Which players are good enough?

[devilish]

Let it go, Jesus Christ.

When you say agree to disagree you end the debate, not try continue to prove the person wrong.

Let's just agree that you're wrong and move on.

 

[pascell]

Which one is it? The #10 or the CM? We can't fit both.

I think we'll go push for a CM and play Pogba in the Mkhitaryan role.

 

[devilish]

I think we'll go push for a CM and play Pogba in the Mkhitaryan role.

His best position is as the most advanced CM in a 3 men CM. He lacks the finishing skills to be no 10.

I think we should shift to a 4-3-3 system with Rashford and Martial on the flanks and Lukaku as a lone striker

 

[pascell]

His best position is as the most advanced CM in a 3 men CM

Yeah that's where I think we'll play him next season. We'll bring in a CM that can breakup play, hold onto the ball under pressure and has a solid passing range. For this season that CM will likely be Fellaini.

I can see us buying a RW, LB and CM in summer and not bothering with Griezmann. Maybe even Ozil on a free.

 

[pocco]

Silly thread. We've a really good squad that's lacking a top LB and winger. It should be more than capable of challenging for the title (although we're unlucky in that this City side look like they could be record breakers), the manager simply needs to do more.

I'm not buying that at all. I've heard that for the last three years and where are we? Still miles behind City, let alone the big teams in Europe. The core of this squad is not good enough...they've failed under 2/3 managers, each with different ideologies, and yet we're still here saying "well maybe we should try this formation".

Everything that gets suggested on here is tried at some point by the manager (eg 352) and we are still shite. The thing is, it's so obviously the players. They wilt under pressure and our passing goes to shit. The very basics of football elude them in the biggest games. Do you honestly think Jose Mourinho is telling them to do this stuff?

 

[sincher]

We are not a bad team at all and have made some progress. We aren't as good as City. We are the same level as Spurs and Chelsea, a bit better than Arsenal and Liverpool.

Losing at the bridge is no disgrace but I did feel that we could have nicked it with better tactics. Conte was smart dropping Rudiger and Luiz though and in playing three in midfield, which is where we lost the game.

 

[pocco]

You're talking about assembling the perfect team though.

You don't need the perfect team to win the league, you need a team that can compete with the best team in the league.

If you threw Hazard into our Starting XI and had Pogba back, we'd be competing.

What I'm trying to find out is exactly how far away we are. I'm not saying we need WC players in every position, though I can see how that may come across. But I want to know how many top players we do need and how many of the current lot may fill in positions on a weekly basis, in order to achieve a team that can go out and beat Real, Barca, Bayern, City etc. I think we'd get thumped if we tried playing football against any of them.

 

[devilish]

Yeah that's where I think we'll play him next season. We'll bring in a CM that can breakup play, hold onto the ball under pressure and has a solid passing range. For this season that CM will likely be Fellaini.

I can see us buying a RW, LB and CM in summer and not bothering with Griezmann. Maybe even Ozil on a free.

I don't share your optimism. I think we'll stick to a 4-2-3-1 system which will end up hurting Pogba. In my opinion we should shift to a 4-3-3 system and add some absolutely great flank men (wingers/fullbacks) who can take on players and create plenty of assists/score goals.

 

[Mciahel Goodman]

de Gea - best keeper in the world.
Valencia - top 3 rightbacks in the league.
Bailly, Jones, Smalling - best defence in the league, regardless of combinations.
Young - has been superb this season, not a long term solution though.
Blind/Darmian - squad players with squad player status.
Pogba - one of the best players in the world (I mean that bracket after the top 3-4 no one displaces).
Matic - has been amongst the best players in the league so far. Great signing.
Fellaini - Squad player. Just back from injury, was playing best football of his career here prior to that.
Herrera - a bit lost this season, third choice CM.
Carrick - last season, ultra backup.
Lingard - Squad player, intelligent in tactical terms, underrated here if overrated elsewhere.
Rashford - could be among football's elite strikers one day.
Martial - has everything needed to be the best.
Zlatan - 25+ goals last season, excellent at holding the ball up.
Lukaku - 6 or 7 without a goal, but has been starved of service. He'll benefit from Pogba's return. His hold up play is a concern, but hence the notion direct football with crosses delivered precisely with pace into the box (Perisic).

Mkhitaryan - Not good enough to command a starting place in a title wining squad.
Mata - better than Mkhitaryan, but we also need an upgrade here.

Rojo - our best CB last season.


