i'll give you 30m if that shuts you up
Gaming The SM RedCafe League
- Thread starter Damien
- Start date
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
I honestly would have nothing to do with it
I would if Damien sells me Eriksen
But seriously this is not about money or even players FFS. It's not even about me. It's about everyone else outside a select few teams that is playing the game. It's not going to be much fun to do it with less than scraps to compete for and people will get bored and leave.
I spend almost all day on SM, RS, MJJ and Taurean can testify to this as I speak to them on there all the time, and even I'm getting bored lately. Can you imagine what it'll be like for some that don't even spend much time there to begin with? Something needs to make it more appealing for them to stay. I for one enjoyed it much more when the Div 2 was full and competition was fierce there. I'd like the game to stay full as it becomes more fun just by the banter alone!
We have changed it a lot already and doing any more would kill the game for us and we would probably see more leaving.
You changed it and the numbers increased. They're back to what they were around the start is what has been said but over time as people started leaving more and more players were brought into a few teams who stayed on the whole time. Now you have the same numbers as at the start but a worse distribution of players so people will inevitably leave. We need to find something that works for everyone, doesn't even have to be a lowering of the player cap, we could just suggest to obliterate Man UTD and tear the team apart player by player
The problem is that every time it's brought up people in question refuse to discuss it. It was the same at the beginning of the season. No improvement was discussed and in fact the FFP table hasn't even been updated in about 6 months.
If we all discuss it together I'm sure we can come up with a solution to please everyone because as it stands things are not working out for most of us.
What about loans with options to buy? If you exceed a certain number of loans (say 10 for instance) each player loaned out after that has to be loaned with an automatic option to buy at face value for the receiving club. That way top clubs have to be selective about the youth they hoard, and it would automatically limit squad sizes due to wages, etc, making things fairer (as far as I can see, at least).
but there is nothing that can be done, its a catch 22 situation people will leave if we dont change people will leave because we change and it will probably be the ones who are playing the game the longest, damo has spent nearly 3 year building that squad when you are here that long you should have a decent squad, redsky started out with a shit squad and built it, from there point of view you want rome and you want it built in a day
1. Risers
600 shortlists mean feck all. All it does is giving unnecessary alerts every time. As of now, I only have 42 players in my shortlist because I know exactly what kind of players I am interested in. And scouting is not just about looking at the current ratings in SM, but how the players actually perform in real-life. Again, this ties to which players you actually want because you can't possibly look at every single one of them
2. FFP
The GW was about 25 managers in Season 7/8 I think. After FFP was implemented, number of managers have increased steadily to 43 as of today. Like it or not, FFP works in keeping the GW active and alive. Yes, there is some request for changes every now and then, but you can't please everybody. I would say give it few more seasons and see how it pans out, before we decide to change anything
600 shortlists mean feck all. All it does is giving unnecessary alerts every time. As of now, I only have 42 players in my shortlist because I know exactly what kind of players I am interested in. And scouting is not just about looking at the current ratings in SM, but how the players actually perform in real-life. Again, this ties to which players you actually want because you can't possibly look at every single one of them
2. FFP
The GW was about 25 managers in Season 7/8 I think. After FFP was implemented, number of managers have increased steadily to 43 as of today. Like it or not, FFP works in keeping the GW active and alive. Yes, there is some request for changes every now and then, but you can't please everybody. I would say give it few more seasons and see how it pans out, before we decide to change anything
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3. Loans Cap
There are 57 unmanaged clubs as of now, means total of 171 players to be loaned out to them. If we implement a loan cap, it means each club can only loan out 4-5 players to unmanaged clubs. Probably 4 players for Div 1, and 5 players for Div 2 and below?
No restriction on players to be loaned out to managed clubs
There are 57 unmanaged clubs as of now, means total of 171 players to be loaned out to them. If we implement a loan cap, it means each club can only loan out 4-5 players to unmanaged clubs. Probably 4 players for Div 1, and 5 players for Div 2 and below?
