside and outside of the ring," said Taffet, alluding to De La Hoya's youth foundation as well as the millions of dollars he donated to two wings at White Memorial Medical Center in East Los Angeles. "He carried the lower weight divisions on his shoulders, to new heights, heights never seen before.
"He literally was the No. 1 pay-per-view franchise for 15 years running, set the all-time records. He had fans of every race, ethnicity, backgrounds, gender. He broke all the previous tracks, and set all the new records and I believe the records he set may go on forever."
Where were the fans?
Dan Goossen co-promoted Saturday's card at Mandalay Bay in Las Vegas, where an announced crowd of 5,600 showed up to watch Chris Arreola knock out Jameel McCline in the fourth round in the heavyweight semi-main event and Paul Williams win a unanimous decision over Winky Wright in the middleweight main event. Goossen was asked Wednesday if he was disappointed with such a low turnout for a card that included Williams - a top 10 pound-for-pound fighter - and Arreola, a top 10 heavyweight on the brink of a title fight. Goossen promotes Williams and Arreola.
"Not really because as nice as it was to be in Las Vegas and Mandalay Bay, the fight, really in my eyes, if it were in Los Angeles I believe we would have gotten 10-12,000," Goossen said. "Paul has a big fan base out here because he has fought out here many times." Five of Williams' past nine fights have been in Southern California. Two were in Carson, which is just a stone's throw from Los Angeles. Arreola is from Riverside via Los Angeles, for that matter. Still, 5,600 for a card at a major Las Vegas venue is not encouraging.
But, wait. It was also Easter weekend, as Goossen so correctly pointed out.
Arum, when asked about the state of boxing now that De La Hoya is gone, had a different view of why this card did not draw well. "You do a Winky Wright-Paul Williams fight in Vegas and nobody comes," Arum said. "Well, why would anybody come? Who cares?”
Wow!
So, what's next?
Goossen said he is hopeful that he can get Arreola a fight with champion Wladimir Klitschko should Klitschko get by David Haye on June 20 in Germany.
"To put it simply, if there is a possibility with Klitschko, we will certainly speak to them and see if it makes any sense to move forward," Goossen said. "If not, we will continue to do what we're doing now, getting meaningful fights toward the mandatory defense."
As for Williams, Goossen said he asked De La Hoya after Williams beat Wright if he would like to put together a fight between Williams and Bernard Hopkins or Williams and Mosley. Hopkins and Mosley both fight under the Golden Boy Promotions banner and are partners in De La Hoya's company.
Goossen said he told De La Hoya that Hopkins would have to get down into the 160s. As for Mosley, Goossen believes the fighter who has never turned down a challenge probably wants nothing to do with Williams.
"I think it's going to be something hard for Shane to do because of how dominating Paul was (against Wright)," Goossen said. "But without a doubt, the best welterweight in the world today is Paul Williams; the best super welterweight in the world is also Paul Williams; and the best middleweight in the world is Paul Williams."
"None of it came by accident," said Arum, who promoted De La Hoya for roughly two-thirds of his 17-year career. "It was all a lot of hard work by a lot of people. A lot of innovative stuff.
"The women that suddenly appeared, going crazy for Oscar, that wasn't an accident. That was something we took out of the Frank Sinatra book. You stir it up and then the fire starts and then you can step back and let it be natural. But it doesn't start naturally.
Anyone who thought it did was naive.
"The way we played to the Hispanics and then we were able to cross over into the mainstream. That took a lot of work and a lot of effort. That also took a lot of work from Oscar because he enabled it to happen. He had the personality and the looks and the story that helped us create this. By the time we were no longer involved with Oscar, he was, in effect, a finished product."
The "story" Arum referred to was De La Hoya - of East Los Angeles - winning the gold medal in the 1992 Barcelona Games not quite two years after his mother, Cecilia, died of cancer.
Arum said that the only regret he had for the way he engineered De La Hoya's career was that he let De La Hoya dictate some of what went on with the selection of his opponents. For example, Arum said De La Hoya absolutely "refused" to fight a southpaw on the way up the ladder.
Well, De La Hoya did beat the left-handed Jimmi Bredahl in his 12th fight in March 1994 to win his first world title, but Bredahl was no real threat.
Then De La Hoya took on Pernell Whitaker four years later - in April 1997 - and won a unanimous decision.
“The only one he ever fought was Whitaker and he was a dead man," Arum said. "And he nearly beat Oscar. That is why I was so convinced that (Manny) Pacquiao would beat him and beat him badly and knock him out. I really believed that. It wasn't just promoter's talk; I wasn't going to embarrass myself.
"I knew he couldn't fight southpaws and as a consequence, he got the s**t kicked out of him."
De La Hoya was stopped after eight rounds by Pacquiao - who is promoted by Arum - last December in what would be De La Hoya's last fight.
What Might Have Been
De La Hoya did fight most, if not all, of the big names during his career. But he lost more big fights than he won. Arum suggested that was De La Hoya's fault.
