Turning on Rangnick

Greck said:
Like what? as opposed to going to another club where he doesn't have to work under several people?

There's a reason we are even jumbling so many farfetched whatifs to justify it. He wasn't even present at an interview Fletcher of all people attended. From the very beginning he was never given an impression Ralf was an integral part of the process. This one is on the club.
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I mean it's fairly obvious from what Ten Hag said in his first press conference, what all the major United journalists have said on the matter and not least the fact that Rangnick was sacked and his consultancy cancelled that Ten Hag clearly didn't want to work with him.

So is it really a far fetched what if?
 
JJ12 said:
His analysis on the squad being rubbish was spot on and his recommendations for players probably would've been of great benefit.

Unfortunately we hired him as a manager, something he hadn't done in year and never at an elite level. The club misses so many times it is incredible. The next stage of his appointment was where he was going to be useful, but of course he shone a light on the idiots above and that was just unacceptable.
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Exactly... an excellent example of 'consultancy poisoning'... or in simpler terms 'shooting the messenger'
 
stevoc said:
I mean it's fairly obvious from what Ten Hag said in his first press conference, what all the major United journalists have said on the matter and not least the fact that Rangnick was sacked and his consultancy cancelled that Ten Hag clearly didn't want to work with him.

So is it really a far fetched what if?
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Yes, the the two statements are farfetched rationales to suggest ETH was why Ralf was let go. Simple saying he didn't care about Ralf is fair, blaming him for Ralf's departure is make believe. It was never a Ralf vs ETH, pick one thing. It's the definition of unfair to pin it on someone who wasn't even a part of the club when early indications already pointed to Ralf being marginalised.
It's entirely possible that early on in the negotiations with Ten Hag he made it clear has wasn't interested in the players Ralf was suggesting and/or working with Rangnick at all.

So what if we told Ten Hag he has to work under Ralf and he just said no thanks, just lose out on one of Europes up and coming coaches for the sake of keeping Rangnick on?
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el3mel said:
We didn't need Ralf to tell us the squad is rubbish though. That's like saying water is wet.
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Actually we sorta did considering that that message didn't apparently get through to the board who reminded us that this squad finished 2nd a bit back. People still parrot this achievement even on here, ignoring that we were set up to play a very specific way which suited the players we have.

Ralf did recommend a restructure and buying players before they turn into superstars worth in excess of 100 million. Also a rebuild in the same manner of Klopp at Liverpool. Seems sensible advice to me.
 
1988 said:
Why are we talking about Ralf again?
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Because his game plans, priorities and decisions would benefit us in the long run, and here we are in the long run and I see no benefit.
 
el3mel said:
If you know the report he gave the board, enlighten us.
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No, no you are right. He just told them everyone is rubbish. 3 words was in the report and tarred everyone with the same brush.
 
Irwin99 said:
Actually we sorta did considering that that message didn't apparently get through to the board who reminded us that this squad finished 2nd a bit back. People still parrot this achievement even on here, ignoring that we were set up to play a very specific way which suited the players we have.

Ralf did recommend a restructure and buying players before they turn into superstars worth in excess of 100 million. Also a rebuild in the same manner of Klopp at Liverpool. Seems sensible advice to me.
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The board know the squad is shit. They just don't care about it that much.
 
JJ12 said:
No, no you are right. He just told them everyone is rubbish. 3 words was in the report and tarred everyone with the same brush.
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As long as you don't know the actual report he gave them, you really have no business claiming how deep or what even was in it.
 
el3mel said:
As long as you don't know the actual report he gave them, you really have no business claiming how deep or what even was in it.
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No I’ll just assume he told them they were all rubbish. Very logical.
 
You people are crazy if you think that Pep, Klopp, Conte or Tuchel would not make top four last season if they took over when Ralf did.

There is only one way to make room for cultural changes and improvments in the squad in Manchester United, and that is by winning football matches.

Ralf thought there was another route, when theres not — and out the window flew his credibility.
 
We either hired him just to be a head coach for half a season, the consultancy was some extra shit to placate him and never taken too seriously (which is bloody stupid seeing as though he isn’t even a proper manager and the least experienced on the short list) or we hired him knowing he wasn’t a proper manager but that it would give him an opportunity to evaluate the squad before becoming involved behind the scenes, doing what he does best (then decided to part ways as we changed our mind over his involvement likely due to on pitch performances). I don’t know which of those is the stupidest decision to be honest, either way it doesn’t look good on Murtough as this was all him. Unles he pulls a rabbit or two out of the hat and sharpish then he should be gone based on these two mistakes alone.
 
LazyGoal said:
You people are crazy if you think that Pep, Klopp, Conte or Tuchel would not make top four last season if they took over when Ralf did.

There is only one way to make room for cultural changes and improvments in the squad in Manchester United, and that is by winning football matches.

Ralf thought there was another route, when theres not — and out the window flew his credibility.
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Even fergie would struggle with this lot.
 
Before we get all big on praising Ralf, let's not forget that Ralf was mentioning a future captaincy role for McTominay, who is probably our worst footballer.
 
bosnian_red said:
Before we get all big on praising Ralf, let's not forget that Ralf was mentioning a future captaincy role for McTominay, who is probably our worst footballer.
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Is that supposed to invalidate everything he said?
 
VidaRed said:
Ole got sacked because of these players.
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Well. Last fall is sort of an enigma really. We came of 2nd place (even do that was a bit flattering) and things was looking on the up.

Maybe it was the euros or Ronaldo or just many players out of form or Pogba or Ole thinking they could challange or whatever the reason the collapse was astonishing and whatever Ralf was thinking as a manager was perplexing.

So.You can always say players, and I do think they hold way to much power, but all of this is not in their interest either — so yeah its them and then theres all the reason way they are not performing.
 
