Why is our fanbase so toxic towards its players?

[Enigma_87]

Its a term used for anyone that is not currently cutting the mustard. Even if said player was great before. Young and Valencias current performances have rewitten history and they were never any good. Which just isnt true. Mata is part of the current deadwood. Why? Because he doesnt run very fast. Like thats all he has to his game. Carrick was getting abused something fierce a few years ago. He was deadwood in all caps. Fletcher, rooney, blah blah blah. You name the player that started to decline still wearing our shit, they got abused. And if they hung around too long, they got the deadwood label.

Can't agree with Valencia, Carrick, Fletcher or Mata being deadwood mate. Rooney was at a time and was rightfully axed as he was becoming detrimental for our play, considering he's a big name and the play flows through him. Same for Neville in his last games.

Pretty much agree with you on your examples(that they shouldn't get so much flack in the past), but for players like Young, Jones, sadly Sanchez (who I thought would be success), etc are rightfully labeled as deadwood and we should be looking to offload them asap.

 

[ivaldo]

Thats just it though isnt it? Players get away with anything when they make the effort on the pitch. We dont have anything else to talk about in regards to lingard. Hes done nothing of worth on the pitch, and hes turned the dial his social media profile all the way to the right. You play like shit, people will call you on it. Act like you are the dogs back bits, and people will be quick as feck to call you on it.

Then call them out for playing shit. Sometimes players simply aren’t good enough. That doesn’t mean we have to micro-analyse every aspect of their off field lives in order to determine they’re horrible, worthless human beings. To the unbiased viewer Lingard is one of the hardest workers in the pitch we have, and there’s never been any complaints about his professionalism in training, and yet here you are, trying to make out that’s the case.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

Lingard wore glasses to the legends game on Sunday. What a cnut.

 

[Jim Beam]

Basically, lack of success has turn many people into raging feckwits.

But, it is not just luck of success. The whole "I love and idolize you only if you're good or until the moment you are old and not of any use" attitude towards players is a bit absurd from a supporting point of view. And then we ask where is the loyalty on the other side.

 

[Sir Scott McToMinay]

I stopped having emotional connection to players when Becks left to Real.
I care about the club, the lot of those players let us down time and time again, on monumental levels, finishing 6th every second year is absolutely unacceptable at this level.

Many of them are nothing but mercenaries and not even good ones at that.

 

[purgethefallen]

Don't you know, It's all the lazy foreigner's fault. We just need to run around more.

Of course that's all it is

 

[Enigma_87]

Basically, lack of success has turn many people into raging feckwits.

But, it is not just luck of success. The whole "I love and idolize you only if you're good or until the moment you are old and not of any use" attitude towards players is a bit absurd from a supporting point of view. And then we ask where is the loyalty on the other side.

Not always matter of lack of success. Some people just need to vent it out and moan it out and find a scrape goat.

Even Cristiano, Rio, Giggs received treatment despite not being over the hill or we lacked success, for different reasons of course.

 

[Reddy Rederson]

Can't agree with Valencia, Carrick, Fletcher or Mata being deadwood mate. Rooney was at a time and was rightfully axed as he was becoming detrimental for our play, considering he's a big name and the play flows through him. Same for Neville in his last games.

Pretty much agree with you on your examples(that they shouldn't get so much flack in the past), but for players like Young, Jones, sadly Sanchez (who I thought would be success), etc are rightfully labeled as deadwood and we should be looking to offload them asap.

I think if anyone has put in a shift for us, they arent deadwood. It might be time to move on, but theres a nicer way of saying it than "deadwood". Young is shit now, but hes always given us his best effort even when that effort wasnt enough. Theres players that need to be replaced/moved on and theres the deadwood. IMO. Young and jones need to move on/ be replaced, but Id never consider them what "deadwood" implies them to be. Rooney needed to be moved on, but considering how great he was for us, being referred to as "deadwood" is insulting to all he did for us.

 

[Champagne Football]

We've become the new 'Spice Boys', while Liverpool have become the new Utd. It hurts when your club spends hundreds of millions on players who have outrageous talent, but who are more interested in being the center of attention in every moment with endless activity on social media, as opposed to busting a gut for their employers (like true Utd players always have done) on the pitch.

