When can we truly be excited?

[Adebesi]

I'm sure some would be churlish and say things like that, but that wouldn't make it true. A win at Anfield would further boost confidence and get the rest thinking.

I would say the point is there is no absolute truth. Some people dont think the games we have played so far prove we have improved. Others think they do. Some think a Liverpool win will be proof, others think nothing is proven until the New Year.

I am already excited. Some others wont be excited until after the Liverpool game and only if we win. Still others wont be excited even then.

Ill be delighted if we win at Anfield but it isnt going to tell me much I dont already believe, looking at this team. Because even then, itll be a single meeting against a "big" club (in relatively poor form). We'll know more when we have played 2 or 3 of these 6 pointer type games, especially when we've played City and Chelsea. But I will certainly continue to be very excited before that happens, unless our form collapses and we start losing a lot of ground on the top.

 

[Salus Populi Suprema Lex]

To the OP. It depends on your expectations really

United's expectations must always be to be in the title race and at the business end of the Champions League. It can't happen every year, but that must be standard demanded. This season we must be in a position to challenge for the title; being out of it before Christmas again isn't acceptable. Making a real challenge is the minimum standard.

 

[Adebesi]

Yeah good post. I'm definitely excited. Plus we're making Old Trafford a bit of a fortress again. Aggregate score of 14-0 so far & only 1 loss in Jose's time here.

The one thing that was putting a bit of a downer on it is City looking even stronger. It would be gutting if we have a good season, with a big points haul but lose out to a City team getting, say, 90-95 points.

Basically, I still don't believe we are the best team in the league, yet. But delighted with the progress and now looking forward to the challenge of topping a hugely gifted City squad over the next couple of years.

Completely agree. I havent actually watched much of City this year other than on MOTD but between that and what Ive read, it looks like they are even better than us.

It comes down to how you define excitement. For me it doesnt have much to do with expectation that we'll win the league. It has far more to do with an expectation that we will still be contesting it in the latter stages of the season - that we will actually show up for the title race. And a more general sense that we are back on the up and can look forward to further improvements.

 

[Salus Populi Suprema Lex]

I would say the point is there is no absolute truth. Some people dont think the games we have played so far prove we have improved. Others think they do. Some think a Liverpool win will be proof, others think nothing is proven until the New Year.

I am already excited. Some others wont be excited until after the Liverpool game and only if we win. Still others wont be excited even then.

Ill be delighted if we win at Anfield but it isnt going to tell me much I dont already believe, looking at this team. Because even then, itll be a single meeting against a "big" club (in relatively poor form). We'll know more when we have played 2 or 3 of these 6 pointer type games, especially when we've played City and Chelsea. But I will certainly continue to be very excited before that happens, unless our form collapses and we start losing a lot of ground on the top.

If we play well at Anfield and take a point, that's perfectly okay. Away draws against your rivals are not something anybody should turn their nose up at. If we perform and win, we'll really have made a statement of intent. A defeat would take the wind right out of our sails and prompt fears of another mediocre season.

 

[shaky]

I'm sure the "top 6" teams will give us more of a challenge but most of them are probably more worried about us than we are of them. Anyway, the non top 6 teams account for 84 of the 114 points available in the season, and we've collected more than 90% of those points we've played for so far.

Get excited now. We're scoring for fun. Picking up the points that we should be picking up. Doing the job in the CL with no fuss. We aren't invincible and we're going to have annoying results and bigger tests ahead of us, but jeez, it's miles better than we've seen for ages and we have a squad full of potential for years to come. We might not win the league this season but we're probably not going to be scrapping over 4th place either.

 

[cyberman]

I don't understand this. Should we only be excited when we look nailed on to be champions?

 

[Adebesi]

They say "once bitten, twice shy".

We've been bitten a lot in the last few years. So its understandable that people are reluctant to get their hopes up.

 

[Salus Populi Suprema Lex]

I don't understand this. Should we only be excited when we look nailed on to be champions?

No, nothing is guaranteed or nailed on, but for me (and I'm sure for many others also) United must be competitive. I'm optimistic now; if we win at Anfield I will be excited about our prospects. It's the first big test of the season.

 

[Rusholme Ruffian]

The football was far more exciting in 06 07, difficult to compare ...

Remember that we had one of the greatest of all time playing in that team though. Drop Ronaldo into the mix now and we'd look very different.

I knew this cliche would be mentioned don't get me wrong, I'm happy with what Jose and the team have achieved so far. I'm just not excited.

God, each to his own, but I'm so glad I don't have this frame of mind - football is supposed to be fun! If you can't be excited when you've had the best start to a premier league season ever when can you be?!

I see clear improvement over last season. I'm not denying it. Before the season started would you expect anything less than 19 points out of our opening fixtures?

No, because football isn't played on paper - and amongst our 'easy' fixtures have been a few teams that take points off us most seasons.

Right now I'm cautiously optimistic, still not sold on this team.

don't you mean manager?