No restriction on players to be loaned out to managed clubs
7.17 - Olivier Boscagli (17/75) ¦ 90mins
7.11 - Jordan Obita (21/82) ¦ 90mins
6.96 - Dominique Heintz (22/83) ¦ 90mins
6.98 - Dominik Kohr (21/85) ¦ 90mins
6.90 - Jose Rodriguez (20/85) ¦ 84mins
6.68 - Leonardo Bittencourt (21/87) ¦ 49mins
5.87 - Joe Gomez (18/80) ¦ 90mins
N/A - Srdjan Babic (19/82) ¦ 79mins
N/A - Vukasin Jovanovic (19/80) ¦ 90mins
Didn't Play:
Stefanos Kapino (21/84) - Second choice for Olympiakos
Sofiane Boufal (21/84)
Arnaud Lusamba (18/80)
Sehrou Guirassy (18/80)
Batuhan Altintas (19/77) - Just recovered from injury
Alexander Djiku (21/75) - Suspended
Injured:
Jonas Fohrenbach (19/75)
Still To Play:
Ivan Cavaleiro (21/85)
Kenneth Omeruo (21/84)
Carlos Strandberg (19/82)
David Concha (18/82)
Danilo Pantic (18/80)
George Williams (20/78)
Borja San Emeterio (18/78)
Alberto Grassi (20/77)
Rodrigo Bentancur (18/77)
Leo Dubois (20/75)
7.11 - Jordan Obita (21/82) ¦ 90mins
6.96 - Dominique Heintz (22/83) ¦ 90mins
6.98 - Dominik Kohr (21/85) ¦ 90mins
6.90 - Jose Rodriguez (20/85) ¦ 84mins
6.68 - Leonardo Bittencourt (21/87) ¦ 49mins
5.87 - Joe Gomez (18/80) ¦ 90mins
N/A - Srdjan Babic (19/82) ¦ 79mins
N/A - Vukasin Jovanovic (19/80) ¦ 90mins
Didn't Play:
Stefanos Kapino (21/84) - Second choice for Olympiakos
Sofiane Boufal (21/84)
Arnaud Lusamba (18/80)
Sehrou Guirassy (18/80)
Batuhan Altintas (19/77) - Just recovered from injury
Alexander Djiku (21/75) - Suspended
Injured:
Jonas Fohrenbach (19/75)
Still To Play:
Ivan Cavaleiro (21/85)
Kenneth Omeruo (21/84)
Carlos Strandberg (19/82)
David Concha (18/82)
Danilo Pantic (18/80)
George Williams (20/78)
Borja San Emeterio (18/78)
Alberto Grassi (20/77)
Rodrigo Bentancur (18/77)
Leo Dubois (20/75)
How does that help any of us again? It helps those who have the highest rated players as they can send them out easily.
Regarding point 1, the gameworld is so oversaturated that there are not that many promising talents available. The 600 on the shortlist are there so I can keep track of their progress because one or two of them could become first team players and that will reflect in their rating. I cannot check every single player all the time so that helps me and warns me if someone else bids too. The 600 odd shortlist is also an indication that on the contrary to what's been said I have been doing scouting. Erturgul Ersoy was my find and also someone else.
Regarding point 2 things worked because FFP was implemented, I'm not saying get rid of it, I'm saying improve it in a way that other players also benefit from it. The attitude that we shouldn't give a crap about Johnny come lateys won't make them stay long. Otherwise close registrations and keep it to a select few.
You all seem to forget/ignore that when the game has started and there were a lot of managers there was a more even spread when it came to talent and over time all that talent was concentrated in the teams that did continue to stay on and rightly so, but maybe now that there are some more people again throwing a bone won't be such a bad thing because even if people do leave again they'd still be able to get that talent back.
2-3 SM seasons is another year and some people will be released naturally after not fulfilling their potential and as more promising talents become available.
The difference between 10 or so clubs and most of us is that they buy talent for development and we buy it to make money. Not counting you since you're building a squad from Div 5 and can afford to wait few years on the people you buy.
The fact is that EVEN if they do let go of some more talent or high rates players, with all the money and other talent they have they will be able to get it back once they do come good and all they've done in the process is redistributing some of their wealth financially and talent wise to helping the other teams in the league.