 

[Wumminator]

I stopped having emotional connection to players when Becks left to Real.
I care about the club, the lot of those players let us down time and time again, on monumental levels, finishing 6th every second years is absolutely unacceptable at this level.

Many of them are nothing but mercenaries and not even good ones at that.

I’m glad you stopped having emotional connections to players who haven’t earned it yet Sir Scott Mctominay

 

[SteveJ]

Lingard wore glasses to the legends game on Sunday. What a cnut.

He's making a spectacle of himself.

 

[ivaldo]

Where am I basing my claims on just trophies? I'm sorry but that is horseshit. I see it how it is when I think a team on a lot of money/wages playing for a team who is one of the biggest in the world didn't pull their weight over a season. And it wasn't just the odd one or two you're mentioning that we've had in the past.

What I say..
It has NOTHING to do with them not winning any trophies.
It has NOTHING to do with them coming in the position they did in the table.

It's all about their performance and attitude on pitch I base it on this year - which in my opinion is also the result on their attitude out of the pitch.

Edit: and their attitude of wanting to play for and not for a manager, which was very visible to see this year.

It’s pretty evident you are. You arent basing it on anything. Show me some evidence. Explain to me, with specific examples, how a player having a social media presence has effected their ability to play football. Go.

So yes it has EVERYTHING to do with trophies.

 

[Big Ben Foster]

Our fans are angels compared to most other big club fanbases. If Madrid or Barcelona had a season like ours, there would be riots in the streets.

 

[USREDEVIL]

He's making a spectacle of himself.

I saw what you did there.

 

[Sir Scott McToMinay]

Our fans are angels compared to most other big club fanbases. If Madrid or Barcelona had a season like ours, there would be riots in the streets.

Make no mistake, they would be waiting with torches outside the stadium if they went through a 6 year period like ours.
“Our fanbase is toxic towards the players”
Hilarious.

Stop lowering excpectations, most of them aren’t Manchester United players, they’re employees.
Manchester United players should be competing for league titles, the standard was set by the great man himself, Cantona, Keano, the class of 92, Vidic, Evra, Rio and Rooney, anything less is not good enough.

 

[Reddy Rederson]

Then call them out for playing shit. Sometimes players simply aren’t good enough. That doesn’t mean we have to micro-analyse every aspect of their off field lives in order to determine they’re horrible, worthless human beings. To the unbiased viewer Lingard is one of the hardest workers in the pitch we have, and there’s never been any complaints about his professionalism in training, and yet here you are, trying to make out that’s the case.

Hmm, I'll have to read my post again to see what I said about his professionalism. Be right back. Yep, I was right. I said nothing about it. Being great in training means feck all when it doesnt transfer on to the pitch, and running around a lot doesnt mean very much to me. Like I said, when he does nothing else on the pitch but ups himself big time outside of it hes going to draw attention. "Look at me, look at me", well we are looking Jesse, and we dont like what we see.

 

[Reddy Rederson]

You are making them sound as if they lost a leg in the battlefield, fighting the enemy while being paid on minimum wage. Most of these players were already out of depth in their prime. The reality is what it is. We've got the second highest salary bill for players who are neither good nor very hardworking. In fact we are the lower part in terms of hard work. Our team is made up of players in the search of their final big pay cheque and a mix of very average players. They should thank their gods that they ended up with us. A well managed top club wouldn't have signed them in the first place and they would instead be lingering at Villa, Wigan, Fulham, Blackburn, Torino or China were they belong to.

Don't feel too sad about them either. They will retire as filthy rich people from the money ordinary working people had paid to watch these rubbish 'playing football' at their beloved club. They are probably laughing themselves to the bank right now. Meanwhile they will publicly say how disappointed they are about their performances despite knowing, fully well, that they cant do better in the first place.

People deserve respect for what they done in the past. Not to be considered scum, stealing a living. Which is what the term deadwood implies. Needing to move on and being deadwood are two very different things IMO.

 

[limerickcitykid]

Lingard wore glasses to the legends game on Sunday. What a cnut.

