Why did we buy Fred?

[Adam-Utd]

I'll post it again....

Ole......."We know there’s a very, very good player there with Fred so hopefully he’ll adjust to the English game because there’s no doubt there's talent, absolutely no doubt.

"It’s always difficult to come here. One: It’s Man United, you’re expected to perform straight away. Two: It’s an English league that he’s not used to. But he’s a Brazilian international, Andreas is a Brazilian international, the talent is there and when they get the chance the next time... it’s easier to come into a team that’s doing well.

"I didn’t do Andreas or Scott or Fred any favours when I put them in against Reading when we've had nine changes. Next time they come in there might be one or two changes, and it’s easier, and then we’ll see what they’re capable of.

"There’s loads of players that have come in and found the first few months difficult. One of the best players I’ve played with that struggled the most was Diego Forlan. Veron [is another] you know, those two fantastic players and it took a bit of time. But when they settled they performed....."

Enough said and I'm not sure after 18 games with most coming off the bench during the Jose era we can make any assessment of him. He'll get his chance but currently it's hard because everyone inc those that arrived before him deserves it too. Most on here been wanting Andreas to get a chance and others Scott too. I actually rate Fred highly but I think at times he's trying to hard to impress.

Exactly as I expected, there just being patient with Fred and letting him bed into the team.

He's just had a baby and missed our winter training camp, so he's bound to be a bit behind the rest of the squad. I have faith he will come good, he's clearly got talent and IMO he hasn't been that bad in the matches, just clearly over trying and a second off the pace which makes a big difference at the top level. He reminds me of Lindelof in that sense. He's full of nervous energy but eventually he will calm down and show his real ability.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

Not the best examples, really, from OGS there. Forlan and Veron were obviously very good players, as they proved elsewhere (and occasionally for United too, especially in Veron's case) - but they never settled and never seemed good fits for the English game.

 

[IronCroos37]

50 mill, City bought Berna. Silva for same price.

 

[Oldyella]

I'll post it again....

Ole......."We know there’s a very, very good player there with Fred so hopefully he’ll adjust to the English game because there’s no doubt there's talent, absolutely no doubt.

"It’s always difficult to come here. One: It’s Man United, you’re expected to perform straight away. Two: It’s an English league that he’s not used to. But he’s a Brazilian international, Andreas is a Brazilian international, the talent is there and when they get the chance the next time... it’s easier to come into a team that’s doing well.

"I didn’t do Andreas or Scott or Fred any favours when I put them in against Reading when we've had nine changes. Next time they come in there might be one or two changes, and it’s easier, and then we’ll see what they’re capable of.

"There’s loads of players that have come in and found the first few months difficult. One of the best players I’ve played with that struggled the most was Diego Forlan. Veron [is another] you know, those two fantastic players and it took a bit of time. But when they settled they performed....."

Enough said and I'm not sure after 18 games with most coming off the bench during the Jose era we can make any assessment of him. He'll get his chance but currently it's hard because everyone inc those that arrived before him deserves it too. Most on here been wanting Andreas to get a chance and others Scott too. I actually rate Fred highly but I think at times he's trying to hard to impress.

Are those quotes recent? Glad Ole has noted that, always annoys me when we make a raft of changes and then everyone complains we look poor. Give fringe players a chance with the 1st team, only way we know how they can fit in.

 

[Litch]

Exactly as I expected, there just being patient with Fred and letting him bed into the team.

He's just had a baby and missed our winter training camp, so he's bound to be a bit behind the rest of the squad. I have faith he will come good, he's clearly got talent and IMO he hasn't been that bad in the matches, just clearly over trying and a second off the pace which makes a big difference at the top level. He reminds me of Lindelof in that sense. He's full of nervous energy but eventually he will calm down and show his real ability.

Agree. People also forget, he was injured at the start of the World Cup and didn't play during it either. I'm labouring the point but it was hard enough for those players to perform under Jose who were already here much less being new to it. Not sure Jose comments about him not being able to play him with this defence help his confidence either.
For me the season started 13 games ago, and we have had the benefit of reassessing some but not others enough. Fred fits in that camp......