Discussion on rules are always welcome. But i wouldn't support a squad cap of 35. I didn't like it in the mk2 and I won't here either. It's too few to be an enjoyable when buying youngsters are concerned.
FFP has helped imo else teams like southend wouldn't have been able to buy such a nice collection of risers. It's a fair point about some higher rated players not being available and being hoarded. But give another season, many more will go back into the market whilst your risers might be the one wanted by the big teams. It's a tricky situation as well, because small teams don't have the weekly income to handle a large squad either, and is sure to make loss if you are in Div2 or lower.
FFP has helped imo else teams like southend wouldn't have been able to buy such a nice collection of risers. It's a fair point about some higher rated players not being available and being hoarded. But give another season, many more will go back into the market whilst your risers might be the one wanted by the big teams. It's a tricky situation as well, because small teams don't have the weekly income to handle a large squad either, and is sure to make loss if you are in Div2 or lower.
I'm skipping a lot of the conversation here, but there is plenty of talent out there. Just have to be patient with it.
What you lack is patience. Many of my better young players were picked up when there was no squad cap and the likes of Arsenal had 70+ squad strengths. The players are there. You just have to identify them and then wait for them to flourish and increase in rating. And the squad cap has already helped enormously and we've haven't even had the full impact of it yet. The likes of Arsenal and United will almost certainly have to sell more and more players as time goes by if they want to ever involve themselves in the transfer market. If you aren't interested in the said players then no one can do much. You can't expect managers to sell you the players you want. The likes of United and Arsenal will always have an advantage. No point moaning about that. I have already picked up a few players just by waiting for squad caps to fill up and then getting them unopposed.
And 700 players on your shortlist? What the feck? I have about 50...
Loan cap is very good idea however and one I'm completely in favour of. Should be based on a combination of stadium size and division of the team.
I echo this.
Let's swap teams!
I've bought all these players to make money because no other way to do it. They are too old and their condition deteriorates towards the end of the match, that's why I concede towards the end. That is why you're too and I'm bottom. Most of your players are in their mid 20's.
Have just looked at your squad and most of them were recycled players into the system. Very few are the ones which you've picked up and nurtured. Even Fekir was at Forest initially and was flipped for profit at the time I'm guessing but the problem now is that there are TOO MANY clubs not recycling any talent and higher rated players and the rest of us are fighting for scraps.
You said it yourself that you're bored from Blackburn because there is not much happening. Transfers between clubs are stale because no one needs to sell. Clubs can afford to keep their teams as they are and they'll be perfectly fine for many years to come.
Maybe every club should be forced to put a release clause on 5 players in their team or something like that. That way they're not forced to simply get rid of them and get a decent fee for it.
Again loan cap makes very very very small difference. I have 7 players out and only saving £25k. United can easily afford to keep all players in and still roll.
I don't think your transfer policy will work. You want money fast so that you can compete in short term, but there is so much you can do because (1) the big clubs will easily surpass you; (2) you don't want long-term investment on risers, which myself, RS and others are more than happy to get our hands ontoLet's swap teams!
I've bought all these players to make money because no other way to do it. They are too old and their condition deteriorates towards the end of the match, that's why I concede towards the end. That is why you're too and I'm bottom. Most of your players are in their mid 20's.
Have just looked at your squad and most of them were recycled players into the system. Very few are the ones which you've picked up and nurtured. Even Fekir was at Forest initially and was flipped for profit at the time I'm guessing but the problem now is that there are TOO MANY clubs not recycling any talent and higher rated players and the rest of us are fighting for scraps.
You said it yourself that you're bored from Blackburn because there is not much happening. Transfers between clubs are stale because no one needs to sell. Clubs can afford to keep their teams as they are and they'll be perfectly fine for many years to come.
Maybe every club should be forced to put a release clause on 5 players in their team or something like that. That way they're not forced to simply get rid of them and get a decent fee for it.
Again loan cap makes very very very small difference. I have 7 players out and only saving £25k. United can easily afford to keep all players in and still roll.