The team is in good shape but we need to replace/upgrade Mkhitaryan and Mata whilst also getting a left back and a striker. A case of four more players needed. Five really, as Valencia needs competition at RB.

If we can get a Griezmann type player to take the place of Mkitaryan/Mata, we'd instantly improve, but that's stating the obvious. Sometimes all you really need is one or two players to transform a team, though. Van Persie more or less won us a league title because he papered over deficiencies in defence and midfield with his goal scoring. We need a couple of consistent top class players to play off of Lukaku (this is where Zlatan comes in, but we still need more).

Finally, I find these evaluations a bit premature. We're 11 games into a season and doing very well, despite shit form of late. That form coincided with Pogba and Fellaini's absences, which should not be forgotten. After the break, both should be back with relative match fitness and Zlatan/Rojo not far behind. When we enter that stage of the season (December/January) where we play three times a week, I think we could claw back quite a few points from City. They'll hit a rough patch, guaranteed.

 

[Mciahel Goodman]

I'd get rid of Shaw, Mkhitaryan, Mata and Darmian, bring in LB, Griezmann, a wide player (Perisic or whomever), and a RB for cover. But not until the summer. World Cup years are usually busy in terms of transfers and business is usually done early (ish).

 

[AshRK]

I do not think we are that far from dominating teams and are actually capable of winning the league. I seriously think we need a world class number 10 and a right winger who can cross the ball. Lukaku will automatically become twice the player if someone can actually cross a ball to him. Imagine if he had got the chance that rashford fluffed yesterday and headed above the post. We have got a solid striker, just need some world class attacking midfielders who can ease some pressure off the striker and Pogba.

 

[Stadjer]

de Gea - best keeper in the world.
Valencia - top 3 rightbacks in the league.
Bailly, Jones, Smalling - best defence in the league, regardless of combinations.
Young - has been superb this season, not a long term solution though.
Blind/Darmian - squad players with squad player status.
Pogba - one of the best players in the world (I mean that bracket after the top 3-4 no one displaces).
Matic - has been amongst the best players in the league so far. Great signing.
Fellaini - Squad player. Just back from injury, was playing best football of his career here prior to that.
Herrera - a bit lost this season, third choice CM.
Carrick - last season, ultra backup.
Lingard - Squad player, intelligent in tactical terms, underrated here if overrated elsewhere.
Rashford - could be among football's elite strikers one day.
Martial - has everything needed to be the best.
Zlatan - 25+ goals last season, excellent at holding the ball up.
Lukaku - 6 or 7 without a goal, but has been starved of service. He'll benefit from Pogba's return. His hold up play is a concern, but hence the notion direct football with crosses put delivered precisely with pace into the box (Perisic).

Mkhitaryan - Not good enough to command a starting place in a title wining squad.
Mata - better than Mkhitaryan, but we also need an upgrade here.

Rojo - our best CB last season.

Bailly is good and will be even better in the future, Jones is good and could have been so much better if he wasnt injured all the time and Smalling is good at defending but ''not so great'' at anything else. However i wouldnt call it the best defense in the league. Lingard is a squad player but he plays way too often in important matches as a squad player. Like many others on the forum im not a huge fan of him. Herrera shouldnt be third choice midfielder, he just isnt good at anything besides working hard, showing commitment, shouting and falling over. No great passing, hopeless at shooting. He should be a good squad player and a (world) class midfielder should be playing alongside Pogba and Matic.

Agree with most other statements..

 

[Salus Populi Suprema Lex]

I'd get rid of Shaw, Mkhitaryan, Mata and Darmian, bring in LB, Griezmann, a wide player (Perisic or whomever), and a RB for cover. But not until the summer. World Cup years are usually busy in terms of transfers and business is usually done early (ish).

You'd offload Mata and Miki yet keep Smalling, Blind and Lingard? Miki isn't playing well, but he was superb last season; Mata is proven quality. Opinions vary, but I think we have more deadwood than Mata and Miki.

 

[Mciahel Goodman]

However i wouldnt call it the best defense in the league

I mean from a literal viewpoint in that we've conceded the fewest goals of all teams thus far.

That Lingard plays so much I put down to two things. Firstly, he does the things Jose wants him to do. Secondly, Mata and Mkhitaryan haven't been good enough.

 

[Mciahel Goodman]

You'd offload Mata and Miki yet keep Smalling, Blind and Lingard? Miki isn't playing well, but he was superb last season; Mata is proven quality. Opinions vary, but I think we have more deadwood than Mata and Miki.

