I too underestimated the elite level manager.
What should be the realistic expectations for 2020-21?
- Thread starter Tony247
- Start date
Yes we've done well. Or Liverpool dropped off alarmingly!
That all depends on the transfer window. With the same squad as we have today a top 4 and CL quarters + FA/League semis is the realistic one.
Yep, I definitely didn't see United finishing second and thought Arsenal would grind out a lot more low scoring wins than they ultimately have.
Fair enough. We can only compete against what we got.
Fair play mate. Neither did I.
Which is why I feel we should give some credit to the manager and players rather than saying we only finished 2nd because the rest were rubbish?
Last season we got top 3 because Leicester and Chelsea dropped off, this season we finished 2nd only because other teams have fallen off? Seems to be a theme from fans making excuses for us finishing well?
Since you want to play the smart ass so much, we'll finish a handful of points ahead of Chelsea who had a dire half-season.
We didn't fecking win the league, so I don't see what you think you're doing with this investigative posting here.
Last edited:
It's nice to see how clueless our fans were. That's what it is.
If you read my posts I was on the same boat. I too was pessimistic.
This isn't about being investigative or rubbing in. This is about cherish the progress when we all, including me, were not expecting.
Are you not happy the team progressed beyond your expectations? I am!
I think there are a few on here that cannot take Ole doing well.
The reason some of us are happy is because he managed to do something that no one expected. We all thought fighting for top 4 will be our season. Giving credit to the players and manager is sensible.
Unfortunately, some fans have made their mind up and will not say anything positive.
At the time it wasn't a terrible idea that Arsenal looked good. They beat Chelsea and City well to win the FA Cup. They looked very good defensively and Aubamayeng was in a year. Obviously since the contract he's been poor in comparison and Luiz turned back into Luiz.
I've already said on this forum I was wrong about them. I even made the Arsenal watch thread about them this season.
4 points off third and confirming second in GW 37 isn't comfortable but it's clear we've made good progress this year. I sincerely hope we do so again next year and challenge for the title properly.
Same again I think. Top 4 as a minimum, whilst trying to close the gap to City and a trophy. Hopefully an improvement in the Champions League. I think we will have a good Summer, however I could see it being one in which we don't make too many inroads in terms of upgrading our central midfield. This is why I'm reluctant to say 'title challenge' because quite simply we can't win the league with our current options there.
Its because we have really dropped of recently. We put out almost a youth team against Leicester, you can tell the players are lacking motivation at the moment.
That's the next challenge now, go and mount a proper challenge where you are expected to win every game.
I was wrong too! I too thought Arsenal would be top 4 challengers.
Chelsea had new manager bounce. That is all. Depends which way you look at it.
Oh yeah, there absolutely is context to it. And if it was 4 points a month ago, I'd imagine our results would've been better.
I imagine it'll be harder next year but with the right investment, it should be our target.
I think there are a few on here who have their head firmly in the sand (and a fair bit up their backside as well).
Unfortunately, we've barely made any progress on our points total, are playing the final of the kid's CL while City and Chelsea are where we should be with regard to the top level competition.
Our Bruno bounce has swiftly gone away this season and we look distinctly average for large parts of most games.
With Pogba set to leave latest in 2022 and us playing dross like Dan James and McT week-in, week-out, this forum is set to be flooded with Arsenal mentality where winning 3 points more and making top 4 in gameweek 37, instead of 38, is considered some sort of monumental achievement.
I don't know what you have been watching over the last 7 years, this is the first time we have made top 4 back to back.
That is called progress.
We are 2nd in the league, we secured top 4 a while ago.
Again, I am not sure which season you have been watching but Dan James does not start week in week out, I am happy for you to prove it otherwise.
Also, we play a 4-2-3-1 with 2 CDM's, who else can play that role apart from McT?
Finishing 3rd last season was progress...Finishing 2nd this season and (hopefully) winning the Europa league is certainly tangible progress again.Now the challenge is to take the next step which will be very difficult...That’s why we need the board and the owners to whole heartfelt back Ole this summer...We have to mount a title challenge next season,as simple as that...
We are around what was expected at the beginning of the season. Meaning top 4, of course is good to have secured top 4 a couple of matches ago.
Does that mean that I'm happy and satisfied? Well not really. I won't be until we go back to winning titles.
Using old predictions to say we should be happy is a low punch, expectations change as the season goes by. I mean imagine if we were 1st for all the season but lost the last 10 games in a row and end up 4th, would you say hey but at the beginning of the season everyone expected us to be top 6 and we end up 4th we should be happy!
This season was an opportunity to win something big, the covid effect shortened the distance between teams. Juve didn't won the serie A after 9 years, Lille is about to win Ligue 1 after God knows how many years of PSG dominance, Atletico is about to win La Liga, Sporting won Primeira Liga after 20 years, Chelsea are on a UCL final.
I don't think it's fair to punch this team or manager for not winning anything major because of course we weren't favourites but somehow it feels like a lost opportunity and I think next year the distances between teams will be shown again.
Realistic (subject to funding) an extra 10 points and quarter finals of CL as a minimum.
Achieved.
| Team | P | W | D | L | GF | GA | GD | Pts |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Manchester United | 37 | 20 | 11 | 6 | 71 | 43 | +28 | 71 |
A bit behind on the goal difference, but there's still one more game to play.
Last edited:
I think this team will really mature next year. With the right signings in the areas that need strengthening (CB,RW,DM,RB,CF...3 of these positions is a minimum) we will really push on. The players are all pulling in the same direction, the football is good, when we aren't playing 7 games a week. The Europa League would be great for Ole and the coaching staff and hopefully silence the Cult of Jose and Ole-outers on here. The squad is at the point were they believe they can win and should win things. Hopefully they get the EL this year and then the Premier League won't seem so far away next year.