The loan cap makes a big difference for small clubs like mine. Few 10k off from our wages is relatively huge for us. This concern has been raised before in the past from lower league clubs like Norwich
There are plenty of other ways to make money. We have almost identical stadium sizes. I just don't feel the need to buy OAP's like you have. When I first joined Balckburn I did pretty much the same thing as you but it's not a great strategy and not something that works long term-ish.
Bullshit! What does it matter that Fekir was once at a managed club? Phil didn't think Fekir was good enough. I did (truly!) and snapped him up. Point is there are ALWAYS players like him at external clubs. And this was before the squad cap era. With the squad caps in place the chances of clubs selling players that might be very talented is only going to increase. As a statistic, only 2 of the 45 players at Blackburn were signed from managed clubs and both were this season (Kruse and Simeone). If clubs don't recycle talent now, they won't be able to buy. It's that simple. United might want to hold on to Eriksen until eternity but that stops them from getting the next Eriksen if and when he pops on the DB.I don't have the patience to turn Blackburn into something resembling an elite. It's definitely possible but takes work which is how it should be. You can't just expect to take over a club and expect to topple up the big clubs by signing a load of high 90 rated players. It's realistic that way without the part that forces the smaller clubs to sell their best players and thus allowing them to get better.
Nah. Anything that forces the club to sell players is a terrible idea.
It's not going to make too much of a difference to United or many division clubs for that matter but it could make a good deal of difference to lower league clubs which I'm all in favour of.
@green_smiley
1. That's what's happening now so no change. Why is it relevant?
2. I don't miss out on people as I am constantly searching and adding. If there are those who haven't had a rating increase I would buy them. I bought and sold a few of them already but simply weren't making enough money. I don't buy someone just because someone else is bidding, I check to see what prompted that bid.
3. FFP has worked but it's stalled. There's no decent talent left and the rest of us are feeding off scraps. You can afford to buy as I said because you started in Div 5.
As for your second post, I want money so I can stay afloat, my transfer policy is the only thing that manages that while remaining competitive at the same time. You can afford to buy risers because you're coming from Div 5 and RS can do the same because he has a solid first team.
I can't believe that you can't/won't see the disparity of the situations.
Also you will not have £100k of your wage bill! You have 7 players out and are saving 22k and it makes a very slightly bigger difference because you're in Div 4. The rest of us are Div 1 and 2 and £25k is nothing.
1. That's what's happening now so no change. Why is it relevant?
2. I don't miss out on people as I am constantly searching and adding. If there are those who haven't had a rating increase I would buy them. I bought and sold a few of them already but simply weren't making enough money. I don't buy someone just because someone else is bidding, I check to see what prompted that bid.
3. FFP has worked but it's stalled. There's no decent talent left and the rest of us are feeding off scraps. You can afford to buy as I said because you started in Div 5.
As for your second post, I want money so I can stay afloat, my transfer policy is the only thing that manages that while remaining competitive at the same time. You can afford to buy risers because you're coming from Div 5 and RS can do the same because he has a solid first team.
I can't believe that you can't/won't see the disparity of the situations.
Also you will not have £100k of your wage bill! You have 7 players out and are saving 22k and it makes a very slightly bigger difference because you're in Div 4. The rest of us are Div 1 and 2 and £25k is nothing.
I'm Nottingham Forest. I started off in Division 2 and started off buying risers. My team was a mix of old and some young (on 88/89s). I was patient!
Leno was 89 for 3 SM seasons before he reached 90. Laporte I bought when he was 85 rated and I don't have a solid first team at all, I have a very SMALL first team which lacks depth and whenever I get more than 1 injury i'm utterly screwed.
There are plenty of other ways to make money. We have almost identical stadium sizes. I just don't feel the need to buy OAP's like you have. When I first joined Balckburn I did pretty much the same thing as you but it's not a great strategy and not something that works long term-ish.
I don't have the patience to turn Blackburn into something resembling an elite. It's definitely possible but takes work which is how it should be. You can't just expect to take over a club and expect to topple up the big clubs by signing a load of high 90 rated players. It's realistic that way without the part that forces the smaller clubs to sell their best players and thus allowing them to get better.
Nah. Anything that forces the club to sell players is a terrible idea.
It's not going to make too much of a difference to United or many division clubs for that matter but it could make a good deal of difference to lower league clubs which I'm all in favour of.
