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United linked with van Gaal in the meeja

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Kill 'em all

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How do we know the staff LVG want's to bring are any better than what we have? The lads in charge at present have vast experience of the club and have played under the greatest manager and many top coaches over the years. They all have great CV's.
I'm sure van Gaal's coaches have much great CVs as well, as coaches and not players. They have coached some of the greatest talent around with this experience spanning many years. The current staff may have been great players but they have no experience in terms of how to get the best out of players and things like these.

Then there's the other thing. What happens when Giggs and co decide to go against something van Gaal wants to implement? Let's say they don't like his style of football, what happens if they all go against him? We would end up another season wasted out of the champions league while our rivals are getting stronger all the time.

Giggs has no managerial experience, our current coaches don't have any coaching experience. Make the logical choice.

edit: not to mention the style of play that van Gaal would want to implement at Manchester United which is totally different from Sir Alex's style.
 

Plugsy

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The worst thing though is that if Sunderland turn us over at the weekend these same people will switch to "maybe it isn't a good idea to give Giggs the job". This is how much of a whimsical gamble they'd be willing to take with the club.
 

Bader

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Man utd have every right to reject and ask questions about those 5 staff members

We need more than 1 staff members to continue as they know the ins and outs of the clun.

He can't rip apart our successful staff members who do great work behind the scenes for last 5-10 years( all those titles we won. Fergies said that he wanted loyal staff members and kept thm at this club for many years.

Most mangers bring max 3 staff members. We have to ask questions on why is this extra demand? Are these staff members coming just for a favour and because he just likes them? Most importantly, are they better than staff members in the same role currently?

I think it is great to debate this because what if it were a bad season like this season? We will have to replace those 5 staff members.

People say, who those coaches? Or how are they so important if we lost this season? Well, those staff members do their jobs and the manager does his. It was bit their fault, these were the same staff members as the last 5-10 seasons which we were successful in. Some of them here do a great job:

Fitness coaches
-Chris Woods (done a spectacular job with De gea)
-Psyhhologist(maybe)
-many morr who we do not see

You also have to ask what do these new staff members bring to the table?

You think this is a bad thing when woody denies Van Gaal what he wants? If woody accepts Van Gaal's demands and then replaces most of the staff, what will you say about woody then? You will mock him and say he was too soft.

Woody looks like he is somebody's bitch to be totally frank.He needs to stamp down his authority and show he can't be pushed around. We do not want a 'yes man 'as our Chairman!
 

Skills

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I don't get why the coaching staff having spent 95% of their career under Fergie and doing things his way, is seen as advantageous to their coaching/management career. Fergie was quite obviously a genius, and it'll probably go massively wrong for someone who tries to copy exactly what SAF did without being SAF themselves.
 

PlayerOne

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This shouldn't even be a point of contention. Some managers bring in a dozen staff members & more, never mind five. It's unhealthy for the club's future if our board wants the '92 guys in place solely for PR reasons (or even because mistakes were made in Moyes' reign regarding fired staff). We can't afford to allow a 'soft' coup by old boys to happen, one which potentially undermines managers unless those boys are given jobs.
Spot on Steve. At the end of the day the responsibility will all be on him so he should do whatever he feels to help him succeed.
 

Lu Tze

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I don't get why the coaching staff having spent 95% of their career under Fergie and doing things his way, is seen as advantageous to their coaching/management career. Fergie was quite obviously a genius, and it'll probably go massively wrong for someone who tries to copy exactly what SAF did without being SAF themselves.
I agree 100%. We need fresh ideas and purpose, not pale imitations of Fergie. If anything we need to put an end to the Fergie era and renew the club and the ideas surrounding our football in order to move forward, rather than endlessly attempting to emulate past greatness like Liverpool. Moyes can be seen as the sputtering end to the Fergie era/style at United - LVG would start his own era, molded in his own image.
 

Plugsy

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Why doesn't every club just appoint as manager whichever former player has the most medals?

It's foolproof, isn't it?
 

united_99

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This season can't end soon enough! First I had to cheer for City/Chelsea and now I even have to cheer for Gus fecking Poyet against my own team I guess!
 

