Sickening feeling. We basically bottled it.
Two bad points dropped
- Thread starter Ole's_toe_poke
- Start date
We were shit, they were shit. But like the fulham game, when you are in a winning position late on, to cave in like that twice in a few weeks is alarming. It smacks of a collective mental fragility amongst the team when there is a bit of pressure on to keep your head, your shape and see it out, it's bread and butter stuff and needs to be addressed big time and quickly. That's two massive kicks in the bollox and it's only week 4 of the season, sounds like a normal start to a United season.... oh yeah and Evra does'nt look right at all, perhaps his shit from the world cup is having an impact and an interrupted pre-season. 8 points from 12 is not a disaster so far in black and white, especially having had two tricky away fixtures but the nature of the points dropped is obviously the concern. Positives, Berbatov was excellent again, I think that was important.
We're scoring goals atleast...3 goals in 4 out of 5 games... Cut out these mistakes at the back and jobs a good un. There's plenty of positives to take from our first 5 games of the season and I'm sure this will all be put down as a blip if we turnover Rangers and Liverpool this week...Chelsea will drop silly points this season too...it's the premierleague
We have had a good start.
Played 4. Won 2. Drawn 2.
And we've gotten 2 of the hardest away ties out of the way already.
Evra played like a land mine victim and was responsible for the first goal,only a twonk trys to overhead kick a ball when hes one of the last defenders,if he stays on his feet he would have had no problem,hes not been great at all this season to be honest.
Nevilles a great servant to the club ,but thats it, as a full back he would probably struggle to get in any other premiership side
I did worry that Vidic was going to snap cahill in half after they had their altercation (i wish he fecking had)and get sent off at least then we would have had an excuse .
Its been a weird weekend last night i watched a re run of the 1999 final against Bayern (they show it every week on aljazeera sport 7) and it showed the Bayern fans at the end, feckin hell guys and gals ,we've never had it that bad and we never can (bagsy a can of petrol or a noose if we do)
Its been a bad day at the office but for any of us unfortunate enough to remember alan fecking sunderland in 1979 its doesnt even come close to pain.
Nevilles a great servant to the club ,but thats it, as a full back he would probably struggle to get in any other premiership side
I did worry that Vidic was going to snap cahill in half after they had their altercation (i wish he fecking had)and get sent off at least then we would have had an excuse .
Its been a weird weekend last night i watched a re run of the 1999 final against Bayern (they show it every week on aljazeera sport 7) and it showed the Bayern fans at the end, feckin hell guys and gals ,we've never had it that bad and we never can (bagsy a can of petrol or a noose if we do)
Its been a bad day at the office but for any of us unfortunate enough to remember alan fecking sunderland in 1979 its doesnt even come close to pain.
Indeed. But why? What was wrong?
Now THAT was pain...
Even watching it on ESPN classics was bad. I'm sure glad I wasn't old enough then.Everton at Goodison Park - yes, it's a game we'd like to win, and yes, from the position we were in, we should have won, we bottled it and that's a worry.
However, putting it in a bit of perspective, Everton at Home is a tough fixture for anyone in the league, and there will be other big teams dropping points here before the season is out.
Secondly, Fulham and Everton away are both tricky fixtures. Yes, we'd expect to win, but a draw is hardly the end of the world.
To those getting upset that Chelsea are four points ahead, look at who they've played. Stoke, Wigan, West Brom and West Ham - all teams that we would expect to beat comfortably as well.
Don't panic, there's a long way to go this season, we're doing okay. A bit tighter at the back, we're scoring goals, Nani and Berba are playing a lot better than last season, things are okay.
However, putting it in a bit of perspective, Everton at Home is a tough fixture for anyone in the league, and there will be other big teams dropping points here before the season is out.
Secondly, Fulham and Everton away are both tricky fixtures. Yes, we'd expect to win, but a draw is hardly the end of the world.
To those getting upset that Chelsea are four points ahead, look at who they've played. Stoke, Wigan, West Brom and West Ham - all teams that we would expect to beat comfortably as well.
Don't panic, there's a long way to go this season, we're doing okay. A bit tighter at the back, we're scoring goals, Nani and Berba are playing a lot better than last season, things are okay.
They are tricky fixtures but a serious EPL title contender is expected to win the majority of these matches. Im sick of people who are happy with 1 point against these 'mighty' sides. FFS their best players are Zamora, Felliani and co, not Villa, Cristiano Ronaldo and Milito.
What an awful feeling. Two goal lead with the time left, we shouldn't be droppings points.
I fear for the lads. SAF must've gone ballistic in the dressing room. I'd give an arm and a leg to see what happened
I completely agree mate. Being United, being a serious contender for Honours, I think we all would expect us to beat both of these sides. It's these away games where the league title gets decided - last season for example, dropping points away at Everton, Blackburn, etc. cost us.
I'm just saying that they are the sort of teams that can cause some of the bigger teams problems, especially at their home grounds, so a point isn't the end of the world. We'd expect to win sure, we're United, we expect to win every game we play, but a point isn't the end of the world.
exactly what my chelsea supporting mate said
really happy with the second half performance and berbatovs form so yea..really annoying we could well be level on top..