Feels like we're going round in circles.There are plenty of other ways to make money. We have almost identical stadium sizes. I just don't feel the need to buy OAP's like you have. When I first joined Balckburn I did pretty much the same thing as you but it's not a great strategy and not something that works long term-ish.
I don't have the patience to turn Blackburn into something resembling an elite. It's definitely possible but takes work which is how it should be. You can't just expect to take over a club and expect to topple up the big clubs by signing a load of high 90 rated players. It's realistic that way without the part that forces the smaller clubs to sell their best players and thus allowing them to get better.
Nah. Anything that forces the club to sell players is a terrible idea.
It's not going to make too much of a difference to United or many division clubs for that matter but it could make a good deal of difference to lower league clubs which I'm all in favour of.
The point is that the best players in the game are at a handful of clubs, they get rotated around for cash or more talent at a handful of clubs, that same handful releases players with little potential into the GW so they can get better ones and often (like all the time) we cannot compete due to the vast amounts of money being thrown. Could any of us outside that handful have afforded to spend £11m on Berahino or £32m on Xhaka or even £75m on Ozil or whatever Vidal went for? The answer is a resounding no. And even though Damien for example has 12 90+ rated players for a maximum of 5 midfield positions he still deems them an important part of his team. This is without including any youngsters that could cover.
Anyways I'm not going to discuss this any longer because the ones who think everything is fine and are being vocal about it are obviously those who are interested in maintaining the status-quo or those who aren't really affected by this while others seem disinterested in taking part in this discussion.
Peace out.
I don't dispute any of that but you could afford to buy and keep low rated players because you were building from lower divisions and also you were able to buy talent as the GW emptied. If you're saying that we should be patient for that to happen again then it's completely contrary to what I'm saying which is keep the GW full and find a way to make things interesting for everyone at the same time.
I'm not sure why I'd be interested in maintaining status-quo. I don't exactly have a great squad myself.
Obviously none of us could even dream of spending 75m on Ozil but then I suppose that's quite realistic. Anyway, I think you are underestimating the impact FFP will have on the GW.
feck off Litterbug. You got a 30m handoff for nothing a couple of weeks ago. I never had that, I built Forest up from the ground having to buy risers and selling them on to make money. The only reason my squad has good young players in it is because I was patient and bought them when they were in their 70's/low 80's. This is something that you are not doing.
Finding risers is not difficult, all you had to do was look at Ligue 1 after the first 2 games and check which young players have played and then check them in SM. There were plenty. They have now been bought by other clubs (FFP is working as barely any went to the top division clubs as their squads are full).
It's not a long game as you put it as proven by the fact that Wendell went up 7 to 87 in one year, Fekir going up 8 to 88, there are many examples of players getting a big boost and reaching 86-88 region in one season. You simply don't do it. If ratings were the most important part of this game then Damien or JB7 (Manchester City) would win every competition because they have the squads with the highest ratings.
How did I win the league a few seasons back when I only had 2 players rated 92+ at the time? How is Blackburn top of this season given his first team ratings? You think player ratings is the most crucial part of this game, the experienced players understand that this isn't the case. This is why I use my 88 rated players in my squad and why I use Berahino so much.
Finding risers is not difficult, all you had to do was look at Ligue 1 after the first 2 games and check which young players have played and then check them in SM. There were plenty. They have now been bought by other clubs (FFP is working as barely any went to the top division clubs as their squads are full).
It's not a long game as you put it as proven by the fact that Wendell went up 7 to 87 in one year, Fekir going up 8 to 88, there are many examples of players getting a big boost and reaching 86-88 region in one season. You simply don't do it. If ratings were the most important part of this game then Damien or JB7 (Manchester City) would win every competition because they have the squads with the highest ratings.
How did I win the league a few seasons back when I only had 2 players rated 92+ at the time? How is Blackburn top of this season given his first team ratings? You think player ratings is the most crucial part of this game, the experienced players understand that this isn't the case. This is why I use my 88 rated players in my squad and why I use Berahino so much.