DomesticTadpole

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I don't get why the coaching staff having spent 95% of their career under Fergie and doing things his way, is seen as advantageous to their coaching/management career. Fergie was quite obviously a genius, and it'll probably go massively wrong for someone who tries to copy exactly what SAF did without being SAF themselves.
The fact that in the latter years Fergie didn't even take the coaching is another point. They were being coached by Fergie years ago when football was different and team tactics were different. You would worry that they want to take the team back to then, when it isn't appropriate now.
 

Sultan

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Of course my thinking is from the heart. I'm a United fan, and I'd love it if one of our own was to be successful.
 

Sandikan

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Even if Giggsy wins these last games 4-0 he shouldn't be manager! It's madness, however much of a legend he is.

How would he know how to go about getting players in, coaching them , tactics etc. He has to learn all this stuff.His name and legendary status won't be enough.
 

PlayerOne

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Of course my thinking is from the heart. I'm a United fan, and I'd love it if one of our own was to be successful.
I don't blame you but I don't think we can afford to get it wrong again, that's why the club is opting for a 'safe' option. I would love Giggs as a number two to whoever takes over and hopefully in a few years Giggs will be ready for the role.
 

LR7

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How do we know the staff LVG want's to bring are any better than what we have? The lads in charge at present have vast experience of the club and have played under the greatest manager and many top coaches over the years. They all have great CV's.
LvG (or any manager) would need a few of his own men of course but I personally don't see why he needs to bring a Physio and a fitness coach. Fergie left all that infrastructure in place. It means that if there are more managerial changes than expected there isn't constantly too much upheaval each time. Were far too big a club for all of that to be chopping and changing all that time.
For me the class of '92 should be kept on in some capacity.

Also where did the brainless idea being bandied about that Giggs can't possibly have any tactical knowledge because he's only ever played under one manager come from? So many people posting that baseless argument. He'll have studied and implemented different tactics whilst doing his coaching badges.
 

Plugsy

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Also where did the brainless idea being bandied about that Giggs can't possibly have any tactical knowledge because he's only ever played under one manager come from? So many people posting that baseless argument. He'll have studied and implemented different tactics whilst doing his coaching badges.
I think Jamie Redknapp has his coaching badges too
 

Revan

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Man utd have every right to reject and ask questions about those 5 staff members
They should not give him the job if they aren't happy for him to get his own staff.

We need more than 1 staff members to continue as they know the ins and outs of the clun.
Probably. Very debatable.

He can't rip apart our successful staff members who do great work behind the scenes for last 5-10 years( all those titles we won. Fergies said that he wanted loyal staff members and kept thm at this club for many years.
Except that they haven't done anything behind the scenes. Giggs is a legend, so is Scholes, but neither have experience in coaching. Neville and Butt are inexperienced too and have left the club as players a decade ago.

Most mangers bring max 3 staff members. We have to ask questions on why is this extra demand? Are these staff members coming just for a favour and because he just likes them? Most importantly, are they better than staff members in the same role currently?
Moyes brought 10 staff members. 5 aren't many and most of the managers bring more than 3.

I think it is great to debate this because what if it were a bad season like this season? We will have to replace those 5 staff members.
Yep. Like how every club does when they sack the manager.

People say, who those coaches? Or how are they so important if we lost this season? Well, those staff members do their jobs and the manager does his. It was bit their fault, these were the same staff members as the last 5-10 seasons which we were successful in. Some of them here do a great job:

Fitness coaches
-Chris Woods (done a spectacular job with De gea)
-Psyhhologist(maybe)
-many morr who we do not see

You also have to ask what do these new staff members bring to the table?
That's completely wrong. Van Gaal's biggest strength is his coaching, and it won't be that great if we don't let him get his proven coaches but give him a bunch of newbies to work with him. Woods did good (although Steele was better anyway) but I can guarantee that Van Gaal's keeper coach is easily better than him. If you know Van Gaal's tactics (which you should if you're talking about how he should not get his coaches here) then you should know how important is that the keeper to play good with his feet in his system. The keeper is almost like a third central defender who plays almost on line with the two CB. He starts actions for the team, team passes more than 20 time in average the ball to him. Have we seen De Gea doing so yet? No. Who better to teach him that than the coach who has worked for 2 decades with Van Gaal and has teached keepers like VDS, Reina and Valdez, all very known for their great play with feet.

You think this is a bad thing when woody denies Van Gaal what he wants? If woody accepts Van Gaal's demands and then replaces most of the staff, what will you say about woody then? You will mock him and say he was too soft.

