Vidic

[HsJ]

He has been a feckin BEAST in defence...

We are extremely lucky to have three of the best defenders in the world in our team...Rio, Vidic and Jesus (Evra).......

 

[KingEric7]

It's the difference between being player of the season and being in the team of the season.

Evra hasn't been at the same level, and more often than not gets a bit overrated on here anyway.

Very strange comment.

On the topic in hand, Vidic has been absolutely monstrous. Rio's form over the last 3 years has been better than what Vidic is currently producing, but Vidic is making a heroic attempt at surpassing him.

 

[Brwned]

Very strange comment.

On the topic in hand, Vidic has been absolutely monstrous. Rio's form over the last 3 years has been better than what Vidic is currently producing, but Vidic is making a heroic attempt at surpassing him.

'Tis very true.

Vidic this season has been on another level to any other player.

And Evra's always overrated, which is fair enough because he's a bloody great player to watch.

 

[uae]

How do you mean Evra is overrated?

 

[Red Pavan]

Major controversy as Brwned labels Evra as being overrated by the caf

 

[Brwned]

How do you mean Evra is overrated?

In that people forget about his defensive mistakes if he goes on a run forward and beats two or three men, before putting in a rubbish cross.

Fantastic full back all round, but he's slightly overrated still.

 

[vuc]

I agree with Brwned. Want proof of this go into the Player Ratings thread for the last game. Evra didn't even play the whole game yet gets higher ratings then Vidic who scored the decisive goal, was a monster and got a clean sheet. Logic?

Evra IS however the best left back in the league by some distance.

 

[afrocentricity]

Christ, Evra is not overrated... you just fail to see his contribution to the team, and (more importantly) our brand of attacking football...

It's all opinions but just because you don't rate him don't assume the rest of the caf overrates him. Some will, some won't and the truth usually lies in the middle, this applies to most of our players (apart from Goggs and The Neviller who are generally underrated by all)

 

[Ruudy10]

The way he played against chelsea, and really has been playing for us this season, is immense. He has been magnificent. And hopefully it will be noticed at the end of the season when the awards are dwelt.

 

[vuc]

Christ, Evra is not overrated... you just fail to see his contribution to the team, and (more importantly) our brand of attacking football...

It's all opinions but just because you don't rate him don't assume the rest of the caf overrates him. Some will, some won't and the truth usually lies in the middle, this applies to most of our players (apart from Goggs and The Neviller who are generally underrated by all)

If that's directed to me then have a look at where I said he is the best left back in the league and then see if I don't rate him.

 

[afrocentricity]

If that's directed to me then have a look at where I said he is the best left back in the league and then see if I don't rate him.

Did you say he was overrated?

 

[Brwned]

Did you say he was overrated?

I didn't say I don't rate him either, best left back in the world and it's not even a contest any more.

Doesn't mean he isn't overrated, IMO of course.

 

[dev1l]

Up to a few months ago I used to think that if we play a keeper, any three defenders and Rio, it would be enough.

It looked as if defensively, we were dependent on Rio.

But Vidic's latest performances made me change up my mind....

 

[afrocentricity]

I didn't say I don't rate him either, best left back in the world and it's not even a contest any more.

Doesn't mean he isn't overrated, IMO of course.

Fair enough, but if you read my post (it was to you) you'll find I just put it all into context. You are probably one of those that underrates him in relation to those you think overate him.... not the end of the world

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I didn't say I don't rate him either, best left back in the world and it's not even a contest any more.

Doesn't mean he isn't overrated, IMO of course.

Do you have a very specific set of criteria for exactly how much "rating" the caf is allowed to give players, whilst still avoiding the accusation of him being over-rated? Cause I have no idea how that might work.

Obviously there's not a footballer in the world who's flawless but it beggars belief that you can call someone the best LB in the world at the same time as calling him over-rated

 

[vuc]

Did you say he was overrated?

I would say on here he is, in that muppets in the ratings threads give him 9's and 10's just because he is Evra or Jesus or God, or whatever he is called these days. Of course he's a great player no denying it but how are people gonna rate him with better ratings then Vidic/Neville/Evans when he went off injured 30 minutes before the end. I don't get it.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I would say on here he is, in that muppets in the ratings threads give him 9's and 10's just because he is Evra or Jesus or God, or whatever he is called these days. Of course he's a great player no denying it but how are people gonna rate him with better ratings then Vidic/Neville/Evans when he went off injured 30 minutes before the end. I don't get it.

Because he player better than Vidic/Neville/Evans, during the hour he was on the pitch.

Seems a bit odd to rate someone more harshly because they got injured.

 

[afrocentricity]

I would say on here he is, in that muppets in the ratings threads give him 9's and 10's just because he is Evra or Jesus or God, or whatever he is called these days. Of course he's a great player no denying it but how are people gonna rate him with better ratings then Vidic/Neville/Evans when he went off injured 30 minutes before the end. I don't get it.