But thats what you're failing to understand! There is talent to be bought right now who will rise this season, you're just not getting them! Honestly, I thought you would trash it in August and dominate the market and buy up the risers given the fuss you've been making about the FFP. But you haven't touched one that I have on my list.
Going. Round. In. Circles.
This argument is as saturated as the GW.
Let's wait for people to leave and raid their teams. Hopefully Barney and Herrera will once they get relegated again.
This argument is as saturated as the GW.
Let's wait for people to leave and raid their teams. Hopefully Barney and Herrera will once they get relegated again.
How does one go about getting one of these?
I'm still not 100% sure myself, but I think your squad has to be lower than the average of the league you're in.How does one go about getting one of these?
What are you even on about. I'm not going to spend £7-8m on a player that will be undervalued in my team for them to just about break even if they do manage a rise.
I have looked and I have bought people that I think are value for money additions. I would be able to buy more if I was able to have a solid 11 but I constantly have to change that to generate cash and that's why I was looking for a marquee signing like Eriksen for example or someone else so I could have a solid young axis in my team then use youngsters to fill 2-3 other positions.
You still avoided the whole Knoche fiasco as to why you sold him and whether you think he'd rise this season
Your club needs to be in "noncompetitive state"How does one go about getting one of these?
1. I'm not talking about players worth 7-8m. That's the quick fix. I'm talking about players rated 75-82.What are you even on about. I'm not going to spend £7-8m on a player that will be undervalued in my team for them to just about break even if they do manage a rise.
I have looked and I have bought people that I think are value for money additions. I would be able to buy more if I was able to have a solid 11 but I constantly have to change that to generate cash and that's why I was looking for a marquee signing like Eriksen for example or someone else so I could have a solid young axis in my team then use youngsters to fill 2-3 other positions.
You still avoided the whole Knoche fiasco as to why you sold him and whether you think he'd rise this season
2. Knoche is out of favour currently due to his dip in form since he was dropped from Europa League. But he's 23, and had almost 6000mins for Wolfsburg, at 89 rated he can reach 90 (but it took Laporte a while). I return to the word patience.
Lesson learnt: Please research before you buy. If you think the player is worth it despite being out-of-favour, then go ahead. Nobody forces you to buy
Bart Ramselaar is 72 rated, I paid 70k and he's getting good game time for Utrecht. #bargain
I knew that too well that's why I never went for him but you seemed to suggest that you and Damien made risers available when it was as I said, people with no potential to rise. Which again proves my point that the clique clubs sell "talent" when they see there's not much potential.
I've bought plenty of 75-87 rated players. You're mistaken.
When I get to work tomorrow I'll show you some that even you've probably missed.
The one positive out of this is that smiley seems to be learning stuff. Let's hope Herrera is reading too so he doesn't spend £18m on a dud next time
He's not a dud. You just have no patience which everyone can see. Knoche is at a club who's cap is around 92, he's at 89. He can rise to 90 as long as he gets back to being first choice which given he has been for 2 seasons now isn't unreasonable. Just like i'm sticking with Arnold who's 88 rated at Wolfsburg and not playing.The one positive out of this is that smiley seems to be learning stuff. Let's hope Herrera is reading too so he doesn't spend £18m on a dud next time
Just like i'm sticking with Willems, Sanson, Marin who all have long term injuries. Just like i'm sticking with N'Jie, Baba, Munir who can't seem to get off the bench at the moment. All are risers, all are struggling to get playing time but all have potential to rise fast if you have patience and accept that being benched is part of reality when you're young.
@LitterBug clubs sell "talent" when they see there's not much potential. Doesn't mean they are always right. Fekir is a good example
Yeah I didn't want to sell Fekir at all but I was broke so had too. I sold loads of players back during S3/S4.
I sold Diego Costa when he was 87 rated for 4.8m!
Ligue 1
- Bernardo Silva starts for Monaco
- Paul Nardi on the bench
- Heung-Min Son starts for Spurs
- Eric Dier starts for Spurs
- Christian Eriksen still injured
- Nabil Bentaleb now confirmed to be out for four weeks with injury
- Richairo Zivkovic starts for Willem II
- Tonny Vilhena on the bench for Feyenoord