I'd only offload them if we had better players coming in (Griezmann, Sanchez, et al). Smalling could go too, but I don't see the point. It remains to be seen how well Rojo adapts post injury, and Jones is the most injury prone player in the squad. Smalling/Bailly might be the combination needed in the immediate future. I won't mention Lindelof as he has to adapt to the league -- I'll judge him next season if he's still here.

It's not that Mkhitaryan and Mata aren't any good, it's more that they lack qualities I think a title winning team needs. Mkhitaryan is too inconsistent, Mata doesn't contribute enough going forward. These are our playmakers and they haven't been up to it lately. Ideally, goal scoring 10, and a wide player with pace/physicality who can assist/score is what we should be looking at. Zlatan can cover the 10 spot, but this is his last season and he'll most likely slow the game down. It's a stopgap.

With regard to Blind, I think he's a useful squad player. Can cover CB, LB, CDM, and LWB. He's not first choice, but does a decent job when called upon. Tactically versatile.

 

[Bwuk]

If we consider 4-2-3-1 to be our main formation, I'd argue that we could do with;

• A permanent solution to our left back. We have a bunch of players who we tend to play there, and none are good enough if we are honest.
• A right back. Valencia is good, but is aging and we could do with a proper rotation option.
• At #10 Mkhi has been very disappointing, and Mata clearly isn't viewed as that. It's like playing a man down half the time.
• We have no right winger whatsoever.
  
• We need another play maker somewhere in the side, we've shown that without Pogba our side looks clueless.

We have far too many players who either aren't good enough, or should only be squad players at best.

 

[Freak]

There are good players in our team, the problem lies in how they work as a unit. It's a coaching problem.

De Gea
Bailly
Jones
Rojo
Valencia
Matic
Pogba
Martial
Rashford
Ibrahimovic
Lukaku

These are all players who are good enough and who can hold their own 90% of the time, the bold ones being truly world class at what they do. We just need to start working as a team, and some of them just need to start getting back to form.

 

[G-manc]

You'd offload Mata and Miki yet keep Smalling, Blind and Lingard? Miki isn't playing well, but he was superb last season; Mata is proven quality. Opinions vary, but I think we have more deadwood than Mata and Miki.

The other 3 you've mentioned are no great shakes but their deficiencies can largely be compensated by other players in the team. I think when you're playing the 10 role there is nowhere to hide when it's not working out as you're expected to be the provider - especially in tight games.

Mata and Mkhitaryan have struggled for any sort of consistency and are both piss weak physically and unable to play elsewhere effectively e.g. wide right.

 

[Leftback99]

This set of players were clearly not good enough and struggled to create and score under LVG, since then attack wise we've added:

Lukaku/Zlatan - target men/finishers
Mkhitaryan - average number 10
Pogba - centre mid

It's no wonder we're still struggling going forward.

 

[prtk0811]

Degea , Bailly almost , pogba almost, zlatan ( but slow), matic

Herrera, lukaku, martial and rashford ( learning) Valencia good at what they do but have limitations.

Lingard Mata darmian blind lindelof v ( at the moment) smalling rojo squad players never seen any improvement.

Mkh young very bad on the ball.

 

[Mciahel Goodman]

De Gea
Bailly
Jones
Rojo
Valencia
Matic
Pogba
Martial
Rashford
Ibrahimovic
Lukaku

When Zlatan is back I don't see Rashford and Martial playing either side. Mkhitaryan on the right, one of Rashford/Martial on the left is more likely. Matic shielding the defence and Pogba playing box to box.

 

[bosnian_red]

De gea, valencia, bailly, jones if fit, blind, pogba, matic, herrera (squad player), martial, rashford (squad player)... not sure on Lukaku. Mkhitaryan and mata are good squad players if used as squad players. Darmian good enough for a squad player at either fullback.

But it definitely depends on the system used. Martial is a much bigger talent then sterling and a better player right now, but sterling is playing consistently in a very high functioning attack. Put martial in that team and he would tear up the league. Rashford less so IMO as he isnt as developed but he'd have a role for sure. Herrera could (and has) perform a similar role to fernandinho as they are similar players. Pogba is quality of course, bailly, jones and even rojo when fit are better then City's center backs imo, valencia is as good a right back as any in the league, blind is good enough at left back in the right system (and no worse then fecking Delph playing there for City).