"Oscar was a great attraction, the biggest attraction of his time and he was a very good fighter that fought all the competition that was around at the time," Arum said. "But he was never a great fighter. Later on in his career, when he wouldn't or couldn't push himself like a Manny Pacquiao does in training, he ended up losing fights that he should have won.
"I thought he won the (Felix) Trinidad fight, but it never should have been that close. Same thing with the second ("Sugar" Shane) Mosley fight. Should not have been that close. Once he established himself and once he was a big box-office draw, he was unable or unwilling to push himself to the next step to achieve true greatness.
"Look at the difference in the work ethic of a Manny Pacquiao and an Oscar. There is not even a comparison."
Can Pacquiao pick up slack?
With De La Hoya gone, it will be interesting to see what transpires in the pay-per-view world as well as the overall popularity of boxing. Arum said he isn't making any predictions, but he is hopeful that Pacquiao can pick up where De La Hoya left off. Arum said he will continue to promote Pacquiao's "uniqueness" and that it is his dream that he will be able to "exceed what Oscar has accomplished, what Oscar has achieved. Do I know that for sure? No. But that is my game plan. That is what I hope with Manny we can accomplish.
"And I really believe it is feasible or I wouldn't say it."
Pacquiao-Hatton
Since Pacquiao will be taking on Ricky Hatton on May 2 at MGM Grand in Las Vegas on an HBO pay-per-view card, Arum was asked how important it is for the pay-per-view numbers in this fight to be high in the aftermath of De La Hoya's retirement.
"It's important because a good showing on pay-per-view establishes the viability of the business," Arum said. "The way it's going, I really expect a tremendous number of homes and I think we have a shot to do better than De La Hoya-Pacquiao."
Arum said De La Hoya-Pacquiao did between 1.25 and 1.3 millions buys.
"The reason I say that is because this is expected to be a much more even fight," Arum said. "The big problem we had on De La Hoya and Pacquiao was that nobody gave Pacquiao a shot. Ninety percent of the guys thought it was a mismatch."
De La Hoya made Lopez proud
About 15 minutes before Tuesday's Los Angeles news conference began announcing De La Hoya's retirement, actor/comedian George Lopez spoke about De La Hoya, with whom he has become good friends. Strictly from the standpoint of De La Hoya's record-breaking pay-per-view numbers as well as being the only fighter to win titles in six weight classes, Lopez spoke with great admiration.
"The fact that he's a Latino speaks (volumes) because there hasn't really been a place for us," said Lopez, who, like De La Hoya is Mexican-American and grew up in San Fernando (near Los Angeles). "Some of the greatest fighters in boxing ever have been non-Latinos.
"From Joe Louis to Muhammad Ali to (Joe) Frazier to Rocky Marciano to Jack Johnson. You know, there hasn't really been a place for us."
Lopez said that, yes, there have been other great Latino fighters. He mentioned Alexis Arguello, and he could have mentioned many more. "But no one who has surpassed what have been considered to be the greatest fighters of all time, but that's what Oscar has done," Lopez said.
Taffet's two cents
Like Lopez, HBO executive Mark Taffet spoke to us about De La Hoya minutes before De La Hoya said he was retiring. Since De La Hoya made HBO a ton of money with those 14.1 million pay-per-view buys and $696 million in pay-per-view revenue, it wasn't surprising to hear Taffet sing De La Hoya's praises.
"Oscar made unprecedented contributions to the sport, inside and outside of the ring," said Taffet, alluding to De La Hoya's youth foundation as well as the millions of dollars he donated to two wings at White Memorial Medical Center in East Los Angeles. "He carried the lower weight divisions on his shoulders, to new heights, heights never seen before.
"He literally was the No. 1 pay-per-view franchise for 15 years running, set the all-time records. He had fans of every race, ethnicity, backgrounds, gender. He broke all the previous tracks, and set all the new records and I believe the records he set may go on forever."
Where were the fans?
Dan Goossen co-promoted Saturday's card at Mandalay Bay in Las Vegas, where an announced crowd of 5,600 showed up to watch Chris Arreola knock out Jameel McCline in the fourth round in the heavyweight semi-main event and Paul Williams win a unanimous decision over Winky Wright in the middleweight main event. Goossen was asked Wednesday if he was disappointed with such a low turnout for a card that included Williams - a top 10 pound-for-pound fighter - and Arreola, a top 10 heavyweight on the brink of a title fight. Goossen promotes Williams and Arreola.
"Not really because as nice as it was to be in Las Vegas and Mandalay Bay, the fight, really in my eyes, if it were in Los Angeles I believe we would have gotten 10-12,000," Goossen said. "Paul has a big fan base out here because he has fought out here many times." Five of Williams' past nine fights have been in Southern California. Two were in Carson, which is just a stone's throw from Los Angeles. Arreola is from Riverside via Los Angeles, for that matter. Still, 5,600 for a card at a major Las Vegas venue is not encouraging.