I guess my post was directed at you too then...

 

[vuc]

Because he player better than Vidic/Neville/Evans, during the hour he was on the pitch.

Seems a bit odd to rate someone more harshly because they got injured.

Must be wrong then.

 

[Brwned]

Do you have a very specific set of criteria for exactly how much "rating" the caf is allowed to give players, whilst still avoiding the accusation of him being over-rated? Cause I have no idea how that might work.

Obviously there's not a footballer in the world who's flawless but it beggars belief that you can call someone the best LB in the world at the same time as calling him over-rated

Pretty simple, you look at the ratings thread, and he's overrated match after match.

 

[afrocentricity]

Pogue has a good way of making other posters see sense, I just lose interest... he has a lot of patience, he'd probably be good with kids, and little retarded elfs...

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Pretty simple, you look at the ratings thread, and he's overrated match by match.

Alternatively. You happen to disagree, personally, with how he is rated by everybody else.

Which is not the same thing as being "over-rated" at all.

IMO, someone who is over-rated is a player who gets undue praise from a lot of (slightly less discerning) fans/journos, while a significant proportion of (slightly harder to please) fans/journos have reservations. When any one player generates an overwhelmingly positive consensus, in the way that Evra does, chances are the consensus is correct and the one or two individuals who happen to disagree are likely to be missing something.

 

[Brwned]

Alternatively. You happen to disagree, personally, with how he is rated by everybody else.

Which is not the same thing as being "over-rated" at all.

IMO, someone who is over-rated is a player who gets undue praise from a lot of (slightly less discerning) fans/journos, while a significant proportion of (slightly harder to please) fans/journos have reservations. When any one player generates an overwhelmingly positive consensus, in the way that Evra does, chances are the consensus is correct and the one or two individuals who happen to disagree are likely to be missing something.

So wait, you're trying to say that there isn't a significant portion of (rival, in this case) fans and journos who hold reservations about him being the best left back in the world?

 

[Pogue Mahone]

So wait, you're trying to say that there isn't a significant portion of (rival) fans and journos who hold reservations about him being the best left back in the world?

There will always be rival fans who don't rate United players. There will always be journos who don't rate them either. That's never gonna change.

As Andy Gray said on Sunday "I always think the fans who know best" and the United fans have made their feelings clear on Evra. Well 99.9% of them have anyway.



EDIT: Yeah I know, using Andy Gray as evidence immediately undermines my argument but on this one I think he's correct.

 

[Brwned]

There will always be rival fans who don't rate United players. There will always be journos who don't rate them either. That's never gonna change.

As Andy Gray said on Sunday "I always think the fans who know best" and the United fans have made their feelings clear on Evra. Well 99.9% of them have anyway.

EDIT: Yeah I know, using Andy Gray as evidence immediately undermines my argument but on this one I think he's correct.

It's always true to an extent, but in some circumstances it can get distorted. By that I mean things like how the majority of fans thought that Heinze was a very good player, shown by how he won fans' player of the year in his first season.

Obviously that's diverting away from the topic a bit but the major similarity - their commitment to the cause(on the pitch in Heinze's case, obviously) and their playing style - is what makes me think they're comparable.

Maybe it is just me, but I don't see how saying Park is underrated - which some have said and which does fit in your guidelines of underrated/overrated - is any further from the truth.

Agree to disagree.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

It's always true to an extent, but in some circumstances it can get distorted. By that I mean how the majority of fans thought that Heinze was a very good player, shown by how he won fans' player of the year in his first season.

Obviously that's diverting away from the topic a bit but the major similarity - their commitment to the cause(on the pitch in Heinze's case, obviously) and their playing style - is what makes me think they're overrated.

Maybe it is just me, but I don't see how saying Park is underrated - which some have said and which does fit in your guidelines of underrated/overrated - is any further from the truth.

Agree to disagree.

Fair enough but I don't think the Henize comparison is a good one. Heinze was like Smith is like Tevez. They're so whole-hearted that fans can forgive some technical limitations.

Evra is as whole-hearted as all of this lot but is also technically as good as almost anyone in our squad. Some of his dribbling and tight control is absolutely sublime.

Anyway, agreeing to disagree is good. People should do it more often

 

[afrocentricity]

Nice one lads...

 

[Scholesgoals]

Isnt brwned that guy that loves JOshea? or is that brad?

I'm a massive critic of O'Shea, i'll admit, but i thought he had done a good job in the time he was out, he was solid at the back, and thats enough for a stand in. But going forward you really notice paddy's ability to make space for others when in comparison to o'sheas trap it and pass back to evans routine.

When he is able to overlap and cut through like that he really opens space for the wingers to isolate their man. Evra and Scholes are at the beginning of so many of our attacking moves.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Isnt brwned that guy that loves JOshea? or is that brad?

