Didn't say he was the only factor, but he was a big one. And the others you've mentioned were also in the late stages of their careers. It cannot be denied, that you were living off your substance for too long.We weren't a one man by any stretch. We had huge contributions from loads of ther player like Carrick, Rafa, Rio, Rooney throughout the season. RVP at one went through 8 or so games without scoring. As for lack of consistent opposition, we were just too consistent for the rest.
We got 89 points (and this was after we stopped caring) which would have won the title in any of the last 20 odd seasons. Poor argument.Didn't say he was the only factor, but he was a big one. And the others you've mentioned were also in the late stages of their careers. It cannot be denied, that you were living off your substance for too long.
As for consistency, you were the *only* team that was consistent.
How is it a poor argument to see that you were the only ones to be consistent in that season?We got 89 points (and this was after we stopped caring) which would have won the title in any of the last 20 odd seasons. Poor argument.
It was, but it had a lot of players in the final stages of their careers who didn't get proper replacements in time to prevent the sharp decline we've seen after SAFs retirement.It was a pretty good team. just managed poorly by the predecessors.
That doesnt invalidate winning the league with ease. If that was the case might as write of all of Bayern's recent titlesHow is it a poor argument to see that you were the only ones to be consistent in that season?
Feel likethis arguement has been done too many times over the last 3 years.We weren't a one man by any stretch. We had huge contributions from loads of ther player like Carrick, Rafa, Rio, Rooney throughout the season. RVP at one went through 8 or so games without scoring. As for lack of consistent opposition, we were just too consistent for the rest.
It doesn't. And yes, the 3 titles we won so easily between 2013-2015 were down to a lack of a consistent competitor, too. No chance of denying that. Last season was a lot closer until matchday 32(of 34).That does invalidate winning the league with ease. If that was the case might as write of all of Bayern's recent titles
It's just a really offensive term used to describe someone who you have literally no respect for, and would be used to insultEh? What else does it mean apart from "someone who wasted/is wasting their life"?
Nah, it's not THAT bad. Quite applicable for this thread in fact.It's just a really offensive term used to describe someone who you have literally no respect for, and would be used to insult
If Depay doesn't make it it will be a lack of talent rather than a lack of effort.Quincy Owosu Abeyie must be in here, the guy was as hot as Messi at a youth World Cup, went to Arsenal relatively young and was absolutely stunning at that age, couldnt handle the money, fame and the girls and still kept contacts with his hood friend from round here (Bijlmer in Amsterdam), also maybe Depay in few years.
He is in strictly for the same reason as Anderson. Injury laid waste to their undoubted talent. His mental health was never a factorBosnich is a great shout. Was more interested in nose candy than football. Just stopped caring, seemingly. Mutu would definitely also come in under that 'bracket'.
Putting Diesler in is unfair. Declining mental health isn't a fitting match for a waster.
How so?but the context is wrong, Morrison would be the opposite of a wasteman
Going according to how the slang is used, if you are a wasteman, you wouldn't be involved in an trouble and would keep to yourself, i'm not saying this is the full criteria, just that the slang is awkwardly/wrongly used hereHow so?
It's relevant to the thread, however wasteman isn't anything to do with getting in trouble, the street meaning of a waste man is a dcik head basically, in this thread it's a man whose talents are wasted, surely Ravel would qualify?Going according to how the slang is used, if you are a wasteman, you wouldn't be involved in an trouble and would keep to yourself, i'm not saying this is the full criteria, just that the slang is awkwardly/wrongly used here
This doesn't need to be a big discussion though, I feel i'm now distracting from the purpose of this thread
Not really relevant to the thread but actually the word wasteman was originally street slang to refer to a gay man. Since then it's evolved and it now is used as a general insult in the same way that the term that's gay is used to describe people or behaviour that is weird, different or frowned upon.Going according to how the slang is used, if you are a wasteman, you wouldn't be involved in an trouble and would keep to yourself, i'm not saying this is the full criteria, just that the slang is awkwardly/wrongly used here
This doesn't need to be a big discussion though, I feel i'm now distracting from the purpose of this thread
McGrath is my hero.Paul McGrath
One of the absolute best Center halves I have seen.
For Ireland was always immense. After he left United went to villa and Derby where he was still unreal at 39.
Destroyed Roberto Baggio in USA94 and was only man who got near him all tournament.
Career ruined much like Ledley King by chronic knee trouble which meant he couldn't train.
Mental health issues and depression which turned him to alcohol.
Actually had pleasure of playing against him at a thing in RDS in Dublin John Aldridge was on my team Aldridge didn't get a sniff and McGrath pole axed him twice in the game and was drinking pints like water every 5 minutes on the side of the pitch when he could.
Irish hero and had the talent to be the absolute best Center half you could imagine.
Paul McGrath
One of the absolute best Center halves I have seen.
For Ireland was always immense. After he left United went to villa and Derby where he was still unreal at 39.
Destroyed Roberto Baggio in USA94 and was only man who got near him all tournament.
Career ruined much like Ledley King by chronic knee trouble which meant he couldn't train.
Mental health issues and depression which turned him to alcohol.