I'm going to be honest, I felt it in my waters as soon as they started running down the left in the 91st minute at 3-2 that they were going to get another.
I was shocked at the way we fell apart after the first Everton goal. The really scary thing is in the dying seconds Everton could have even taken all the points.
We missed some good chances to finish Everton off as well. Nani blasted high and wide when we could have squared the ball. Nani had a good game but it was a typical "well we're 3-1 up we are home and dry so it won't matter too much if I miss".
We paid for our, dare I say it, arrogance. 3-1 up 90 minutes played, three points in the bag. Even when they scored we reacted as if it was a just a consolation goal.
To be fair to Everton many sides, in previous seasons, at 3-1 down against United it would have broken their spirit but once you start getting a reputation for conceding late goals the opposing teams will always have hope.
We missed some good chances to finish Everton off as well. Nani blasted high and wide when we could have squared the ball. Nani had a good game but it was a typical "well we're 3-1 up we are home and dry so it won't matter too much if I miss".
We paid for our, dare I say it, arrogance. 3-1 up 90 minutes played, three points in the bag. Even when they scored we reacted as if it was a just a consolation goal.
To be fair to Everton many sides, in previous seasons, at 3-1 down against United it would have broken their spirit but once you start getting a reputation for conceding late goals the opposing teams will always have hope.
Same here. You just knew it was going to happen.
I was hoping the players would have kept possession by just knocking the ball around. But I'm not sure which player decided to pump it into the corner for Berbatov to chase. Idiot.
Like who?
Agree
You'd rather we lost like last season? League titles are some times won by a single point you know. It's so important to not get beat for as long as possible.
Exactly. 2 fixtures that cost us dear last time with defeats.
League titles are lost by single point as well. Goodison Park was a place where we had a pretty good history but it's definitely not looking any good now, is it? Serious title contenders shouldn't be losing....sorry, throwing away points like this.
We love our players, especially the ones has been with us for a long time. people has been against Giggs on his rough patches, saying he should move on. Meh, even back in 2003 we wanted him out. He is still proving us wrong. But don't think many can defend Gary Neville on his performance last evening.
We love our players, especially the ones has been with us for a long time. people has been against Giggs on his rough patches, saying he should move on. Meh, even back in 2003 we wanted him out. He is still proving us wrong. But don't think many can defend Gary Neville on his performance last evening.
I agree.
It wasnt a bad result to be honest. We were kinda unlucky but they deserve the draws as they are quality sides and kept the pressure up until the end. Chelsea and Arsenal will also struggle to win at Fulham and Everton. It's still early days and we are very good at chasing the leaders.
Unprofessional. The way we bottled it really is.
Last year Bayern, Fulham and Everton, they are all down to us throwing away games for no reason.
I really don't know why we stop playing football after going in front comfortably, also the display from our fullbacks (especially from Evra) is concerning.
Last year Bayern, Fulham and Everton, they are all down to us throwing away games for no reason.
I really don't know why we stop playing football after going in front comfortably, also the display from our fullbacks (especially from Evra) is concerning.
No I'd rather see us win. Everton are no push overs but we should have been able to go there and grab the 3 points. I really can't see the wisdom behind the '1 point against Everton is good enough' theory. FFS we are Manchester United. I'll be happy if we grab 1 point against Barca in their own backyard garden and not against Everton with the Clown haired bean pole and their bunch of United rejects.
Evra went off before we conceded the 2 goals I think.
Anyway, it was just bad luck in a way. We did play football. We were still attacking but credit for Fulham and Everton for kept going. We would received tonnes of praise if we did the same thing.
Well I thought his performances overall for us this season have been underwhelming (since he came back from South Africa surprisingly), especially defensively.
Hopefully he will quickly get back into form.
He had an 'eventful' World Cup. He didnt have a proper pre-season. It's a good reason to start the season slow IMO.He didnt play too bad actually.
The concern was our focus in injury time in the two games. And they were not his mistakes that lead to the 3 goals. It was 2 high crosses and a scrambled goal which was deflected off Scholesy. The fullbacks arent at fault at all.
So there I was around the 85 minute mark dozing off (I had gone to sleep at 4am and the match kicked off at 745am locally) and was half awoken by Cahill's goal. I was like well there's no way they'll score a third and just as soon as my eyes had closed there was Everton attacking and a third goal. I couldn't believe it. Surely I was dreaming.
over reaction yesterday by me.
As a team they should have been ashamed yesterday...and I think they would have been because it was a very unprofessional performance.
They will learn....
Am not sure what about yesterday constitutes the performance as unprofessional. Yes, made a couple mistakes but, is it unprofessional then every time we score through another team making a mistake?
It is as Fletch put it - desperately disappointing but, nothing I saw that was unprofessional. Perhaps mistakes in tactics in hoofing the ball up and letting them come at us but, that's about it.
We do need to play till the final whistle while defending a lead much like we are known to play till the final whistle when we are chasing a goal for the result.