But, wait. It was also Easter weekend, as Goossen so correctly pointed out.
Arum, when asked about the state of boxing now that De La Hoya is gone, had a different view of why this card did not draw well. "You do a Winky Wright-Paul Williams fight in Vegas and nobody comes," Arum said. "Well, why would anybody come? Who cares?”
Wow!
So, what's next?
Goossen said he is hopeful that he can get Arreola a fight with champion Wladimir Klitschko should Klitschko get by David Haye on June 20 in Germany.
"To put it simply, if there is a possibility with Klitschko, we will certainly speak to them and see if it makes any sense to move forward," Goossen said. "If not, we will continue to do what we're doing now, getting meaningful fights toward the mandatory defense."
As for Williams, Goossen said he asked De La Hoya after Williams beat Wright if he would like to put together a fight between Williams and Bernard Hopkins or Williams and Mosley. Hopkins and Mosley both fight under the Golden Boy Promotions banner and are partners in De La Hoya's company.
Goossen said he told De La Hoya that Hopkins would have to get down into the 160s. As for Mosley, Goossen believes the fighter who has never turned down a challenge probably wants nothing to do with Williams.
"I think it's going to be something hard for Shane to do because of how dominating Paul was (against Wright)," Goossen said. "But without a doubt, the best welterweight in the world today is Paul Williams; the best super welterweight in the world is also Paul Williams; and the best middleweight in the world is Paul Williams."
He's right in alot of what he says but ucking hell, Arum is a bitter fecker.
According to Top Rank's Bob Arum, the next likely opponent for Manny Pacquiao will be WBO welterweight champion Miguel Cotto. It's not the first time that Arum mentioned the possibility of a fight with Pacquiao and Cotto. Since January the subject came up a number of times. Arum said the overall decision will come down to the fighters. If both boxers want to make the fight, Arum will make the fight. If the fight does take shape, it probably won't happen until November.
Arum told the Manila Bulletin that Pacquiao is not looking to fight again until late-November. Both of them have tough fights ahead. Pacquiao has Ricky Hatton on May 2, and Cotto meets Joshua Clottey on June 13.
"We can do it at Madison Square Garden,” said Arum. “Manny told me that after this one (with Hatton), he would be available to fight next in late-November."
There is a secondary plan, which is Pacquiao vs. Julio Cesar Chavez Jr. at the catch-weight of 150-pounds. Some fans would like to Pacquiao fight Floyd Mayweather Jr. but Arum doesn't think that will happen because Mayweather wants the bulk of the money.
“Mayweather wants 60 percent of the revenue and I feel right now that Manny deserves the bigger percentage because he is the star," Arum said.
Arum told the Manila Bulletin that Pacquiao is not looking to fight again until late-November. Both of them have tough fights ahead. Pacquiao has Ricky Hatton on May 2, and Cotto meets Joshua Clottey on June 13.
"We can do it at Madison Square Garden,” said Arum. “Manny told me that after this one (with Hatton), he would be available to fight next in late-November."
There is a secondary plan, which is Pacquiao vs. Julio Cesar Chavez Jr. at the catch-weight of 150-pounds. Some fans would like to Pacquiao fight Floyd Mayweather Jr. but Arum doesn't think that will happen because Mayweather wants the bulk of the money.
“Mayweather wants 60 percent of the revenue and I feel right now that Manny deserves the bigger percentage because he is the star," Arum said.
fecking hell. IF Manny was to beat both Hatton and Cotto he could lay serious claim to being one of the greatest ever.
He can't beat Cotto I think I would jump off a bridge if that happened
Damn near close to it...
Rooting for Hatton obviously but Paqmans track record is brilliant.
May 2nd
I can't wait. Its kind of a win-win. I love Ricky so I'd love to see him win, but if Pac blows him out it will basically confirm that we're getting to watch an all-time great build his legacy.Damn near close to it...
Rooting for Hatton obviously but Paqmans track record is brilliant.
May 2nd
I've been reading on message boards that the both of them verbally agreed to a re-match if it went to a controversial decision?
Imagine a split Hatton win, and Paqman comes back for blood... goodness gracious i'm getting ahead of myself
I've been reading on message boards that the both of them verbally agreed to a re-match if it went to a controversial decision?
Imagine a split Hatton win, and Paqman comes back for blood... goodness gracious i'm getting ahead of myself
Don't worry mate these things happen. I had their entire careers mapped out in a drug-induced stream of consciousness rant at my mate. Hatton would win the first one, and Pac would win the two rematches to take the trilogy. Hatton would then end his career on a high by knocking out Amir Khan, and Pac would move up to welterweight to try to unify the titles and clean out the division, beating Cotto and an out of retirement Mayweather, but coming up short against Shane Mosley. He'd then end his career with one last war with Marquez.
My mate was lost for words when I eventually shut up. Says I'm the only person he's met than can chat more unadulterated shite about boxing than he does.