 

[Litch]

Are those quotes recent? Glad Ole has noted that, always annoys me when we make a raft of changes and then everyone complains we look poor. Give fringe players a chance with the 1st team, only way we know how they can fit in.

mid Feb I think. Also has Ole already said, it's not like he didn't know who these players were before he got here.....

 

[MikeUpNorth]

Not the best examples, really, from OGS there. Forlan and Veron were obviously very good players, as they proved elsewhere (and occasionally for United too, especially in Veron's case) - but they never settled and never seemed good fits for the English game.

Yeah, I thought the same. He should use the standard Vidic/Evra 'it takes time to settle' examples like everyone else.

 

[Red00012]

To the OP the only reason I can think of at the moment is he fits in nicely into the Ole’s at the wheel song. That’s it really

 

[Zlatan 7]

I think I wrote at the bottom what I thought.....I think if I arrived at the club, I would give those who already are here for sometime the chance to prove their worth as Fred in essence doesn't in the same way given he's just arrived. I think Ole wants to give Scott and Andreas a chance because they deserve it and I think Ole needs to know (and maybe Fred inc at some point) if they can come in and offer cover for the 3 that are already there. Ole will only find out if he plays them but like he said, can't do that all at once. I think Fred will get another season but Andreas has already been out on loan and I suspect if Scott isn't good enough at the mo, he'll go out on loan too.
After seeing how tall Scott is becoming, I suspect they might see him playing CB in the future.

Oh....Ole doesn't have to say that about him at all. I actually think one of Ole's strengths is his honesty and would lose a lot of credibility amongst the players if he's says that publicly and something else privately......

Ok.

I have the opinion if Fred was showing enough in training he’d have had more time on the field since ole got here.

Being patient or not.

 

[SSSSnake]

If he's not showing it in training then something must be wrong with this fella. Such a shame since we forked out so much money. Could have easily been reinvested somewhere else. We may have to cut our loses in the summer perhaps?

 

[talking robot]

Here's another hypothesis. Ole saw him, liked what he saw, but is trying to reshape him for a role he's not used to. Remolding would take some time and could potentially explain why he's not ready for action yet.

 

[deadrevelz]

Weirdly very few people, including myself, have suggested he should be sold this summer. Are there any examples of a player coming to a club, being so out of form that they often don't make the squad, but go on to be a regular first team player?
How much could we even sell him for? I doubt he is going to make it here on the long term as I'm not sure he is the right player for is if we are building the midfield around Pogba, but if he comes good I suppose he would strengthen our currently shocking midfield depth.

 

[Tony247]

I'll post it again....

Ole......."We know there’s a very, very good player there with Fred so hopefully he’ll adjust to the English game because there’s no doubt there's talent, absolutely no doubt.

"It’s always difficult to come here. One: It’s Man United, you’re expected to perform straight away. Two: It’s an English league that he’s not used to. But he’s a Brazilian international, Andreas is a Brazilian international, the talent is there and when they get the chance the next time... it’s easier to come into a team that’s doing well.

"I didn’t do Andreas or Scott or Fred any favours when I put them in against Reading when we've had nine changes. Next time they come in there might be one or two changes, and it’s easier, and then we’ll see what they’re capable of.

"There’s loads of players that have come in and found the first few months difficult. One of the best players I’ve played with that struggled the most was Diego Forlan. Veron [is another] you know, those two fantastic players and it took a bit of time. But when they settled they performed....."

Enough said and I'm not sure after 18 games with most coming off the bench during the Jose era we can make any assessment of him. He'll get his chance but currently it's hard because everyone inc those that arrived before him deserves it too. Most on here been wanting Andreas to get a chance and others Scott too. I actually rate Fred highly but I think at times he's trying to hard to impress.

what do you expect Ole to say in front of whole world watching? 'we messed up. he is no good.'? Some things are left unsaid.

Veron and Forlan they struggled but there was no iota of doubt over their technical capability. We all, have seen football enough to differentiate between a good player struggling to adapt in new league and a player struggling to demonstrate some of the basic footballing techniques. Fred so far fall in the latter.