Almost as bad as Rashford wearing a granddad collar. Pair of absolute embarrassing clowns or something like that.

 

[Canagel]

I don't have problem to blame players in general but I do have problem with scapegoating our better players for not carrying the dross. The players that should be blamed doesn't get blamed which is very irritating.
The whole "back the manager at all costs" is bullshit too. Manager like players is an employee of the club but our fans puts manager on special pedestal because it makes you better fan or something. No manager has full control they must earn their right to be backed and if they don't deliver they must go. Just like player is dropped for underperorming and perhaps sold what makes the manager different? . You don't hear fans of other clubs saying let's give manager 4 windows minimum and following them blindly.

 

[Jim Beam]

Not always matter of lack of success. Some people just need to vent it out and moan it out and find a scrape goat.

Even Cristiano, Rio, Giggs received treatment despite not being over the hill or we lacked success, for different reasons of course.

Don't remember they had this level of abuse or hate. Let's be honest, no one would care about Lingard clothes or his looks if he scored over 20 this season. Which he simply isn't capable as a player.

And tbf, I am not sure why his clothes or social media activities should bother people that much either way.

Manchester United players should be competing for league titles, the standard was set by the great man himself, Cantona, Keano, the class of 92, Vidic, Evra, Rio and Rooney, anything less is not good enough.

Yeah, people adore the class of 92 these days. When shit hits the fan, it looks like everyone's to blame.

 

[devilish]

People deserve respect for what they done in the past. Not to be considered scum, stealing a living. Which is what the term deadwood implies. Needing to move on and being deadwood are two very different things IMO.

But that's exactly what most are doing and had been doing for a long time ie steal a living

 

[ivaldo]

Hmm, I'll have to read my post again to see what I said about his professionalism. Be right back. Yep, I was right. I said nothing about it. Being great in training means feck all when it doesnt transfer on to the pitch, and running around a lot doesnt mean very much to me. Like I said, when he does nothing else on the pitch but ups himself big time outside of it hes going to draw attention. "Look at me, look at me", well we are looking Jesse, and we dont like what we see.

Hmmm let me just look to see if this thread was specifically about you. Nope not you. Hmmm let’s see if the original post I responded to was yours. One moment. Nope. Now let’s see what in God’s name social media has to do with on-pitch performances. Let. Me. See. Oh, absolutely nothing. So if you don’t think you or others are making a specific connections between social media and performances, why are you and others mentioning it? They aren’t connected, and to make those connections is nonsensical and childish.

Like I said, if the player is playing shit or isn’t good enough, then say just that. Stop this pretence in needing of micro-analyse everything about a player in order to shit on them.

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

I don't think the fanbase is toxic.

We've been mostly shit and painful to watch for the last 6 years and the last 2 months of this season in particular is as bad as I've ever seen from Utd. We won what? 2 in the last 12?

It would be ten times worse at a lot of other clubs that's for sure.

 

[Majima]

Of course that's all it is

This is the 2nd time I've had to explain I'm being sarcastic.

 

[FFK Norway]

The biggest problem with the supporters of united is that they are living in the past. It was much easier to win the leauge when SAF did it and he would never manage to do the same today. Back then it was pritty much only United that was rich. Now you have soon 10 clubs wich has more money than united that is much more professionale clubs.

That's why people have to back Solskjaer for the next years cause he is trying to undo the madness wich has ruined the club. That's why the form went to hell also cause solskjær has stopped the wages. Jones, smalling and young got new contracts without ole being asked. But he's now stopping the insane wages cause united can't sustain it in the length.

I think it's sad in 10 years probably most of the English football clubs will be owned by oil sheiks and its ruining the football and the supporters.
If United don't back Solskjaer now and let him change things in how the club is being run united is done as a top club. Mark my words.

 

[ivaldo]

I don't think the fanbase is toxic.

We've been mostly shit and painful to watch for the last 6 years and the last 2 months of this season in particular is as bad as I've ever seen from Utd. We won what? 2 in the last 12?

It would be ten times worse at a lot of other clubs that's for sure.