I'm a massive critic of O'Shea, i'll admit, but i thought he had done a good job in the time he was out, he was solid at the back, and thats enough for a stand in. But going forward you really notice paddy's ability to make space for others when in comparison to o'sheas trap it and pass back to evans routine.

When he is able to overlap and cut through like that he really opens space for the wingers to isolate their man. Evra and Scholes are at the beginning of so many of our attacking moves.

Dunno about "loves" but he thinks he's a good player to have in our squad. So do I, as it happens.

Agree about the extra dimension Evra brings to our attack. No coincidence that almost all of Ronaldo's best work as a winger has been down our left flank.

 

[Brwned]

Isnt brwned that guy that loves JOshea? or is that brad?

I'm a massive critic of O'Shea, i'll admit, but i thought he had done a good job in the time he was out, he was solid at the back, and thats enough for a stand in. But going forward you really notice paddy's ability to make space for others when in comparison to o'sheas trap it and pass back to evans routine.

When he is able to overlap and cut through like that he really opens space for the wingers to isolate their man. Evra and Scholes are at the beginning of so many of our attacking moves.

I don't love O'Shea at all.

Evra's close control, dribbling, pace and power are all big parts of his and our game and he provides a very good attacking outlet.

He's a very good defender one-on-one and he's good enough positionally and in the air, and he has a great attitude.

Oh and for the record I was only making the comparison between Heinze and Evra because I think their attitude is what puts them on another level in terms of how the supporters rate them, obviously Evra is much better than Heinze in every sense.

I just think that if you went and compares the majority of ratings in the ratings thread, and then compared it to say Skysports or the BBC's, you'd see that Evra gets rated higher to a greater extent(i.e. there's a notable difference in ratings for him in comparison to others, rather than he gets plenty of high ratings).

Probably all in my head, but I'll have a look the next few times.

 

[afrocentricity]

To be fair I wouldn't base anything on the ratings threads... I'm willing to bet a sizeble portion of us caftards (let alone fans in general) don't even bother with the ratings threads (like myself)...

 

[Fortitude]

I love Vidic to bits, but....

It's amazing how people can turn around quite quickly and say 'Vidic's as good as Rio, if not better' with such conviction. Rio hasnt been on form this season, presumably parts of it due to the injury, whereas Vidic has been playing like a world beater. It still doesnt take away the fact that Rio has been more instrumental to our successes in the last two season than anyone, bar Ronaldo. Vidic may appear to be stronger and more aggressive, but Rio's footballing brain and his game-reading ability is second to none for a defender. Not to mention his pace and leadership. I'd say if on top form, Rio shades Vidic by quite a margin.

I'd also think that despite Vidic's great form, Rio's still the better defender/player of the two. And together, they're just the perfect team. Cant see a team with a better partnership in Europe. Add Evra, Brown and Neville to that, put VDS in goal and you have probably the best back four in Europe as well

The most important thing is that together they form the best CB duo there is today. One good thing to see is that Vidic is able to play on both side of the CB position.

Very strange comment.

On the topic in hand, Vidic has been absolutely monstrous. Rio's form over the last 3 years has been better than what Vidic is currently producing, but Vidic is making a heroic attempt at surpassing him.

sense.

 

[Heinzesight]

what's the lastest on his red card and possible ban v's Inter...any news?

 

[vuc]

Vidic was awarded the Serbian player of the year award before the friendly match against Cpyrus on Tuesday. Legend

 

[Merman]

Still think Rio of last season was better. Vidic has had an excellent season so far though.

 

[Striker10]

Maybe it's me but with this run, I think it's noticeable we've players throwing themselves blocking shots more - which we've not always done well in the past

Evra has been great BUT if it's a choice i'd go with Vidic because evra's missed quite a few games this season for one reason or another and vidic has gone from strength to strength scoring 5/6 goals and some important ones to boot

 

[vuc]

Still think Rio of last season was better. Vidic has had an excellent season so far though.

Well this season isn't over yet and besides Rio never scored the goals that Vidic has scored this year let alone the 12 clean sheets thing.

 

[Escobar]

Still think Rio of last season was better. Vidic has had an excellent season so far though.

The form of Rio over the last 3 years has mostly been brilliant, and last season nothing could get past him. It's great to have a brilliant season, but he had now almost 3 of them. Hope Vidic gets on the same level of consistency

 

[vuc]

The form of Rio over the last 3 years has mostly been brilliant, and last season nothing could get past him. It's great to have a brilliant season, but he had now almost 3 of them. Hope Vidic gets on the same level of consistency

Has he not done this the last 2 and a half years?

 

[Escobar]

Has he not done this the last 2 and a half years?

Obviously not, otherwise I wouldnt have written it, would I?

Vidic had his ups and down, even this season, at the beginning where he looked a bit unfit and sloppy. Last season, he had his spells as well.