 

[Thisistheone]

Completely agree. I havent actually watched much of City this year other than on MOTD but between that and what Ive read, it looks like they are even better than us.

It comes down to how you define excitement. For me it doesnt have much to do with expectation that we'll win the league. It has far more to do with an expectation that we will still be contesting it in the latter stages of the season - that we will actually show up for the title race. And a more general sense that we are back on the up and can look forward to further improvements.

Yeah for sure. Being in the title race come the business end of the season, April/May is a great thought and definitely reason to be excited. But the goal is eventually to win the league again. And it doesn't feel we're quite there yet, partly because it's still early days but also because of City.

It's the next challenge. We have weaknesses in the current side but this sure as hell beats the last 4 years.

 

[Borden]

don't you mean manager?

Him too, sure

 

[Snowjoe]

I'm exited now, full muppet mode may as well enjoy the ride.

 

[cyberman]

I'm excited for the Liverpool game, I honestly think we'll do them but I don't understand being apprehensive after the start we've had just, We should look forward to games v Liverpool where we have a fantastic recent record instead of wondering what the meaning of life is.
At least give us the chance to fail.
Its like 11 in 10 Lukaku being criticised by the media because he will find it harder to score v top 4 than Southampton away.
There are certain aspects of the media and fanbase that are subtly criticising us for results that haven't happened.

 

[Ramshock]

When we beat City

 

[marlowe78]

I'm excited.

 

[El Zoido]

It may seem crazy to say after winning all but one game and scoring so many, but I think better teams will cause us problems. I’ll be more excited if we play well and win at Anfield, but we’ll see. City look better than us at the moment but form can change.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

They say "once bitten, twice shy".

We've been bitten a lot in the last few years. So its understandable that people are reluctant to get their hopes up.

It's definitely the false dawns, corning turning situations that keep most from jumping over the edge. There's a lot here who seem to have forgotten most of our problems over the last few seasons and competing against the top 6 isn't one of them. Under Moyes, yes it was but van Gaal sorted it out and we OK last year where we beat Spurs, Chelsea and were minutes away from beating Arsenal. The problems revolve around those at the bottom and the ease at which teams have played against us at OT.

Whilst we haven't been as "beautiful" as City, if I may, we've set the tone and sent a message. 21 goals in 6 games at OT will stop most teams from playing the way they may have in previous seasons under Moyes and van Gaal. Add to the fact that only one team has scored against us shows that we're as good defensively as we have been in years. I believe OT is slowly becoming the fortress it once was. However, the message doesn't stop there, Martial and Rashford, in particular, have turned us into the "late game" team where we've been relentless, potent and incredibly efficient in the latter stages of most our games. That's kept most teams from being able to attack us when they desperately need to in fear of being countered. Yet, few have succeeded with United scoring 10 goals in the last 10 minutes of our games, this season.

Prior to the Palace game, there was an expectation surrounding us that hasn't been there for years for both our fans and the neutrals. We weren't just expected to beat them, we were expected to demolish them and that we did, without stepping out of 2nd gear. Teams fear us, maybe not the big guns, but most of the league does and that's a victory in itself. It's understandable that our fans won't be jumping to conclusions yet, but, I feel, now is the perfect time to be excited.

 

[kouroux]

If we beat Liverpool wont the doubters say they have been rubbish this year and beating them doesn't prove anything?

Only victories against City, Chelsea and Spurs should really count because the rest of this "greatest league in the world" are making up the numbers.

I know I won't.

 

[Raoul]

When we beat a top four opponent.

 

[World Game]

When we beat a top four opponent.

We haven't even beaten a top ten opponent yet

 

[wolvored]

if we are still top 2 at Christmas then I will be excited. We will have played everyone by then, and can judge more realistically whether we are going to be top 4, or even better. I feel we might fall short to City but finish runners up. I also think last 8 Champions league is a realistic target. Any farther and we would be in dreamland!

 

[el3mel]

Interestingly, I have been searching old threads and found this :

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/post-match-southampton-home.365641/

You'll think for a moment they were talking about the last Southampton game not the one from our last title winning season!

This forum is always over worrying it seems.

 

[Dirty Schwein]

Our real test begins now. Let's see how we fare against some tough competition. I'm sure we'll do ok.

 

[Suedesi]

When we beat City, Spurs, Chelsea or Liverpool

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

It's been a really good and comforting start to the season, however, given all the false dawns over the last few years, I don't (and maybe many of you) want to get too far ahead of myself. At what point will you be comfortable enough to finally brush away the "false dawn" label - when we can truly be excited about whats to come this season?

When we win our next 2 big games. Best Liverpool away and Spurs at home properly and we have every reason to be excited.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I don't want to tempt fate but I do disagree with this idea that we've only played against bang average opposition. The likes of Basle and CSKA have caused plenty of decent sides problems over the years (including title winning sides from Manchester United!) The fact our CL fixtures have been such walks in the park gives a bit of extra reassurance that we're the real deal this time round.