That doesn’t mean we have to treat the players like scum though, which is exactly what is happening. It is possible to separate someone who isn’t good enough from being lazy/unprofessional/a twat. And seeing as poor performances have been endemic, regardless of who is at the club, it might be worth considering our issues stem deeper than having terrible human beings as players.

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

That doesn’t mean we have to treat the players like scum though, which is exactly what is happening. It is possible to separate someone who isn’t good enough from being lazy/unprofessional/a twat. And seeing as poor performances have been endemic, regardless of who is at the club, it might be worth considering our issues stem deeper than having terrible human beings as players.

How are people treating the players like scum?

By voicing displeasure at their pathetic efforts on a forum or on twitter?

And I would say the final 2 or 3 months of the season was deserving of huge criticism. They were disgraceful.

The vast majority of the current squad have been here years and years and shown time and time again they are simply not good enough.

I agree though that they lack of quality in the squad isn't even the major issue, the entire structure of the club is a mess and until the Glazers are gone we're going to be crap for a long time.

 

[FootyGirl88]

Our fans are far from toxic, we're timid in comparison to other fans.

 

[SalfordRed18]

Oh i dont know. What would be a good example for you? Obviously there isnt one where they literally say ' i dont give a f*ck' but there becomes a point where after each and every tiresome performance they say the same old cr*p......... We must stick together, we are disappointed with the performance blah blah blah,,,,,, DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT THEN.
Stop the clothing brands
Stop the flirting with Madrid
Stop trying to build a a reputation as a 'lad' outside of football

Focus 100% on improving your abilities as a professional footballer at one of the biggest clubs in the world instead of becoming complacent.
Stay a few hours late every training session until you sort your sh!t out
Show a bit of passion on the field rather than accepting mediocrity
Be big enough to know that your not good enough to represent this football club and request a transfer

Because there is a queue of players willing to do all that for this club.

cringe

 

[goin4glory]

It's a bit too easy to blame Mourinho for this but I think this toxicity goes back a lot further than Mourinho.

I would say it has existed since Moyes' days. The likes of Rio, Evra and co were getting abused back then for being cnuts and not letting Moyes do his job (or something along those lines). Club legends who had been here for 10+ years.

Anyone think this statement by Fergie has resulted in a lot of poison being directed towards the players :


The whole stand by your manager thing, I think some people literally took to their hearts. It has meant the anger, frustration and pure poison that builds up due to poor results then gets pointed mostly at the players. Either way, it's a pretty sad state of affairs and the club is not a great place to be if you're a player.

Because we've just finished 6th with the 2nd highest wage bill in world football?

Because players are earning more money in 1 week than most people do in years but we have worse fitness levels than every team in the top 6 in the premier league and outside the top 20 in Europe.

Our fans should be more ruthless if anything. Madrid and Barca don't dominate football because they clap the team off after finishing 6th.

Top reds like you are more of a reason for the clubs stagnation than fans demanding more.

 

[Hawks2008]

Meh, I'm more worried about the toxic elements of the dressing room than the fan base. Over the past 6 years we have acquired a pack of mercenaries who have no ambition beyond receiving their paycheck, who readily throw coaches under the bus when it suits them, work hard when it suits them, down tools when it suits them, focus more on their brand than their football, hide behind their team mates etc.

Squad needs an overhaul, build a new core and shed the dead weight.

 

[GiddyUp]

You are making them sound as if they lost a leg in the battlefield, fighting the enemy while being paid on minimum wage. Most of these players were already out of depth in their prime. The reality is what it is. We've got the second highest salary bill for players who are neither good nor very hardworking. In fact we are the lower part in terms of hard work. Our team is made up of players in the search of their final big pay cheque and a mix of very average players. They should thank their gods that they ended up with us. A well managed top club wouldn't have signed them in the first place and they would instead be lingering at Villa, Wigan, Fulham, Blackburn, Torino or China were they belong to.

Don't feel too sad about them either. They will retire as filthy rich people from the money ordinary working people had paid to watch these rubbish 'playing football' at their beloved club. They are probably laughing themselves to the bank right now. Meanwhile they will publicly say how disappointed they are about their performances despite knowing, fully well, that they cant do better in the first place.