Lukaku is a question mark for me because he hasnt proven yet that he can play at a high enough level, while he definitely couldnt play in a system like peps or fergies because of his weaknesses, and those 2 systems have always been successful in the league.

Players who aren't good enough for even squad player level IMO are fellaini, smalling, lingard, carrick (too old now) and Shaw. Possibly lindelof too, though early days. Lingard is decent but he isnt a winger who creates, he isnt a pure #10, he doesnt score too many goals.... he just kinda drifts around in a free role, but is mid table level at that. Fellaini needs to be a target man to be at his best, and systems with target men won't win the title. And there has to be better ways to go about comebacks then hoofing it up to one. Smalling is way too limited on the ball for a title winning side, while Shaw doesnt even stick out playing for the youth team. So yeah. A bit of dead wood, but mostly down to system used I think. Also reliant on rashford and martial developing more.

 

[Lentwood]

Finally a thread where we get to the bones of it! No of this nonsense about 'negative football' or whinging about formations/tactics!

I would categorize our players as follows;

World Class

By this I mean would improve any squad in world football and most likely go straight into any XI

De Gea
Pogba

Title Winning Standard

By this I mean players who would be good enough to fit somewhere into ALL of our title-rivals teams

Bailly
Matic

Title Winning Standard in the Right Team

By this I mean players we have that are good players when paired with the right player or deployed in their favourite system, and could form part of a title-winning team on a regular basis

Valencia
Jones
Smalling
Rojo
Lukaku
Romero

Young Players with Potential to be Title Winning Standard

Pretty self-explanatory. Players who have the talent but not necessarily the consistency or experience right now

Rashford
Martial
Shaw

Top 6 Players

By this I mean players who are likely to get you a top 6 finish but lack the class/bottle/consistency to start for a title-winning side

Mhiki
Mata
Herrera
Fellaini
Lingard
Darmian
Blind
Young
Zlatan
Carrick

Please note - I am rating these players AS THEY ARE NOW, as if we were playing a game of football this afternoon

Now compare this to City and you start to instantly realize why we are struggling to keep pace with them

 

[Salus Populi Suprema Lex]

The other 3 you've mentioned are no great shakes but their deficiencies can largely be compensated by other players in the team. I think when you're playing the 10 role there is nowhere to hide when it's not working out as you're expected to be the provider - especially in tight games.

Mata and Mkhitaryan have struggled for any sort of consistency and are both piss weak physically and unable to play elsewhere effectively e.g. wide right.

But they just aren't United class, IMHO. If we want to be title challengers, we can't carry players whose deficiencies are covered by teammates. As I say, we all have opinions on players we rate or don't rate. Personally I would sell on Darmian, Blind, Smalling, Lingard, Rojo. All can play well on their day, but I don't see them as United quality. We need a left back right now. Young is doing great, but it isn't fair to expect him to play there long term. I would also like a new centre half to replace Smalling. As for the number ten, world class players in that position are like hen's teeth. If we could get one, great.

 

[Mciahel Goodman]

Rojo

I don't get this one. He was out best defender last season. I'd evaluate how he comes back from injury before shipping him out. Has a great mentality too.

 

[bosnian_red]

Basically this for a starting 11 in the right system:

De Gea
Valencia Bailly Rojo Blind
Matic
???? Pogba
???? ???? Martial
​

Someone like Isco, Sane and lewandowski/kane for the 3 missing positions instead of mata, mkhitaryan and lukaku which we currently use. Those are obviously unrealistic, so can be Malcom right wing, put martial as the striker and rashford left wing? Dont think rashford can be a lone striker really, though long way for him to develop so who knows. Definitely not at the level of being of enough to get that role yet though.

And for second 11:
Romero, darmian, Lindelof, Jones, young, herrera, mata, ????, ????, ????, rashford.

(Missing pogba back up, right wing back up/starter, lone striker back up/starter). Lukaku i cant help but see smalling but striker version. A good finisher and decent striker, but lacking the required ability on the ball to be seen as a lock in the side for United. Best that we have at the moment, but far behind the usual level we had over the years.

 

[Salus Populi Suprema Lex]

I don't get this one. He was out best defender last season. I'd evaluate how he comes back from injury before shipping him out. Has a great mentality too.

He did well, but I just think he's a bomb scare who always has a big mistake in him. I just can't relax when he's playing; he lunges in too and is liable to a red card. Just my opinion, but I think Manchester United could replace him with better.