 

[Virgil]

I don't want to tempt fate but I do disagree with this idea that we've only played against bang average opposition. The likes of Basle and CSKA have caused plenty of decent sides problems over the years (including title winning sides from Manchester United!) The fact our CL fixtures have been such walks in the park gives a bit of extra reassurance that we're the real deal this time round.

Now that IS tempting fate. In much the same way that I find myself wincing when I hear commentators make statements such as 'not beaten at home for X number of games' or 'never failed to score against x'

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

Its not that our opposition has been average. We are yet to get tested by truly big teams. Especially direct rivals. City passed their two tests vs Pool and Chelsea. Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelsea passed one and failed one. Now its our turn. Our champions league performances vs sides that have given us huge headache in the past though are a valid source of optimism on our part tbf.

 

[cyberman]

I hate this only beaten sides outside of the top 12 narrative.
Maybe the reason they're so low is because we've taken 3 points off of them?.
How can Liverpool be considered a test if they're 7 points behind us?Theres a realistic scenario that has Liverpool laying in 11th place after a Utd win, is the result then whitewashed as a non test?
There seems to be an inconsistent mixture of last year and present day standings that sets up a bout of good old confirmation bias.

 

[Salus Populi Suprema Lex]

When we win our next 2 big games. Best Liverpool away and Spurs at home properly and we have every reason to be excited.

Definitely. Four points would be good; six would be a real statement.

 

[Treble]

I don't want to tempt fate but I do disagree with this idea that we've only played against bang average opposition. The likes of Basle and CSKA have caused plenty of decent sides problems over the years (including title winning sides from Manchester United!) The fact our CL fixtures have been such walks in the park gives a bit of extra reassurance that we're the real deal this time round.

Currently 3rd and 4th in their respective leagues. Soton ans Stoke away were more serious tests for sure.

Truth is we don't know yet. United are playing very well at home, not so much away (excluding CSKA which was a great performance from start to finsih). Maybe we will pass the tests with Liverpool and Spurs with flying colours and the still untested yet narrative will look silly in hindsight.

 

[rtr]

Hold your horses.

• No recognised, regular left-back
• An ageing right-back
• I don't think either Martial or Rashford are playing the wide role well enough. I might be alone on that opinion
• No recognised right-forward, perennially deciding over who's better between Mkhi and Mata, not in a good way
• No solid 3rd midfielder when in a 3

Maybe some other things I didn't mention...

 

[Danny Roberts]

A good manager can make a team more than the sum of their parts. If we were to get a couple of good results against City, Chelsea or Spurs I'd say we could start getting excited.

 

[Lentwood]

It's fine to get excited now because we have undoubtedly improved after a couple of false dawns.

It was always going to be a huge ask to go 7th, 4th, 5th, 6th and then 1st but if we wrap up top 4 early and are within 5pts of the top in April you would have to consider that a big step forward

Also, I don't believe that the games against the top 6 are necessarily the only benchmark of a good side. There are 84pts up for grabs against non-top 6 sides and the focus should always be primarily on first becoming ultra consistent in these games

 

[Danny Roberts]

I agree that sometimes too much is thought about games against rivals but it does give us a better idea of if the side are capable of competing against the best in Europe.

 

[Bobcat]

I'm sure the "top 6" teams will give us more of a challenge but most of them are probably more worried about us than we are of them. Anyway, the non top 6 teams account for 84 of the 114 points available in the season, and we've collected more than 90% of those points we've played for so far.

Get excited now. We're scoring for fun. Picking up the points that we should be picking up. Doing the job in the CL with no fuss. We aren't invincible and we're going to have annoying results and bigger tests ahead of us, but jeez, it's miles better than we've seen for ages and we have a squad full of potential for years to come. We might not win the league this season but we're probably not going to be scrapping over 4th place either.

Agreed, we are looking good, but City are looking really strong as well and they already beat Chelsea, Liverpool and Spurs, two of them away.

The future looks bright though, in Pogba, Rashford, Martial and Lukaku we might have the core for a really good team for years to come

 

[gajender]

Agreed, we are looking good, but City are looking really strong as well and they already beat Chelsea, Liverpool and Spurs, two of them away.

The future looks bright though, in Pogba, Rashford, Martial and Lukaku we might have the core for a really good team for years to come

City have been impressive this season but they only defeated Chelsea away, Liverpool was at home and they are yet to meet Tottenham this season.

 

[Clas Sified]

Agreed, we are looking good, but City are looking really strong as well and they already beat Chelsea, Liverpool and Spurs, two of them away.

The future looks bright though, in Pogba, Rashford, Martial and Lukaku we might have the core for a really good team for years to come

While I do agree with your points, City haven't played Spurs yet. (Unless you're of course counting the pre-season match?)

 

[Hernandez - BFA]

I'll get excited once I see City slip one more time.

 

[RooneyLegend]

Once we've negotiated our way through the next batch of tough games and we're still looking like title contenders then we'd be able to claim being the real thing. Even this season we've had some not so impressive performances despite handing out some spankings to a few of the minnows.