Woody looks like he is somebody's bitch to be totally frank.He needs to stamp down his authority and show he can't be pushed around. We do not want a 'yes man 'as our Chairman!
Every manager gets his own staff. In Moyes case it was a big deal cause our staff was better and more experienced than his staff. Here it shouldn't be, Van Gaal's staff are better and more experienced than some ex players who have 3 years of coaching combined within them. Van Gaal's main strength is coaching and he needs people with whom is comfortable and knows them well to work.

You let him get his own staff or you simply get someone else here. THere is no middle way.
 

Sultan

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I completely understand where you guys are coming from with your Giggs concerns. :wenger:
 

Amir

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Yep, like I said if he's a success it would be great - like if Moyes would've been who was another long term manager. If he's not, he would've had his shot and there's no cloud hanging over our future managers with everyone pining for Giggs to be given his chance.
Except that if this is such a great idea and Giggs could be a future manager, getting the job too early could kill his prospects. And this is just too early and not a healthy situation. It calls for something else.
 

Bojan11

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LvG (or any manager) would need a few of his own men of course but I personally don't see why he needs to bring a Physio and a fitness coach. Fergie left all that infrastructure in place. It means that if there are more managerial changes than expected there isn't constantly too much upheaval each time. Were far too big a club for all of that to be chopping and changing all that time.
For me the class of '92 should be kept on in some capacity.

Also where did the brainless idea being bandied about that Giggs can't possibly have any tactical knowledge because he's only ever played under one manager come from? So many people posting that baseless argument. He'll have studied and implemented different tactics whilst doing his coaching badges.

Looking at this season, I can see why he needs to bring his fitness coach. And why shouldn't he be allowed to?

I'm sick of this Giggs talk. It's mostly rival clubs lapping it up whilst some idiots falling for the bandwagon. These same idiots jumped on the Moyes bandwagon. Saying he is the next Fergie and will do stuff the Man Utd way.

I guarantee we would have won that game on Saturday with Moyes in charge. We slowly turning into Liverpool. Can't stand this Man Utd way nonsense.
 

Bader

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Why doesn't every club just appoint as manager whichever former player has the most medals?

It's foolproof, isn't it?
Not many other clubs have a 'Giggsy' in their team ( I say a Giggsy because he is a onr of a kind). No other team has a player who had started from 13 years of age until 40, and playing for the same club.

No other club has player who has the experience of 20 years and has won everything (13 Pls, 2CL, some Fa cups and league cups etc). This experience of his just got even more useful when he literally was play 20 years under the greatest manager there is.

Fergie and Muelsteen have openly spoken out that he would be a perfect manager too. Yep, I will listen to some Cafe members over then two.

Come on man...
 

Raees

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Repost.

Hand on heart most of us would love for Giggsy to be United manager one day and be our very own Guardiola. Possibly manage the club for a couple of decades. But I just think some including Lindegaard are taking a rather simplistic view of things. It's great that Giggsy can give rousing speeches and uplift the player morale.. But that's not all a manager's job entails, those are just tertiary requirements. The most important and basic thing about being a manager is setting up the team, employing the right tactics, have alternate backup plans in-game if those don't work etc - mostly stuff that happens on the football field rather than off it or in the dressing room. I'm not qualified enough to judge how good Ryan is in that regard but we can make an educated guess. And at least on that front he might have some more learning to do to be compared with someone like Pep.

Giggsy has only experienced the finer technical details under Sir Alex and Moyes in his whole playing career. For sure he would've learnt a lot from the great man but I doubt he picked anything up from Moyes' tenure. This is what worries me the most. It's really simple - if a person has only eaten oranges, he'll think it's the best fruit ever. Yet he's never even tried mangoes, apples or strawberries to make a proper judgement. He's experienced a fairly isolated environment so his imagination for the team might be limited and that could prove to be fatal against continental coaches. What he should ideally do is further his education under a genius tactician like Van Gaal, who is famous for keeping his door open to the staff and players. Some of his pupils are renowned coaches and 3 of them won the highest club honours - Mourinho, Guardiola, Rijkaard. Giggy could pick up so many different things from Louis which will help him develop a deeper understating for the game and in the longer run it'll only make him a better tactician.