 

[the_irish123]

Weirdly very few people, including myself, have suggested he should be sold this summer. Are there any examples of a player coming to a club, being so out of form that they often don't make the squad, but go on to be a regular first team player?
How much could we even sell him for? I doubt he is going to make it here on the long term as I'm not sure he is the right player for is if we are building the midfield around Pogba, but if he comes good I suppose he would strengthen our currently shocking midfield depth.

Barcelona tripled their profit on Mina and he was even a bigger failure for them.

 

[RadamelFalcon]

Honestly I keep forgetting he plays for us. When is the last time he started in the league?

 

[Bilbo]

No chance we get even half of our money back for this guy as things stand. We may as well persevere with him for another season.

On the one hand, if he isn't making the bench it because he isn't showing enough. Then again, he has to have something about him, surely. If he doesn't end up making some impression, then in my mind this has to go down as one of the worst transfer deals ever in football.

 

[deadrevelz]

Barcelona tripled their profit on Mina and he was even a bigger failure for them.

We're not making a profit on him if we sell him. Certainly not for £150MIL!

 

[Thunderhead]

50 mill, City bought Berna. Silva for same price.

nah, we only paid £43m for Bernardo with no add ons, was an absolute steal

 

[Gehrman]

Maybe he's our secret weapon and we are waiting to unleash him when the world is ready for it.

 

[captain666]

I think Pep knew what he was doing,knowing that Jose would out trump him for a dud!

 

[StrettyEnder07]

But is it too much to ask for if you buy something at £50 million + that it is fit for purpose and works?

We shouldn’t have to be messing around getting someone fit for purpose and putting him right if he cost us that much, he should be bloody good enough to go straight in and perform. Alas he isn’t, a total waste of money and a bloody disgrace that a club of our stature does business like this. If he was a car he’d be rejected under the consumer protection act or whatever it’s called! He’s a bloody second hand Ssang Yong for brand new Mercedes money!

So it is his fault for the amount of money we spent on him? Because he was bought for 50m he does not have to adjust, live in a hotel, sort his family out etc., he has no right to take time to get up to the speed of the game etc.

Pires was the exact same at Arsenal, took 12 months to get use to it and then boom was one of the best players to grace the league.

So Lindelof was bought for what, 35m, are we happy he took a year to get himself sorted and now he is a rock at the back, so the difference of 15m from one player being allowed that luxury to Fred not being allowed it?

Yeah it would be great if he came in and hit the ground running, but to write him off because he hasn't set the world alight after 6 months, most of that in one of the most toxic atmosphere's I can ever remember, and he has not really played over the last month or two, so 4 months under Mourinho and your spitting your dummy out, do me a bloody favour

 

[StrettyEnder07]

Weirdly very few people, including myself, have suggested he should be sold this summer. Are there any examples of a player coming to a club, being so out of form that they often don't make the squad, but go on to be a regular first team player?
How much could we even sell him for? I doubt he is going to make it here on the long term as I'm not sure he is the right player for is if we are building the midfield around Pogba, but if he comes good I suppose he would strengthen our currently shocking midfield depth.

Lindelof

 

[crossy1686]

I'm not even bothered about the transfer fee at this stage, I just hope he can contribute in some way moving forward because right now, they might as well have signed me for £50m. We're going to need some fresh legs in the coming weeks and it would be nice to have someone we could depend on doing a job here and there when Pogba or Matic can't play.

 

[Tony247]

So it is his fault for the amount of money we spent on him? Because he was bought for 50m he does not have to adjust, live in a hotel, sort his family out etc., he has no right to take time to get up to the speed of the game etc.

Pires was the exact same at Arsenal, took 12 months to get use to it and then boom was one of the best players to grace the league.

So Lindelof was bought for what, 35m, are we happy he took a year to get himself sorted and now he is a rock at the back, so the difference of 15m from one player being allowed that luxury to Fred not being allowed it?

Yeah it would be great if he came in and hit the ground running, but to write him off because he hasn't set the world alight after 6 months, most of that in one of the most toxic atmosphere's I can ever remember, and he has not really played over the last month or two, so 4 months under Mourinho and your spitting your dummy out, do me a bloody favour

not Fred's fault.