Actually had pleasure of playing against him at a thing in RDS in Dublin John Aldridge was on my team Aldridge didn't get a sniff and McGrath pole axed him twice in the game and was drinking pints like water every 5 minutes on the side of the pitch when he could.
Irish hero and had the talent to be the absolute best Center half you could imagine.
McGrath is my hero.
He had a fantastic career, despite his injuries and alcoholism. FA Cup winner with United, a two time League Cup winner with Villa and also finished as a runner up during the year we won our first Premier League title. He was voted as the best player in the league by his peers that season.
Ian Rush said the reason why he didn't score many goals against United was because of one person; Paul McGrath.
Great game from McGrath from a LCM/LDM position against Juventus in the European Cup Winners Cup semi final, keeping tabs on the likes of Platini and Boniek excellently, whilst being United's greatest threat on the night, with his aerial prowess causing absolute mayhem against a World Cup winning defense. His reading of the game is of course, on the money and his class on the ball apparent - his ball control, one touch passing etc without being too extravagant.
A couple of points about McGrath. Whilst there is always a tinge of regret that he never fully managed to capitalise on his immense potential, he had the innate talent to be one of the all time greats imo, there is no doubting the fact that he was one of the best defenders of his generation - this is the 80s & early 90s lot that we are talking about, mind. Whilst his exploits against Italy is arguably his 'greatest' game amongst his body of work, he's had plenty of those big-game performances in his locker (McGrath himself says he's had better games) and has always been a key figure for both club and national side.
He was an excellent defender for United - a MOTM performance against a strong Everton side in the FA Cup final, a great performance against Platini's Juventus in the Cup Winner's Cup semi-final and finishing runners up to Linker in the PFA's Player of the Year award for 1986. He'd do one better at Aston Villa and win the PFA's Player of the Year award in 1993; finishing as Football Writers' Footballer of the Year Runner up in 1992 and 1993; and winning 4 consecutive club POTY awards for Aston Villa, whilst leading them to two runners up finishes in the Football League Championship and the PL. His fantastic display against United in the 1994 League Cup Final deprived us of the chance to complete a domestic treble. In fact Fergie himself personally congratulated McGrath in the tunnel later on his performance, despite the two not being on the best of terms. McGrath is arguably Villa's greatest player ever and is fondly referred to by Villa fans as 'God'. In fact his chant still reverberates throughout Villa Park on match-days, just as 'Ooh Aah Cantona' still does at Old Trafford.
He was an inspirational presence for Ireland at the back and was one of the driving forces behind the plucky Irish side of the late eighties and early nineties - a period in which where they were extremely unfortunate to go out in the Euros 1988 against eventual winners Netherlands (more on that later), made the quarter finals in the 1990 WC and the R16 in 1994 (where his display against Baggio's Italy was the stuff of legends). Needless to say he won Ireland's 'Player of the Tournament' for both Euro '88 and Italia '90, and the Irish International Player of the Year twice during this period (90 & 91). Keano's won two of the latter for comparison's sake.
Paul McGrath represented his country 83 times on the football pitch scoring eight goals. It is difficult to recall a single poor performance by Paul when playing soccer for Ireland. Even when playing out of his normal position on the pitch invariably he was one of the star performers match-in match-out. Two stand-out performances spring to mind when Irish soccer fans are asked about Paul's greatest matches for Ireland. Both were against Italy. In the quarter final of the 1990 World Cup in Rome Italy were overwhelming favourites to win the match. In a very good overall team performance McGrath's performance stood out as the Irish lost narrowly 1-0.
Great as that performance was, and it really was great, Paul gave an absolute master class four years later in the opening group match in the World Cup finals in New York. Back in his favourite position at centre-half McGrath was simply magnificent. Ireland lead from early through a Ray Houghton goal. The Irish defence had to endure some periods of sustained attack from the talented Italians.Euro 1988 Match Report said:Jack Charlton's side, making their bow in the finals, had cause to feel aggrieved. Indeed, they had come closest to scoring in Gelsenkirchen from their only corner of the match. Paul McGrath rose majestically above the defence and headed the ball firmly down against the base of the post. A last ditch intervention by Gerald Vanenburgh prevented the ball spinning over the goal line.
McGrath was imperious, a colossus with bad knees. Injury to right-back Chris Morris forced him to vacate his midfield berth for this game as cover but he was as influential as ever – at both ends. He did not deserve to be a footnote for the winner, as with desperate Dutch pressure mounting it was his header that Ronald Koeman unintentionally turned towards Kieft.
McGrath also featured in the Ballon d'Or list 4 times during his career finishing 17th, 12th, 13th & 26th - the votes tally isn't earth-shattering stuff but it's vital to take into context that he was a defender who wasn't necessarily playing for a top team nor in one of the heavyweight continental leagues etc. A top notch player on his day and quite simply a wall at the back. McGrath tended to be plagued by injuries throughout his career but it never stopped him from delivering on the pitch when it mattered most. It speaks volumes about his resilience and mentality that despite being injury prone (so much so that he stopped training and only did light sessions on the bike after a few months at Villa) he still managed to deliver top class performances well into his thirties.