When will you understand that this has nothing to do with the managers, Shaw,Harry, Rashford, Fred, McT,Martial do we need to go further. Nothing will change while the are the go to guys.
 
Irwin99 said:
Actually we sorta did considering that that message didn't apparently get through to the board who reminded us that this squad finished 2nd a bit back. People still parrot this achievement even on here, ignoring that we were set up to play a very specific way which suited the players we have.

Ralf did recommend a restructure and buying players before they turn into superstars worth in excess of 100 million. Also a rebuild in the same manner of Klopp at Liverpool. Seems sensible advice to me.
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Dastardly ole playing a way that suits the players ... Every knows the only pure tactic is the opposite one to the squads strengths !
 
Greck said:
Yes, the the two statements are farfetched rationales to suggest ETH was why Ralf was let go. Simple saying he didn't care about Ralf is fair, blaming him for Ralf's departure is make believe. It was never a Ralf vs ETH, pick one thing. It's the definition of unfair to pin it on someone who wasn't even a part of the club when early indications already pointed to Ralf being marginalised.
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I agree with you. There’s no evidence that ETH said he didn’t want to work with Ragnick. He was an outsider at the time who barely knew the guy. It’s the club who had long decided they wanted to get rid of him, and Ten Hag just went along with it. His exact response in his first presser about Ralf’s consultancy role was “That is on the club.”
 
Crashoutcassius said:
Dastardly ole playing a way that suits the players ... Every knows the only pure tactic is the opposite one to the squads strengths !
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Hey if you were happy watching United play every opponent as the plucky underdog looking to hit teams on the counter and never win any trophies then good on you, however, even Ole wanted to transition to a more attacking style last season and we all saw what happened there.

The majority of the squad he left is just not a team you can win a league with sadly. You're not winning titles with Fred, McTominay, Dalot/AWB and Shaw.
 
Ralph1386 said:
I agree with you. There’s no evidence that ETH said he didn’t want to work with Rangnick. He was an outsider at the time who barely knew the guy. It’s the club who had long decided they wanted to get rid of him, and Ten Hag just went along with it. His exact response in his first presser about Ralf’s consultancy role was “That is on the club.”
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It's obvious that Murtough don't want him at the club as an advisor once he said everything in public. As a consultant he was a threat to Murtough. RR should never have been appointed interim manager. John Murtough should never have been appointed DOF. RR should have been the DOF.
Most people accept that as a manager he did a terrible job and it's the same usual suspects who was the Ole in brigade who say that ETH never wanted him.
It's utterly stupid to even think that the club got rid of a consultant to the DOF because a manager who never met him didn't like him and wanted him gone.
 
Irwin99 said:
Hey if you were happy watching United play every opponent as the plucky underdog looking to hit teams on the counter and never win any trophies then good on you, however, even Ole wanted to transition to a more attacking style last season and we all saw what happened there.

The majority of the squad he left is just not a team you can win a league with sadly. You're not winning titles with Fred, McTominay, Dalot/AWB and Shaw.
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Yep, the squad has never actually looked decent playing proactively. It has now gotten two managers sacked including the one who put it together. I have no doubts the likes of Bruno, Rashford and co can play with 40 yards of space behind the last defender but that inability to be successful with any other style is why we could have played it for another 100 years and still won nothing.
 
Irwin99 said:
Hey if you were happy watching United play every opponent as the plucky underdog looking to hit teams on the counter and never win any trophies then good on you, however, even Ole wanted to transition to a more attacking style last season and we all saw what happened there.

The majority of the squad he left is just not a team you can win a league with sadly. You're not winning titles with Fred, McTominay, Dalot/AWB and Shaw.
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Yeah this, it amazes me how some were so satisfied with being a Poundland Atletico and getting our 66 points second place trophy.
 
R'hllor said:
RR had a chance to take different path just like ETH, instead he took a safe option to chace top 4 bullshit, went against his own ways, completely sold out and at end deservedly got fecked by cnuts we have in the squad.

Think about it, they couldnt press more than 15 min, they couldnt play his initial formation, they didnt like trainings later in the day or some bullshit, they didnt like that couldnt hide in the shadows because RR didnt let them and what he did, he abandoned his ways to adjust and adapt to that bunch of fecks, he got what he deserved. Doesnt mean that he wasnt wrong regarding them, maybe.
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Will ETH do the same thing? Anyone thinks with self preservation in mind and we know these guys aren't good enough and are untrainable. We saw that with Ragnick but we all said that's because they knew he wouldn't be there long term. Not sure about that anymore to be honest.
 
giggs-beckham said:
Will ETH do the same thing? Anyone thinks with self preservation in mind and we know these guys aren't good enough and are untrainable. We saw that with Rangnick but we all said that's because they knew he wouldn't be there long term. Not sure about that anymore to be honest.
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Depends of his next few decisions, he already fecked up by picking those feckers, giving them clean slate, guy wanted to form his own opinion about them, just wasted time with it, he would have better success to pick some hungry, willing to learn/develop and run youngsters, on low wages, at least fans wouldnt sit here and thinking how they stealing a leaving.
 
Greck said:
Yes, the the two statements are farfetched rationales to suggest ETH was why Ralf was let go. Simple saying he didn't care about Ralf is fair, blaming him for Ralf's departure is make believe. It was never a Ralf vs ETH, pick one thing.
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It was pretty widely reported that Ten Hag had no interest in working with Rangnick. Why else would United have sacked him only a few months after giving him a 2 year consultancy deal?

It's the definition of unfair to pin it on someone who wasn't even a part of the club when early indications already pointed to Ralf being marginalised.
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Well Erik wasn't a part of the club but it's likely that negotiations with him started shortly after Rangnick was hired. December/January.
 
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