Lindelof played played and played, and finally became regular. So I guess managers believed in his ability even when he was struggling. If managers believe in Fred ability he also should be playing, no? forget regular, at least sub? If there is a player in him somewhere then why he can't get even 5 mins is worrying most of us. Because if it is just adaptability issue then unless he plays he can't adapt for sure.

 

[Tony247]

I'm not even bothered about the transfer fee at this stage, I just hope he can contribute in some way moving forward because right now, they might as well have signed me for £50m. We're going to need some fresh legs in the coming weeks and it would be nice to have someone we could depend on doing a job here and there when Pogba or Matic can't play.

last few matches will be hunt for top 4. And as hunters say 'you cannot go for hunt with unproven gun'. He needs to play now whatever time he gets to be available when push come to shove.

 

[deadrevelz]

Lindelof

I thought Lindelof had something about him even when he was playing crap. He also played quite a lot during that period, unlike Fred who has barely featured this season. I've got nothing against Fred, I hope he comes good, just seems unlikely given the situation. It's not like Lindelof, Vidic, Evra or even Forlan, Veron, Obertan etc. Those players got time, Fred has disappeared.

 

[Melville Red]

Pre or Post Jose.....

Well even Jose said he wasn’t up to it and it doesn’t appear that Ole is confident of playing him either.

 

[StrettyEnder07]

I thought Lindelof had something about him even when he was playing crap. He also played quite a lot during that period, unlike Fred who has barely featured this season. I've got nothing against Fred, I hope he comes good, just seems unlikely given the situation. It's not like Lindelof, Vidic, Evra or even Forlan, Veron, Obertan etc. Those players got time, Fred has disappeared.

Yeah totally agree its not looking good, don't get me wrong so far he has looked pretty shocking but will give him another season, if it is the same next year then look to get rid but would be wary about selling him for half the price this summer, him going somewhere else and tearing it up, we made that mistake with Memphis.

I was one of them who could not see Lindelof doing much but so glad he has proved me wrong, absolute beast now.

 

[StrettyEnder07]

not Fred's fault.

Lindelof played played and played, and finally became regular. So I guess managers believed in his ability even when he was struggling. If managers believe in Fred ability he also should be playing, no? forget regular, at least sub? If there is a player in him somewhere then why he can't get even 5 mins is worrying most of us. Because if it is just adaptability issue then unless he plays he can't adapt for sure.

Don't forget that Lindelof hardly made a squad for a good 2/3 months under Jose, from Sept through to nearly Christmas he was hardly seen, was a bit part player at best for the last six months of that season but nothing more, a lot of which were due to injuries, after the Huddersfield disaster he was not in a squad for a good while, his situation is very similar to Fred.

Don't get me wrong it's not looking good for Fred at all and he needs to step up massively, I just wouldn't write him off yet and give him at least another season as if he can get his head out of his a*s he could potentially be a very good back up for Herrera as supposedly plays a very similar way.

 

[Melville Red]

So it is his fault for the amount of money we spent on him? Because he was bought for 50m he does not have to adjust, live in a hotel, sort his family out etc., he has no right to take time to get up to the speed of the game etc.

Pires was the exact same at Arsenal, took 12 months to get use to it and then boom was one of the best players to grace the league.

So Lindelof was bought for what, 35m, are we happy he took a year to get himself sorted and now he is a rock at the back, so the difference of 15m from one player being allowed that luxury to Fred not being allowed it?

Yeah it would be great if he came in and hit the ground running, but to write him off because he hasn't set the world alight after 6 months, most of that in one of the most toxic atmosphere's I can ever remember, and he has not really played over the last month or two, so 4 months under Mourinho and your spitting your dummy out, do me a bloody favour

Well let’s put him in against the scousers if you are that confident. Ffs I’m not comparing him to others I’m worried what he is about and what he is doing in training and it can’t add up to much if he can’t even get on the bench.
Dummy? The only dummy to be referred to is the one named Fred.
Two managers don’t fancy him, that says a lot.

 

[Shark]

Where are these stats you mention?
I said much much earlier even before we signed him, “who is this Fred?” “And why is he playing n The Ukraine?”
Got shot down everyone saying what a marvellous player he is etc, well I think I got it right but I am curious now you have gone and mentioned these stats. Cheers.