It's getting overlooked a bit but what makes Guardiola unique isn't just that he coached the Barcelona reserve team. He vastly improved his tactical nous being in different leagues and learning from so many different coaches. He didn't just learn from Van Gaal. He learnt from Cruyff, he experienced Italian tactics with Roma and Brescia. He played in Mexico. And took a one year sabbatical travelling to Argentina, Brazil, Uruguay including mentoring by Bielsa. He experienced so many different footballing cultures and probably learnt about a million different minor details from some of the best tacticians around. This is why I think it's premature for Giggsy to branded as the new Pep. We don't even need to look further to gauge the benefits of having a varied football education. There's a great example in Liverpool with Rodgers - who's a different breed to most other British + Irish managers (no offence intended whatsoever). After a brief playing career he scoured Spain to learn a gamut of different things and that's helped solidify his knowledge of the game - and made him arguably one of the best tacticians around.

Giggsy will be United manager one day - that's for certain. But I just think waiting a few more years and gaining a thorough knowledge of the game will make him a better, more complete manager. If Giggsy keeps an open mind he has a great chance to learn from Louis if he's appointed, broaden his horizons a bit and get some distance from familiar surroundings, talk to some other great tacticians like Sacchi, Bielsa, Capello and absorb their experiences, if possible travel to South America and learn about their philosophies, coach for a bit in Germany or Italy or Spain. Then come back in 4-5 years when he's imbibed every little detail. That'll massively help him in setting up the team to counter any opposition game plan. He'll be what 45 in in 4 years ? That really young in managerial terms. No need to rush things now with a half cooked meal. He could work out great given the next season, but all we know it could be an utter disaster and scar his chances to be a United manager in the future.
Spot on. Anyone calling for Giggsy needs their head testing in my opinion. This team is crying for a brilliant tactical mind to come in and provide a new modern blueprint and have the balls to get rid of a few... Giggsy and the old crew are too attached to the current crop. They should go abroad and widen their knowledge.
 

Plugsy

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Not many other clubs have 'Giggsy' in their team. No othrr team has a player who had started from 13 years of age until 40, and playing for the same club.

No other club has player who has the experience of 20 years and has won everything (13 Pls, 2CL, some Fa cups and league cups etc). This experience of his just got even more useful when he literally was play 20 years under the greatest manager there is.

Come on man...
Yeah, maybe he can just out-medal the opposition managers

"What a brilliant tactical switch, he's tossed his 1994 FA Cup medal onto the pitch,the opposition are stunned into inaction"
 

Bojan11

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Not many other clubs have 'Giggsy' in their team. No othrr team has a player who had started from 13 years of age until 40, and playing for the same club.

No other club has player who has the experience of 20 years and has won everything (13 Pls, 2CL, some Fa cups and league cups etc). This experience of his just got even more useful when he literally was play 20 years under the greatest manager there is.

Come on man...
There is, so why doesn't he go elsewhere and take it? Go to championship club and start there.

How many of our ex players who won loads of medals became good managers? Bruce maybe is decent. Hughes could be considered a failure. These players had SAF as manager that doesn't make them great managers.

Come on man.....
 

PlayerOne

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One other thing about keeping the class '92, what if they disagree with Van Gaal's philosophy? We already know how strongly Van Gaal feels about his philosophy and we already know what Giggs and Scholes think about the way United should play. It could become an issue when things aren't going well.
 

Kill 'em all

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I hope our board isn't applying the reasoning or lack of reasoning of some of you sentimentalists. I would fear for the future of our club if they do. This is no time for big risks. We're in a transition and we need an experienced manager to run that transition.
 

Plugsy

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There is, so why doesn't he go elsewhere and take it? Go to championship club and start there.

How many of our ex players who won loads of medals became good managers? Bruce maybe is decent. Hughes could be considered a failure. These players had SAF as manager that doesn't make them great managers.

Come on man.....
Scary thing is both Bruce and Hughes are by far stronger candidates than Giggs.
 

Skills

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LvG (or any manager) would need a few of his own men of course but I personally don't see why he needs to bring a Physio and a fitness coach. Fergie left all that infrastructure in place. It means that if there are more managerial changes than expected there isn't constantly too much upheaval each time. Were far too big a club for all of that to be chopping and changing all that time.
For me the class of '92 should be kept on in some capacity.
Physio yes, but I'm guessing a fitness coach is pretty important to the way a team plays. This might not apply to Van Gaal, but I'm guessing the right fitness coach is pretty important for a Klopp team? You can't press like they do without having immensely high levels of fitness, and I'm guessing having a coach that the manager trusts to deliver that for him is pretty important.
 