Also, don't agree with the comments we need to be more ruthless and keep playing at a high intensity once we are comfortably ahead. We need to play smart and within ourselves. It's a long season and if we can conserve energy and avoid injuries seeing a game out by slowing down the game and just controlling it - good. Just adjust our tactics so if we are going down that route then at least make sure we are better at retaining the ball rather than relying on our defense to see the game out. Mistakes can happen in an instant as we have now experienced twice already in this young season.
We got scored on once yesterday pushing for a goal and we almost got scored again at the death. Trying to push for more goals for the sake of being ruthless is not the answer. We had our chances and didn't take them at 3-1 but, that shouldn't have mattered, it doesn't matter in most 99% of the games.
It is as Fletch put it - desperately disappointing but, nothing I saw that was unprofessional. Perhaps mistakes in tactics in hoofing the ball up and letting them come at us but, that's about it.
We do need to play till the final whistle while defending a lead much like we are known to play till the final whistle when we are chasing a goal for the result.
Also, don't agree with the comments we need to be more ruthless and keep playing at a high intensity once we are comfortably ahead. We need to play smart and within ourselves. It's a long season and if we can conserve energy and avoid injuries seeing a game out by slowing down the game and just controlling it - good. Just adjust our tactics so if we are going down that route then at least make sure we are better at retaining the ball rather than relying on our defense to see the game out. Mistakes can happen in an instant as we have now experienced twice already in this young season.
We got scored on once yesterday pushing for a goal and we almost got scored again at the death. Trying to push for more goals for the sake of being ruthless is not the answer. We had our chances and didn't take them at 3-1 but, that shouldn't have mattered, it doesn't matter in most 99% of the games.
I'm still bewildered at how Arteta sat in the box unmarked as the ball fell to him. Was Scholes marking anyone? Because I'm quite sure Carrick would have been slaughtered if he had been on the pitch.
Scholes has earnt a few liberties which Carricl has not. Simple as.
felt exactly like this , and to be honest when they broke at 3-3 i thought theyd score again.......
thats what I was getting at. In my books it is unprofessional to think we have the points in the bag and mentally switch off, which we did.
We have done it twice so far. I'm betting the team won't do it again.
Everton Saturday were poor. We made them look a lot better than they were. A team without proper forwards most of the match? and we struggled against them. In the second when they tired we began to dominate. Then threw it all away because we forgot that we needed to play till the final whistle.
Fulham was stronger and will pose some problems.
That's horseshit though. If Scholes was marking another player then someone left Arteta alone. If he was just standing there not marking anyone then he has to take some blame regardless of his being a legend or not.
It was also a problem last season, that although we're winning the game, as soon as the other team starts to press, we're shitting it. Its a mental thing imo
are we on a meltdown? with only just 4 games in the season? hmmm...
I'd say this looks worse due to Chelsea's ridiculously easy start to the season.
Just let things play out.
Just let things play out.
The most concerning thing for me, as compared to Chelsea is that we seem to "lack the hunger" to really push home any dominance or advantage.
After going 3 up, we wasted 1 or 2 promising attacks with Nani skying the ball and Berbatov not being able to beat the GK (when both probably had a better chance trying to tee up a team mate).
I am in no way blaming them (dont get me wrong - this is not a "knee jerk, find a scapegoat post), but the entire team seems to have the mentality of "going into the comfort zone" after we score 3 or 4 goals. How many times have we bollocked a side in a competitive match over the last year or 2 by scoring more then 5? - and I have seen us dominate quite a few sides, only for the last 20-30 mins to "run out comfortably" without any real notable action.
I have no doubt in my mind that teams have picked up on this attitude, and started pushing us backward. We should have closed out this match comfortably tbh. Apart from Gaz struggling against Pienaar and Everton dominating the early stages, we were in control and the lack of any real hunger in the final quarter of matches we are leading is a tad bit complacent/worrying.
At the end of the season, the title run in will be close and it will be really frustrating if we end up a point or 2 short, thinking back to this match especially.
I hope SAF sorts out the issue soon.
(on a positive note: Fulham and Everton away are both games we lost last season).
After going 3 up, we wasted 1 or 2 promising attacks with Nani skying the ball and Berbatov not being able to beat the GK (when both probably had a better chance trying to tee up a team mate).
I am in no way blaming them (dont get me wrong - this is not a "knee jerk, find a scapegoat post), but the entire team seems to have the mentality of "going into the comfort zone" after we score 3 or 4 goals. How many times have we bollocked a side in a competitive match over the last year or 2 by scoring more then 5? - and I have seen us dominate quite a few sides, only for the last 20-30 mins to "run out comfortably" without any real notable action.
I have no doubt in my mind that teams have picked up on this attitude, and started pushing us backward. We should have closed out this match comfortably tbh. Apart from Gaz struggling against Pienaar and Everton dominating the early stages, we were in control and the lack of any real hunger in the final quarter of matches we are leading is a tad bit complacent/worrying.
At the end of the season, the title run in will be close and it will be really frustrating if we end up a point or 2 short, thinking back to this match especially.
I hope SAF sorts out the issue soon.
(on a positive note: Fulham and Everton away are both games we lost last season).