The OP question can't be answered until we see what goes down in the transfer window. Not even tentatively. Simple as that.
Realistically we should aim to get more points in the league than this season as that would represent progress that should also mean we're in the top 4.
We should aim to get out the group stages of the champions league.
Get to a domestic final. Win if possible.
We should aim to get out the group stages of the champions league.
Get to a domestic final. Win if possible.
Been building up to say this (and sorry, it could have been in reply to anyone of a hundred posters): WE DON'T PLAY 4231 WITH 2 CDMs.
Firstly, if we played with 2 defensive midfielders, it wouldn't be a 4231, but what could only be described as a 42031. Nobody does this. If you play with two defensive midfielders, you don't put four players in your attacking line. Someone's got to take care of the zone between your defensive line and your attackers. If you're the one doing that, you're not a defensive midfielder. If you're a defensive midfielder, you're generally dealing with the zone between your defensive line and your midfield.
We play with 2 central midfielders, which is something different. Though a central pivot can emphasise either the offensive or defensive aspect, or do this differently from game to game, that doesn't mean they're defensive midfielders. McFred is no more a pair of CDMs than Jorginho/Kovacic, Højbjerg/Sissoko, McGinn/Luiz or Bissouma/Allan.
Last edited:
It's been a very encouraging season in my opinion.
As bad as we have been post-SAF, you could argue that without the financially-doped Manchester City we would have two more league titles right now at least. Being 2nd to what basically amounts to a 'cheat mode' team isn't too shabby given all the flak we get in the media and from our own fans!
Call it what you want. 4-2-3-1, 4-2-0-3-1. If the case is we dont play 2 CDM's why have we not seen Pogba and Donny as the CM's? or Bruno and Pogba as the 2 CM's?
Bruno, Donny, Pogba have all played CM positions for their previous clubs and country. We play with 2 CM's who are defensive minded which allows us to play 4 up front.
A CM is someone like a Scholes / Keane which means they are box to box players. Can you highlight to me in what way you think McFred are box to box?
Or even Hojberg /Sissoko or Bissouma/ Allan? They are not box to box midfielders, if they were you would expect them to get goals / assists and be there to break play.
[QUOTE="romufc, post: 27247625,
Call it what you want. 4-2-3-1, 4-2-0-3-1. If the case is we dont play 2 CDM's why have we not seen Pogba and Donny as the CM's?
We have, if not at the same time.
or Bruno and Pogba as the 2 CM's?
Because Bruno isn't a CM. Not for us, anyway.
We play with 2 CM's who are defensive minded which allows us to play 4 up front.
Yes, my point here is that there's a distinction between CDM as a position, and being a defensive-minded central midfielder.
A CM is someone like a Scholes / Keane which means they are box to box players. Can you highlight to me in what way you think McFred are box to box?
Scholes and Keane are hardly the textbook definition of "central midfielder". They were both extraordinary players including in the range of their impact. "Box to box midfielder" is just one way of filling the CM position. The point is whether there's someone else between you and the attackers. If there isn't, then you're not a defensive midfielder. Also, both Fred and McTominay are fairly frequently involved in the attack, moving up to the opposition box.
Or even Hojberg /Sissoko or Bissouma/ Allan? They are not box to box midfielders, if they were you would expect them to get goals / assists and be there to break play.
No, but they're not CDMs either, or more pertinently, occupy positions in their team's setup that could be described as CDM. Also, they do get goals and assists. Just not very many. Which is pretty normal for CMs.
Call it what you want. 4-2-3-1, 4-2-0-3-1. If the case is we dont play 2 CDM's why have we not seen Pogba and Donny as the CM's?
We have, if not at the same time.
or Bruno and Pogba as the 2 CM's?
Because Bruno isn't a CM. Not for us, anyway.
We play with 2 CM's who are defensive minded which allows us to play 4 up front.
Yes, my point here is that there's a distinction between CDM as a position, and being a defensive-minded central midfielder.
A CM is someone like a Scholes / Keane which means they are box to box players. Can you highlight to me in what way you think McFred are box to box?
Scholes and Keane are hardly the textbook definition of "central midfielder". They were both extraordinary players including in the range of their impact. "Box to box midfielder" is just one way of filling the CM position. The point is whether there's someone else between you and the attackers. If there isn't, then you're not a defensive midfielder. Also, both Fred and McTominay are fairly frequently involved in the attack, moving up to the opposition box.
Or even Hojberg /Sissoko or Bissouma/ Allan? They are not box to box midfielders, if they were you would expect them to get goals / assists and be there to break play.
No, but they're not CDMs either, or more pertinently, occupy positions in their team's setup that could be described as CDM. Also, they do get goals and assists. Just not very many. Which is pretty normal for CMs.
2nd in the PL only to Man City and going to the wire (unlike current season). Otherwise if City should have a bad season which I don't think will happen, then nothing less than champions is acceptable.
CL semi final
Couldn't give a feck about the others tbh!
CL semi final
Couldn't give a feck about the others tbh!
We are Man Utd, we will be challenging for the PL and CL!
Realistically:
1) Top 4
2) CL last 8
3) FA Cup at least last 4
Realistically:
1) Top 4
2) CL last 8
3) FA Cup at least last 4
This was my expectations for a 'good' season, and looks like I got it pretty much spot on for the league. CL was a disappointment of course, but we have got to the final of the Europa so hopefully we can bring that home.
- A solid 2nd place (check)
- QF run in UCL... but Europa final trumps that.
- FA Cup win... meh. But at least we'll have a trophy if we win Europa
- Nearly at 72 goals (need 1 more on Sunday) - check
- Feckin dropped "more" points at home if anything
- Definitely played attacking football - check
- Plenty of stupid goals conceded last minute.