I'm pretty sure they are far more pissed at the reported 25% salary cut, that they signed, more then their performance, fitness and general attitude this season.
I would also like to add that when Beckham is mentioned it's a false equivalency. He was the best in the world with his crossing and deadballs due to hard graft and dedication. He married a superstar wife who molded him in to a fashion icon and worldwide phenomenon. His performances certainly dipped towards the end of his United career but he still had it in his locker to do some amazing things.
Jesse Lingard is more David Bentley than David Beckham. When his football career is done he will be quickly forgotten, no matter how many times he dresses like he's going to the Grammys.

Final thought, don't give an inch and play like you deserve the money you are on and there is no problem. Allowing the ref to beat you to the box while tracking back on an opposition break or having you're arse handed to you by mid table or relegated team and we have a big fecking problem.

 

[SalfordRed18]

We've become the new 'Spice Boys', while Liverpool have become the new Utd. It hurts when your club spends hundreds of millions on players who have outrageous talent, but who are more interested in being the center of attention in every moment with endless activity on social media, as opposed to busting a gut for their employers (like true Utd players always have done) on the pitch.

I miss Berbatov busting his gut

 

[Jibbs]

Because more than half of them don't deserve to be anywhere near man united, lot alone exploiting precious resources of our club and sucking it like leeches for personal gains, earning atrocious salaries and not even trying to work hard enough for the club and the fans.

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

We've also just come off a season where in our biggest home games of the season, against the other top 6 rivals and in Europe against Valencia PSG and Barcelona, our record stood at 0W 4D and 4L. With 3 goals scored in those 8 games.

I mean that is appalling.

 

[ivaldo]

How are people treating the players like scum?

By voicing displeasure at their pathetic efforts on a forum or on twitter?

And I would say the final 2 or 3 months of the season was deserving of huge criticism. They were disgraceful.

The vast majority of the current squad have been here years and years and shown time and time again they are simply not good enough.

I agree though that they lack of quality in the squad isn't even the major issue, the entire structure of the club is a mess and until the Glazers are gone we're going to be crap for a long time.

But we aren’t judging them purely on performances are we? I mean just look at the utter abuse Lingard got the other night for wearing glasses. You’d think he had burned down an orphanage. The vitriol against them has gone far beyond them as players, and is directed at them as people. It’s pathetic.

 

[Champagne Football]

I miss Berbatov busting his gut

1 luxury player in 26 years is not a bad record in the transfer market.
I couldn't see Mata, Pogba, Martial lasting too long under Klopp.

 

[Kag]

I’d argue the influence of social media merely lifted the lid on this sort of thing. Racism, homophobia and abuse was concealed to the terraces, or the pub. Now it’s manifested online - everywhere.

The club didn’t even have Twitter when Ferguson left the club. That the club has just finished sixth doesn’t help, but it’s never really been easier to direct anger and ire towards famous people.

 

[Kag]

I also think a lot of people confuse the term ‘fanbase’.

As much as many people on here - or wherever they post - like to think they are, they’re not really part of the inner fanbase. The true hub of support lies with those who attend the matches and lend their support in that physical sense (cry about this all you want, but it’s true). And that fanbase has been incredibly supportive on the whole. Yes, there is a large following of dickheads online (I’m probably - definitely - one of them), but this is a product of United’s success and global standing. Brighton or Burnley would have just as many dickheads doing the same thing if they were ever as successful. They aren’t, so they don’t.

When Liverpool fall back off the balcony then the same abuse will be prevalent within their own fanbase - if it isn’t already.

 

[VeevaVee]

I actually think our fanbase has been very patient. I've seen people calling us spoilt and the like, despite giving Moyes a chance, despite standing behind a failing LVG until it became too much, despite our players constantly talking a lot but failing to deliver time after time. This isn't kneejerk spoilt behaviour. It's being annoyed because of years of issues and waiting for something to happen. People are tired of crap.

The players are getting the brunt of it now, because everyone is finally realising they are a major part of the problem, and we're not this sleeping giant of a team that just needed a bit of good management to challenge for the league, like many have made out in the past. Anything that doesn't seem like them seriously knuckling down like they need to is judged negatively, and while some of it may not be entirely on point, I kinda get it.