LR7

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Looking at this season, I can see why he needs to bring his fitness coach. And why shouldn't he be allowed to?

I'm sick of this Giggs talk. It's mostly rival clubs lapping it up whilst some idiots falling for the bandwagon. These same idiots jumped on the Moyes bandwagon. Saying he is the next Fergie and will do stuff the Man Utd way.

I guarantee we would have won that game on Saturday with Moyes in charge. We slowly turning into Liverpool. Can't stand this Man Utd way nonsense.
Our fitness was poor this season because Moyes made our players do more running than they've ever done in their lives. Not because our fitness coaches (who are part of the infrastructure Fergie built) are inadequate.

I don't think Giggs should be the next manager either I just think he should stay on the coaching staff and learn under LvGs tutelage.

I was vehemently opposed to Moyes being appointed for years so doing even put me in that last category.
 

Mister Ed

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You've made up your mind after one game? I'm not even going ask how you've come to those conclusions with the rest of your post.
I don't come up with that on the basis of the Norwich game. i come up with that on the basis of Giggs having 0 managerial experience and no proper training as a coach. At least Pep Guardiola had a proper training as a coach and he had a bit of experience coaching on the lower youth levels. With Ryan it is absolutley nothing, no experience, no training, just the fact he has been here at the club for a long time and he looks good in the suit.

I'd have said those things before he coached a single aswell. You want to know how I make my conclusions, because I use the grey mass in my head called a brain. It doesn't take a genius to know that somebody without any managerial experience or proper training will fail in one of the biggest managerial jobs in the world. According to your logic, we might aswell give the position to Fred the Red, he also knows what the club is about and we haven't seen his management skills yet, so we can't comment on them either. What a load of bullshit and flawed logic !

Before you get to be coach, you had better taken coaching lessons, were they school you about tactics, formations, playing systems, the strong points and weak points and finner details of all those matters. They teach you about the psychology of training, what you have to deal with, how you can deal with it. Than it takes years of experience to put those things into practice and you start at the begining, a lower league side, not a powerhouse like Manchester United. You learn on the job build up your set of knowledge, learn from your mistakes, form an own philosphy about football, putting it into practice, learn from the exerpience, adepting your philosphy until you find of working that works, than you specialise in that, you perfect it, you get results with it, you show the world your philosphy and your coaching methods and if a big club wants you than you do it at a big club. That it how it works. Ryan hasn't been through anyone of those steps, I make my assumption he won't be able to tactically outclass any kind of manager that hass, because I believe those things aren't complete bullshit. Because that is the only way Ryan would ever succeed in this job, if all those things, proper training, learning, building up experience, developing an own philosphy are complete bullshit. Ryan hasn't had the time to go through any of those steps, yet why he hasn't got a single chance of succeeding at the challenge of managing Manchester United. I thought this was one of the biggest clubs in the world and one of the most challenging managerial jobs in the world, yet it seems like most suited according to you (and the club) are the ones without any managerial experience at all, that is madness, there is no other word, it is madness !

On top of that, Giggs is biased, he has been a teammate to all of those players for years. Alot of them are his friends. The coach shouldn't be friends with his players, that is an unhealthy situation. Football is about competition, the one best suited to the posituion is the one that should play, and the one best suited depends, on quality, attitude and about the system in which you want to play. It doesn't depend on who you like more or less. he has already said, the hardest thing was deciding who would start and who wouldn't, not in the sense that he didn't know, in the sense that it was hard for him to look them in the eye and tell them they weren't going to play. He said the players didn't sulk or moan, so he was lucky, what about next season, if those decisions will be bread and butter business, how can he do a good job if that is the hardest part ? He'll have to make those decisons day in day out, what will he do if his mates start moaning, if they start sulking. Will he be able to tear them a new one, will he be able to bring up the hammer, the hair dryer. Will he be able to punish his mates if they are late for training because they went out partying into the late hours ? More important will he be able to transfer his mates if they aren't the right players for this club, will he be able to chose a new player that he doesn't know as a person over somebody that has been his teammate for over years ? I don't think those will be easy decisions to make in his position. If your day to day life becomes a series a decisions between your work or your mates than it is likely you'll make some biased decisions in the end.
 
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