I checked here https://www.transfermarkt.com/fred/profil/spieler/191614

 

[Devil may care]

The comparison stuff is pointless, there are players that have started out struggling and adapted and there are players that started out struggling and simply couldn't adapt to the league or the size of the club, it's impossible to know which one Fred will be, but constantly pointing to Lindelof is as futile as those that used to point to Fletcher as a reason Gibson would make the grade.

Ole's quotes don't surprise me, he's the anthithesis of the toxic one in how he talks about the players so I'd expect him to speak positively regardless, but it is weird IMO that Fred can't even get minutes against garbage sides like Fulham. The clubs we are supposedly in the top bracket with do cut their losses early if need be but we never do so Fred's fan club in here can be sure he'll get another season, time will tell if he's this top quality player some think he is, or a technically loose, positionally clueless player others feel he is.

 

[CG1010]

Quite surprised at the reaction people have here. Almost as if they haven't seen how Lindelof has progressed in his second season. Atleast give Fred another season to get used to the speed of the PL. Then we could decide whether he is going at the Depay route or not.

I feel he has shown enough talent in terms of ability on passing, and running with the ball to consider a talent worth pursuing. In fact the highlight reel of his best passes at United would also be quite good! He just needs to get upto speed with the PL and improve his defensive work, both of which should happen gradually.

 

[Cee90]

People are using Lindelof as an example of the benefits of remaining patient with a player however, I am still not convinced with Lindelof either.

Sure, he has been better than he was when he first joined, but I still don't see a top quality centre half in him.

Still, in saying that, my prediction is that Fred will actually surpass Lindelof as the better player for us over a longer period of time.

 

[Litch]

Ok.

I have the opinion if Fred was showing enough in training he’d have had more time on the field since ole got here.

Being patient or not.

Ole said no one is scoring more goals than Rom in trainng and he doesnt start....

Well even Jose said he wasn’t up to it and it doesn’t appear that Ole is confident of playing him either.

Says a lot about Jose considering he bought him. Thats not what Ole said and he didnt have to say it either. Whether pre or post Jose, just pure stupidity to write someone off after 18 games most coming of the bench....

Not trying to be clever but what ever happened to let him find his feet, play under Ole a few games and make an assessment then. What do we gain from selling him without seeing how he plays now?

 

[Sassy Colin]

@Litch

Here is the article from the MEN:

Why Fred is not playing for Manchester United

https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...all-news/man-utd-news-fred-solskjaer-15863130

 

[The Red Thinker]

Don’t be daft lads clearly he was bought for the song. We just need a “Fred” from somewhere for one of the greatest chants we’ve had in decades.

 

[Litch]

@Litch

Here is the article from the MEN:

Posted this earlier. Ole clearly says he is a very, very good player and its seems like most players, its more about their ability to come to terms with the league than their ability itself. This might be the case, Im just saying its too early to tell given he hasnt had too many chances. This has become even worst given no one expected we would be still competing for the league and cup. I think Ole himself thought he'd be giving the young players games but that wont bd happening either, the stakes are too high....

https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...all-news/man-utd-news-fred-solskjaer-15863130

 

[Maccataq]

To be fair, it's pretty difficult to drop Matic/Herrera/Pogba at the moment. Matic is probably the weak link but I don't see Fred in that role and whilst you could perhaps have Herrera play that role with Fred playing in Herrera's position, I feel like we would lose what Herrera contributes. Given time, I expect Fred to do well for us - if he doesn't get a chance against PSG, I will be surprised. Matic probably needs a rest at some point and will probably pick up a suspension soon as well so there will be other chances too.

 

[Trizy]

People are using Lindelof as an example of the benefits of remaining patient with a player however, I am still not convinced with Lindelof either.

Sure, he has been better than he was when he first joined, but I still don't see a top quality centre half in him.

Still, in saying that, my prediction is that Fred will actually surpass Lindelof as the better player for us over a longer period of time.

I'm the same to be honest. Every time I see Lindelof 1v1 or going up to win a header I always fear the worst. In excellent form but I don't trust him.