 

[Ballache]

Most of our players are good enough, we just need to add some extra quality to what we already have.
Fast tricky RW, creative #10, attacking LB and a DM.

 

[Invictus]

I think as important as which players are good enough is which positions we are good enough in - and how important those positions are in the overall framework of the team. You don't need to have top quality players in every position as long as they can adhere to the grand tactical plan and their overall lack of top quality is compensated for by the others around them or via some tactical reconfiguration. That is why you could play slightly weaker players under Fergie without skipping a beat. e.g. you don't particularly need to have top quality fullbacks if the wingers or wide attackers ahead of them are dominant because the latter can pin the opposition fullback in defense and even make their wide attacker backtrack to support the flank (a recent example could be Delph behind Sané). Similarly, if you had a dominant wingback, the winger ahead of him doesn't have to be top quality (Alves/Cuardado). You don't need a top centerback if his partner is masterful at organizing things at the back and being a vocal leader (Godín/Savić). You don't need to have top-notch hold-up play at #9 as long as the attackers behind the lead striker are good at regulating the game and bringing him into goal-scoring positions. And so forth. Top quality everywhere would be nice, but is not always realistic.

The problem with United is that there aren't enough players to mask the shortcomings of some of the weaker members of the XI (either individual or collective) - particularly in terms of how they fit with each other or how each player affects the team's tactics. e.g. Mkhitaryan is good enough if he's a cog in a fluid, fast-paced offense that's very defined in terms of his remit - he showed that at Shakhtar and under Tuchel at Dortmund while emerging as one of the best players in the Bundesliga. Does he start floundering when too much pressure is applied on him? Yes - and we knew that he was a bit mentally fragile after the season under Klopp and Tuchel's motivational work to rebuild his confidence:

Tuchel has looked at their sleeping habits and prescribed books to read. Mkhitaryan, one of Europe’s most gifted technicians but also fragile soul, has learned to stop worrying after reading Timothy Gallwey’s “The Inner Game of Tennis.” “It’s like it was written especially for me,” said the Armenian midfielder. “I used to make all the mistakes mentioned there. I’m really grateful that the coach has changed the way I think.”

Link.

That's precisely why he's not showing his top level at United - he's being asked to be one of the most important players in our whole setup at #10 in an attack that's not very well defined or constructed. Same thing out wide - if the attackers were dominant, you could do with more conservative fullbacks. But more threatening fullbacks are critical when your wide attackers aren't taking the game to the opposition. A lot of players at United are good enough in technical terms if their weaknesses are masked by either the others around them or the manager's tactics (like Louis using Smalling as a in-the-box central defender). It's when the light starts shining on them or they're taken of out their comfort zones that they stop withering - and that has a domino effect on the entire team). A lot of them are good enough to challenge for big trophies if we just add a bit more quality in key positions and tailor better tactics around them - that is something we haven't always done since Fergie retired. e.g. you had a complete striker in Van Persie to act as the reference point in an offense that didn't always fire on all cylinders, you had Carrick to regulate the game in a team that lacked passing rhythm at times. If you have those type of players to take charge, it raises the level of the others - so you won't have to jettison half the squad.

 

[G-manc]

But they just aren't United class, IMHO. If we want to be title challengers, we can't carry players whose deficiencies are covered by teammates. As I say, we all have opinions on players we rate or don't rate. Personally I would sell on Darmian, Blind, Smalling, Lingard, Rojo. All can play well on their day, but I don't see them as United quality. We need a left back right now. Young is doing great, but it isn't fair to expect him to play there long term. I would also like a new centre half to replace Smalling. As for the number ten, world class players in that position are like hen's teeth. If we could get one, great.

We don't concede a lot of goals - i don't see how our defence is currently a priority outside of maybe a full back for either side. Replacing Smalling, Darmian, Blind et al isn't going to stop us losing a game like yesterday or help with the main problem - a lack of creativity. I'd prioritise a an attacking mid, right mid, and another centre mid over any other position.

I'd probably take the AM/number 10 from any 'top 4' team in Europe's elite leagues over ours. City have Bernardo Silva on the bench who sh*ts over both of our options.

 

[haram]

Rashford is good enough. Pogba returns and Lukaku starts smashing goals in again and these shit threads stop.

 

[Infra-red]

Pogba and De Gea are top class and wouldn't look out of place at Real, Bayern, Juve, Barca etc. That's about it. Need a few more of their ilk.

Rashford, Martial, Bailly look to be good prospects and Matic/Lukaku are solid first-teamers.

 

[Salus Populi Suprema Lex]

We don't concede a lot of goals - i don't see how our defence is currently a priority outside of maybe a full back for either side. Replacing Smalling, Darmian, Blind et al isn't going to stop us losing a game like yesterday or help with the main problem - a lack of creativity. I'd prioritise a an attacking mid, right mid, and another centre mid over any other position.

I'd probably take the AM/number 10 from any 'top 4' team in Europe's elite leagues over ours. City have Bernardo Silva on the bench who sh*ts over both of our options.

The defence isn't the problem, true; I'm just listing the players I believe surplus to requirements. There's still fat to be trimmed from the squad, IMO. I think our strongest eleven is very impressive, with only a left back and right mid to sort.

 

[TheReligion]

Hands on hearts. How many of our players are truly good enough to form an 11 capable of firstly winning the Premier League, and secondly the Champions League? Because this is the criteria our players should ultimately be measured against.

De Gea
Bailly
Matic
Pogba

In my opinion these are the only players that we have currently that are of the required standard to play in an 11 that could win top honours.

We have the likes of Valencia, Herrera, Jones that can do a job but when measured against the best they aren't good enough. The only young hopefuls that we have are Rashford and Martial, but both of them aren't good enough currently and still have a hell of a long way to go.

In terms of winning the league, you can get by with a few players that can "do a job", but the bar has been significantly raised in Europe and we may be witnessing City also raising that bar in the league.

Basically, it doesn't look good for us right now in terms of getting back to where we want to be, which is challenging seriously on all fronts.

I'm interested to hear who everyone else genuinely believes is good enough to play every week in an 11 that could win the CL and/or PL.

Again tell me a team the has 11 or more players which are world class? It's a squad game. Ask David May, Henning Berg, Jesper Blomquvist..

Again another post I just don't understand on here at the moment.

 

[soap]

Easier to say who isnt tbh.

Mata, Mkhi and all of our left backs need replacing. As much as I like Blind he shouldn't be starting. The jury is out on Jones and Bailly I suppose, personally I have faith in Bailly, Jones is a tougher call due to his fitness. I think Smalling and Rojo are adequate back ups either way.

Other than that we're fine. Mata simply hasn't produced enough since he's been here. Smart player who will almost always keep the ball, slow/quicken the tempo when needed and chase back, sure. That isn't enough though.

 

[Ephrem]

Repalce Mickhy with Hazard or De Bryune , I would have placed bet with anyone that Jose would have won the PL.

 

[soap]

You'd offload Mata and Miki yet keep Smalling, Blind and Lingard? Miki isn't playing well, but he was superb last season; Mata is proven quality. Opinions vary, but I think we have more deadwood than Mata and Miki.

Mata and Mkhi won't be OK with being back ups. Lingard, Blind etc will.

 

[dogwithabone]

Hands on hearts. How many of our players are truly good enough to form an 11 capable of firstly winning the Premier League, and secondly the Champions League? Because this is the criteria our players should ultimately be measured against.

De Gea
Bailly
Matic
Pogba

In my opinion these are the only players that we have currently that are of the required standard to play in an 11 that could win top honours.

We have the likes of Valencia, Herrera, Jones that can do a job but when measured against the best they aren't good enough. The only young hopefuls that we have are Rashford and Martial, but both of them aren't good enough currently and still have a hell of a long way to go.

In terms of winning the league, you can get by with a few players that can "do a job", but the bar has been significantly raised in Europe and we may be witnessing City also raising that bar in the league.

Basically, it doesn't look good for us right now in terms of getting back to where we want to be, which is challenging seriously on all fronts.

I'm interested to hear who everyone else genuinely believes is good enough to play every week in an 11 that could win the CL and/or PL.

Don’t really get your point given that among those you’ve left out a whole load of them have won top honours.

I’m yet to see a football team with genuine world class players in every position. The greatest teams ever generally have one or two water carriers. Right now we are just lacking that talisman who can swing the game in our direction but there’s stacks of talent in the squad, far more than the four you mention.

 

[Treble]

Which City players are good enough to be firm starters for Jose's United? Serious question.

 

[pocco]

Rashford is good enough. Pogba returns and Lukaku starts smashing goals in again and these shit threads stop.

Until we play the better teams in the league or get to the latter stages of the CL.Unless you actually believe this team is capable of winning the league and CL? Which is exactly the point of this thread.